Imagine: Self-Absorbed Sex

[Netzach]

What sunfox said, I've lied. I've fudged and gotten really quiet. I've made promises I've never intended to keep. I've broken hearts.

And I've had it done to me. More frequently actually, by a lot. I've found that being the asshole is harder than being the hurt, sometimes.

Love is as pretty as those nature shows on fucking whatever channel. Sometimes I root for the fox, sometimes I root for the bunny.

Comparing the green river killer to someone who lied to get someone in the sack is like comparing Hitler to your uptight school principal. I don't see how strangling sex workers compares to making bad on romantic promise.

OT aside to lara, thank you, It's amazing what a professional can do, whatever the endeavor, photography being one.

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Imagine: Self-Absorbed Sex

this is sick. sick sick sick. deliberate. ohh that is soo grossss~~~ I almost can't even believe this is true! Only a truly injured =--deeeply injured, soul-injured person is capable of deliberately hurting another human--god that's disgusting! and to think it's fun hurting someone else ... I'm glad you're healed pet...


I pray this is not for real. I mean, I can see what's-his-face...the one th---the Green River Killer being so caught up in his belief that he is bad that he actually got enjoyment out of killing ...

butand omg this belief that it's okay has got to be where it began
oh grosss

OK...the point of this thread was to discuss the ability to play that way. I have done it. If the mood strikes me, I will do it again. It is deeply offensive to me that you would decide based on my experiences that I am akin to a murderer.

Yes, deliberately hurting/misleading someone is a mean, twisted, cruel and very sadistic thing to do. I admit it. Part of the pleasure was knowing that they would be hurt or upset by my actions or lack thereof. I have always enjoyed the game. But to sit up on your little soap box and tell me that I am wrong...where do you even get off? Who gave you the right to judge me?

The fact of the matter is EM that not everyone is as lily white as you. Some of us enjoy the dirtier side of things. That is who and what we are. If you have lived a completely spotless life with no lies, no grudge fucks, no fights, no hurt I am exceedingly happy for you...that doesn't mean I have. And it doesn't mean that your way of doing things is better than mine, it's just different.

I think THAT was the most disrespectful post I have ever seen by you...and I have seen quite a few.

Shelly

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Imagine: Self-Absorbed Sex

Hmm, I would only be able or want to do that if I was angry, and Pure said anger was out. "no grudge or loss of temper."

How did you react to their reaction?

How about this -- does it qualify or no? I guy I was living with said, calmly, 'what would you say if I told you I was only with you for your sweet young body?'
I didn't have the words, so I overturned my beer on his head. He got mad. Hardly seemed fair. I felt he should have taken it calmly.

So pet and pure, is (or was) dishing it out but not being able to take it part of the equation?

(edited to add paragraphing)

My reaction? No reaction. Simply put, they had provided what I needed from them: a body, nothing more, nothing less. I never made promises I did not intend to keep, nor did I tell them I would give them anything more. True my actions may have led them to believe otherwise but IMO that was just part of the game.

And as I have never had it done to me, I am not sure if I could (or would) take it but sex just for fun..sure why not? We have condoms, we have spermicidal inserts...why attach more to it then what it is: (at least sometimes) the primal urge to mate, period. Attaching emotions to it is only to satisfy some outdated notion of society.

(The above does not mean I do not believe in love or whatever strong feelings...I just don't feel that love really has anything to do with sex..or vice versa)

 

[sunfox]

Not to hijack Pure's thread again... unless he'd spank me for it, in which case, I'm guilty!

But am I the only one who sees the humor in someone into BDSM saying it's terrible and wrong to deliberately hurt another person?

*goes off to have a giggle*

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

Not to hijack Pure's thread again... unless he'd spank me for it, in which case, I'm guilty!

But am I the only one who sees the humor in someone into BDSM saying it's terrible and wrong to deliberately hurt another person?

*goes off to have a giggle*

thanks sunfox for that cheerful thought after my minor rant...

[hi-jack over]

 

[Pure]

Excellent point, Sunny. The proud statement "I'm a sadist, but I'm never mean to anyone" does often leap out a ya, in these parts!

Ethereal, a point suggested by apet and others, also, is that every hurt is not evidence of a criminal act or disposition. Like, say, when your fiance walks out on you the day before the wedding (happened to a friend) having previously disclosed no reservations.

