U.S. politics isolation tank

[JMohegan]

So, anyone talking about Krystal Ball (unfortunate name).

She's actually running here against Wittman, who's a typical Old White Guy ;-)

Anyway, so our home phone is getting the automated phone calls and my oldest answered the one from Krystal Ball and as the kid was having a MUCH MORE IMPORTANT conversation, she yelled at the recording "MY MOM IS VOTING FOR YOU ALREADY BECAUSE YOU HAD SEX!"

So. My lessons: 1. My kid hears every.damn.thing. even if I think I'm out of earshot.

2. She doesn't LISTEN to everything so comes out with half assed shit that must sound really great when she tells her teachers at school!

Anyway, while Ball can be compared to Palin in a way by being pushed to the forefront quickly, I really admire the way she didn't back down because an embarassing photo surfaced. Of course, she was not doing anything illegal or really immoral - she was messing around with her husband after all, and it was a fake penis ;-)

The public dispersal of Ms. Ball's Halloween pics = a cautionary tale for the tweeting facebook generation. Not that I expect them to listen.

 

[00Syd]

The public dispersal of Ms. Ball's Halloween pics = a cautionary tale for the tweeting facebook generation. Not that I expect them to listen.

 

[JMohegan]

..

 

[sb2009]

Honestly, this is life, this is how it is. So, unless our public leaders are going to be very very different from everyone else, people will just have to accept that OMG PEOPLE SOMETIMES DO SILLY SHIT and it's doesn't mean they can't be a public servant.

I think it's high time, myself. There have been a million times I have thought to myself "I could never do *insert thing* because i have not led a textbook life." That, to me, is crap.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Honestly, this is life, this is how it is. So, unless our public leaders are going to be very very different from everyone else, people will just have to accept that OMG PEOPLE SOMETIMES DO SILLY SHIT and it's doesn't mean they can't be a public servant.

I think it's high time, myself. There have been a million times I have thought to myself "I could never do *insert thing* because i have not led a textbook life." That, to me, is crap.

I think this is changing somewhat, thank god. And it'll have to. With FB and Twitter and smartphones no one will be immune from stupid stuff. It'll just be "how stupid?" and "Is it completely hypocritical to their policy positions?"

Humor! I get it. Let me try

Tips for democrat candidates:

<snip>

And remember if you lose, try again in 2012. When the base of the democrat party will put down their bongs, be out on parole, and be mesmerized by the only president in history to need a teleprompter to order a pizza from Dominos.

I'll bet your stuff was good satire, WD. But I mostly tuned out after you did that creepy right wing radio thing where they refuse to say the real name of the party, because it sounds too complimentary or whatever. It's the Democratic Party. Democrat-ic. Democratic platform. Democratic candidates. Or do you regularly refer to the GOP as the Republic Party, nominator of those Republic candidates?

 

[WriterDom]

I think this is changing somewhat, thank god. And it'll have to. With FB and Twitter and smartphones no one will be immune from stupid stuff. It'll just be "how stupid?" and "Is it completely hypocritical to their policy positions?"



I'll bet your stuff was good satire, WD. But I mostly tuned out after you did that creepy right wing radio thing where they refuse to say the real name of the party, because it sounds too complimentary or whatever. It's the Democratic Party. Democrat-ic. Democratic platform. Democratic candidates. Or do you regularly refer to the GOP as the Republic Party, nominator of those Republic candidates?

Ok, so you are a democratic. Are you one of those democratics who feel they are losing because the party isn't far left enough?

 

[midwestyankee]

I think this is changing somewhat, thank god. And it'll have to. With FB and Twitter and smartphones no one will be immune from stupid stuff. It'll just be "how stupid?" and "Is it completely hypocritical to their policy positions?"



I'll bet your stuff was good satire, WD. But I mostly tuned out after you did that creepy right wing radio thing where they refuse to say the real name of the party, because it sounds too complimentary or whatever. It's the Democratic Party. Democrat-ic. Democratic platform. Democratic candidates. Or do you regularly refer to the GOP as the Republic Party, nominator of those Republic candidates?

Ok, so you are a democratic. Are you one of those democratics who feel they are losing because the party isn't far left enough?

