Extramarital Affairs in Women.

[sexymilf44]

Yea I’m a bit far away

Very funny! It would be a different Lit member!

 

[Greytruck]

I have strayed in my marriage … so if wife had an affair I couldn’t be mad.
Fair is fair

 

[WildFireTN]

Interesting perspective. As I have noted before I don't know if there is a good excuse for cheating. But in a world where people generally disapprove of non-monogamy, especially among women, I think it is fair to say that those of us who don't want to be monogamous are at a distinct disadvantage.

When I was growing up it wasn't just a matter of being clear on where you stand. A woman who chose to be non-monogamous and sexually adventurous was met with very harsh judgment. Being deemed a promiscuous slut - even if open and honest about it - was arguably no better than being a cheater. And in some ways an unhappy wife who keeps her affair(s) discrete might be more accepted than a slut. So all roads seemingly led towards being compelled to resists one's sexual temptation. And when we consider how some people may have a much higher sex drive and greater sexual opportunity it seems a bit unfair to be as harshly critical as we can be sometimes.

Yes! Well said.

 

[drobert44]

Yep, I fuck a married high school dame out in Kansas. We are both 80. He used to beat her, I am the only man to touch her in 10 years.

 

[Bigboobbabe]

I agree, but it may be a need that one isn't aware of until they are much older. And people often confuse polyamory with the desire for multiple sex partners. They are NOT the same.

My wife and I found monogamy to be quite easy for the first 25 years of our marriage. After which our desire to love only each other remained strongly intact, but the desire for occasional NSA (no strings attached) sex outside the marriage grew stronger and stronger.

You are describing ethical non-monogamy. No strings.

In polyamory, you deeply like or are in love with more than 1 person. It's like having 2 (or more) committed relationships.

 

[drobert44]

You are describing ethical non-monogamy. No strings.

In polyamory, you deeply like or are in love with more than 1 person. It's like having 2 (or more) committed relationships.

Yes, only one relationship at a time.

 

[Swuck]

My wife and I have cheated. We both know that the other has strayed. We decided that knowing details were not beneficial. We have an unspoken “don’t ask” rule. We have a very good sex life and marriage. In fact I attribute her great oral skills came from a bf.

 

[LMWM321]

As an aside, this is a great thread. ..Lot's of thoughtful, on-point discussion that has remained quite civil. ..I just re-read the whole thread again.

It's kind of a shame that Fetish & Sexuality are a combined thread. It's weird seeing this serious, informative topic alongside the "how long since you swallowed a load" and "The experience of having pee in my mouth" threads. ...I'm not judging people or their fetishes, I'm totally fine w/ it. But this is a serious convo, while those threads are just people looking to get their respective itches scratched. Wouldn't be a bad thing if they separated the two, IMHO.

 

[bilash]

Funny...dude never compared himself to other dudes or see who was making friends with who, eh?

Ya gotta know yourself, certainly. Improve what you can, accept what you can't. Making yourself especially handsome and 4 inches taller just isn't realistic. But there is a giant list of things a guy can do to improve himself. Be around women and they will notice. But that's another thread.

As for me, I do okay. Fit, job, good friend, clean, generous lover , a person could do much worse than me! Ain't no "Chad", not wealthy, not tall, etc. But I know this so I've never pursued any chick higher than what I rate a 8. (Looks) Okay, maybe a couple of times, with expected results.

Makeup, cosmetics, plastics surgery make a 4 gal into 10 queen.
Example: Black Pink's Lisa.

Who are lewd women having sex with? Themselves? Lol no.

A good portion of modern young boys think those Instagram models r real! I wish they knew a bit more about editing apps!


The court or judicial system doesn't force rich men to marry poor women so they can rob money in divorce settlement.

A particular person may not like providing child support. Okay why didn't he use condoms?

 

[lc69hunter]

Cheating. Many gradients as to what constitutes cheating. I am not a fan of affairs. They eventually get caught, and about 80% destroy the marriage, hurting everyone involved.
However, a random one-off, while out of town or something, where there is, no harm, no foul is perfectly acceptable. It can actually help the marriage if done right

 

[Greytruck]

Cheating. Many gradients as to what constitutes cheating. I am not a fan of affairs. They eventually get caught, and about 80% destroy the marriage, hurting everyone involved.
However, a random one-off, while out of town or something, where there is, no harm, no foul is perfectly acceptable. It can actually help the marriage if done right

Yeah affairs are dangerous.. it starts as sex then it’s an attatchment.