Ethereal, I don't want to get too far into your ethereal realm unconnected with this thread and its debauched inhabitants, but did you read the opening posting which indicated observance of the law?

As to deception, that's complicated; deliberate gros lying puts one in the unscrupulous outlands of libertinism, though there's no clear line.

In most cases people are willing to mislead themselves; i.e., if she makes you come good, many a female will feel there's some bond and relationship, as Netzach has pointed out. Many a male will mistake the results of bedroom stickmanship for desire to become an ongoing fucktoy.

That's why I've stressed that 'expectations' are violated, which is a different thing from actively deceiving; it's showing up assumptions, for instance.

It's to be noted that deliberate lying is often crude and inneffective: it is going to mean a pretty swift end of things (sometimes desired), and a loss of credibility.

I.e, your self absorbed *lying person isn't gonna get laid a second time, if found out, and all further statements may be disbelieved, which surely cramps his or her libertine style, esp. if the whole neighborhood or barroom crowd hears the story.

People have much less sympathy with "I thought s/he'd call again, things seemed to go so well."
----

Note: Netzach, as well as debauched, you're definitely an unsavory character who's welcome in this thread!

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

As to deception, that's complicated; deliberate gros lying puts one in the unscrupulous outlands of libertinism, though there's no clear line.

In most cases people are willing to mislead themselves; i.e., if she makes you come good, many a female will feel there's some bond and relationship, as Netzach has pointed out. Many a male will mistake the results of bedroom stickmanship for desire to become an ongoing fucktoy.

That's why I've stressed that 'expectations' are violated, which is a different thing from actively deceiving; it's showing up assumptions, for instance.

It's to be noted that deliberate lying is often crude and inneffective: it is going to mean a pretty swift end of things (sometimes desired), and a loss of credibility.

I.e, your self absorbed *lying person isn't gonna get laid a second time, if found out, and all further statements may be disbelieved, which surely cramps his or her libertine style, esp. if the whole neighborhood or barroom crowd hears the story.

People have much less sympathy with "I thought s/he'd call again, things seemed to go so well."

Pure:

If my brain would have been functioning when first I stumbled upon EM's post, I would have tried pointing out the same thing. As it is I have never HAD to tell a deliberate untruth to get some stud mufin or a little chickie into the sack. I have just always let their assumptions work FOR me.

Another minor point: for me the end of the game was in some respects more important then the actual chase or capture. The ability to just *stop* whatever the other person felt they needed from me, was the prize.

It was not like I was dealing with children or teenagers. Nine times out of ten, the same people I played would have done it to me..if they had the chance. THAT has always been the thrill, sexually. The ability to say "I got what I needed...now go away." and really mean it.

Does that make me a hard ass? Probably, but I didn't care then and if I ever played those games again, I wouldn't care now. Sex is just sex after all.

pet

 

[Phoenix Stone]

Pure:

If my brain would have been functioning when first I stumbled upon EM's post, I would have tried pointing out the same thing. As it is I have never HAD to tell a deliberate untruth to get some stud mufin or a little chickie into the sack. I have just always let their assumptions work FOR me.

Another minor point: for me the end of the game was in some respects more important then the actual chase or capture. The ability to just *stop* whatever the other person felt they needed from me, was the prize.

Sex is just sex after all.

pet

I think some of us, most especially probably EM, are talking about different things here, or at least different levels of this game. You seem to be talking about a one time thing with someone who maybe would rather it be long term and was persuing a longtime relationship with you when you were just persuing sex. Ok, so going to bed with them without say, stopping and having them sign a waiver first, 'wait, wait, before you take off your pants, you are aware, are you not that my intentions toward you are strictly dishonorable? Sign here, if yes.'
Nothing unfair or evil or anything else about not doing that.

Taking the argument one step further, I was asking in my last post, about telling someone you are living with, that you only wanted them for your body -- would you then be outraged at their outrage? (Exemplified here by my dumping a beer on the guy's head?) Or would you have no reaction to my outraged reaction.
I think it was what you said earlier, something about letting them know that this is all they are 'worth,' that you meant it as a putdown, of someone who presumably has feelings for you, that I object to. Where do you draw the line? What about coldly and calculatedly being in a relationship with someone for an extended period, knowing this is what you were doing, and Then smilingly springing it on them out of the blue one day? Still ok? Still feeling good about cruelly crushing their feelings? Perhaps even better? It's so much more effective once you've been together for a while. Then they Really know they've been played.

