War starts on command, but doesn't end when you please

[mayfly13]

The way you operate your preconceptions is mildly amusing. The God created the numbers, it's all he did. Math is philosophy, geometry used to part of it. Until they tried to square the circle dismissing tools their engineers used as "impure" the same way Einstein failed allowing his philosophy constrain his math. Rene Dehart "I think, therefore I am" was so powerful declaration of independence exactly because it was answer to question, "if all I know or believe is false, what can I rely upon?" And he starts with that, that the sceptic should necessarily exist. And rebuild his entire philosophy, the building of science, based on that. And Kant... by the way, he lived and worked in Konigsberg, now Kaliningrad.

no, it's analytic -- as opposed to continental -- philosophy.
https://philosophynow.org/issues/74/Analytic_versus_Continental_Philosophy

I didn't know that you guys also adhere to it

 

[mayfly13]

In contrary, the elites might compromise, but be labeled traitors. But they would be labeled traitors for fairly losing the war, or even for not winning it fast and deficiency enough, so that may be nearly inevitable anyway.

Ukrainians had always -- always -- elected their own pastors. Think about it.

or maybe it's the cossack spirit... any other people would choose slavery over death.
Because -- let;s talk 3 months from now-- Russians aren't going anywhere, Ukraine is losing..
Most people have started to waken up from the initial high and realize that.

 

[mayfly13]

Huh. This is just absurd. The only reason is Russian actions. Biden has managed this as best as anyone could, even despite his administration's problems with moderating themselves to standstill. Yes, there's always room for improvement. If Biden was allowed to lead where his instincts seem to be...

Those Biden-imposed sanctions ended up hurting lay-Americans and Africans far more than they are hurting Russians.
And Germany, Russia's biggest payer, is only applying a half-baked version.
Thing which none of the US-bought outlets are mentioning.

So what is their point?

 

[mayfly13]

So what was those sanctions' point?

Biden knew History.
The Russian army was and will never be allowed to back down by their leaders, even if Russians are starving.

 

[LupusDei]

Eurasia is one continent, on one continental plate. Europe is a peninsula of that continent.

Nope. Learn some plate tectonics. Now if you said Eurasia to be one landmass with Europe as subcontinent... but I suspect it wouldn't convey the desired message.

 

[mayfly13]

Eurasia is one continent, on one continental plate. Europe is a peninsula of that continent.

interesting, and you might be right.

For example, some of the current Eastern European popullationns were born through Asian invasion of the European side. The Asian DNA run extinct in time and those popullations are now 100% European through generational mingling with their neighbors, but their origin was Asian.

 

[LupusDei]

no, it's analytic -- as opposed to continental -- philosophy.
https://philosophynow.org/issues/74/Analytic_versus_Continental_Philosophy

I didn't know that you guys also adhere to it

Interestingly how the article start with the classic semiotics question and manage to never mention semiotics. But thanks, although how you pretend one contemporary trend to be something inherently British...

 

[LupusDei]

I thought of the term subcontinent, but that term is more appropriate for India on its own plate.

As old and inactive Ural mountains be, the plate border exists.

 

[LupusDei]

or maybe it's the cossack spirit... any other people would choose slavery over death.

Let's be particular: you would choose slavery. Your cry for authoritarianism has such a stench...

 

[mayfly13]

Interestingly how the article start with the classic semiotics question and manage to never mention semiotics. But thanks, although how you pretend one contemporary trend to be something inherently British...

I suspect that you studied these things formally. I studied them as an autodidact, even if dilligently for more than a decade. So i'm prone to mistakes.
Some of my heroes are critics such as Weber and Charles Taylor.


The reason I started this self-journey is that I emmigrated, starry eyed as a youngster who knew the minimum about EE, to Australasia. I thought "fuck EE, The West rocks they are open minded etc etc".

But I got stuck in environments where the mentality was
"you gotta take responsibility and self-manage by compartmentalising yourself into parts and analysing them and acknowledging your 'rats in a maze' crap. that's the gist of the Western enlightened person".
That's how they viewed people, like self-managing fine-tuned AI's. I'm not sure if it belongs to analyic or neoliberal philosophy, but such thinking is schizophrenic and Hitler-esque! And prevalent in corporations.

Is EE in the throws of this pestilence too? Am I misguided in attributing it to Anglos or what's going on?

 

[LupusDei]

So what was those sanctions' point?

Biden knew History.
The Russian army was and will never be allowed to back down by their leaders, even if Russians are starving.

The point was, and still is, primarily to prevent Russia from rapidly replacing high tech equipment and military hardware. It never was to stop the war (such strategy was indeed seen as fruitless, and if that would be the goal the sanctions should precede the war, wouldn't you think?), or deliberately place hardships on Russian population. That's Russian government job to react to sanctions in a way that offload effects on population as it strengthens the regime.

