What do readers want?

[MrHereWriting]

If I did not care about what the reader wants I would not care about comments and ratings and things, but I do so obviously I care.

But I think writing for the reader would detract from the stories. You have to write for yourself and hope readers respond.

It's not Writer Vs Reader and I think that gets lost on a lot of writers who say "I write for myself!"

The Boys is a perfect example of when you write for yourself too much, while Better Call Saul is a perfect example of writing the story you want to tell without becoming a wish fulfillment for the audience nor a big fat middle finger to them either.

Most writers are a part of their own audience and the only time they get into trouble with their audience is when they overthink their plot so they can surprise their audience, which leads them to do the dumbest thing in the world, the subverting of expectations.

People have expectations because you don't need to be a writer to know what makes a good story. The only thing that should be subverted is how those expectations are fulfilled if you want to separate yourself from your peers.

 

[DEFCOM5]

I write for me and to my surprise there are people who likes what I write.

So I keep on writing for myself and somehow enough people like it so I feel I should keep on publishing my storyies.

 

[Annabelle1990]

I write for me and to my surprise there are people who likes what I write.

So I keep on writing for myself and somehow enough people like it so I feel I should keep on publishing my storyies.

My first story was more like a diary thing. It was my husband and then our boyfriend who encouraged me to join lit and have it published. I'm like you - I did not think it would get a lot of attention and then it did get some!

 

[DEFCOM5]

Contrary to a lot of (good) writers here, none of my stories are based on facts or lived experience .....

 

[MrHereWriting]

I write for me and to my surprise there are people who likes what I write.

So I keep on writing for myself and somehow enough people like it so I feel I should keep on publishing my storyies.

When you write your stories, are more like George Lucas writing Star Wars, or Rian Johnson writing Star Wars?

 

[DEFCOM5]

When you write your stories, are more like George Lucas writing Star Wars, or Rian Johnson writing Star Wars?

No idea how Lucas or Johnson wrote their stories. All I know is that Star Wars ended after episode 6

 

[MrHereWriting]

No idea how Lucas or Johnson wrote their stories. All I know is that Star Wars ended after episode 6

We're talking about mindset.

Lucas was an obvious fan of his own work and that comes from being a fan of the mythologies and stories he used to inspire and create Star Wars. He was a fan who turned creator, stayed a fan, and made magic for his fans without compromising his storytelling to give his fans the ol' gotcha!

Rian Johnson was a guy who knew nothing about the meaning of Star Wars and fisted the fans right in the bum because he thought he was smarter than everyone else.

 

[DEFCOM5]

We're talking about mindset.

Lucas was an obvious fan of his own work and that comes from being a fan of the mythologies and stories he used to inspire and create Star Wars. He was a fan who turned creator, stayed a fan, and made magic for his fans without compromising his storytelling to give his fans the ol' gotcha!

Rian Johnson was a guy who knew nothing about the meaning of Star Wars and fisted the fans right in the bum because he thought he was smarter than everyone else.

I am not smarter than anyone else. So I am not Johnson

I am using my own fantasy to write what would turn me on. I am not Lucas because I don't make magic for my reader. I just peddle porn.

 

[MrHereWriting]

I am not smarter than anyone else. So I am not Johnson

I am using my own fantasy to write what would turn me on. I am not Lucas because I don't make magic for my reader. I just peddle porn.

You're a fan of what you write, which means you're like minded with the fans of your stories. The moment you stop writing like a fan because you think you need to write like a writer, whatever the hell that means, is the moment you start losing fans.

Your need to sidestep the simplest of simple comparisons boggles the mind.

 

[Cagivagurl]

what do readers want...

To be entertained...
To have their senses stirred,
To feel something...
Every single one, is looking for something different.
IMO...

 

[AG31]

The Boys is a perfect example of when you write for yourself too much,

If you happen to be writing for yourself (and it's certainly not recommended or the reverse), I don't think you can do it too much. The relationship between a writer who writes for themselves and their readers is to be on the lookout for like minded people, not to please the audience.

 

[MrHereWriting]

If you happen to be writing for yourself (and it's certainly not recommended or the reverse), I don't think you can do it too much. The relationship between a writer who writes for themselves and their readers is to be on the lookout for like minded people, not to please the audience.

You can definitely write for yourself too much. If you take what you've established and ignore it to send 3 seasons worth of political messages that completely ruin your show for all except those with the most rabid of ideologies, then yeah, you've written for yourself too much.

 

[liliput1]

You can definitely write for yourself too much. If you take what you've established and ignore it to send 3 seasons worth of political messages that completely ruin your show for all except those with the most rabid of ideologies, then yeah, you've written for yourself too much.

That was oddly specific.

 

[AG31]

You can definitely write for yourself too much. If you take what you've established and ignore it to send 3 seasons worth of political messages that completely ruin your show for all except those with the most rabid of ideologies, then yeah, you've written for yourself too much.

Well, not if your purpose is to find people who share your rabid ideology.

 

[Cagivagurl]

I think people are misconstruing the phrase writing for myself...
I see writing for myself as...
Writing for the sheer pleasure of it. Not reliving a personal fantasy, or past event...
Simply that if you love writing, and gain pleasure from the process. That is writing for yourself.
Not pandering to an audience that may, or may not even exist...
You get an idea, and turn it into a story for no other reason than writing it gives you satisfaction...
Merely my thoughts...

