Why do you hate Sarah Palin?

[SweetErika]

I'm sure I'm going to get hell for this, but I don't think Ifill did well in several respects.

I expected her to ask fair questions and treat the candidates fairly, and she certainly lived up to that, but I was totally unimpressed by her soft approach and unwillingness to keep the candidates on track. I think there should have been more reminders about time limits, sticking to the questions and less letting them go back and forth over and over going on. Because Ifill was so easy, Palin was basically able to stall so much with mostly irrelevant talking points that they got to far fewer questions/issues than they should have.

Ifill was fair and professional, but I would have much rather seen her be tougher with both candidates than let them go off on tangents and disregard the agreed upon format and time limits on just about every question. I think the questions could have been a little harder, too.

 

[Netzach]

I'm sure I'm going to get hell for this, but I don't think Ifill did well in several respects.

I expected her to ask fair questions and treat the candidates fairly, and she certainly lived up to that, but I was totally unimpressed by her soft approach and unwillingness to keep the candidates on track. I think there should have been more reminders about time limits, sticking to the questions and less letting them go back and forth over and over going on. Because Ifill was so easy, Palin was basically able to stall so much with mostly irrelevant talking points that they got to far fewer questions/issues than they should have.

Ifill was fair and professional, but I would have much rather seen her be tougher with both candidates than let them go off on tangents and disregard the agreed upon format and time limits on just about every question. I think the questions could have been a little harder, too.

No hell here - emotionally I agree with you.

Realistically -
I don't think she had that option, I think it would have hurt the Democratic party, not because the candidate couldn't do it, but because of the immense flack. The fact that the "partisan hack" might garner a thank you note from WD is a testament to someone who does her job damn fine.

I like the fact that the two candidates were much more humane with one another, allowed one another to look good even, and gracious with the host and vice versa. It was a glimmer of hope in a split that's reduced people to sending hate mail to each other. The intellectual rigor may not be where I'd like it but some class that's missing is present.

Oh, also, people noticed that she didn't answer several questions and prattled on in a loop. It WILL not help her, trust me.

 

[FurryFury]

Honestly, I don't much care for Biden. I don't believe much that he said BUT he said the right things that I wanted to hear. KWIM?

I could NEVER vote for Palin over Biden. She is just a nothing in comparison. She said mostly wrong things from my POV or things of absolutely no substance.

 

[Netzach]

Honestly, I don't much care for Biden. I don't believe much that he said BUT he said the right things that I wanted to hear. KWIM?

I could NEVER vote for Palin over Biden. She is just a nothing in comparison. She said mostly wrong things from my POV or things of absolutely no substance.

Right. I don't buy every part of it, I don't think that Bosnia was a great unqualified success, I know he's been part of the mess on the hill, but frankly I don't need to be in love with him. Jesus we elected Bush/Quayle.

 

[BeachGurl2]

I'm thinking the ticket wants her to sound like a bake-sale mom. Gets her more in touch with the voters, ya know. They can relate to her. But the intellectuals, the people who actually pay attention and care about what happens aren't at all impressed with that. In fact, I thought it sounded pretty stupid and made her look bad. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

You know what would be shocking? A political debate in which the politicians actually answer the questions put to them.

This was my position while watching this. Biden did very well, addressing the questions, and then addressing the tangent that Palin brought into her answer. She really didn't directly answer any question that I heard. She had her buzz words, they prepped her well so that she didn't sound like a complete idiot, but she still didn't answer the questions presented to her.

And don't you just love the way she talked about her 'big' state of Alaska? I got a kick out of that. What's the population of Alaska, anyway? Isn't it about the size of Mesa, Arizona, population-wise?

 

[Netzach]

I love Begala "maybe thoughtful is just in this year!"

I hope so.

 

[midwestyankee]

She didn't puke into her shoes but she did come within a hair's breadth of hyperventilating a few times. Gawd, does she think that verbal velocity equates to wisdom and intelligence?

Biden was almost as good as I thought he'd be. It seemed like he was struggling to gauge her during the first half hour, trying to figure out how strong he could be. Once they got to foreign policy he soared.

