Silencing the voices

[DEFCOM5]

@talemestories and @alohadave,

Thank you for the links. Greatly appreciated.

 

[EmilyMiller]

There's really no need to ridicule the stance you don't share.

So I wrote (as quoted by you):

So anyway, writing and the creative process and whether that can ever be devoid of outside influences. Plus the evils of beta readers and how they will lead to the collapse of civilization (sorry @Voboy - as I say I understand your self-consistent stance fully).

Is it possible that you might have set a new world record for how low a bar can be set for defining ridicule?

Light-hearted, whimsical leg pulling at worst, and not even mentioning you at all. But I guess read into things what you want to .

 

[dirk2024]

You are too kind.
I still feel that I am in the probatory period and I will need to go through the introduction ceremony into the secret society. Or more like an intern, hoping to get a return offer!

If you Venmo me $50, you're in!

 

[DEFCOM5]

If you Venmo me $50, you're in!

$50? Cheap date!

 

[lovecraft68]

I think it is (speaking ONLY for myself). Because my plot was my plot. Now that I've changed it to suit you, it's no longer mine. It's partly yours.

This.

Beta readers picking up inconsistencies or any type of error is the purpose, rewriting your story isn't. People have to hold the line on that.

 

[lovecraft68]

Emily wasn't talking about the difference between vets and newbs contributing to the forum so much as addressing the fact that some people here feel they're the Forum Police, gatekeeping who's allowed to post / comment and how many times, based strictly on who they don't like for their own petty reasons.

"My man Carvelli said..."

Welcome back Kotter if you don't understand the reference.

 

[Dodola]

One thing I've learned in my few months observing AH, is that some are allowed to be assholes, and others are not.
It's easier to be an asshole if you're never held accountable for it.

 

[Voboy]

One thing I've learned in my few months observing AH, is that some are allowed to be assholes, and others are not.
It's easier to be an asshole if you're never held accountable for it.

Accountability usually only works where there's mutual respect, and a few people here don't seem to feel much of that. It's a phenomenon that's been noted before among prior assholes; the current crop actually isn't as bad as some of the past ones.

 

[SimonDoom]

One thing I've learned in my few months observing AH, is that some are allowed to be assholes, and others are not.
It's easier to be an asshole if you're never held accountable for it.

This is social media. Nobody is held accountable in a forum like this one. It's bothersome only if you let it be bothersome.

I think the Author's Hangout is much less vexing and hostile and problematic than some think it is. By social media standards, it's fairly civil, and there are many intelligent, interesting people who participate here.

One of my few critiques of this place is that there's far too much handwringing about things. Just write your stories and express your opinions, let others express their opinions, and stop worrying so much. No good ever comes of it. When I started writing stories here in December 2016 I had no pedigree, experience, or qualifications as a creative writer. None. I was 52 years old and hadn't written a word of fiction in my entire adult life up to that point. I didn't care. I wrote the stories I wanted to write. I made the posts I wanted to post. I never accepted the idea that anyone, merely by criticizing me or expressing an opinion I disagreed with, was limiting me in any way.

When people write in this thread about "gatekeepers," I don't know what they are talking about. There are no gatekeepers. You're free to express your opinion. People are creating boogeymen in their minds. Stop fretting and just write and express your opinion and see what happens.

 

[SimonDoom]

Accountability usually only works where there's mutual respect, and a few people here don't seem to feel much of that. It's a phenomenon that's been noted before among prior assholes; the current crop actually isn't as bad as some of the past ones.

This is true. When I landed here in December 2016 it was at the tail end of a period that was far more toxic and nasty than anything we see now.

 

[Voboy]

This is true. When I landed here in December 2016 it was at the tail end of a period that was far more toxic and nasty than anything we see now.

I arrived around the same time. It was... interesting. And I constantly had the sense it had been even more interesting a few months before.

 

[MelissaBaby]

This is true. When I landed here in December 2016 it was at the tail end of a period that was far more toxic and nasty than anything we see now.

If I ran Lit, new members would be required to make at least 100 posts on the General Board before they could post anywhere else. The amount of bellyaching on the other boards would plummet.

 

[SimonDoom]

If I ran Lit, new members would be required to make at least 100 posts on the General Board before they could post anywhere else. The amount of bellyaching on the other boards would plummet.

True, but if they were forced to spend that time at the General Board they might come to the Author's Hangout with white hair, a shocked expression, and a state of catatonia. A little boot camp is one thing, but that seems excessive.