Along those lines, your outrage at EM's disrespectful posting about your disrespectful (and proud of it) treatment of others, strikes me as amusing.

Not quite as much as her equating what I assume we've been talking about here with some killer, which seems like a pretty bizarre leap, but amusing nonetheless. (Btw, by your lights, I would expect amusement at my dumping the beer to be a more reasonable response than his outrage. Thought the dude was gonna kill me, right there in public. Talking about being able to dish it out but not take the least little bit of it....)

 

[Pure]

Hi Phoenix,

Did you ever see 'Dangerous Liaisons', the better one, with Malkevich?

That would make the answer to your beer pouring question, now repeated, pretty obvious. The libertine, when finally 'discovered' may well face anger, including (depending on the crowd) beer throwing or pouring.

My vision of the self absorbed erotist or libertine would include that he or she does NOT fly into an uncontrolled rage, but remains cool; retains aplomb, and makes a non-hurried exit. (Your 'dude', while seek seeking, seems not long on aplomb!)

I believe apet would concur about this, since the maxims are 'stay aware' 'retain the upper hand' 'take what you want and leave'.

Uncontrolled fits of temper, and taking offense at insults or angry gestures does not fit in the picture, though no one is perfect. OTOH *staged* fits of temper or outrage designed to discomfit and neutralize some affronted expartner might be chosen as the occasion seemed suitable.

Let's consider your escalating challenge:

What about coldly and calculatedly being in a relationship with someone for an extended period, knowing this is what you were doing, and Then smilingly springing it on them out of the blue one day? Still ok? Still feeling good about cruelly crushing their feelings? Perhaps even better? It's so much more effective once you've been together for a while. Then they Really know they've been played.

I suppose it's sarcastic, but it's essentially saying, Why not be as (surprisingly) mean and cruel as possible? Well, reputation, for one thing, even for a libertine. (See the thoughts of Madame libertine, Mme Meurteuil, in this respect. Let the wolf generally seem like a lamb.)

What you seem to be missing in this jocular crusade against evil, is that the objectives of the libertine are sexual, as well as the realization of power in the sex-political game. While a degree of cruelty is intrinsic to a 'conquer and leave' excercize, there's nothing to say it should, *for its own sake*, be maximized.

You seem to be unable to decide whether a libertine is the poonhound college boy next door or a poisoner Don Juan. And the answer, likely, is neither.

 

[Netzach]

I would expect a beer in the face to be the wages of sin, and take it with suave irony...again self-awareness. You know you are not being right and nice when you do something for self gratification like this, and you stand by your not-rightness with the wilingness to suffer the consequences. I support the shitty thing's I've done with enough pride to say I'm not proud, but I'm not ashamed or regretful, either.

...and I'd expect the kind of person/situation we are talking about to be the same. This actually parallels that other bogey-man of contemporary sexual ethics...the "extra marital affair" in many ways.

I tend to hit the door unapologetically when I feel the expectations beginning to wrap around me like a baby boa constrictor, that's more my style.

And I don't offer explanation or excuses, because I do tend to be talkative before you get me in the sack. You'll know a lot of what you need to, and whether you choose to believe what I say about myself and my intentions, is YOUR problem, not mine.

If someone didn't listen to the nuances, clearly broadcast over 4 or 5 days of hanging out before a fuck, as in one case, if one chose to ignore statements like "I'm not looking for a serious thing" "I have a partner I'm not willing to give up" ...all information volunteered openly in the spirit of NOT being an asshole!!...then I hit the door, I go quiet for 2 weeks and when you can't handle not seeing me every day I go gone.

The conversation was had, there's nothing to talk over and mend.

 

[sunfox]

I tend to hit the door unapologetically when I feel the expectations beginning to wrap around me like a baby boa constrictor, that's more my style.

And I don't offer explanation or excuses, because I do tend to be talkative before you get me in the sack. You'll know a lot of what you need to, and whether you choose to believe what I say about myself and my intentions, is YOUR problem, not mine.

If someone didn't listen to the nuances, clearly broadcast over 4 or 5 days of hanging out before a fuck, as in one case, if one chose to ignore statements like "I'm not looking for a serious thing" "I have a partner I'm not willing to give up" ...all information volunteered openly in the spirit of NOT being an asshole!!...then I hit the door, I go quiet for 2 weeks and when you can't handle not seeing me every day I go gone.

