The Wind Industry Just Took A Massive Hit, I hope It's Just The Beginning

[eric_erosfan]

We installed ground-to-air (geothermal) heat pumps on a couple of houses we built. Significant upfront costs but damn those things work great. Quiet too.

Air-to-air heat pumps are standard on all new construction around here, but the geothermal units are still fairly rare.

It was 3 degrees Fahrenheit the other morning but 70 in the guest house. That is Jesus level miracle science to me. I am a believer.

 

[Rightguide]

Thank you, the weatherguardwind podcast transcript cleared up the issue.

Okay as I understand it:

• There are three separate Indian Nation treaties in the US: "Untamed" (Western US). "Tame" (Eastern US) and.....Osage.
• Osage is different from everyone else. Why? Because the US government purchase a chunk of the existing Cherokee reservation in Oklahoma and relocated every Osage native American to their new "homeland".
• Unlike other Indian reservations, the US government gave the Osage the exclusive right to manage mineral rights (i.e. "let's have the white men come in and rob them blind"). BOTH sides wanted this, and got it.
• The Osage HATED their new reservation, and 98% of them moved out to happier hunting grounds. According to the last census, there were exactly TWO Native American families living there. 98% white Okie trash.
• 2010, Enel leased 8400 acres for the expressed purpose of building a wind farm on some of this unbuildable rocky land.
• Like you and I, Enel had the absolute right to blast rock to build concrete foundation
• Attornies for the Osage nation took them to court and said "Digging foundations is technically MINING!" and got laughed out of court
• Then sharp Osage eyes noticed that Enel was trucking the "blown up" rock away to a commercial rock grinder, turning it into gravel, then bringing it back and using the gravel to "top off" the foundation of the windmill. Saved the company a lot of money by reusing your own rocks!
• Osage Nation went BACK to court and said "See? Rock being excavated, trucked away, turned into gravel. This is MINING!"
• Court said hmm let's think about this one.
• Enel used the delay to rush windmills to completion in record time, they worked 3 shifts 24 hours a day.
• Osage asked the court for an injunction. Court gave a temporary stop order. ENEL IGNORED IT.
• Osage asked Bureau of Whatever Indian Affairs is called now for a ruling, Enel got a cease and desist order, ENEL IGNORED IT.
• Enel put energy plant online to national grid, said ta-daaaah, we're operational now, Osage nation lawsuit is moot, we're not doing anything anymore with crushed rock. No foul right?
• Lawsuit goes very slowly through the Department of Justice, is kicked to "international affairs" since Osage is still technically a "sovereign nation" dealing with the sovereign nation of the USA.
• International Law Judge finds Enel paying to have excavated useless boulders into gravel and paying for it was , in fact, technically "mining"
• Worse, the court found Enel acted in "bad faith" by ignoring federal court order AND accelerating construction in an attempt to circumvent the legal system, and drops the "nuclear option"...."Take it all down and put it back the way it was" Federal courts take a very dim view of people not named Donald J. Trump thumbing their nose at the legal system.
• Nobody really thinks they'll take the windmills down, Enel will likely pay millions of dollars in restitution (they should have settled in 2010 for about a million but they played hardball back then, now they're paying out the ass). All the scattered remnants with 1/8th Osage blood will be buying new RVs, ATVs, and big screen TVs this year as a result.

There is a deadline date in the court's order for complete removal.

 

[Rightguide]

The Osage are like taxi drivers who tap their brakes to get hit for the whiplash claims.

Lowest on the tribe ladder.

The mighty Comanche, once the rulers of the Southern Plains are no more. They had to be wiped out so Rob could live down south in Texas.

 

[ll74]

Wind energy works for producing energy.

As with all energy production, it has drawbacks.

Deciding that some energy production shouldn't be explored because shit happens is dumb.

That includes wind, solar, oil, gas.

When these wind farms are taken down, no one will need to arrive to "clean" up shit.

 

[Rightguide]

Wind energy has it's place but the wind fantasy of running any significant part of the grid from wind has always been foolish. Foolish ideas run their coarse and flop. The same thing is true of running the grid by capturing the energy signature of fairy dust and converting it to thermal energy to run steam turbines for electrical power. There are lots of fairy's but not enough dust to make it work.

