It has occurred to me that I may not be a natural Dominant

[Marquis]

What if you thought his opinion was incorrect or unfair? Would you submit then?

Even within the D/s sphere of our relationship, my answer to this question is no.

I was waiting for someone to say this.

 

[Marquis]

Ahhhhh, finally Sir, we get to the core of this beautiful world..........

As far as the "Natural Dominant" question.... there are natural Dominants - sometimes they don't even know that this is what they are. Let me give an example:
i met a man a few years ago - not particularly good-looking nor arrogant (in fact, much to my dismay at first, He was very religious - Mormon in fact) but the moment i heard Him speak, at any time that i was in His presence, i could not control the "slave fires in my belly'. He knew nothing of BDSM, nor did He understand my interest in Him at first. After three months of much explaining and incredibly obvious and slutty seducing on my part, He did Dom me...... (insert evil grin here).
It was not His feeling of Himself...........it was the response He illicted in me......
This made Him a "Natural Dom" in my opinion........

i don't submit to just anyone - in fact, after 20 years of learning about myself and this world of kink, i have come to understand that each person's world is their own. i submit to those with whom i can not help but submit to - naturally. Sometimes at a play party i may beg to play with someone who either scares or pisses me off - safe to do at a public party - not because i like Them but because of the challenge of understanding my submission - it's not about Them - it's about the inner slave in me and understanding her.

i have been very lucky to spend time with Others who understand this world better than me and have learned so much for it. They have brought me to tears, sometimes from pain, sometimes from humiliation, sometimes from shame (of disappointing Them), but as it has always seemed to me - because They too want me to see me........ good, bad and ugly and the challenge of this is often the "hard work" that every great Dom would be happy to do............

As far as "how often do i step outside my submission" - every freaking day! i work in a male dominated industry. Not only am i the only woman......... i am the boss! The word "bitch" is sometimes used to describe me at work - but alas, i silently smile to myself, i do so like being called that

For me, submission is about much more than my sexuality, it's about the beautiful and complex inner spirit to which balance is a constant and fragile state of being..............

Thank you Sir for Your, once again, subtle and somewhat sneaky path to the truth.......

I know exactly what you mean.

 

[Kajira Callista]

Thank you my comrades, after much consideration I've decided I'm not only a natural Dominant, but perhaps the most natural Dominant that has ever been known to man.

 

[Quint]

I have a question for the submissives.

How submissive are you really?

See previous flippant answer. Not really but sort of. We've both stepped out of our spheres too often due to stress. I guess the fact that I've been out so long means that I'm not really submissive, but the fact that I regret it means that I might be. However that goes.

How often do you step outside the zone of submission that you both appreciate?

Far too often. I feel shiny when we're in our respective places; I feel productive, focused, positive, clean, and in love with life. I don't know if lack of submission is due to stress or stress is due to lack of submission. It probably feeds on itself.

What if you thought his opinion was incorrect or unfair? Would you submit then?

Depends on his reaction. If he is being unconsciously unfair, I will let him know what I think. If he knows he's being unfair, yes indeed I submit. The only thing I can't tolerate from him is ignorance.

How often do you think that?

Not very. He asks a lot of me (again, when we're firmly in our spheres) but it's rare that I feel he's unfair in his demands.

 

[Marquis]

If he knows he's being unfair, yes indeed I submit. The only thing I can't tolerate from him is ignorance.

I think you were a little confused with my questions (perhaps I worded them poorly), but this answer made up for everything.

 

[O'Mac]

I'm really glad I stumbled across this thread, Marquis, because very recently I've undergone a dramatic shift in my own personality that has similar connotations to what you are referring to.

In a nutshell, up until last Monday I considered myself a "nutured Dominant" (to paraphrase what you've already mentioned) and did not truly consider myself a "legitimate" Dom in some respects. I'm not sure why exactly, but I've always suspected I was holding myself back in some regards. In many ways, being the Dom I wanted to be seemed "unnatural" to me when I actually tried to do some of the things I wanted to do. I felt that I was still in the early stages of development with regards to the lifestyle. And I would readily agree that, to me Dominance WAS a lot of hard work as well. Basically I think that I didn't receive the gratification I felt I deserved.