You know, WD, sometimes you have interesting and thought-provoking things to say in these political discussions. But just as often it seems like all you're doing is parroting Rush and his ilk. I know that I, for one, would take your ideas a lot more seriously if you'd cut back on the talk-radio baloney and present your own thoughts in your own words more often.

Otherwise, it's like trying to discuss professional development with Wile. E. Coyote.

 

[intothewoods]

Heh heh. I read that a lot of high school kids now delete their facebook profiles during college admissions season. I think it really will be interesting to see how social media is used. I kinda feel like there will be a backlash at some point, but who knows exactly how it will play out. I just don't think we will get to a point where oversharing is boring or not worth it.

Honestly, this is life, this is how it is. So, unless our public leaders are going to be very very different from everyone else, people will just have to accept that OMG PEOPLE SOMETIMES DO SILLY SHIT and it's doesn't mean they can't be a public servant.

I think it's high time, myself. There have been a million times I have thought to myself "I could never do *insert thing* because i have not led a textbook life." That, to me, is crap.

I feel like it's in poor taste to put photos like that on Facebook, political candidate or not. On the other hand? That she went to a private party dressed like that? I could care less. She has a sense of humor and isn't uptight about her sexuality.

 

[sb2009]

Heh heh. I read that a lot of high school kids now delete their facebook profiles during college admissions season. I think it really will be interesting to see how social media is used. I kinda feel like there will be a backlash at some point, but who knows exactly how it will play out. I just don't think we will get to a point where oversharing is boring or not worth it.



I feel like it's in poor taste to put photos like that on Facebook, political candidate or not. On the other hand? That she went to a private party dressed like that? I could care less. She has a sense of humor and isn't uptight about her sexuality.

well, in this case, the photos were not on any public forum or the internet. Someone who attended the party gave them to a source who used them in some sort of "advertising" - which was not endorsed by her opponent, but went as far as to compare her to a whore. Which was a bit far for antics with ones spouse at a halloween party, no matter who you are, I think.

I have been thinking though, that there is a positive side to this. Unless you know you want to be in politics from a very early age, is it really realistic to be on guard every second for something that may look stupid and cost an election? So I'm in my 40's now and may feel the need to "do something" about my local school board. Should I just figure I'm not good enough because they could dig up shit about me? Sure, if the crap is stuff about me molesting kids, that would make a difference. But what if it's me dancing topless at a certain club in Savannah on a dare? I'd like to see that day when things that *do not* have to do with a person's ability/dedication/quality of service don't put an end to them jumping in the game.

Sure, it's a pipe dream. But I do see that it's where we are headed....there is so little privacy about stuff, I hope we can let it expand opportunities for us all instead of limiting even more people. Or we'll only be left with blue-bloods who have the money to cover up their dirty deeds.

 

[WriterDom]

You know, WD, sometimes you have interesting and thought-provoking things to say in these political discussions. But just as often it seems like all you're doing is parroting Rush and his ilk. I know that I, for one, would take your ideas a lot more seriously if you'd cut back on the talk-radio baloney and present your own thoughts in your own words more often.

Otherwise, it's like trying to discuss professional development with Wile. E. Coyote.

It's really hard to have a serious discussion with as well. Since you believe all opposition to Obama is based on some "Ivy League" envy bullshit, or racism, or worse yet, that the right is somehow upset that Obama's mother married an African.

You and Obama have a real problem with this "Rush, Fox News, and WSJ" bellyaching. All your problems would be over if you could just manage all the fucking airways, right? Honestly, you bring up Rush twice a week. If it bothers you so much move the dial to NPR. You know, where Juan worked before George Soros had him fired?

 

[sb2009]

I may be wrong, but the whole "Rush" thing is that he's .... not anyone who makes any sense and isn't someone that anyone can take seriously. He's like a street corner preacher. And the people that quote him appear to be as mentally ill as he does. He's not sane. Or he's really sane and know he makes a ton of money playing into fear. Either way, he's not someone to use as a talking point for what works about the Republican party or neo-cons in general.

 

[JMohegan]

I'll bet your stuff was good satire, WD. But I mostly tuned out after you did that creepy right wing radio thing where they refuse to say the real name of the party, because it sounds too complimentary or whatever. It's the Democratic Party. Democrat-ic. Democratic platform. Democratic candidates. Or do you regularly refer to the GOP as the Republic Party, nominator of those Republic candidates?

WD doesn't respect Democrats or the Democratic Party. This is not news.