Yet in many places they still stand to pollute the vista, assault the eye, slaughter the Golden Eagle, and many other species.

 

[ll74]

Yet in many places they still stand to pollute the vista, assault the eye, slaughter the Golden Eagle, and many other species.

Wind farms don't cause pollution

Whether you like seeing them isn't a factor in that.

 

[dmallord]

Yet in many places they still stand to pollute the vista, assault the eye, slaughter the Golden Eagle, and many other species.

Wind turbines cause bird deaths, particularly among raptors and migratory birds, but their impact is relatively small compared to other human activities.

• A 2014 study estimated that U.S. wind turbines kill about 140,000 to 328,000 birds annually. In contrast:
  • Collisions with buildings kill hundreds of millions of birds each year.
  • Cats kill 1.3 to 4 billion birds annually in the U.S. alone.
  • Fossil fuel plants indirectly kill birds through habitat destruction and pollution, including climate change impacts.

It can be said that: hydroelectric dams, coal-powered plants, nuclear-powered plants, electrical substations, and electrical grid structures strung throughout the nation also stand to pollute the vista, assault the eye, and piss off naturalists. A person with critical thinking skills doesn't want to eliminate those and return to the past for a clean landscape view. Right?

We could focus on animal control of cats in particular and save a lot of winged critters. Let's spay and neuter those furry home pets. Get on your soap box for that.

 

[dmallord]

Wind farms don't cause pollution

Whether you like seeing them isn't a factor in that.

Except for the EOL equipment disposal.

Fibreglass is not totally recyclable. It's non-biodegradable and made up of a composite of very fine strands of plastic and glass, which is extremely difficult to process at the point of recycling. Instead, it's usually discarded as waste at landfills or incinerated. New methods are being developed to increase recycling. It's an ongoing process of improvement.

People who pontificate about birds being killed fail to realize that few windmills kill humans.

That's a point they ignore and veer toward, blaming things like Democrats as the cause of bird deaths rather than the mass-killing capabilities of firearms in the hands of crazies.

'Drill baby, drill!"

 

[Rightguide]

Wind farms don't cause pollution

Whether you like seeing them isn't a factor in that.

That is an ignorant lie. The proper disposal of their worn out blade are an emerging environmental problem. A simple search reveals the following:

The Problem:​

1. Material Composition: Wind turbine blades are primarily made of composite materials like fiberglass and resin, which are durable and difficult to recycle.
2. Longevity: Blades typically last 20–25 years. As older wind farms are decommissioned or upgraded, the number of retired blades is increasing rapidly.
3. Size and Weight: Blades are enormous, often spanning over 50 meters, making transportation and disposal logistically challenging.
4. Landfill Impact: Many blades are currently sent to landfills, where they occupy significant space and degrade very slowly, contributing to environmental concerns.

Emerging Solutions:​

1. Recycling Technologies:
   • Mechanical Recycling: Shredding blades into smaller pieces for use as filler material in concrete or other industrial products.
   • Chemical Recycling: Breaking down composite materials into their base components for reuse.
   • Pyrolysis: Heating materials in the absence of oxygen to recover fibers and resins.
2. Repurposing:
   • Using decommissioned blades in innovative ways, such as constructing bridges, playgrounds, shelters, or street furniture.
   • Transforming blades into raw materials for other industries.
3. Circular Design:
   • Designing blades with end-of-life considerations, using materials that are easier to recycle or biodegrade.
   • Developing modular blades that can be upgraded or repaired without complete replacement.
4. Policy and Regulation:
   • Governments and industry groups are working to set recycling mandates and encourage investment in sustainable disposal methods.
   • Extended Producer Responsibility (EPR) programs could require manufacturers to manage the end-of-life processing of their products.
5. Alternative Materials:
   • Research into biodegradable composites or other sustainable materials could mitigate future disposal challenges.

Challenges to Overcome:​

• High costs of recycling versus landfill disposal.
• Limited infrastructure for large-scale blade recycling.
• Need for collaboration between manufacturers, governments, and recyclers to develop efficient systems.

Addressing this issue will require coordinated efforts across industries and innovation in materials science, logistics, and waste management. You should get busy catching up with those who are familiar with the issues involved.

