Judge blocks Trump's blatantly unconstitutional birthright citizenship order

[Fuzzy1975]

But you know what I mean.

No I don't you claimed half of the population. Now are you backing away from that,or? It would be nice if you could clarify what exactly you think
this election proved?

 

[ClockworkFox]

All of our collective heads need to be examined for talking politics on a sex site, yet, here we are, and I’ve nothing better to do…

There's a tenuous sex-politics connection in that Trump voters think that Biden shafted them in the ass, and Biden voters think that Trump shafted them in the ass once, and is about to do it again.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Only 69%? You do realize that’s the best we’ve done since the 50’s and 60’s…

Yes, it was impressive. Still 80-90% would be even better.

 

[DeluxAuto]

MAGATs are unintentionally hilarious.

Corrupt judges!
Soros' judges!
Incompetent judges!
Lawfare!
...but appeals!

 

[ClockworkFox]

No I don't you claimed half of the population. Now are you backing away from that,or? It would be nice if you could clarify what exactly you think
this election proved?

OK, I'll back away from that. Now are you shutting the fuck up, or? It would be nice if you could clarify what exactly you think this nitpicking assholery proved. And that last sentence isn't a question, so it doesn't need a fucking question mark like yours has, does it? Unlike the previous one.

 

[HumpDayHoratio]

MAGATs are unintentionally hilarious.

Corrupt judges!
Soros' judges!
Incompetent judges!
Lawfare!
...but appeals!

Yes, it was impressive. Still 80-90% would be even better.

What’s funny is you Radicalized trying to use weasel words to interpret the 14th, much like you’ve done with the Second.

 

[ClockworkFox]

OK, I'll back away from that. Now are you shutting the fuck up, or? It would be nice if you could clarify what exactly you think this nitpicking assholery proved. And that last sentence isn't a question, so it doesn't need a fucking question mark like yours has, does it? Unlike the previous one.

OK, I'll cooperate, and I'll be nice and clarify. This election proved that more people voted for Trump. Fewer people voted for Biden. The more people hate the fewer, and the fewer hate the more.

All I mean is that - as in many countries around the globe - since the George Dubya era, with all that fuss over ballot papers at the beginning of the noughties, the elections are either a damn close-run thing or they've become so polarised and bitter that people not only vote for their candidate, but increasingly their hatred of the other side is borderline psychotic. I see it everywhere on the "Politics" forum. Don't you?

 

[DeluxAuto]

What’s funny is you Radicalized trying to use weasel words to interpret the 14th, much like you’ve done with the Second.

The court is "radicalized?"
The Second?

Fuck off, dipshit.

 

[ClockworkFox]

When you are inside of a country, you are subject to the country's jurisdiction, with one exception.
I will try to explain.

• You are an American citizen, you rob a bank, get caught and convicted. You go to prison. You are subject to the jurisdiction of state and federal bank robbery laws.
• You are a citizen of another country, you are here legally on a visa, you rob a bank, get caught and convicted. You go to prison. You are subject to the jurisdiction of state and federal bank robbery laws. Your country of legal domecile's laws on bank robbery do not apply within the United States.
• You are a citizen of another country, you are here illegally because you snuck in, you rob a bank, get caught and convicted. You go to prison. You are subject to the jurisdiction of state and federal bank robbery laws. Your country of legal domecile's laws on bank robbery do not apply within the United States.
• You are a citizen of another country, you are here legally on a DIPLOMATIC visa, you rob a bank, get caught and claim "diplomatic immunity". You are NOT subject to the jurisdiction of state and federal bank robbery laws. Your country of legal domecile's laws on bank robbery do not apply within the United States. You will likely be declared "persona non grata" by the US government and sent packing on the next flight home.

This is not rocket surgery.

I understand all that. I take it the "rocket surgery" / "rocket science" bit is subtle humour? Otherwise I'd have to wheel out my irritating tools of pedantry.

Can I just jump in here and ask why people across the pond say "inside of" instead of just "inside"? Or "get off of" instead of just "get off"? It is literally a waste of time - our senses waste a fraction of a second with that totally unnecessary extra word, whether it's written, read, spoken or heard.

And I know what you're going to say here. Don't think I don't, because I do. You're going to say that the Rolling Stones who, as evry skoolboy kno, are British, sing "Hey, you, get offa ma cloud", aren't you, but that's quite different. That is simply an elongation of the word to produce an extra syllable. They also sing "I can't get no satisfaction", mind you, but that's another story, and bugger all to do with time-wasting, a lot of which I've been doing here, to be honest.

I rest my case.

 

[Bn2f]

Wow. I must admit I haven't looked at "Politics" much on Literotica, but has it always been like this? Half of America seems to really hate the other half. No, I've got that wrong - almost exactly one half USED to hate the other half, considering the 2020 election results, but now fewer people hate more people. Is that good or bad?

