Being a woman in geek culture

[KoPilot]

No, I took - and continue to take - exception to the definition of 'geek culture' as a 'haven'. Based on a personal perspective of 30-40 years immersion in that culture.

Culture by its very definition necessitates that some group of people find it to be a "haven", an inside as opposed to an outside. "Geekdom" is not an objectively defined category that exists outside of human experience, it is defined completely by the experiences of the people who adopt the mantle. So you're wrong here.

Hypocritical and intrusive? Well, thank goodness being here is entirely voluntary... Those eager to take offence where none was intended can hopefully make their way to the exits unharmed... Heaven forfend that any voice not singing the litany might harm their shell like ears by making an unpopular observation...

Here's a good write-up on why the common trope of "stop getting offended" is asinine and completely ignores the point.

We'e gotten a lot of men come in here, pretty randomly, and accuse us of not having appropriate reactions to things in various ways-- some short and sweet, some sermon-length, some obvious, some concern-trolling.

What these posts all have in common, like your previous note about choosing to be victims, is the idea that your voice as a man gets to trump ours here. By telling us that we're looking to get offended, that we're choosing victimhood over survivorhood, means that you want us to agree with your perspective and assume it, abandoning our own.

Why in the world do you think we would want to hear that, over and over and over again? Ad nauseum? Because you've permitted yourself to think that it's such a wise perspective, such original advice. Not only are you OK with not being aware of the conversation we've been having up until the point where you came in, but you're OK with not having the slightest conception of how often we hear exactly these things, and how we're expected to drop everything and admit that we're wrong and overreacting.

If you can't even let us respond to words, messages, events, in the way that we feel like it, then you have no business being in here.

 

[Keroin]

Umm... isn't the whole point of a gender neutral meritocracy that everyone has to prove themselves? And that whoever gets to be King/Queen of the Hill gets there by fighting their way tooth and claw up that hill?

Equality means having a level playing field, not that you get the prize just for showing up.

Certainly in many cases the playing field is not level as regards gender. But that's what needs fixed, by everyone. And it's hard work.

Cheers

Clearly you have missed the point. Let me switch things up and frame this in a way that you might more easily understand.

You are going out of town for a few weeks and decide to hire someone to house and pet sit for you while you're gone. You get two candidates, each of whom can work for a week: a white man and a black man.

You ask the black man for a criminal background check, personal and professional references, and insist that he is bonded. You ask for nothing from the white guy. You hire them both. The black man does a fantastic job. The white guys leaves your house a mess and steals from you.

Why did the black man have to prove anything to you and the white guy didn't? You see, that's what we're talking about here. Either both sexes have to prove their competence or neither do.

This is not singing a sad song, this is pointing out a serious flaw that exists in not just geekdom but in many, many facets of life. You probably don't see it, because you're not the one who has to prove himself simply based on gender.

For the record, I had a successful career in a male-dominated industry. And while I did well, this was my experience on numerous occasions.

 

[Primalex]

Real life. New female software developer at work.

Girl:"I get a strange error message when I try to compile the project. Can you take a look?"
qp:"Sure......hm... The message says that you have duplicate files in your project. What did you do?"
Girl:"Nothing, I just copied the old project files over the new project files."
qp:"Well, it says you have duplicate files in your folder."
Girl:"That's the strange thing."
qp:"Well, did you look and check if there are duplicate files in there?"
Girl:"No."
qp opens Explorer. "You didn't copy the files over each other, you copied the old project into a subfolder of the new project."


So, after the third time of her total helplessness and me fixing it, she walks over to a coworker and says:"qp thinks I'm stupid because I'm a woman."

 

[Stella_Omega]

Why DO you think she's stupid? I mean-- I know that she fucked up a whole lot there, but do you ascribe an underlying reason for that?

 

[Recidiva]

Real life. New female software developer at work.