The sanctions are obviously working. Russia is currently unable to produce tanks, for tangible example. The strengthening ruble might seem paradoxical as a proof the sanctions are working, but it is, because it stems from Russian inability to spend money they receive for natural resources exports, particularly, on militarily hardware.

Russia is now weaker than it ever was (arguably, even to 1917 possibly) and inevitably on further downward path at least short term, but the damage should be felt for decades.

Of course, the natural resources export bans could be great, and possibly speed things up, but are difficult to both negotiate and enforce, and the sanctions regime remaining in place for a few years will mostly make them meaningless as the extradition of said resources will stop due to technological failures that could not be repaired or replaced.

 

[LupusDei]

Is EE in the throws of this pestilence too? Am I misguided in attributing it to Anglos or what's going on?

I suspect that's a different angle, but there was recent discussion on differences on how Russians and Americans see honesty, and in particular, why each see the other as inherently false, fake. The "American" approach, ostensibly, doesn't see much if any divide between private and public and prioritize consistency, therefore there's inability to be truly honest in a "Russian" sense.

In a "Russian", the compartmentalization is almost absolute: private and public person can even hold diametrically opposed political views, and there comes the rather uniquely Russian: "careful, it's not government property" or "how can one not steal [from government or far enough boss]?" Only the private, privileged access person must be honest and ethical, the behavior of the public person is dictated externally and is absolved of true responsibility. Therefore there's simply no requirement to be honest in "American" sense.

In the rest of the real world there might be some gradient between them two.

What you complain about might be the upset of the private person on requirements of the public person. Being unfortunately close to Russia I personally believe the true merger of them is not only impossible but also unwelcome. Moreover most corporate environment is inherently totalitarian (paradoxically the more the "freer" the economy is) and thus encourages such divisions.

 

[mayfly13]

Ukraine is losing the war of attrition. It won't get enough munitions to continue fighting. This is still only a minor skirmish, but the world's strategists and tacticians are watching what works there. The big war that will probably happen later is China against the alliance of India, Japan, and Australia. Russia may choose an ally or sell fuel to everyone.

well said.

I think that we, the unwashed are being sold feel-good/bad narratives raped Ukrainian women, layUkrainians burried under buildings.
While those in charge are simply using those horrors to learn & up their game.

I think the Ukraine war opened our --the unwashed-- eyes as to how History manuals --from all countries, all eras--were made. Bullshit narratives for the unwashed, different world rules created by Elites.

 

[rockcasbah]

This stuff should all be decided by referendums.

If only those Dominion Voting Machines could be trusted.

 

[Rightguide]

Europe is going to have to kick in much more than they have to date.

 

[mayfly13]

Europe is going to have to kick in much more than they have to date.

On Wednesday, Syria’s official news agency SANA cited local sources from Al-Yarubiya area in the countryside of Hasakah Province as saying that a convoy of 130 tanker trucks loaded with Syrian crude oil was transferred to the Iraqi village of Mahmudiyah, which lies to the South of the illegal border crossing of Al-Waleed, on Tuesday.

Last week, the US forces brought a convoy made up of 111 vehicles loaded with military equipment and tanker trucks carrying stolen oil from Syria to its bases in Northern Iraq. In early January, a US convoy of 128 vehicles transferred military equipment and Syrian oil into Northern Iraq.

The US military has stationed forces and equipment in Eastern and Northeastern Syria, with the Pentagon claiming that the deployment is aimed at preventing the oilfields in the area from falling into the hands of Daesh (ISIS or ISIL) terrorists. Damascus, however, says the unlawful deployment is meant to plunder the country’s resources. Former US President Donald Trump admitted on several occasions that American forces were in Syria for its oil, noting he was keeping some forces there “to secure the oil" following a partial US troop withdrawal from Northeast Syria in October 2019.


https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/...-forces-continue-to-steal-syrian-oil.6769057/

 

[mayfly13]

My point being: with the crisis that America is facing --I heard that Biden tried to negotiate oil even with countries they'd criticised-- it makes sense that they might be plundering Syria's oil.

 

[rockcasbah]

My point being: with the crisis that America is facing --I heard that Biden tried to negotiate oil even with countries they'd criticised-- it makes sense that they might be plundering Syria's oil.

Of course they are.

What I dont understand is why Biden isnt re-friending Venezuela; there’s even a Kennedy in the mix to help ( even if he is a crazy antivaxxer).

Venezuela’s a far easier nut to crack than anything in the middle east.

 

[LupusDei]

Ukraine is losing the war of attrition. It won't get enough munitions to continue fighting. This is still only a minor skirmish, but the world's strategists and tacticians are watching what works there. The big war that will probably happen later is China against the alliance of India, Japan, and Australia. Russia may choose an ally or sell fuel to everyone.