However, all of that came to a head last week. It felt like a total mind-snap and I've yet to totally recover mentally and emotionally from the experience. To give you some background, I've recently ended a very serious relationship with my former partner and friend. and for a few weeks now I've been doing the regular online seaching and meet-and-greet that I'm most comfortable with. Well, I hit paydirt two weeks ago and met a girl from Collarme.com that I've had my eyes on for quite some time. We arranged to meet-up and she came over for the weekend. Needless to say, we hit things off well and ended up getting very intimate with each other. She left on the Sunday afternoon and immediately afterwards my former partner walked into my room, spilling her heart out in front of me. She talked about how she didn't want me to leave her, and how much of a mistake it was to call things off. She begged and pleaded for me to take her back.

And I was angry.

In fact, I was furious.

From start to finish with her crying I had only the utmost comtempt for her in the back of my mind. I don't think I showed it so much on the outside, but in my own thoughts I was absolutely enraged. Thoughts of: "How dare she in interfere with my life" or "Why would she choose now instead of earlier to tell me this". I was so mad I could hit her.

Then I snapped.

I remember the moment so well, now. One second I had my hands curled up into fists and keeping myself as controlled as I could hope for, and the next second I was literally tearing the clothes right off her body. I must honestly admit that I was just as shocked as she was. It felt like all the anger and resentment I had flowing through my brain was suddenly converted into a mix of equal parts lust and sadism. Before I could even think to stop myself, my hands were pulling at her hair and grabbing her arms hard as I moved myself into her. It was absolutely beastial and was unlike anything I ever experienced before. I knew right then and there that things had been taken to a completely new level for both of us. And the more I grabbed and pinned her down, and pushed myself into her, the less resistance she offered.

She was mine. Totally and without question. There was no longer any room for self-doubt.

I had the most intense session right then and there. Raking my nails across her back until she cried out, spanking her so hard she climaxed just from the touch of my hand on her bottom. It was unlike anything else. I was swearing and calling her slut and bitch, snarling at times if she deviated the slightest from what I wanted. These were all things that I have done in the past, but never in this manner with the sort of mental state I was in.

Like I said, before that day I had never considered myself a "natural" Dom. Now though, I've realised that I have surpassed just another mental barrier. In some ways the thought of that fills me with both excitment and concern in equal measure.

 

[stirbird]

Angry sex can be a good thing between dominant and submissive.

About that phrase natural dom, I too see it appearing everywhere and have kind of wondered about what it is juxtaposed against. (An unnatural dominant? I think Data from Star Trek would have made a great unnatural dominant, but I digress. ) My own meaning of the term is just someone who, for most of their lives, has wanted to be dominant with other people and in their lives. I don't think it has anything to do with whether you do the work of dominance or have the skills or anything like that. It just seems to refer to a person's attitude over most of their lives. For example, I wouldn't call a man or woman who was submissive for 20 years and then decided he was also a dominant or wanted to explore dominance or whatever a natural dominant, because he didn't want to be dominant during those twenty years previous.

 

[FurryFury]

I'm really glad I stumbled across this thread, Marquis, because very recently I've undergone a dramatic shift in my own personality that has similar connotations to what you are referring to.

In a nutshell, up until last Monday I considered myself a "nutured Dominant" (to paraphrase what you've already mentioned) and did not truly consider myself a "legitimate" Dom in some respects. I'm not sure why exactly, but I've always suspected I was holding myself back in some regards. In many ways, being the Dom I wanted to be seemed "unnatural" to me when I actually tried to do some of the things I wanted to do. I felt that I was still in the early stages of development with regards to the lifestyle. And I would readily agree that, to me Dominance WAS a lot of hard work as well. Basically I think that I didn't receive the gratification I felt I deserved.

However, all of that came to a head last week. It felt like a total mind-snap and I've yet to totally recover mentally and emotionally from the experience. To give you some background, I've recently ended a very serious relationship with my former partner and friend. and for a few weeks now I've been doing the regular online seaching and meet-and-greet that I'm most comfortable with. Well, I hit paydirt two weeks ago and met a girl from Collarme.com that I've had my eyes on for quite some time. We arranged to meet-up and she came over for the weekend. Needless to say, we hit things off well and ended up getting very intimate with each other. She left on the Sunday afternoon and immediately afterwards my former partner walked into my room, spilling her heart out in front of me. She talked about how she didn't want me to leave her, and how much of a mistake it was to call things off. She begged and pleaded for me to take her back.

And I was angry.

In fact, I was furious.