I decided to watch CNN to get the little voter-meter and it was fascinating to watch. I was hoping that they'd change to a different focus group or two for some variety but seeing Ohio respond generally very well to Biden overall was comforting.

 

[JMohegan]

I don't know if this is good or bad but Biden choking over his daughter is going to be the icon of this, you watch.

In a totally non-threatening and very human way, he called her out for the ridiculous and fundamentally offensive notion, implicit in the core of the Palin myth, that the hockey mom from a small town is the only "real" person in the room.

 

[WriterDom]

10 to 1 Fox says she won. Haven't checked the Clinton News Network

 

[FurryFury]

I'm thinking the ticket wants her to sound like a bake-sale mom. Gets her more in touch with the voters, ya know. They can relate to her. But the intellectuals, the people who actually pay attention and care about what happens aren't at all impressed with that. In fact, I thought it sounded pretty stupid and made her look bad. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.



This was my position while watching this. Biden did very well, addressing the questions, and then addressing the tangent that Palin brought into her answer. She really didn't directly answer any question that I heard. She had her buzz words, they prepped her well so that she didn't sound like a complete idiot, but she still didn't answer the questions presented to her.

And don't you just love the way she talked about her 'big' state of Alaska? I got a kick out of that. What's the population of Alaska, anyway? Isn't it about the size of Mesa, Arizona, population-wise?

I agree with you on all points!

 

[Netzach]

10 to 1 Fox says she won. Haven't checked the Clinton News Network

I can see maybe maybe squeezing "tie" out of that event. If I were the most foaming at the mouth fan.

For all the re-airing of the Tina Fey thing totally inappropriately on CNN (news for idiots by day) I don't think they've jumped the shark on any and all reality.

She did not win. Make up all the facts you want she did not win. She put a tourniquet on the massive puncture wound to the McCain campaign that she is.

 

[FurryFury]

In a totally non-threatening and very human way, he called her out for the ridiculous and fundamentally offensive notion, implicit in the core of the Palin myth, that the hockey mom from a small town is the only "real" person in the room.

I agree that was a really good thing to do.

 

[FurryFury]

I can see maybe maybe squeezing "tie" out of that event. If I were the most foaming at the mouth fan.

OMG! On some of my homeschooling groups and cafe mom groups they think she is the shit! (Said in a Godly conservative way of course, not my way. LOL.)

I'm just watching them and gagging. They think she "swept the floor" with Biden.

 

[FurryFury]

She didn't puke into her shoes but she did come within a hair's breadth of hyperventilating a few times. Gawd, does she think that verbal velocity equates to wisdom and intelligence?

Biden was almost as good as I thought he'd be. It seemed like he was struggling to gauge her during the first half hour, trying to figure out how strong he could be. Once they got to foreign policy he soared.

I decided to watch CNN to get the little voter-meter and it was fascinating to watch. I was hoping that they'd change to a different focus group or two for some variety but seeing Ohio respond generally very well to Biden overall was comforting.

Now I'm wishing I had watched on CNN and that's a first! LOL!

 

[Netzach]

OMG! On some of my homeschooling groups and cafe mom groups they think she is the shit! (Said in a Godly conservative way of course, not my way. LOL.)

I'm just watching them and gagging. They think she "swept the floor" with Biden.

These people picked the last president. I don't think they're going to get to pick this one again. The independents had no significant reason to vote Kerry other than "not bush" and I think Obama Biden puts a little more meat on the table. It's the economy, stupid. And I don't think people believe that McCain Palin are mavericks on it.

They're gonna have to steal florida colorado nevada and ohio with people watching the elections a bit uh more closely. It's a lot of theft to handle.

I can now honestly say that it's no joke, no shit. We have black neighbors and I don't think it's an accident that we had a bullshit RNC mailer - a phony absentee ballot sent to us.

I have seen one of these things with my own eyes now, held it in my own hands.

Do not think this is hyperbole - whatever side you are on you should be very vigilant and very worried. People - DNC, RNC, your employer - WILL try to fuck with your vote.