Girl:"I get a strange error message when I try to compile the project. Can you take a look?"
qp:"Sure......hm... The message says that you have duplicate files in your project. What did you do?"
Girl:"Nothing, I just copied the old project files over the new project files."
qp:"Well, it says you have duplicate files in your folder."
Girl:"That's the strange thing."
qp:"Well, did you look and check if there are duplicate files in there?"
Girl:"No."
qp opens Explorer. "You didn't copy the files over each other, you copied the old project into a subfolder of the new project."


So, after the third time of her total helplessness and me fixing it, she walks over to a coworker and says:"qp thinks I'm stupid because I'm a woman."

There are dumb women. We've all seen them. If she can't take feedback and blames it on you, that's on her.

I don't think it's fair that she does that. Nor does she have the right to do that to you if you don't think it, you think she's dumb because she's dumb.

But if you really do think she's dumb because she's a woman, maybe that bleeds through too.

I don't know, can't speak for you, can't speak for her, can only speak for myself.

Did you inform her that you overheard her and that you didn't think that was fair, or did you save it up to tell us here? Because that matters.

 

[KoPilot]

Real life.

Black man gets arrested for crack possession.

Latino man joins gang, commits murder.

Woman gets divorced, takes everything, gets full custody, child support goes towards purses while kids go to school hungry.

Gay man molests children.

Omg, so like... stereotypes are sometimes reinforced by the actions of a few people? Omg. Revelation.

Lex, do you even like, read books or anything? Was the last paper you heard about regarding the difference between the sexes the one claimed women were unfit for higher education because all their blood would go to their brains and their uteri would atrophy? Because there's been some interesting developments since then.

 

[satindesire]

Talking to Mr. Stalker like he's a real person that can use his brain logically instead of trolling my threads because he's obsessed with me is like banging your head on a brick wall.

Don't bother. The minute he joined Lit he was a troll and he's always going to be a troll.

He WANTS attention. That's why he's here, to see how much he can get if he says outrageous things that make no sense. He WANTS to argue and fight. He WANTS to be seen as a sexist bastard.

By quoting him, replying to his nonsensical textual diarrhea, you are affirming the fact that if he's ugly enough, he'll get the responses he wants.

To him, being ignored is worse than death. He's here for attention because he's a lonely, sad pitiful excuse for a man. Even negative attention is attention.

DO NOT FEED THE TROLL.

 

[Recidiva]

Talking to Mr. Stalker like he's a real person that can use his brain logically instead of trolling my threads because he's obsessed with me is like banging your head on a brick wall.

Don't bother. The minute he joined Lit he was a troll and he's always going to be a troll.

He WANTS attention. That's why he's here, to see how much he can get if he says outrageous things that make no sense. He WANTS to argue and fight. He WANTS to be seen as a sexist bastard.

By quoting him, replying to his nonsensical textual diarrhea, you are affirming the fact that if he's ugly enough, he'll get the responses he wants.

To him, being ignored is worse than death. He's here for attention because he's a lonely, sad pitiful excuse for a man. Even negative attention is attention.

DO NOT FEED THE TROLL.

...this isn't specific enough. Which one?

 

[KoPilot]

Talking to Mr. Stalker like he's a real person that can use his brain logically instead of trolling my threads because he's obsessed with me is like banging your head on a brick wall.

Don't bother. The minute he joined Lit he was a troll and he's always going to be a troll.

He WANTS attention. That's why he's here, to see how much he can get if he says outrageous things that make no sense. He WANTS to argue and fight. He WANTS to be seen as a sexist bastard.

By quoting him, replying to his nonsensical textual diarrhea, you are affirming the fact that if he's ugly enough, he'll get the responses he wants.

To him, being ignored is worse than death. He's here for attention because he's a lonely, sad pitiful excuse for a man. Even negative attention is attention.

DO NOT FEED THE TROLL.

I swear, it's like bacon sometimes.

But you're right. Yes ma'am. u_u

 

[satindesire]

...this isn't specific enough. Which one?

Primadonna.

Oops, I meant Primalex.

I swear, it's like bacon sometimes.

But you're right. Yes ma'am. u_u

*hug*

ETA: LOOK GUYS! NEW AVATAR!