The conversation was had, there's nothing to talk over and mend.

This is it, exactly. Well said, Netzach.

People hear what they want to hear, and no matter what the warning signs I've given, they still go into my bed thinking they can 'change' me. Proving them wrong didn't make me evil.. it made me right.

If I don't say I'm in it for a deathless romance, and in fact, indicate that I just want to get laid... then it's hardly my fault when your heart is broken a few weeks later when I move on.

Heartless? Maybe. But I admit, I've felt a thrill from doing this to people in the past, and that desire still lingers inside me and rears its ugly head from time to time despite my current happy relationship.

 

[bridgeburner]

Jeez, not only am I a pervert, but I'm also perverse. I don't want to be lusted after, pined over and pursued by somebody unless either A) I want him too or B)he shined me on at some point.

I mean, it's flattering to be thought of later and to have somebody wanting another go-round, but I don't want to be on the receiving end of unrequited love. No way. No how. Unless, as I said it's somebody who spurned my affections in the past and then he can pine away the live long day as far as I'm concerned.

I don't seek out that sort of experience though. Just not how I'm wired. I can admire the skill of those who are wired such, but I can't really get my head around it in any kind of visceral understanding and a lot of times it just seems too mean. I think maybe I'm too empathetic about other people's emotions in such a case.


-B

 

[bridgeburner]

Phoenix,

Your mailbox is full.

;->


-B

 

[rosco rathbone]

nutsack has the best av


she is a star!!!

" * "

 

[Pure]

bb said,

I can't really get my head around it [self absorbed sex] in any kind of visceral understanding and a lot of times it just seems too mean. I think maybe I'm too empathetic about other people's emotions in such a case.

[material deleted]
Added: What I want to say is I don't doubt your good side, and that most people in the thread are decent and humane to others, as a rule. At the same time, without getting caught up in trying to recreate a fictional character ("the libertine") we can look at our occasional 'lapses' from sociality. When we did, sexually, look out for number one. And apart from that, everyone has read or had fantasies with 'unscrupulous' even dangerous characters, and it can be fun to discuss these, apart from questions of real life action.

J.

 

[s'lara]

i will side with bb here. i most likely wouldn't be able to pull off something so elaborate and without guilt. There is appeal in such a game from the prey end, but i am in the grouping of those who wouldn't be able to sustain it and find pleasure in it.

lara

 

[Phoenix Stone]

Hi Phoenix,

Did you ever see 'Dangerous Liaisons', the better one, with Malkevich?

That would make the answer to your beer pouring question, now repeated, pretty obvious. The libertine, when finally 'discovered' may well face anger, including (depending on the crowd) beer throwing or pouring.

Repeated, with elaboration, because I didn't feel I got an answer to it. I think I saw some of the movie, quite a few years ago but don't recall an answer in it. Thanks for giving one plainly below.

My vision of the self absorbed erotist or libertine would include that he or she does NOT fly into an uncontrolled rage, but remains cool; retains aplomb, and makes a non-hurried exit. (Your 'dude', while seek seeking, seems not long on aplomb!)

Yes, this seems more apropos. Had it been I, I would have raised an eyebrow and said, 'fair enough,' smiling as I went. Might have also first looked the prey in question up and down and added, 'tasty though,' before I left.

I suppose it's sarcastic, but it's essentially saying, Why not be as (surprisingly) mean and cruel as possible? Well, reputation, for one thing, even for a libertine. (See the thoughts of Madame libertine, Mme Meurteuil, in this respect. Let the wolf generally seem like a lamb.)

What you seem to be missing in this jocular crusade against evil, is that the objectives of the libertine are sexual, as well as the realization of power in the sex-political game. While a degree of cruelty is intrinsic to a 'conquer and leave' excercize, there's nothing to say it should, *for its own sake*, be maximized.

You seem to be unable to decide whether a libertine is the poonhound college boy next door or a poisoner Don Juan. And the answer, likely, is neither.

Yup, confused. Thus the questions.
What are libertinian limits? At it's mildest and most extreme?

Indeed, a jocular crusade -- glad you recognized the mixture in tone.