 

[FurryFury]

These people picked the last president. I don't think they're going to get to pick this one again. The independents had no significant reason to vote Kerry other than "not bush" and I think Obama Biden puts a little more meat on the table. It's the economy, stupid. And I don't think people believe that McCain Palin are mavericks on it.

They're gonna have to steal florida colorado nevada and ohio with people watching the elections a bit uh more closely. It's a lot of theft to handle.

I HOPE you are right!

Living in the Bible belt, surrounded by these people, has me quite worried!

 

[Netzach]

I HOPE you are right!

Living in the Bible belt, surrounded by these people, has me quite worried!

I think I can honestly say I live in a state that likes mavericks, is actually purple if you really examine it (love fiscal pubs and indies who are a bit off the map) and is not impressed by McCain Palin.

We're very Christian here, too, just "mind your own business and don't stand out" is the unofficial state motto. Leave other people alone and they'll leave you alone. That kinda thing.

 

[SweetErika]

No hell here - emotionally I agree with you.

Realistically -
I don't think she had that option, I think it would have hurt the Democratic party, not because the candidate couldn't do it, but because of the immense flack. The fact that the "partisan hack" might garner a thank you note from WD is a testament to someone who does her job damn fine.

I like the fact that the two candidates were much more humane with one another, allowed one another to look good even, and gracious with the host and vice versa. It was a glimmer of hope in a split that's reduced people to sending hate mail to each other. The intellectual rigor may not be where I'd like it but some class that's missing is present.

Oh, also, people noticed that she didn't answer several questions and prattled on in a loop. It WILL not help her, trust me.

Hmm... I don't know that she would have gotten hell if she was tougher but still fair. Well, I'm sure she would have from some republicans, but overall, I think she probably would have been okay. I understand why she didn't want to walk that tightrope, but I still can't help but be disappointed over her lack of enforcement of the agreed upon rules at least.

Anyone who didn't notice Palin's non-answers was covering their ears. Very, very tightly. I was actually surprised she favored irrelevant answers over reciting her rehearsed answers; it's not like most of the questions were surprising or anything!

You're right, it's heartening to see many viewers (us, the CNN Independents, etc.) noticed and were not pleased by her irrelevant answers, and I agree it'll make a difference.

10 to 1 Fox says she won. Haven't checked the Clinton News Network

Where did you see this? Did Fox do a poll? I looked, but I can't find anything on Fox that mentions who won, nevermind by any margin approaching that!

From the national CNN/Opinion Research poll:
# 51 percent say Democratic Sen. Joe Biden wins vice presidential debate
# Republican Gov. Sarah Palin exceeds expectations, 84 percent say
# Palin beats Biden on likability, 54-36
# 87 percent say Biden is qualified for job, 42 percent say Palin is

From about 4000 Forbes Trailwatch readers:
Early returns from our poll show Trailwatch readers thought Joe Biden won tonight's debate. Of the 3,887 respondents, 2,850, or 73%, called the debate for the Democratic veep. 909 readers have voted for Palin, 23% of the total.

From FiveThirtyEight.com's homepage:
The CBS poll of undecideds had Biden winning the debate 46-21, with 33 percent calling it a tie. But few votes were moved as as result. Among the undecideds, 18 percent committed to Obama, and 10 percent committed to McCain, but 71 percent remained uncommitted.

Biden won the CNN and CBS focus groups. Palin won the Luntz focus group. The candidates tied in the Halperin focus group.

And THIS poll by HDC is really detailed and interesting to me because it scores each candidate on each main issue covered. Independents scored Biden higher on every single issue.

Basically, the people saying Palin cleaned up handily, or even just won, are just being partisan. Why have I noticed that a lot of McPalin supporters swear their candidates won and are either very hesitant or outright refuse to deal out any criticism of their person's debate performance? And in contrast, a lot of OBiden supporters are likely to say it was close and criticize BOTH debate participants? It's very weird!

 

[SweetErika]

I have an honest question for my fellow viewers, now that I've seen the end of the debate:

Is it possible that Palin didn't know what an Achilles' heel was?

Or is it more likely that she just ignored/refused to answer the question?

Here's the clip of the question and both responses.