 

[policywank]

I think that affairs can be dangerous and I certainly don't advocate betrayal.

However, I think that our perception of how things usually go is distorted by relying on anecdotal evidence. This is something about which most people seek to be discrete. So it tends to be the ones where something goes wrong that we become aware of. We are much less likely to become aware of the other affairs that remain discrete and where there isn't a bad outcome. That doesn't mean they don't exist.

It is also one of those things that has a fairly consistent treatment in popular culture. Affairs in movies usually have a bad ending because that is the preferred plot line, not because it is a realistic portrayal. It is a bit like the dark alley. If the director shows you a dark alley in a movie chances are there is something bad there. That reinforces a natural (and prudent) fear of dark alleys. But there isn't actually something bad down every dark alley or even a majority of them.

 

[hulmule]

I have had a couple of affair's. Like others said, starts out as sex and filling each others needs... Then the relationship changing for one person... One start falling for the other then things happened. Either a person gets hurt or their bugging for more and wanting to spend more time together . Been on both sides...

 

[Greytruck]

I have had a couple of affair's. Like others said, starts out as sex and filling each others needs... Then the relationship changing for one person... One start falling for the other then things happened. Either a person gets hurt or their bugging for more and wanting to spend more time together . Been on both sides...

Yeah like you had a couple affairs… and you are right.. starts as just sex.
Then feeling emerge

 

[lc69hunter]

I think that affairs can be dangerous and I certainly don't advocate betrayal.

However, I think that our perception of how things usually go is distorted by relying on anecdotal evidence. This is something about which most people seek to be discrete. So it tends to be the ones where something goes wrong that we become aware of. We are much less likely to become aware of the other affairs that remain discrete and where there isn't a bad outcome. That doesn't mean they don't exist.

It is also one of those things that has a fairly consistent treatment in popular culture. Affairs in movies usually have a bad ending because that is the preferred plot line, not because it is a realistic portrayal. It is a bit like the dark alley. If the director shows you a dark alley in a movie chances are there is something bad there. That reinforces a natural (and prudent) fear of dark alleys. But there isn't actually something bad down every dark alley or even a majority of them.

As always, love your counterpoints. If your affair is consensual with your mate, it can work, even though there will be issues to be worked through at times. I have seen the "work spouse" thing work several times and it is neat when all parties are onboard.

 

[policywank]

As always, love your counterpoints. If your affair is consensual with your mate, it can work, even though there will be issues to be worked through at times. I have seen the "work spouse" thing work several times and it is neat when all parties are onboard.

I think that even affairs that are not consensual with your mate have a wider range of outcomes than we tend to acknowledge. If we take the position that the fact that one partner has been betrayed means that the outcome is intrinsically bad then yes these things always end badly. But if we think of bad outcomes as being those affairs that end up blowing up in someone's face so to speak, then there are plenty that don't go that way.

That doesn't mean the affair was justified or ethical, just that they don't all blow up in someone's face. I have known lots of people who had discrete affairs that never came to light and never affected their lives beyond any sense of guilt they may have felt. In some cases they were acting selfishly and in others they were pursuing the least bad alternative in a complex world. In most cases "happily ever after monogamy" wasn't a realistic option and so does not in my opinion represent the only relevant reference point for whether or not it ended badly.

 

[LMWM321]

If we take the position that the fact that one partner has been betrayed means that the outcome is intrinsically bad then yes these things always end badly

Well said as always, PW.

It's a shame that we have been raised to regard a spouse having sex outside of the marriage as an absolute marriage-ending betrayal instead of being seen as that person perhaps just acting in the best interest of their own mental or physical well-being. I know of two people - one woman and one man - who didn't really feel hopelessly affronted by their spouse's one-off infidelity but felt that they had to go through with divorce because they'd lose face in the community if they didn't. Indeed, friends and family - many of whom were also divorced - were telling them, "divorce him/ her or people won't respect you!" So they did divorce, and today neither of those people is very happy. ..Stupid, eh?

This change WILL happen. To wit: There was a time (and is still is in some countries) when a woman was considered hopelessly devalued by not being a virgin when marrying. Well, we now see that as fucking ridiculous. But in truth it really wasn't that long ago - and sadly there still countries today where that is very much the case. That same sort of change may come as it relates to "cheaters."

Today, young men and women are taught from a young age that if their spouse cheats, "you MUST throw that POS to the curb!" and "Once a cheater, ALWAYS a cheater! And the biggest of all, "You can no longer trust him/ her!!"