 

[ll74]

That is an ignorant lie. The proper disposal of their worn out blade are an emerging environmental problem. A simple search reveals the following:

The Problem:​

1. Material Composition: Wind turbine blades are primarily made of composite materials like fiberglass and resin, which are durable and difficult to recycle.
2. Longevity: Blades typically last 20–25 years. As older wind farms are decommissioned or upgraded, the number of retired blades is increasing rapidly.
3. Size and Weight: Blades are enormous, often spanning over 50 meters, making transportation and disposal logistically challenging.
4. Landfill Impact: Many blades are currently sent to landfills, where they occupy significant space and degrade very slowly, contributing to environmental concerns.

Emerging Solutions:​

1. Recycling Technologies:
   • Mechanical Recycling: Shredding blades into smaller pieces for use as filler material in concrete or other industrial products.
   • Chemical Recycling: Breaking down composite materials into their base components for reuse.
   • Pyrolysis: Heating materials in the absence of oxygen to recover fibers and resins.
2. Repurposing:
   • Using decommissioned blades in innovative ways, such as constructing bridges, playgrounds, shelters, or street furniture.
   • Transforming blades into raw materials for other industries.
3. Circular Design:
   • Designing blades with end-of-life considerations, using materials that are easier to recycle or biodegrade.
   • Developing modular blades that can be upgraded or repaired without complete replacement.
4. Policy and Regulation:
   • Governments and industry groups are working to set recycling mandates and encourage investment in sustainable disposal methods.
   • Extended Producer Responsibility (EPR) programs could require manufacturers to manage the end-of-life processing of their products.
5. Alternative Materials:
   • Research into biodegradable composites or other sustainable materials could mitigate future disposal challenges.

Challenges to Overcome:​

• High costs of recycling versus landfill disposal.
• Limited infrastructure for large-scale blade recycling.
• Need for collaboration between manufacturers, governments, and recyclers to develop efficient systems.

Addressing this issue will require coordinated efforts across industries and innovation in materials science, logistics, and waste management. You should get busy catching up with those who are familiar with the issues involved.

No do coal plants.

 

[Rightguide]

No do coal plants.

Non sequitur.

 

[RobDownSouth]

There is a deadline date in the court's order for complete removal.

Yes, I saw that. I also recall our self-proclaimed "Board Legal Expert" Derpy chirping about "no case is truly resolved until the Fat Appeals Lady sings".

My feeling is that this case is screwy enough to merit an appeal look-see. Who knows, it might be open and shut. But I'm willing to bet that the windmills will not be torn down regardless of the verdict and/or appeal. Like the de facto president-elect Elon Musk says, "Everyone has a price".

I'll book mark this thread and bump it when we find out the ultimate disposition.

 

[Rightguide]

Yes, I saw that. I also recall our self-proclaimed "Board Legal Expert" Derpy chirping about "no case is truly resolved until the Fat Appeals Lady sings".

My feeling is that this case is screwy enough to merit an appeal look-see. Who knows, it might be open and shut. But I'm willing to bet that the windmills will not be torn down regardless of the verdict and/or appeal. Like the de facto president-elect Elon Musk says, "Everyone has a price".

I'll book mark this thread and bump it when we find out the ultimate disposition.

Maybe but how old is this case 14 or 15 years old? The Appeals Court may be tired enough to let it stand.

 

[ll74]

Non sequitur.

If you're not a serious person about your argument, then yes.

 

[HumpDayHoratio]

That is an ignorant lie. The proper disposal of their worn out blade are an emerging environmental problem. A simple search reveals the following:

The Problem:​

1. Material Composition: Wind turbine blades are primarily made of composite materials like fiberglass and resin, which are durable and difficult to recycle.
2. Longevity: Blades typically last 20–25 years. As older wind farms are decommissioned or upgraded, the number of retired blades is increasing rapidly.
3. Size and Weight: Blades are enormous, often spanning over 50 meters, making transportation and disposal logistically challenging.
4. Landfill Impact: Many blades are currently sent to landfills, where they occupy significant space and degrade very slowly, contributing to environmental concerns.