'Love 'em and leave 'em' is a well-worn expression, and I'm still not sure how this differs, except in that part of the game is extended into making sure that the mark knows they've been taken, as it were. Not sure the point of that, but from pet's previous post, it seems to be meant as putdown, a putdown involving somehow making the other person feel worthless, unworthy of a relationship with you, reduced to, in your eyes, and the intention apparently being in theirs, to reduce them to feeling like just a fuck. Is there such a purpose?

If, as Netzach says, the idea isn't to purposely mislead (and in fact, in her class she is quite clear as to her intentions) -- no declarations of undying love, offers of marriage, talk of soulmates, etc. -- then I don't see why anyone would Have any expectations of you. Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer chances. Where's the problem?

Jeez, there are always people around who can be quite seductive and get known for being good at it, as well as being the local Don Juan or Dona Juana. I recall trying to put innocents on their guard so they'd know what they were getting into, and rolling my eyes when they didn't listen and were sure it would be different with them. Is this what you mean?

If you are just talking about that sort of thing, then yes, a long time ago I once decided to purposely pick up a guy for a one night stand. Picked a guy out at a disco (gives you some idea of era), asked him to dance, and while we were dancing, told him I wanted to have sex with him. He took me home and asked for my number the next day and managed to tease it out of me, though I had no interest in him, and knew that going into it the night before. Seemed really surprised and irritated that I resisted giving it to him. I decided to extend things a little longer just to try something else. Went out with him, dancing, but this time, no sex. Told him beforehand. He was really surprised to find out I meant it. Seem to recall him calling me 'tiger' a lot and being both confused and intrigued. Told him we really were different types and it wouldn't work out, but thanks. He kept calling for a while. I don't think he'd ever had a girl do that to him before. (I was a girl then.) Is that a bit like what you mean?

 

[Phoenix Stone]

(Your 'dude', while seek seeking, seems not long on aplomb!)

My young fellow of ill-repute was both short of temper and long of rap sheet. Hence the improportionate mildness of my response to an insult of such magnitude.

Btw -- poonhound? -- where Are you from? Sounds vaguely Southern.

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

Taking the argument one step further, I was asking in my last post, about telling someone you are living with, that you only wanted them for your body -- would you then be outraged at their outrage? (Exemplified here by my dumping a beer on the guy's head?) Or would you have no reaction to my outraged reaction.
I think it was what you said earlier, something about letting them know that this is all they are 'worth,' that you meant it as a putdown, of someone who presumably has feelings for you, that I object to. Where do you draw the line? What about coldly and calculatedly being in a relationship with someone for an extended period, knowing this is what you were doing, and Then smilingly springing it on them out of the blue one day? Still ok? Still feeling good about cruelly crushing their feelings? Perhaps even better? It's so much more effective once you've been together for a while. Then they Really know they've been played.

Along those lines, your outrage at EM's disrespectful posting about your disrespectful (and proud of it) treatment of others, strikes me as amusing.

Not quite as much as her equating what I assume we've been talking about here with some killer, which seems like a pretty bizarre leap, but amusing nonetheless. (Btw, by your lights, I would expect amusement at my dumping the beer to be a more reasonable response than his outrage. Thought the dude was gonna kill me, right there in public. Talking about being able to dish it out but not take the least little bit of it....)

OK no where did I ever state that I started, stayed in and ended a relationship with the express purpose of hurting or mentally abusing a person. I was (am) simply talking about the chase (usually 3 to 4 days) capture (a day or so...with never a hint of a possible relationship needed from me) and release of my conquests.

Sometimes, harsh words were needed and I said them: coldly, calculatingly and with no remorse. Why should I feel badly if they chose to believe that after we fucked I would suddenly decide that i needed them in my life when i never said those words to them????

Don't put your words into my posts, please. If I had been talking about pursuing relationships for the purpose of misleading and hurting them later, then I would have said so.

So no I don't see how my outraged post was amusing in the least. Comparing me to a killer was beyond disrespectful and I have never lied and tried to make it sound any more or less then what it was for me: a game. Comparing what your S/O did to you and what I have done is apples and oranges as I don't have the energy nor the need to drag someone into a relationship just to hurt them later.

Relationships require work..getting my nut off doesn't.

pet

 

[Pure]

Jeez, 'Cruel Intentions' is on TV tonite, with Sarah Michele as the libertine (f) Ms Meurteuil, and (??) as her libertine stepdaddy Valmont. A younger-aged version of "Dangerous Liaisons" by the screenwriter's direct intent.