I expected her to try to answer after she argued the lack of experience point, but then she just kept on listing the reasons why she thinks she's so great and I started to wonder if she just didn't understand what Ifill was asking.

I just can't figure out why she would respond in the way she did to that particular question. If she just didn't want to give any perceived weakness, she would have given a Biden-like answer, no?

 

[RJMasters]

They both lied. Most people accepted what their candidate said as true and immediately dismiss any claims that their candidate lost or lied as bias coming form the other camp. There is a difference in the lying though. Palin's lies tend to come more from misinformation given to her by her handlers and she is just regergatating their lies, or they stem from her lack of eperience. Joe's lies however were more of a direct personal nature and had intent to decieve. He throughout the debate played the "I was there" card, so as to gain credibility as being an eyewitness to events. It was clearly effective as so many who are biased accepted what he said without even think to question if what he was saying is true.

If we are going to elect the best and most expereinced liars, then Biden won that debate hands down. He out lied Palin almost 2 to 1. But if we examine the facts and stripe out the lies, then they are both left with very little substance.

Over-all I was disappointed in both of them.

~and the beat goes on~

------------------------------------------------------------


PALIN: Said of Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama: "94 times he voted to increase taxes or not support a tax reduction."

THE FACTS: The dubious count includes repetitive votes as well as votes to cut taxes for the middle class while raising them on the rich. An analysis by factcheck.org found that 23 of the votes were for measures that would have produced no tax increase at all, seven were in favor of measures that would have lowered taxes for many, 11 would have increased taxes on only those making more than $1 million a year.
------
BIDEN: Complained about "economic policies of the last eight years" that led to "excessive deregulation."

THE FACTS: Biden voted for 1999 deregulation that liberal groups are blaming for part of the financial crisis. The law allowed Wall Street investment banks to create the kind of mortgage-related securities at the core of the problem now. The law was widely backed by Republicans as well as by Democratic President Clinton, who argues it has stopped the crisis today from being worse.
------
PALIN: "Two years ago, remember, it was John McCain who pushed so hard with the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac reform measures. He sounded that warning bell."

THE FACTS: Republican Sen. Chuck Hagel of Nebraska led an effort in 2005 to tighten regulation on the mortgage underwriters -- McCain joined as a co-sponsor a year later. The legislation was never taken up by the full Senate, then under Republican control.
------
BIDEN: Warned that Republican presidential candidate John McCain's $5,000 tax credit to help families buy health coverage "will go straight to the insurance company."

THE FACTS: Of course it would, because it's meant to pay for insurance. That's like saying money for a car loan will go straight to the car dealer.
------
PALIN: "We cannot afford to lose against al-Qaida and the Shia extremists who are still there, still fighting us."

THE FACTS: She appeared to confuse the two main Muslim sects in Iraq. Al-Qaida is solely made up of Sunni Muslim militants. Through the course of the war, U.S. forces fought ferocious opposition from both the Sunnis and the country's dominant Shiite sects. Now, both groups are largely maintaining a cease-fire with the U.S. A much-diminished al-Qaida, mainly foreign fighters, remains the primary threat.
------
BIDEN: Said McCain supports tax breaks for oil companies, and "wants to give them another $4 billion tax cut."

THE FACTS: Biden is repeating a favorite saw of the Obama campaign, and it's misleading. McCain supports a cut in income taxes for all corporations, and doesn't single out any one industry for that benefit.
------
PALIN: Said the United States has reduced its troop level in Iraq to a number below where it was when the troop increase began in early 2007.

THE FACTS: Not correct. The Pentagon says there are currently 152,000 U.S. troops in Iraq, about 17,000 more than there were before the 2007 military buildup began.
------
BIDEN: "As a matter of fact, John recently wrote an article in a major magazine saying that he wants to do for the health care industry -- deregulate it and let the free market move -- like he did for the banking industry."

THE FACTS: Biden and Obama have been perpetuating this distortion of what McCain wrote in an article for the American Academy of Actuaries. McCain, laying out his health plan, only referred to deregulation when saying people should be allowed to buy health insurance across state lines. In that context, he wrote: "Opening up the health insurance market to more vigorous nationwide competition, as we have done over the last decade in banking, would provide more choices of innovative products less burdened by the worst excesses of state-based regulation."
------
PALIN: Said Alaska is "building a nearly $40 billion natural gas pipeline, which is North America's largest and most expensive infrastructure project ever to flow those sources of energy into hungry markets."