 

[Dodola]

This is social media. Nobody is held accountable in a forum like this one. It's bothersome only if you let it be bothersome.

I think the Author's Hangout is much less vexing and hostile and problematic than some think it is. By social media standards, it's fairly civil, and there are many intelligent, interesting people who participate here.

One of my few critiques of this place is that there's far too much handwringing about things. Just write your stories and express your opinions, let others express their opinions, and stop worrying so much. No good ever comes of it. When I started writing stories here in December 2016 I had no pedigree, experience, or qualifications as a creative writer. None. I was 52 years old and hadn't written a word of fiction in my entire adult life up to that point. I didn't care. I wrote the stories I wanted to write. I made the posts I wanted to post. I never accepted the idea that anyone, merely by criticizing me or expressing an opinion I disagreed with, was limiting me in any way.

When people write in this thread about "gatekeepers," I don't know what they are talking about. There are no gatekeepers. You're free to express your opinion. People are creating boogeymen in their minds. Stop fretting and just write and express your opinion and see what happens.

I realize my experience is a very small snapshot in time.

My interpretation of the gatekeepers are what djmac described above:
the self-appointed messengers/lecturers/rule enforcers who express their opinions as facts, then resort to personal attacks when anyone disagrees, or they're losing the argument.

There's a small group of people who will then respond and defend their chosen gatekeeper, often trying to explain what said gatekeeper meant, instead of the asshole things they actually said, and the gatekeeper milks that loyalty regularly.

It's very hypocritical to defend one person being an asshole, while calling out others.

I'm pretty sure most observers of AH are familiar with all of this, but many seem content to stay quietly out of the way.

I'm working on doing that myself.

 

[talemestories]

If I ran Lit, new members would be required to make at least 100 posts on the General Board before they could post anywhere else. The amount of bellyaching on the other boards would plummet.

I disagree.

I don't post anywhere else as I find the other forums to be questionable in nature.

If I were pressed, I might limit this forum to those that actually write and IF you posted elsewhere, you couldn't post in here.

 

[talemestories]

True, but if they were forced to spend that time at the General Board they might come to the Author's Hangout with white hair, a shocked expression, and a state of catatonia. A little boot camp is one thing, but that seems excessive.

A possible option might be five published stories before you get access to AH.

 

[MelissaBaby]

I disagree.

I don't post anywhere else as I find the other forums to be questionable in nature.

Well, that was more or less the point of my tongue in cheek comment. After a few weeks on the GB, the AH looks like Sesame Street.

 

[MelissaBaby]

A possible option might be five published stories before you get access to AH.

My objection to that would be that the newest authors are the ones most likely to benefit from the discussions on the AH.

 

[Djmac1031]

I disagree.

I don't post anywhere else as I find the other forums to be questionable in nature.

If I were pressed, I might limit this forum to those that actually write and IF you posted elsewhere, you couldn't post in here.

See, that I disagree with.

I think all should be allowed in this forum, writers and readers. And while it's called the Authors Hangout, I certainly dont think the topics should be limited to strictly writing.

Now that opinion I KNOW some do not agree with, which is where the attempts at gatekeeping come in. People who feel only certain topics should be discussed here, and complain about anyone who tries to branch out, start new topics, discuss fresh ideas that may or may not directly deal with writing.

To me, it's such a simple matter to ignore threads and topics I'm not interested in discussing and gravitate towards those I am interested in.

I can also ignore posts and comments by people I don't like or get along with and simply move on.

I don't know why this is such a hard concept for some.

 

[old_prof]

If I ran Lit, new members would be required to make at least 100 posts on the General Board before they could post anywhere else. The amount of bellyaching on the other boards would plummet.

It would have kept me out, but that might be part of the point...

 

[AwkwardMD]

The problem with "some people" is that they're always doing that thing. You know what I mean.

Or, at least, you do if you're cool.

 

[YmaOHyd]

The problem with "some people" is that they're always doing that thing. You know what I mean.

My personal life is not on trial here!

 

[TheWritingGroup]

This.

Beta readers picking up inconsistencies or any type of error is the purpose, rewriting your story isn't. People have to hold the line on that.

That's a very specific and incorrect unusual definition of beta reading. In fact, it's the definition of copyediting.

--Annie

 

[ColtonWrites]

A possible option might be five published stories before you get access to AH.

Or at least one

 

[Voboy]

A possible option might be five published stories before you get access to AH.

Is the AH overrun with non-writers? Or am I simply not looking at the threads the non-writers are posting in?