Emerging Solutions:​

1. Recycling Technologies:
   • Mechanical Recycling: Shredding blades into smaller pieces for use as filler material in concrete or other industrial products.
   • Chemical Recycling: Breaking down composite materials into their base components for reuse.
   • Pyrolysis: Heating materials in the absence of oxygen to recover fibers and resins.
2. Repurposing:
   • Using decommissioned blades in innovative ways, such as constructing bridges, playgrounds, shelters, or street furniture.
   • Transforming blades into raw materials for other industries.
3. Circular Design:
   • Designing blades with end-of-life considerations, using materials that are easier to recycle or biodegrade.
   • Developing modular blades that can be upgraded or repaired without complete replacement.
4. Policy and Regulation:
   • Governments and industry groups are working to set recycling mandates and encourage investment in sustainable disposal methods.
   • Extended Producer Responsibility (EPR) programs could require manufacturers to manage the end-of-life processing of their products.
5. Alternative Materials:
   • Research into biodegradable composites or other sustainable materials could mitigate future disposal challenges.

Challenges to Overcome:​

• High costs of recycling versus landfill disposal.
• Limited infrastructure for large-scale blade recycling.
• Need for collaboration between manufacturers, governments, and recyclers to develop efficient systems.

Addressing this issue will require coordinated efforts across industries and innovation in materials science, logistics, and waste management. You should get busy catching up with those who are familiar with the issues involved.

Don’t forget about the lube!

1. Oil Usage: Wind turbines require up to 800 gallons of gear oil and 1200 gallons of transformer oil, contributing to environmental concerns.
2. Blade Disposal: The non-recyclable nature of wind turbine blades leads to burial, posing challenges for sustainability.
3. Diesel Engines: Windmills rely on diesel engines for initiation and electric heating in gearboxes, impacting oil usage.
4. Proper Maintenance: Proper oil disposal and management are essential to minimize the environmental impact of wind turbine oil usage.

 

[ll74]

Don’t forget about the lube!

1. Oil Usage: Wind turbines require up to 800 gallons of gear oil and 1200 gallons of transformer oil, contributing to environmental concerns.
2. Blade Disposal: The non-recyclable nature of wind turbine blades leads to burial, posing challenges for sustainability.
3. Diesel Engines: Windmills rely on diesel engines for initiation and electric heating in gearboxes, impacting oil usage.
4. Proper Maintenance: Proper oil disposal and management are essential to minimize the environmental impact of wind turbine oil usage.

This is fun - now do coal power plants.

Especially the coal ash into the rivers that lead to downstream health concerns.

I'm sure RFKjr is on this one.

 

[UltraChad]

What a stupid thing to cheer about.

Why??

Because you support the windmill stupidity??

What a fucking retard.

 

[Lance_Castro]

The usual suspects, all tilting at windmills.

Lol

 

[ll74]

The usual suspects, all tilting at windmills.

Lol

The thread: posted hours ago

Lance: I've got the perfect joke....just need the proper timing ..

 

[RobDownSouth]

The mighty Comanche, once the rulers of the Southern Plains are no more. They had to be wiped out so Rob could live down south in Texas.