But my SO is tuned to 'Steel Magnolias.'!

 

[Netzach]

Pet, I like your style more and more.

 

[shelleb4]

im not sure i fully understand this? So im allowed to be aware of somebody elses needs, yet i ignore them, if their needs are met, it will be coincidental. That id ignore all esle except my own gratification, im in it for me and me alone?
cant you describe it a bit more for me? Oh go on, please, you know you want to. lol

 

[sunfox]

Jeez, 'Cruel Intentions' is on TV tonite, with Sarah Michele as the libertine (f) Ms Meurteuil, and (??) as her libertine stepdaddy Valmont. A younger-aged version of "Dangerous Liaisons" by the screenwriter's direct intent.

But my SO is tuned to 'Steel Magnolias.'!

The stepbrother is played by Ryan Phillipe. Mmm. Sebastian Valmont.

Anyways, I was trying to find the speech by Valmont to Tourvel when he breaks it off with her in order to win his bet... but so far, I've miserably failed.

So here's one or two other quotes that help to get the point across of why people do this to other people.

Valmont: I often wonder how you managed to invent yourself.

Merteuil: Well, I had no choice, did I? I'm a woman.
Women are obliged to be far more skillful than men. You can
ruin our reputation and our life with a few well-chosen words.
So of course I had to invent not only myself, but ways of escape
no one has ever thought of before. And I've succeeded because
I've always known I was born to dominate your sex and avenge my own."

*****************

Valmont: I always thought that betrayal was your favorite.

Merteuil: No, no. Cruelty. I always think that has a nobler ring to it.

*******************

"Win or Die." --Marquise de Merteuil (Glenn Close), Dangerous Liasions

*****************

Dump them before they dump me... Tell em it's two AM, and they don't have to go home, but they can't stay here... whatever the reasoning, whatever the fun of the chase, like it or don't, this occurs all the time. In all parts of the world, women do it to men, men do it to women, women do it to women, men do it to men.

Acting shocked, as if you've never known anyone to do something like that... allow someone to think something was more than it was, then leave, etc... is just silly. You've lived in a padded room if you've never seen this, or done it yourself.

 

[Phoenix Stone]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Imagine: Self-Absorbed Sex

OK no where did I ever state that I started, stayed in and ended a relationship with the express purpose of hurting or mentally abusing a person. I was (am) simply talking about the chase (usually 3 to 4 days) capture (a day or so...with never a hint of a possible relationship needed from me) and release of my conquests.

Sometimes, harsh words were needed and I said them: coldly, calculatingly and with no remorse. Why should I feel badly if they chose to believe that after we fucked I would suddenly decide that i needed them in my life when i never said those words to them????

Don't put your words into my posts, please. If I had been talking about pursuing relationships for the purpose of misleading and hurting them later, then I would have said so.

So no I don't see how my outraged post was amusing in the least. Comparing me to a killer was beyond disrespectful and I have never lied and tried to make it sound any more or less then what it was for me: a game. Comparing what your S/O did to you and what I have done is apples and oranges as I don't have the energy nor the need to drag someone into a relationship just to hurt them later.

Relationships require work..getting my nut off doesn't.

pet

All righty, then.

Btw, it's called paraphrasing. I have never put my words into anyone's posts. That would be called something else.

In this case I paraphrased because it is such a damn pain in the butt to cut and paste from several pages. However, let us look at what we find the hard way, shall we?

In your Last post you state:

OK no where did I ever state that I started, stayed in and ended a relationship with the express purpose of hurting or mentally abusing a person.

And this:

If I had been talking about pursuing relationships for the purpose of misleading and hurting them later, then I would have said so.

And so you did (in an earlier post):

Usually, it wasn't even about the sex... having the ability to disabuse them of the notion that they were worth anything besides a quick fuck. It was FUN!!
pet

And this:

The taboo involved is the deliberate misleading, the deliberate hurting of someone else.

Shall we compare and contrast word for word, perhaps in separate columns side-by-side, or is the clear enough?

Now the following portions of your latest missive leads me to wonder whether you have read any of my posts on this thread, barring those directed solely at you.

You say:

Why should I feel badly if they chose to believe that after we fucked I would suddenly decide that i needed them in my life when i never said those words to them????