Just as I don't respect the Republican candidates who call themselves Tea Party candidates. That's not news, either.

Let me know when the strictly polite conversation starts, and I'll stop using the term bagger.

 

[JMohegan]

Heh heh. I read that a lot of high school kids now delete their facebook profiles during college admissions season. I think it really will be interesting to see how social media is used. I kinda feel like there will be a backlash at some point, but who knows exactly how it will play out. I just don't think we will get to a point where oversharing is boring or not worth it.


I feel like it's in poor taste to put photos like that on Facebook, political candidate or not. On the other hand? That she went to a private party dressed like that? I could care less. She has a sense of humor and isn't uptight about her sexuality.

She didn't put the photos on Facebook, someone else did. One of her "friends," or friends of her "friends" who attended the very small, private party.

My niece and nephew tell me: "Privacy is dead." There's nothing you can do to keep stuff like this from surfacing, whether you want it to or not, so you might as well just accept that's the way life is.

As for the effects of this type of publicity on political candidates, sometimes it's tough to predict. A lot depends on gender, location, timing, and such.

 

[JMohegan]

She's actually running here against Wittman, who's a typical Old White Guy ;-)

He's 51. OMG, ancient!!

If you live there, then you know VA1 is very red. Ball seems intelligent and charming, but because of the demographics of the district, those pics are unlikely to make a difference in the outcome one way or another - especially this year.

 

[sb2009]

Right, I know LOL I was only teasing...and by Old White Guy you know what I meant...;-) I actually met and talked with him about a program for tuition when I was working in PR for a community college and she struck me as "smarmy" BUT it was at "Legislative Day" and his office was flooded with people wanting to give him their viewpoint on stuff. I would have been a cranky bitch if it were me, so smarmy isn't really the worst thing.


What I do think is good about the whole Ball thing, is that we can see that there are some pretty lame things that will come out and that in the past would have caused a candidate to back out. She didn't and I am hoping it's a sign of things changing in that arena.

I'll still vote for her even it's a losing battle...and I hope that sometime I can run into her and say "Thanks....i think my daughters will benefit from your backbone and I appreciate that!"

 

[JMohegan]

Right, I know LOL I was only teasing...and by Old White Guy you know what I meant...;-) I actually met and talked with him about a program for tuition when I was working in PR for a community college and she struck me as "smarmy" BUT it was at "Legislative Day" and his office was flooded with people wanting to give him their viewpoint on stuff. I would have been a cranky bitch if it were me, so smarmy isn't really the worst thing.


What I do think is good about the whole Ball thing, is that we can see that there are some pretty lame things that will come out and that in the past would have caused a candidate to back out. She didn't and I am hoping it's a sign of things changing in that arena.

I'll still vote for her even it's a losing battle...and I hope that sometime I can run into her and say "Thanks....i think my daughters will benefit from your backbone and I appreciate that!"

I knew what you meant.

I haven't been to your district this season, but word on the ground is that Wittman looks and acts like a guy with a stick up his ass. (Of course, I'm talking to left leaning folks, so that's a biased observation.)

Yes, you absolutely should vote! And I agree about your message.

 

[rosco rathbone]

Political discussion in here is actually damn civil given the intense tribal resentments involved.

I don't mind the "Democrat" thing, as long as I can say "bagger", which I do like to say.

 

[rosco rathbone]

Tea Party Tory



Anti-Anti-Racism? Or Expression of Will to Make it Retroactively Not Have Been The Case That The Side You Are On Now Was, Then, Not The Side That Was On The Right Side? (We report, you decide)

(As usual on Crooked Timber, the action is all in the comments)

 

[WriterDom]

Political discussion in here is actually damn civil given the intense tribal resentments involved.

I don't mind the "Democrat" thing, as long as I can say "bagger", which I do like to say.

If it doesn't bother me then who the fuck is it going to bother?

Considering I'm like a flaming homosexual sitting in a Primitive Baptist church. There is actually a Primitive Baptist denomination. I just heard about them yesterday from an old timer. They do a lot of things out loud because so many of them can't read. Scary churches. I bet BiBunny has heard of them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primitive_Baptist

 

[JMohegan]

Political discussion in here is actually damn civil given the intense tribal resentments involved.

I don't mind the "Democrat" thing, as long as I can say "bagger", which I do like to say.