 

[Voboy]

I think people are misconstruing the phrase writing for myself...

There are many definitions.

Several times, I've seen threads here go sideways because a poster was using one definition but the post reader assumed a different one. It's a shame; it gets in the way of some worthy conversation here.

 

[SimonDoom]

You can definitely write for yourself too much. If you take what you've established and ignore it to send 3 seasons worth of political messages that completely ruin your show for all except those with the most rabid of ideologies, then yeah, you've written for yourself too much.

I agree with this. I "write for myself" in the sense that when I write I imagine myself as a reader and think about what I would like, but my sense of "myself" as a reader is informed by five decades of reading widely and by having read hundreds of Literotica stories before I attempted to write my first one. I don't want to be preached to. I want to be entertained--by the story, by the kinkiness, by the adept choice of words. A writer who becomes too trapped inside their own head is likely not to be a good writer. Being a good writer involves a blend of sticking true to your principles and opening yourself up to the world enough that you know how to communicate your vision to others who may not entirely agree with you.

 

[Cagivagurl]

There are many definitions.

Several times, I've seen threads here go sideways because a poster was using one definition but the post reader assumed a different one. It's a shame; it gets in the way of some worthy conversation here.

I think that it pays to look at all options....
As they are all relevant.
As in every discussion, there are many perspectives.

 

[MrHereWriting]

That was oddly specific.

It's better to be specific than not and The Boys has been everywhere lately for this exact reason. I stopped watching during season 3 for several reasons.

• Circular storylines that ended character development and the shows forward progress.
• The grotesque and over-the-top sex jokes that added nothing but cringe moments to the show. I was done with them in season 1, the writers continued them throughout the series' run.
• I like my shows to be as non political and allegorical as possible. A joke here, a comment there, fine, but the skewed slant had begin in earnest and I don't want to be preached to.

The Wire's take on politics was great. The politicians were more concerned about gaining power, maintaining power, rising in power, profiting from and abusing power instead of using their power to help the people who really needed help. They were complicit in the violence and harm of drug use by taking drug money to finance their campaigns. It was viscous cycle of selfishness that was broad enough in scope that it blanketed anyone who got elected to office.

Well, not if your purpose is to find people who share your rabid ideology.

If you want to sacrifice a decent story after a couple of seasons to discover a smaller audience, I guess. Dwindle away, I say.

I agree with this. I "write for myself" in the sense that when I write I imagine myself as a reader and think about what I would like, but my sense of "myself" as a reader is informed by five decades of reading widely and by having read hundreds of Literotica stories before I attempted to write my first one. I don't want to be preached to. I want to be entertained--by the story, by the kinkiness, by the adept choice of words. A writer who becomes too trapped inside their own head is likely not to be a good writer. Being a good writer involves a blend of sticking true to your principles and opening yourself up to the world enough that you know how to communicate your vision to others who may not entirely agree with you.

I read to be entertained as well. The world's problems aren't going anywhere.

The sad thing is that the art of being a storyteller with an opinion is lost on opinion givers who may actually be good storytellers.

If someone wants to do social commentary, do it, but weave those issues into your narrative with a subtlety that doesn't alienate a high percentage of your readers. You want people who disagree with you to think about your writing and viewpoints, even if they don't come around, they'll have a deeper understanding of those with opposing views. What you don't want is people putting your words aside because you've hit them on the head with a sledgehammer.

 

[lovecraft68]

Contrary to a lot of (good) writers here, none of my stories are based on facts or lived experience .....

Neither are most of the stories that they claim are real.

 

[liliput1]

The Wire's take on politics was great. The politicians were more concerned about gaining power, maintaining power, rising in power, profiting from and abusing power instead of using their power to help the people who really needed help. They were complicit in the violence and harm of drug use by taking drug money to finance their campaigns. It was viscous cycle of selfishness that was broad enough in scope that it blanketed anyone who got elected to office.

That's still on my list, but for Idris. I keep watching him in terrible movies and I've heard good things about The Wire.

Also vote Idris for post-Craig James Bond.

 

[lovecraft68]

That's still on my list, but for Idris. I keep watching him in terrible movies and I've heard good things about The Wire.

Also vote Idris for post-Craig James Bond.

The Luthor series was hit or miss, the movies was awful.

Looks like he took his name out of the Bond hat recently.

 

[liliput1]

The Luthor series was hit or miss, the movies was awful.

Looks like he took his name out of the Bond hat recently.

Oh, I know a couple women who are going to be pissed about that. He is maybe getting a little old to want to sign up for that. Craig kind of set the physicality bar high.

 

[lovecraft68]

Oh, I know a couple women who are going to be pissed about that. He is maybe getting a little old to want to sign up for that. Craig kind of set the physicality bar high.

I'm not a Bond fan at all, but I think he could have pulled it off.

I'm sure when they decide it will be as divisive as everything else is.

 

[liliput1]

I'm not a Bond fan at all, but I think he could have pulled it off.

I'm sure when they decide it will be as divisive as everything else is.

I would also accept a gender swap but I'd want Tessa Thompson and I don't think they'd overlook her Americanness just because she has two BAFTAs.