Yet if you REALLY break it down, is that necessarily true? Well, yeah, perhaps you CAN count on them fucking someone who's NOT YOU again, but NOT trust them? Not trust them for what? ..Be at your side if you get sick? ..Risk their life for yours in the face of danger? ..Do his/ her share of providing for the family? ..Of being a loving, fully engaged parent helping to raise kind, self-sufficient kids? To be with you as you grow old in retirement?

There is NOTHING about a spouse occasionally spending a few hours fucking someone else - maybe just a handful of times over the course of decades! - that necessarily means they can no longer be counted on to do any of those things! Indeed, there are POS spouses who do none of those things who have NEVER cheated.

Instead of people taking such a hardline against sex outside of marriage, wouldn't it be better for couples to understand that perhaps a person CAN be a trusted life partner even though they may occasionally need sex outside of the marriage? And agree on sensible conditions under which NSA sex w/ someone else can occur.

 

[policywank]

Well said as always, PW.

It's a shame that we have been raised to regard a spouse having sex outside of the marriage as an absolute marriage-ending betrayal instead of being seen as that person perhaps just acting in the best interest of their own mental or physical well-being. I know of two people - one woman and one man - who didn't really feel hopelessly affronted by their spouse's one-off infidelity but felt that they had to go through with divorce because they'd lose face in the community if they didn't. Indeed, friends and family - many of whom were also divorced - were telling them they "divorce him/ her or people won't respect you!" So they did divorce, and today neither of those people is very happy. ..Stupid, eh?

This change WILL happen. To wit: There was a time (and is still is in some countries) when a woman was considered hopelessly devalued by not being a virgin when marrying. Well, we now see that as fucking ridiculous. But in truth it really wasn't that long ago - and sadly there still countries today where that is very much the case. That same sort of change may come as it relates to "cheaters."

Today, young men and women are taught from a young age that if their spouse cheats, "you MUST throw that POS to the curb!" and "Once a cheater, ALWAYS a cheater! And the biggest of all, "You can no longer trust him/ her!!"

Yet if you REALLY break it down, is that necessarily true? Well, yeah, perhaps you CAN count on them fucking someone who's NOT YOU again, but NOT trust them? Not trust them for what? ..Be at your side if you get sick? ..Risk their life for yours in the face of danger? ..Do his/ her share of providing for the family? ..Of being a loving, fully engaged parent helping to raise kind, self-sufficient kids? To NOT be with you as you grow old in retirement?

There is NOTHING about a spouse occasionally spending a few hours fucking someone else - maybe just a handful of times over the course of decades! - that necessarily means they can no longer be counted on to do any of those things! Indeed, there are POS spouses who do none of those things who have NEVER cheated.

Instead of people taking such a hardline against sex outside of marriage, wouldn't it be better for couples to understand that perhaps a person CAN be a trusted life partner even though they may occasionally need sex outside of the marriage? And agree on sensible conditions under which NSA sex w/ someone else can occur?

People make mistakes. All of us. The magnitude of those mistakes and what they say about the person who made the mistake can only be ascertained by looking at the whole picture. We shouldn't get into making excuses for others and trust once lost is difficult to earn back. But I don't think absolutes are helpful. It is not difficult to imagine scenarios in which infidelity is at least understandable even if not fully justified.

I think that as humans we tend to sort of adopt an artificial hierarchy of sins. We deem the sins of which we are guilty to be forgivable and the sins which we find personally most discomforting as unforgivable. And the distinction is often based upon what society at large believes and that in turn is rooted in artificial social constructs as opposed to any objective criteria.

The world is full of sins like engaging in unfair/unethical business practices, theft, assault or even murder for which we choose to see nuance. We ask what actually happened and why. We look at the circumstances and allow for the possibility that some of them may be mitigating. That doesn't mean we are accepting of those sins, just that we choose to look closer before passing judgment.

For some people cheating may be that ultimate sin which they can never forgive. But I think that reflects their mindset more so than any absolute immutable truth. Likewise there are plenty of instances of cheating where the circumstances would lead you to believe that there is no way forward for the relationship, but that is after looking at the whole picture, not absolutes.

 

[mmarfox]

Cheating is shitty, both on the perpetrator and their partner. ENM is just people who want to cheat without the guilt.

 

[lc69hunter]

Cheating is shitty, both on the perpetrator and their partner. ENM is just people who want to cheat without the guilt.