I have short hair now!! Like it?

 

[gagginforit]

*hug*

ETA: LOOK GUYS! NEW AVATAR!

I have short hair now!! Like it?

Can't really make it out. Can you brighten it up a bit and post a larger pic?

 

[Recidiva]

Primadonna.

Oops, I meant Primalex.



*hug*

ETA: LOOK GUYS! NEW AVATAR!

I have short hair now!! Like it?

Oh, THAT one! Okay

You are adorable!

 

[greyjim]

Primadonna.

Oops, I meant Primalex.



*hug*

ETA: LOOK GUYS! NEW AVATAR!

I have short hair now!! Like it?

Very sexy...

 

[Sir_Winston54]

ETA: LOOK GUYS! NEW AVATAR!

I have short hair now!! Like it?

Have to agree with gaggin - a bit hard for these old eyes to make out. A few shades lighter would help, though what I can see looks as gorgeous as ever.

 

[satindesire]

Sorry guys! The room was pretty dark when I took the pictures, so the camera just didn't pick up very well. However, I managed to do some lightening/sharpening! Hopefully that makes up for it! ^_^

Here's the full sized picture, no cropping or anything, that my avatar came from.

http://postimg.org/image/3ttx4p21p/

 

[greyjim]

Sorry guys! The room was pretty dark when I took the pictures, so the camera just didn't pick up very well. However, I managed to do some lightening/sharpening! Hopefully that makes up for it! ^_^

Here's the full sized picture, no cropping or anything, that my avatar came from.

http://postimg.org/image/3ttx4p21p/

Satin...you are very very attractive...great hair cut!

 

[Stella_Omega]

Adorable, Satin!

 

[Sir_Winston54]

Sorry guys! The room was pretty dark when I took the pictures, so the camera just didn't pick up very well. However, I managed to do some lightening/sharpening! Hopefully that makes up for it! ^_^

Here's the full sized picture, no cropping or anything, that my avatar came from.

http://postimg.org/image/3ttx4p21p/

Tyvm! And I was right: You *are* just as gorgeous as ever.

ETA: The haircut is really, really cute!

 

[Primalex]

Omg, so like... stereotypes are sometimes reinforced by the actions of a few people?

Geek gamers are sexists is then just a stereotype, isn't it?

And any case presented here is merely the case of a few people reinforcing the stereotype.


Did I get this right? No, most likely not. Let me correct this to get the feminist approval:
If it's something bad about guys, it's an illustration of reality. If it's something bad about girls, it's just an exception that merely reinforces an unjustified stereotype.

Did I summarize your opinion correctly?

 

[Primalex]

Did you inform her that you overheard her and that you didn't think that was fair, or did you save it up to tell us here? Because that matters.

My coworker replied:"qp? qp thinks everyone is stupid." I considered this to be an acceptable end.

 

[Recidiva]

My coworker replied:"qp? qp thinks everyone is stupid." I considered this to be an acceptable end.

Thanks for the answer. I can't talk to you anymore. Sorry!

Nothing personal! I just like satindesire more than I like you and although that is unfair, I think it's worth it.

 

[Primalex]

Nothing personal! I just like satindesire more than I like you

Isn't this a contradiction?

 

[gagginforit]

.....

 

[satindesire]

GFI brightened the picture http://s186.photobucket.com/user/hu...People/Avatar_Short_Hair_zps495d4314.jpg.html

I'm not so great at digital manipulation so thank you!

Anyway, back to the topic at hand.

http://feminspire.com/will-agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-be-the-super-show-women-deserve/

"But for a genre known to sexualize women and stick with white actors, or whitewash characters entirely, Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. might be a kick in the pants for the comic and superhero franchise to FINALLY understand that women are a predominate part of your audience, and including women, and especially women of color, who are valued for their unique talents instead of their looks is the least we deserve after so much disappointment."

 

[Primalex]

ETA: LOOK GUYS! NEW AVATAR!

I have short hair now!! Like it?

Nothing sums up "Being a woman in geek culture" better than this.