Which suggests to me (not taking too big a leap here, I hope) that you think I've stated the following in some form, someplace: that you should feel badly if after you've fucked they chose to believe that you would suddenly decide that you needed them in your life when you never said those words to them. Is that close enough, or am I paraphrasing too loosely?

Perhaps it was the multiple question marks that lead me to believe that you believe this, but there it is. I am going to Jump to the conclusion that this is what you think I've said or believe.

Shall we examine one of my posts now, to see what I've Actually said on this matter? Try page 3. I'm just too damn lazy to go there now. But I will, if you bring it up again, as I'm not above repeating myself when I think i may have been misunderstood. Oh, what the hell, here it is:

I think some of us, most especially probably EM, are talking about different things here, or at least different levels of this game. You seem to be talking about a one time thing with someone who maybe would rather it be long term and was persuing a longtime relationship with you when you were just persuing sex. Ok, so going to bed with them without say, stopping and having them sign a waiver first, 'wait, wait, before you take off your pants, you are aware, are you not that my intentions toward you are strictly dishonorable? Sign here, if yes.'
Nothing unfair or evil or anything else about not doing that.

In this next case, you again appear to misunderstand -- or were you 'putting your words into my post?

Comparing what your S/O did to you and what I have done is apples and oranges as I don't have the energy nor the need to drag someone into a relationship just to hurt them later.
pet

Here is the rest of my actual post about my insignificant other:

Hmm, I would only be able or want to do that if I was angry, and Pure said anger was out. "no grudge or loss of temper."

How did you react to their reaction?

How about this -- does it qualify or no?....

So pet and pure, is (or was) dishing it out but not being able to take it part of the equation?

In other words, the point of the post was to ask whether the event qualified for the category, not to compare it to your experience or that of anyone else on this thread.
In a later post, where I bring this event up again, to make even more clear what I'm getting at, I say, "taking it one step further...." And then give the example. In other words, the intent of the post was exactly as I stated no more, no less. To ask whether that event 'qualified' for the category, to ask about response to the others reaction, while acknowledging that I was taking the case 'one step further.'
One step further you might well ask? One step further than the general case of doing the same thing in a shorter term 'relationship.'

So no I don't see how my outraged post was amusing in the least. Comparing me to a killer was beyond disrespectful....

The word 'so' doesn't really work here, as logically you haven't proved your case that your outraged post wasn't amusing. It doesn't naturally follow from what came before, and in fact, you did no work at all in even attempting to prove the lack of amusement value. Still, I'll let that one go....

And I'm also going to let go any conceivable implication you may or may not have made here that I didn't find EM's post over the top. My posting that it might be a spoof ought to make that evident.

Outrage toward and about outrage always amuses me -- except when it's my own, of course. And outrage about someone treating your disrespect disrespectfully, seems especially amusement worthy.

What Is Beyond disrespect, anyway? And where are you when you get there?

Let's see now, what else might be amusing about it? Writing about doing something outrageous, and perhaps meant to outrage, and then getting outraged when it has the expected affect? Taking it seriously?

Should the topic, especially that bit about 'the taboo involved is the deliberate misleading, the deliberate hurting of someone else' have been expected to elicit a little outrage?

Does it hurt a little having someone say mean things to you -- when you did nothing to hurt them personally, and in fact were only sharing something you thought would be appreciated? Ow. Rather a slap in the face, eh? And going out of their way to tell you in 'harsh words... coldly, calculatingly and with no remorse.'
What, Laughing at someone's pain isn't fun? Ohhh, laughing at YOUR pain isn't fun. NOW I get it.

Good thing I'm not here to pursue relationships.


oh what the hell, I'll add the frog, too. Seems frog-worthy.

(edited to add my original post, and pet's complete, original post to the top -- wouldn't want her to think, well, you know....)

 

[Netzach]

WTF guys, it's just a reponse to a query, namely Pure's for an ever expanding library of personal anecdotes.

I think being compared to a mass murderer for one's sexual exploits *is* kind of offensive, PS. A question was asked and the poor woman made the mistake of replying in candor that she's not perfect.

I've gotten taken to task for pages on pages about a relationship that I value because it's extramarital and told I have no ethics by people who didn't know me from adam, for PAGES. I think I have ethics. I think I just don't happen to SHARE their ethics and telling me that for pages isn't going to change that.

But when you post here you run the risk of drawing offensiveness, and being offensive I guess.

Chill.