Peculiar how you choose to pretend U.S. might sit that one out. Not that it couldn't happen, but at very least place rather interesting time limits on those expectations.

That war being China's to initiate there's still hope brutal enough defeat of Russia could convince them not to pursuit open hostilities. Of course, if Russia is allowed any measure of victory not only it becomes almost inevitable, there's other rather ugly possibilities.

 

[LupusDei]

Girls with traditional Ukrainian ribbons in their hair among those in field flower crowns are a common sight at the Midsummer bonfires this year in Latvia. Nobody would wonder much of such as a fashion fad, but it's not that at all, but genuine national identity. The war refugees are eager to participate in our national "pagan" rites. (In such a contrast to old soveticus migrants who were, many still are, all the decades later, derisive at best and hostile at worst.)

Women from Sumi region (Ukrian controlled since Russian Kyiv campaign failed, but occasional shelling still happens along the border there) I met had left with nothing but emergency backpacks at the very first days back in . Yet, they had packed their national shirts they were proudly wearing, happy about (perhaps unexpected) opportunity to take them out. Not the long skirts though -- too heavy --, so they had borrowed from locals. Similar enough.

Some Kyiv-ans planning to go back, say many other have already returned. An ethnic Russian woman allegedly living in Kyiv allthrough however, in contrary is seeking to transfer her daughter (supposedly fairly talented harpist) to a musical school in Riga from specialized school in Moscow. Saying, not that she would be dropped out, but Moscow's becoming unlivable, at least to "nazi scum" like them (yes, Russians that have lived in wrong places for too long aren't recognized as Russians in Russia, at least when not used for propaganda, that's nothing new). Aren't there options in Kyiv? We didn't press for answers not received any.

Children have no problems playing together talking in three languages even if each uses just one.

Men (local men as Ukrainian are where they need to be) circle back in conversations to frontlines once now and then. Our frontlines. There's little doubt about that. Deep rear as we are at the moment, everyone knows that may change.

Fairly smart and informed people are believing in military genius of Zaluzhnyy (UAF CiC) and rationalizing recent retreats as deliberate, even if necessary, strategy.

Say, winning fast not only impossible, but could be dangerous (to "wake up" the Russians for serious reform, supposedly), while the slow grind will eventually solve the problem forever. And Ukrainians, as a large nation, well, can afford it, for now. Yes, clinical with some guilt mixed in, but that's war.

 

[mayfly13]

LD,
the more I listen to Eastern European right-wing channels,
the more I am on the side of pre-2022 Russians.

Imagine being in their shoes: Ukraine is as big also because Soviet Russia added other countries' territories to Soviet Ukraine
and post-1991 Ukraine not only gets to keep those territories,
but also cries wolf when Russia wants Crimea back? Which belonged to Ukraine only because Krushchev gifted it behind his people's back?

In saying that, I only understand the pre-2022 Russian point of view, What happened this year was unlawful breach of sovereignity + war crimes.

 

[mayfly13]

I was reading about Russian presidents' early formative experiences.

Both Raisa Gorbacheva (what a handsome, classy lady she was) and Mikhail Gorbachev came from mixed Ukrainian - Russian families.

Putin's little brother died of diphteria and starvation in 1942 during the Siege of Leningrad by Nazi Germany, his maternal grandMOTHER was killed by German occupiers, and his maternal uncles disappeared on the Eastern Front during World War II. (Wikipedia)


Kinda telling, isn't it?

 

[mayfly13]

Btw Lupus, I just went: 'WTF?"

Someone was saying that Indians consistently rank as the most racist country among surveys - and it's true. Which is kinda commedic, and it also makes sense cause it's not a homogenous country
By the same token, Scandinavian countries rank as least racist -- which to me means nothing other than that those folks are very polite and/or PC.

But then I saw (damn, I can't relocate the source) that UKRAINE and LITHUANIA didn't fare two well.
Ukraine -- understandably so. Most young or threatened nations often become ultra-nationalistic.
But Lithuania? What the hell?
Where do you think the bias comes from.

 

[mayfly13]

Spiritually, I'm a Rusophile
One of the most exciting Literature, History, and Music in the World. And most Russians that I met were warm and eager to help.

Putin and his murderous clique DO NOT represent the Russian soul.

Ukrainians, on the other hand --while I haven't met any-- apparently are viewed by Poles and Russians as their unsophisticated rural cousins.
Plus many people tell me that on 1:1, they're far colder and more selfish, than Russians are.

 

[mayfly13]

Hey, have you guys seen Medvedev's forecast for the war?
that parts of Ukraine will end up being integrated not just in Russia, but in Poland Hungary Romania a well:

https://dailynewshungary.com/wp-content/webpc-passthru.php?src=https://dailynewshungary.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Map.jpg&nocache=1


What do you guys think of this move?
even for what people call maskirovka... nobody would buy it