Well, I must admit to you that you have stumbled on a particular member who is not representative of the whole. My anger and hatred for the extreme right wingers here is of my own. I willingly have admitted on numerous occasions that I come here to troll. I come here to embarrass and humiliate them. Again, I’m not representative of the whole.

I am of the belief that most Americans in social and polite settings can have spirited disagreements that may lead to positive outcomes. That is not what I think happens here. Most conservatives leaning members here come to bullshit and lie. They run from civil debate and questioning of their so called belief systems. I enjoy other members embarrassing them if I am not able to do so myself.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

OK, I'll back away from that. Now are you shutting the fuck up, or? It would be nice if you could clarify what exactly you think this nitpicking assholery proved. And that last sentence isn't a question, so it doesn't need a fucking question mark like yours has, does it? Unlike the previous one.

Thanks for backing up. There is far too much being read into an election where the choice was, bad or worse. Though that has been the case for the last several elections.

 

[Rightguide]

When you are inside of a country, you are subject to the country's jurisdiction, with one exception.
I will try to explain.

• You are an American citizen, you rob a bank, get caught and convicted. You go to prison. You are subject to the jurisdiction of state and federal bank robbery laws.
• You are a citizen of another country, you are here legally on a visa, you rob a bank, get caught and convicted. You go to prison. You are subject to the jurisdiction of state and federal bank robbery laws. Your country of legal domecile's laws on bank robbery do not apply within the United States.
• You are a citizen of another country, you are here illegally because you snuck in, you rob a bank, get caught and convicted. You go to prison. You are subject to the jurisdiction of state and federal bank robbery laws. Your country of legal domecile's laws on bank robbery do not apply within the United States.
• You are a citizen of another country, you are here legally on a DIPLOMATIC visa, you rob a bank, get caught and claim "diplomatic immunity". You are NOT subject to the jurisdiction of state and federal bank robbery laws. Your country of legal domecile's laws on bank robbery do not apply within the United States. You will likely be declared "persona non grata" by the US government and sent packing on the next flight home.

This is not rocket surgery.

You are wrong in your position on birthright citizenship and the Seattle Judge who issued his "universal" order is wrong in doing so. Federal District Court judges no longer have the authority to enjoin the entire federal government. Supreme Court precedence in cases over the last four years has stripped the authority of federal district Court judges in doing so. Trump will ignore the judges order. The judges authority is limited to his district and those people who are before him in his district. The simplest of subjects do require rocket surgery when it comes to informing your diminished capacity.

 

[ll74]

You are wrong in your position on birthright citizenship and the Seattle Judge who issued his "universal" order is wrong in doing so. Federal District Court judges no longer have the authority to enjoin the entire federal government. Supreme Court precedence in cases over the last four years has stripped the authority of federal district Court judges in doing so. Trump will ignore the judges order. The judges authority is limited to his district and those people who are before him in his district. The simplest of subjects do require rocket surgery when it comes to informing your diminished capacity.

This is not how the court system works. Lol

 

[Politruk]

You are wrong in your position on birthright citizenship and the Seattle Judge who issued his "universal" order is wrong in doing so. Federal District Court judges no longer have the authority to enjoin the entire federal government. Supreme Court precedence in cases over the last four years has stripped the authority of federal district Court judges in doing so. Trump will ignore the judges order. The judges authority is limited to his district and those people who are before him in his district. The simplest of subjects do require rocket surgery when it comes to informing your diminished capacity.

You seem to be placing your reliance on the SCOTUS. But the SCOTUS, even in its present formation, will never abolish jus soli birthright citizenship.

 

[Rightguide]

You seem to be placing your reliance on the SCOTUS. But the SCOTUS, even in its present formation, will never abolish jus soli birthright citizenship.

The SCOTUS has ruled on universal injunctions, that was the subject of my post #113. On the subject Birthright citizenship you will be instructed in the weeks and months to come.

 

[Politruk]

The SCOTUS has ruled on universal injunctions

What case?

 

[Rightguide]

What case?

Three or four cases in the last four years, and recently in a gun case out of Texas. I don't have the case names at my fingertips at the moment but you can google them.

 

[Politruk]

Three or four cases in the last four years, and recently in a gun case out of Texas. I don't have the case names at my fingertips at the moment but you can google them.

I hope you don't mean this idiotic abomination!

 

[YDB95]

We are putting a stop to it. Getting rid of Biden and putting a savvy businessman in charge will put things right.

I have yet to see the first savvy businessman who has had six bankruptcies, one of them from running a casino. You really need to turn off Fox News, my friend.

You are wrong in your position on birthright citizenship and the Seattle Judge who issued his "universal" order is wrong in doing so. Federal District Court judges no longer have the authority to enjoin the entire federal government. Supreme Court precedence in cases over the last four years has stripped the authority of federal district Court judges in doing so. Trump will ignore the judges order. The judges authority is limited to his district and those people who are before him in his district. The simplest of subjects do require rocket surgery when it comes to informing your diminished capacity.