THE FACTS: Not quite. Construction is at least six years away. So far the state has only awarded a license to Trans Canada Corp., that comes with $500 million in seed money in exchange for commitments toward a lengthy and costly process to getting a federal certificate. At an August news conference after the state Legislature approved the license, Palin said, "It's not a done deal."
------
PALIN: "Barack Obama even supported increasing taxes as late as last year for those families making only $42,000 a year."

BIDEN: "The charge is absolutely not true. Barack Obama did not vote to raise taxes. The vote she's referring to, John McCain voted the exact same way."

THE FACTS: The vote was on a nonbinding budget resolution that assumed that President Bush's tax cuts would expire, as scheduled, in 2011. If that actually happened, it could mean higher taxes for people making as little as about $42,000. But Obama is proposing tax increases only on the wealthy, and would cut taxes for most others. In the March 14 budget resolution supported by Obama and Biden, McCain actually did not vote.
------
PALIN: Said a McCain-Palin administration "will support Israel," including "building our embassy ... in Jerusalem."

THE FACTS: Moving the U.S. Embassy from its present location in Tel Aviv to Jerusalem is a perennial promise of presidential candidates courting the Jewish-American vote. In fact, moving the embassy is actually required by U.S. law. But successive administrations of both parties, including President Bush's, have made the same pledge only to find that the realities of Middle East peacemaking have forced them to invoke a waiver to delay it. Jerusalem is claimed as a capital by both Israel and the Palestinians, and Israel's occupation of east Jerusalem is not internationally recognized. The city's status is a key issue of disagreement in peace negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.

 

[midwestyankee]

They both lied. Most people accepted what their candidate said as true and immediately dismiss any claims that their candidate lost or lied as bias coming form the other camp. There is a difference in the lying though. Palin's lies tend to come more from misinformation given to her by her handlers and she is just regergatating their lies, or they stem from her lack of eperience. Joe's lies however were more of a direct personal nature and had intent to decieve. He throughout the debate played the "I was there" card, so as to gain credibility as being an eyewitness to events. It was clearly effective as so many who are biased accepted what he said without even think to question if what he was saying is true.

If we are going to elect the best and most expereinced liars, then Biden won that debate hands down. He out lied Palin almost 2 to 1. But if we examine the facts and stripe out the lies, then they are both left with very little substance.

Over-all I was disappointed in both of them.

~and the beat goes on~

------------------------------------------------------------


PALIN: Said of Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama: "94 times he voted to increase taxes or not support a tax reduction."

THE FACTS: The dubious count includes repetitive votes as well as votes to cut taxes for the middle class while raising them on the rich. An analysis by factcheck.org found that 23 of the votes were for measures that would have produced no tax increase at all, seven were in favor of measures that would have lowered taxes for many, 11 would have increased taxes on only those making more than $1 million a year.
------
BIDEN: Complained about "economic policies of the last eight years" that led to "excessive deregulation."

THE FACTS: Biden voted for 1999 deregulation that liberal groups are blaming for part of the financial crisis. The law allowed Wall Street investment banks to create the kind of mortgage-related securities at the core of the problem now. The law was widely backed by Republicans as well as by Democratic President Clinton, who argues it has stopped the crisis today from being worse.
------
PALIN: "Two years ago, remember, it was John McCain who pushed so hard with the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac reform measures. He sounded that warning bell."

THE FACTS: Republican Sen. Chuck Hagel of Nebraska led an effort in 2005 to tighten regulation on the mortgage underwriters -- McCain joined as a co-sponsor a year later. The legislation was never taken up by the full Senate, then under Republican control.
------
BIDEN: Warned that Republican presidential candidate John McCain's $5,000 tax credit to help families buy health coverage "will go straight to the insurance company."

THE FACTS: Of course it would, because it's meant to pay for insurance. That's like saying money for a car loan will go straight to the car dealer.
------
PALIN: "We cannot afford to lose against al-Qaida and the Shia extremists who are still there, still fighting us."