I have to say, "snake flagger" was brilliance.

 

[rosco rathbone]

If it doesn't bother me then who the fuck is it going to bother?

Considering I'm like a flaming homosexual sitting in a Primitive Baptist church. There is actually a Primitive Baptist denomination. I just heard about them yesterday from an old timer. They do a lot of things out loud because so many of them can't read. Scary churches. I bet BiBunny has heard of them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primitive_Baptist

I had a partner who was from one of those snake handler churches in Southern VA. He was a sniper in the Marines and ended up going to Iraq to "kill towelheads" as he put it.

I actually got along with the guy pretty well given that we were total and complete opposites in every way. We both looked upon the other with genial contempt, him because I couldn't figure out how to use my knife-sharpening stones right and me because he was an unlettered hillbilly.

 

[BiBunny]

If it doesn't bother me then who the fuck is it going to bother?

Considering I'm like a flaming homosexual sitting in a Primitive Baptist church. There is actually a Primitive Baptist denomination. I just heard about them yesterday from an old timer. They do a lot of things out loud because so many of them can't read. Scary churches. I bet BiBunny has heard of them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primitive_Baptist

My Granny used to go to a Primitive Baptist church. Hardshell Baptists, she called them. She stopped going as she got older, but because her daughter was buried there, she'd always go on Homecoming, and we'd go with her. It was...different.

No padding on the pews, no air conditioner (in mid freaking summer in Alabama, for God's sake), no musical accompaniment with the songs (not even a piano), picnics on the ground, etc. It was like being in another world, and I grew up going to a Southern Baptist church myself.

They didn't handle snakes or speak in tongues, though. That's that Pentecostal stuff. *Shudder*

ETA: I don't think a lot of people realize just how class-divided churches are in the South. For a lot of people, it doesn't matter if you agree with all the teachings of the church you attend or not. It's just that the really poor people go to Pentecostal churches, the folks who graduated high school and work in the cotton mill or drive trucks or have lower management type positions go to the Baptist churches, the people who are a little higher on the ladder than that (possibly with college degrees, possibly not) go to the Methodist churches, the richer folks go to the Presbyterian/Lutheran/Episcopalian churches. And if you happen to "forget where you come from," you will be looked down upon. There's more upward mobility in the British peerage than in small town and country Southern Protestant churches. So for a lot of people down, that's why "If you don't believe what they believe, then why don't you leave?" doesn't fly. If they leave their denomination, where are they going to go, assuming they still want to attend some kind of church?

 

[JMohegan]

I don't mind the "Democrat" Party thing, but this comparison to homophobes is over the line and deeply offensive.

WD, though I disagree with nearly all of your views, I sincerely respect your right to express them. I don't think of you as evil, or an abomination; I just think.... well, hmm. I'm not sure how to express this.

We have fundamentally different perspectives. That's the best I can come up with at the moment.

 

[JMohegan]

There's more upward mobility in the British peerage than in small town and country Southern Protestant churches. So for a lot of people down, that's why "If you don't believe what they believe, then why don't you leave?" doesn't fly. If they leave their denomination, where are they going to go, assuming they still want to attend some kind of church?

They could always pray at home, yes?

It's not just a matter of differing opinions. It's the fact that what's being said is ignorant and bigoted, cruel and harmful.

What "doesn't fly" is the notion that tacit acceptance of hate speech is anything other than just that. Acceptance.

 

[BiBunny]

They could always pray at home, yes?

Yes. That's what I do. But for some people, worship is also about communing with others and so forth and so on. Not for me, but for some people.

It's not just a matter of differing opinions. It's the fact that what's being said is ignorant and bigoted, cruel and harmful.

I agree that a lot of things professed by churches are all these things.

What "doesn't fly" is the notion that tacit acceptance of hate speech is anything other than just that. Acceptance.

Not arguing with that, either. It's just that for some people, in the cost-benefit analysis, a little hate speech is preferable to not having a "home" in which to worship. I don't agree with it--obviously--but that's how it's viewed.

I'd no more walk into an Episcopalian church, for example, than a Pentecostal one. I would not be accepted at either, regardless of my own personal beliefs. I'd like to try a Quaker or Unitarian Universalist church, but I'm over an hour away from either one, so thinking about it is as far as I've gotten.