RobDownSouth's Summary History of the Comanches in Texas​

• Rightguide above is referring to the Penataka group of the Comanches. The Penataka group were largely the only group of migratory Comanches.
• Comanches were unique among Native American for three reasons:
  • They had no overall "Chief".
  • Comanches had no "tribal structure", they were a loosely affiliated band of 12 groups
  • Comanches were the absolute last group of Native Americans to learn to domesticate and ride horses, a considerable handicap back then.
• The Penataka group of Comanches were basically the MAGA party of Native Americans, they grifted and looted and stole from other nearby Native Americans (Apache and other Comanche bands), then sold their loot to travelling bands of offshore-born immigrants from Europe, mostly French and German settlers.
• The Penatakas roamed roughly 100 miles per year, to stay one step ahead of all the tribes they'd plundered.
• They traveled directly southward deep into Texas, finally stopping 50 miles outside of San Antonio when they decided it was too fucking hot to continue.
• In the meantime, Spanish conquistadors were pillaging and plundering upwards from Mexico. They engaged in kicking the asses of both the Apache and Pueblo tribes, who eventually had enough of Mexican thundersticks and tucked tail and slunk westward out of Texas to "friendlier" New Mexico territory.
• It's important to know that both the Penatakas and Spanish conquistadors arrived around San Antonio within a year of each other. Land usage was very much undecided.
• The Comanche preyed on weakened bands of Apaches and Navajo refugees for a couple of years, selling stuff to the relatively well-off Spanish settlers. When that source of income dried up, they looted remote Spanish settlers and sometimes kidnapped them too, ransoming the Spanish goods (and women and children) back to them,selling them back their own kin and goods.
• Then the American army showed up and all hell broke loose. After Davy Crockett and Jim Bowie single-handedly routed General Santa Ana's army, the Spanish tucked tail and ran.
• The Pentataka Comanches did what they do best, picked off the stragglers and sold Spanish plunder to their new clients, the Americans.
• Eventually the Spanish plunder was no more, so the Penetakas reverted to their "classic" form and started their usual looting (cattle mostly) and eventually kidnapping American settlers, who were noticeably poorer than the relatively well-off Spaniards.
• The Pentataka Comanches thought nothing of capturing women and children, that was the way they survived. When the number of kidnapped Americans reached forty, the American government raised a white flag of truce and offered to negotiate for the release of the American hostages. They guaranteed safety of Comanche leaders for the duration of the truce.
• The American leaders went "Full Trump", negotiated in bad faith, thinking they could bully the Comanche into ransoming all of the American hostages. Finally the frustrated American military commander declared the "truce was over, effective immediately, commence firing!" and the Army slaughtered all 33 Comanche Pentataka leaders at the table (a precursor to Game of Thrones Red Wedding!!)
• American then destroyed the Comanche settlement right outside of San Antonio and it was on like Donkey Kong.
• Obviously, all hell broke loose in the aftermath. The Pentakas went on a burning and looting war with levels of carnage not seen until Israel invaded Gaza in 2023. Six bloody years of conflict with no resolution.
• The Comanche tribe looted every four legged herd animal they could find within a two hundred mile radius, then retreated northward with vast herds of horses, mules, cattle and sheep.
• Finally, the titular leader of the burning and looting crew, Buffalo Hump, negotiated a treaty with the US government where each tribal member was given 160 acres of land in what is now Oklahoma.
• This was a trap, the Indian had to sign an affidavit freely admitting he was an Indian. A number of Indians refused to sign, because they could and did "pass for white" and declaring themselves to be "Indian" established they were to be treated more harshly than black people if they visited a town. A virtual death sentence for traders.
• In the end, it didn't matter as the sheer number of white settlers arriving caused the military to renege on their land agreements and pushed Indians out of their homes.

But it's worth noting the Comanche never reached Houston. The closest the Comanche got was Victoria, Texas, which was a good 120 miles away, which was quite a distance to travel in those days.

 

[RobDownSouth]

The thread: posted hours ago

Lance: I've got the perfect joke....just need the proper timing ..

You gotta admit, that comment was very droll, one seldom sees that sort of humor coming out of Lance a lot.

 

[LLCox]

. Don't know how the hell something like that navigates 90 degree turns.

I watched a section of a bridge make a 180 on a four lane. The tail end of the bridge section was just a double set of independent tires and nothing else from there underneath to the cab. Fifty point turn I'm guessing.

 

[Rightguide]