You got exactly one thing right in all this: Trump undoubtedly will ignore the judge's order, as he has always ignored any legal guidelines whatsoever that he didn't like.

 

[Rightguide]

I have yet to see the first savvy businessman who has had six bankruptcies, one of them from running a casino. You really need to turn off Fox News, my friend.


You got exactly one thing right in all this: Trump undoubtedly will ignore the judge's order, as he has always ignored any legal guidelines whatsoever that he didn't like.

Everything is right.

 

[YDB95]

Everything is right.

Wrong.

 

[RobDownSouth]

And awaaaaaay we go!

You are wrong in your position on birthright citizenship

I am not "wrong", I have a different opinion of the substance of the 14th amendment's "birthright citizenship" text than you do.
I support my position with established case law
You attempt to support your position with conversations which may or may not be fictional between the Amendment's authors, which have no standing whatsover in a court of law.
We are not the same.

and the Seattle Judge who issued his "universal" order is wrong in doing so.

The judge issued a two week temporary nationwide injunction, which is within the scope of his duties.

Federal District Court judges no longer have the authority to enjoin the entire federal government.

Federal judges absolutely retain the authority to enjoin the entire federal government.
Your opinion is not supported by fact.
There is nothing to prohibit a federal judge from issuing a "universal" order.
Nothing whatsover.

Supreme Court precedence in cases over the last four years has stripped the authority of federal district Court judges in doing so.

The Supreme Court has done nothing of the sort.
There is no legal change, Supreme court or otherwise, that affects a federal judge's discretion to issue universal orders. An appeals court or the Supreme court can and occasionally will stay/enjoin an order, or opt to hear arguments in their own court, but they cannot prevent a federal judge from issuing a universal order.

Trump will ignore the judges order.

I would expect no less from a man who repeatedly claimed he would "rule as a dictator" during his campaign.

The judges authority is limited to his district and those people who are before him in his district.

A "district wide" ruling is, admittedly, the typical scope of a federal judge's order.
"Universal orders" are relatively rare (outside of the ultraconservative 5th District in Texas, which appears to enjoy "legislating from the bench", but I digress).
"Universal orders" are typically issued in the case of egregious federal government misconduct.

I believe even you would agree that the Trump administration re-interpreting a Constitutional amendment that has been in effect for over one hundred years to mean something completely different from the original language of the amendment would certainly qualify as "egregious". Ergo, universal order.

The simplest of subjects do require rocket surgery when it comes to informing your diminished capacity.

I will regard your your usual attempt at ad hominem as a de facto admission that you have nothing more to offer in rebuttal that is based on facts or established case law, and will be moving our discussion to Phase Two, where we traditionally swap insults for the next four or so hours until you disappear when you realize that the majority of the board is laughing at you.

Toodles!

 

[Rebel5soul]

You are wrong in your position on birthright citizenship and the Seattle Judge who issued his "universal" order is wrong in doing so. Federal District Court judges no longer have the authority to enjoin the entire federal government. Supreme Court precedence in cases over the last four years has stripped the authority of federal district Court judges in doing so. Trump will ignore the judges order. The judges authority is limited to his district and those people who are before him in his district. The simplest of subjects do require rocket surgery when it comes to informing your diminished capacity.

Correct, His injunction is restricted to the 9th district.

I suspect that a challenge will be engineered in the 5th district, which will be denied (meaning the EO will be found Constitutional). And that is what will transport the case to the SCOTUS.

 

[Politruk]

Correct, His injunction is restricted to the 9th district.

I suspect that a challenge will be engineered in the 5th district, which will be denied (meaning the EO will be found Constitutional). And that is what will transport the case to the SCOTUS.

Nitpick: At the federal level, the country is divided into appellate circuits, and the circuits are divided into trial districts.

With state courts it's the other way around, or at least it is in Florida -- a trial court is a circuit court and an appellate court is a district court.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Well, I must admit to you that you have stumbled on a particular member who is not representative of the whole. My anger and hatred for the extreme right wingers here is of my own. I willingly have admitted on numerous occasions that I come here to troll. I come here to embarrass and humiliate them. Again, I’m not representative of the whole.

I am of the belief that most Americans in social and polite settings can have spirited disagreements that may lead to positive outcomes. That is not what I think happens here. Most conservatives leaning members here come to bullshit and lie. They run from civil debate and questioning of their so called belief systems. I enjoy other members embarrassing them if I am not able to do so myself.

For teh record, you are not alone.

"Curb Stomping" the reactionary right wing whackadoodles here is proscribed in teh Bible, teh Torah AND teh Quran.

Example: "Thou shalt not allow gold buggery, it is an abomination".

People of faith are simply doing what the Lord God, Allah (pbuh), and the Elders of Zion (select one as appropriate) command as proof of faith.