THE FACTS: She appeared to confuse the two main Muslim sects in Iraq. Al-Qaida is solely made up of Sunni Muslim militants. Through the course of the war, U.S. forces fought ferocious opposition from both the Sunnis and the country's dominant Shiite sects. Now, both groups are largely maintaining a cease-fire with the U.S. A much-diminished al-Qaida, mainly foreign fighters, remains the primary threat.
------
BIDEN: Said McCain supports tax breaks for oil companies, and "wants to give them another $4 billion tax cut."

THE FACTS: Biden is repeating a favorite saw of the Obama campaign, and it's misleading. McCain supports a cut in income taxes for all corporations, and doesn't single out any one industry for that benefit.
------
PALIN: Said the United States has reduced its troop level in Iraq to a number below where it was when the troop increase began in early 2007.

THE FACTS: Not correct. The Pentagon says there are currently 152,000 U.S. troops in Iraq, about 17,000 more than there were before the 2007 military buildup began.
------
BIDEN: "As a matter of fact, John recently wrote an article in a major magazine saying that he wants to do for the health care industry -- deregulate it and let the free market move -- like he did for the banking industry."

THE FACTS: Biden and Obama have been perpetuating this distortion of what McCain wrote in an article for the American Academy of Actuaries. McCain, laying out his health plan, only referred to deregulation when saying people should be allowed to buy health insurance across state lines. In that context, he wrote: "Opening up the health insurance market to more vigorous nationwide competition, as we have done over the last decade in banking, would provide more choices of innovative products less burdened by the worst excesses of state-based regulation."
------
PALIN: Said Alaska is "building a nearly $40 billion natural gas pipeline, which is North America's largest and most expensive infrastructure project ever to flow those sources of energy into hungry markets."

THE FACTS: Not quite. Construction is at least six years away. So far the state has only awarded a license to Trans Canada Corp., that comes with $500 million in seed money in exchange for commitments toward a lengthy and costly process to getting a federal certificate. At an August news conference after the state Legislature approved the license, Palin said, "It's not a done deal."
------
PALIN: "Barack Obama even supported increasing taxes as late as last year for those families making only $42,000 a year."

BIDEN: "The charge is absolutely not true. Barack Obama did not vote to raise taxes. The vote she's referring to, John McCain voted the exact same way."

THE FACTS: The vote was on a nonbinding budget resolution that assumed that President Bush's tax cuts would expire, as scheduled, in 2011. If that actually happened, it could mean higher taxes for people making as little as about $42,000. But Obama is proposing tax increases only on the wealthy, and would cut taxes for most others. In the March 14 budget resolution supported by Obama and Biden, McCain actually did not vote.
------
PALIN: Said a McCain-Palin administration "will support Israel," including "building our embassy ... in Jerusalem."

THE FACTS: Moving the U.S. Embassy from its present location in Tel Aviv to Jerusalem is a perennial promise of presidential candidates courting the Jewish-American vote. In fact, moving the embassy is actually required by U.S. law. But successive administrations of both parties, including President Bush's, have made the same pledge only to find that the realities of Middle East peacemaking have forced them to invoke a waiver to delay it. Jerusalem is claimed as a capital by both Israel and the Palestinians, and Israel's occupation of east Jerusalem is not internationally recognized. The city's status is a key issue of disagreement in peace negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.

RJ, I appreciate your including the analysis from FactCheck.org but I'm curious about your assertion that I bolded. I suspect that you're quite right about the origin of Palin's fabrications because I doubt if she uttered more than a handful of original sentences all night. But I'm dismayed that you claimed a personal motivation behind Biden's and I ask you to back that up with specific examples.

Without specifics, a claim like this just sounds like a partisan who is regurgitating what they heard on Fox News (note "sounds like" - not claiming this is the case here with you) rather than one whose claims are backed by incontrovertible evidence.

 

[WriterDom]

Fresh from the McCain people.