Sorry, sir, but I must disagree with you. That is a very black and white answer to a very NOT black or white issue. @policywank and I sometimes come to this from a different position, as having different experiences in this issue, but she is probably the premier source of wisdom on this and related issues.

I tend to lean toward the position of a random one-off, where there is no harm, no foul, nobody hurt, embarrassed or humiliated, is an acceptable form of cheating. A UK survey of several ears ago said that 42% of women on vacation had sex with someone other than their spouse or mate. It is life. I have been with a number of married women over the years, and never once denigrated or disrespected the husband, as he is the man she loved, not me. I was just scratching an itch.

As a Marine, on my last one year unaccompanied tour (before the days of cell phones and the internet), I told my wife, "I know you cannot remain celibate for the year, so, no VD(now they call it STD's), no new kids, do not embarrass or humiliate me, and be safe. Also, try not to break up someone else's marriage. So yes, I was cheated on, but with my eyes wide open.

 

[Justfantasies]

You should have just asked what leads people to cheat. Men and women really arent that different. So, the exact same things that lead to men cheating. Unhappiness in their relationship, feelings of neglect(including but not limited to lack of sex), being taken for granted, etc, all while the attraction to and possibility of a different guy fills the needs she feels are neglected. I.E. She doesn't feel like you appreciate/are attracted to her while the other guy does make her feel that way.

Or, also just as with guys, sometimes they're just incapable of monogamy. Though I do feel like that's more common with men than women in my, admittedly biased, opinion.

Great answer. This answers the question, especially the bit about men and women not being all that different

 

[mmarfox]

@lc69hunter so your argument is predicted on the “position of a random one-off, where there is no harm, no foul, nobody hurt, embarrassed or humiliated” as an acceptable form of, as you admit, cheating? This is a woefully optimistic perception of the nature of infidelity, the root causes of it, and the inevitable fallout. Yes I’m sure you were quit the gentlemen to fuck all these married women and never degrade their husband. Very honorable of you. Tell me, if they were just one offs as you favor, how would you even know the impact your actions have had down the line, behind close doors, where your not privileged to hear since that isn’t your marriage, your life partner? What do you care. You’re just scratching an itch right? Maybe you figured it out though. It’s ok if your wife cannot keep her panties on for a whole year while you’re away on duty as long as you are aware of it, right? Look at the root causes of why people look for relations outside of their significant other? What in their life, in their relationship, within themselves are they grappling with? It is not “just life” as you say. That’s a cowards way out that doesn’t take the hard look internally necessary for growth and actual love, for oneself and for their significant other.

 

[lc69hunter]

@lc69hunter so your argument is predicted on the “position of a random one-off, where there is no harm, no foul, nobody hurt, embarrassed or humiliated” as an acceptable form of, as you admit, cheating? This is a woefully optimistic perception of the nature of infidelity, the root causes of it, and the inevitable fallout. Yes I’m sure you were quit the gentlemen to fuck all these married women and never degrade their husband. Very honorable of you. Tell me, if they were just one offs as you favor, how would you even know the impact your actions have had down the line, behind close doors, where your not privileged to hear since that isn’t your marriage, your life partner? What do you care. You’re just scratching an itch right? Maybe you figured it out though. It’s ok if your wife cannot keep her panties on for a whole year while you’re away on duty as long as you are aware of it, right? Look at the root causes of why people look for relations outside of their significant other? What in their life, in their relationship, within themselves are they grappling with? It is not “just life” as you say. That’s a cowards way out that doesn’t take the hard look internally necessary for growth and actual love, for oneself and for their significant other.

I was scratching their itch, not mine. The facts are that men do not seduce married women. That is an arrogant perception by men. If a married woman offers her favors, take what she offers, gracefully, kiss her and send her home, hopefully satisfied. Unlike most men, who are binary thinkers, a woman is able to compartmentalize what she is doing, separate from the love of her husband, family and marriage.

 

[marriedbigrl]

I was scratching their itch, not mine. The facts are that men do not seduce married women. That is an arrogant perception by men. If a married woman offers her favors, take what she offers, gracefully, kiss her and send her home, hopefully satisfied. Unlike most men, who are binary thinkers, a woman is able to compartmentalize what she is doing, separate from the love of her husband, family and marriage.

That's the biggest load of bull shit I've ever had the misfortune to read.

 

[drobert44]

That's the biggest load of bull shit I've ever had the misfortune to read.

Exactly, I have seduced and am now fucking a married woman.