RobDownSouth's Summary History of the Comanches in Texas​

• Rightguide above is referring to the Penataka group of the Comanches. The Penataka group were largely the only group of migratory Comanches.
• Comanches were unique among Native American for three reasons:
  • They had no overall "Chief".
  • Comanches had no "tribal structure", they were a loosely affiliated band of 12 groups
  • Comanches were the absolute last group of Native Americans to learn to domesticate and ride horses, a considerable handicap back then.
• The Penataka group of Comanches were basically the MAGA party of Native Americans, they grifted and looted and stole from other nearby Native Americans (Apache and other Comanche bands), then sold their loot to travelling bands of offshore-born immigrants from Europe, mostly French and German settlers.
• The Penatakas roamed roughly 100 miles per year, to stay one step ahead of all the tribes they'd plundered.
• They traveled directly southward deep into Texas, finally stopping 50 miles outside of San Antonio when they decided it was too fucking hot to continue.
• In the meantime, Spanish conquistadors were pillaging and plundering upwards from Mexico. They engaged in kicking the asses of both the Apache and Pueblo tribes, who eventually had enough of Mexican thundersticks and tucked tail and slunk westward out of Texas to "friendlier" New Mexico territory.
• It's important to know that both the Penatakas and Spanish conquistadors arrived around San Antonio within a year of each other. Land usage was very much undecided.
• The Comanche preyed on weakened bands of Apaches and Navajo refugees for a couple of years, selling stuff to the relatively well-off Spanish settlers. When that source of income dried up, they looted remote Spanish settlers and sometimes kidnapped them too, ransoming the Spanish goods (and women and children) back to them,selling them back their own kin and goods.
• Then the American army showed up and all hell broke loose. After Davy Crockett and Jim Bowie single-handedly routed General Santa Ana's army, the Spanish tucked tail and ran.
• The Pentataka Comanches did what they do best, picked off the stragglers and sold Spanish plunder to their new clients, the Americans.
• Eventually the Spanish plunder was no more, so the Penetakas reverted to their "classic" form and started their usual looting (cattle mostly) and eventually kidnapping American settlers, who were noticeably poorer than the relatively well-off Spaniards.
• The Pentataka Comanches thought nothing of capturing women and children, that was the way they survived. When the number of kidnapped Americans reached forty, the American government raised a white flag of truce and offered to negotiate for the release of the American hostages. They guaranteed safety of Comanche leaders for the duration of the truce.
• The American leaders went "Full Trump", negotiated in bad faith, thinking they could bully the Comanche into ransoming all of the American hostages. Finally the frustrated American military commander declared the "truce was over, effective immediately, commence firing!" and the Army slaughtered all 33 Comanche Pentataka leaders at the table (a precursor to Game of Thrones Red Wedding!!)
• American then destroyed the Comanche settlement right outside of San Antonio and it was on like Donkey Kong.
• Obviously, all hell broke loose in the aftermath. The Pentakas went on a burning and looting war with levels of carnage not seen until Israel invaded Gaza in 2023. Six bloody years of conflict with no resolution.
• The Comanche tribe looted every four legged herd animal they could find within a two hundred mile radius, then retreated northward with vast herds of horses, mules, cattle and sheep.
• Finally, the titular leader of the burning and looting crew, Buffalo Hump, negotiated a treaty with the US government where each tribal member was given 160 acres of land in what is now Oklahoma.
• This was a trap, the Indian had to sign an affidavit freely admitting he was an Indian. A number of Indians refused to sign, because they could and did "pass for white" and declaring themselves to be "Indian" established they were to be treated more harshly than black people if they visited a town. A virtual death sentence for traders.
• In the end, it didn't matter as the sheer number of white settlers arriving caused the military to renege on their land agreements and pushed Indians out of their homes.

But it's worth noting the Comanche never reached Houston. The closest the Comanche got was Victoria, Texas, which was a good 120 miles away, which was quite a distance to travel in those days.

I think that info on domestication of the horse is false. The Horse was reintroduced into North America by the Spanish in 1492 and would have come into contact with the Comanche before any of the Northern Plains Indians. A search reveals the following:

"While not the first to domesticate horses, the Comanche are widely considered to be among the first Native American tribes to acquire horses from the Spanish and successfully incorporate them into their way of life, becoming renowned for their equestrian skills and reliance on horses for hunting and warfare; essentially making them one of the first "horse cultures" on the North American plains.

Key points about the Comanche and horses:

• Early acquisition:
  The Comanche were among the first tribes to obtain horses, likely through trade or raiding Spanish settlements.
  
• Horse breeding:
  They were also one of the few tribes to actively breed horses, further solidifying their equestrian culture.
  
• Impact on Plains culture:
  Their mastery of horseback warfare influenced other Plains tribes who later adopted similar practices."
  
  They did have notable chiefs as well. Here's a list of ten of the most notable:
  
  https://www.havefunwithhistory.com/famous-comanche-chiefs/
  
  
  
  
  
  
  

 

[Philthy_Phil]

Why??

Because you support the windmill stupidity??

What a fucking retard.

Lmao, oh look, the emo cuck chimed in with it's usual stupidity.

 

[Politruk]

Fossil fuels and nuclear are better options.

Why?