JOE BIDEN’S 14 LIES TONIGHT


1. TAX VOTE: Biden said McCain voted “the exact same way” as Obama to increase taxes on Americans earning just $42,000, but McCain DID NOT VOTE THAT WAY.


2. AHMEDINIJAD MEETING: Joe Biden lied when he said that Barack Obama never said that he would sit down unconditionally with Mahmoud Ahmedinijad of Iran. Barack Obama did say specifically, and Joe Biden attacked him for it.


3. OFFSHORE OIL DRILLING: Biden said, “Drill we must.” But Biden has opposed offshore drilling and even compared offshore drilling to “raping” the Outer Continental Shelf.”


4. TROOP FUNDING: Joe Biden lied when he indicated that John McCain and Barack Obama voted the same way against funding the troops in the field. John McCain opposed a bill that included a timeline, that the President of the United States had already said he would veto regardless of it’s passage.


5. OPPOSING CLEAN COAL: Biden says he’s always been for clean coal, but he just told a voter that he is against clean coal and any new coal plants in America and has a record of voting against clean coal and coal in the U.S. Senate.


6. ALERNATIVE ENERGY VOTES: According to FactCheck.org, Biden is exaggerating and overstating John McCain’s record voting for alternative energy when he says he voted against it 23 times.


7. HEALTH INSURANCE: Biden falsely said McCain will raise taxes on people's health insurance coverage -- they get a tax credit to offset any tax hike. Independent fact checkers have confirmed this attack is false


8. OIL TAXES: Biden falsely said Palin supported a windfall profits tax in Alaska -- she reformed the state tax and revenue system, it's not a windfall profits tax.


9. AFGHANISTAN / GEN. MCKIERNAN COMMENTS: Biden said that top military commander in Iraq said the principles of the surge could not be applied to Afghanistan, but the commander of NATO's International Security Assistance Force Gen. David D. McKiernan said that there were principles of the surge strategy, including working with tribes, that could be applied in Afghanistan.


10. REGULATION: Biden falsely said McCain weakened regulation -- he actually called for more regulation on Fannie and Freddie.


11. IRAQ: When Joe Biden lied when he said that John McCain was “dead wrong on Iraq”, because Joe Biden shared the same vote to authorize the war and differed on the surge strategy where they John McCain has been proven right.


12. TAX INCREASES: Biden said Americans earning less than $250,000 wouldn’t see higher taxes, but the Obama-Biden tax plan would raise taxes on individuals making $200,000 or more.


13. BAILOUT: Biden said the economic rescue legislation matches the four principles that Obama laid out, but in reality it doesn’t meet two of the four principles that Obama outlined on Sept. 19, which were that it include an emergency economic stimulus package, and that it be part of “part of a globally coordinated effort with our partners in the G-20.”


14. REAGAN TAX RATES: Biden is wrong in saying that under Obama, Americans won't pay any more in taxes then they did under Reagan.

 

[midwestyankee]

Fresh from the McCain people.


JOE BIDEN’S 14 LIES TONIGHT

How refreshing to see you pull your evidence from an unbiased source, WD.

 

[midwestyankee]

I have an honest question for my fellow viewers, now that I've seen the end of the debate:

Is it possible that Palin didn't know what an Achilles' heel was?

Or is it more likely that she just ignored/refused to answer the question?

Here's the clip of the question and both responses.

I expected her to try to answer after she argued the lack of experience point, but then she just kept on listing the reasons why she thinks she's so great and I started to wonder if she just didn't understand what Ifill was asking.

I just can't figure out why she would respond in the way she did to that particular question. If she just didn't want to give any perceived weakness, she would have given a Biden-like answer, no?

I thought the same thing as she was answering. The thing is, all night she'd pretend to answer Ifill's question in a sentence or two and then launch into her script for the balance of her allotted time.

And kudos to you for questioning Ifill's performance. I thought she was not very good. Her questions were entirely too predictable, she did not rein in the off-topic answers, and did nothing to challenge the two to engage each other, though I suspect that the rules of the evening did hamper her quite a bit. Still, she had freedom to ask anything and her question set sounded like one you might get from a decent high school newspaper reporter.

 

[WriterDom]

Gwen Ifill gave Biden the last word. Consistently.