From start to finish with her crying I had only the utmost comtempt for her in the back of my mind. I don't think I showed it so much on the outside, but in my own thoughts I was absolutely enraged. Thoughts of: "How dare she in interfere with my life" or "Why would she choose now instead of earlier to tell me this". I was so mad I could hit her.

Then I snapped.

I remember the moment so well, now. One second I had my hands curled up into fists and keeping myself as controlled as I could hope for, and the next second I was literally tearing the clothes right off her body. I must honestly admit that I was just as shocked as she was. It felt like all the anger and resentment I had flowing through my brain was suddenly converted into a mix of equal parts lust and sadism. Before I could even think to stop myself, my hands were pulling at her hair and grabbing her arms hard as I moved myself into her. It was absolutely beastial and was unlike anything I ever experienced before. I knew right then and there that things had been taken to a completely new level for both of us. And the more I grabbed and pinned her down, and pushed myself into her, the less resistance she offered.

She was mine. Totally and without question. There was no longer any room for self-doubt.

I had the most intense session right then and there. Raking my nails across her back until she cried out, spanking her so hard she climaxed just from the touch of my hand on her bottom. It was unlike anything else. I was swearing and calling her slut and bitch, snarling at times if she deviated the slightest from what I wanted. These were all things that I have done in the past, but never in this manner with the sort of mental state I was in.

Like I said, before that day I had never considered myself a "natural" Dom. Now though, I've realised that I have surpassed just another mental barrier. In some ways the thought of that fills me with both excitment and concern in equal measure.

Interesting. So where does this leave the collar-me chickie?

Fury

 

[O'Mac]

Interesting. So where does this leave the collar-me chickie?

Well, I'm still very much interested in the girl I've met on Collarme.com. I'm actually really trying hard to NOT have sex with my former partner because I don't want to screw things up with this new girl. I'm just bad at keeping my cock in my pants, I guess.

 

[FurryFury]

Well, I'm still very much interested in the girl I've met on Collarme.com. I'm actually really trying hard to NOT have sex with my former partner because I don't want to screw things up with this new girl. I'm just bad at keeping my cock in my pants, I guess.

*chuckles*

Fury

 

[Ozfamilyman]

My 2c

. When getting all "Domly" seems like "It's just too much work.".... especially with a willful and resisting Sub... sometimes I feel a failure for just giving in and think that I might not be as driven to do this as I thought.

( and this is for Maquis as well) Is it then about finding your counterbalance? Some subs need a lot of ''work'' and by admitting your laziness then they are not for you. Yet if you find a sub or part-sub who enjoys being controlled by you but also has the self discipline within themselves to stay under control , even if you are not physically present, then that is your balance.

Someone mentioned above that we are each different. Some folks are more driven than others and have certain features as a requirement. For others, their needs are less pressing and frequent. For yet others, it is less a drive or need, and more of a desire.

And this is also relevant to the sub

 

[catalina_francisco]

And I was angry.

In fact, I was furious.

From start to finish with her crying I had only the utmost comtempt for her in the back of my mind. I don't think I showed it so much on the outside, but in my own thoughts I was absolutely enraged. Thoughts of: "How dare she in interfere with my life" or "Why would she choose now instead of earlier to tell me this". I was so mad I could hit her.

Then I snapped.

I remember the moment so well, now. One second I had my hands curled up into fists and keeping myself as controlled as I could hope for, and the next second I was literally tearing the clothes right off her body. I must honestly admit that I was just as shocked as she was. It felt like all the anger and resentment I had flowing through my brain was suddenly converted into a mix of equal parts lust and sadism. Before I could even think to stop myself, my hands were pulling at her hair and grabbing her arms hard as I moved myself into her. It was absolutely beastial and was unlike anything I ever experienced before. I knew right then and there that things had been taken to a completely new level for both of us. And the more I grabbed and pinned her down, and pushed myself into her, the less resistance she offered.

She was mine. Totally and without question. There was no longer any room for self-doubt.

I had the most intense session right then and there. Raking my nails across her back until she cried out, spanking her so hard she climaxed just from the touch of my hand on her bottom. It was unlike anything else. I was swearing and calling her slut and bitch, snarling at times if she deviated the slightest from what I wanted. These were all things that I have done in the past, but never in this manner with the sort of mental state I was in.

Like I said, before that day I had never considered myself a "natural" Dom. Now though, I've realised that I have surpassed just another mental barrier. In some ways the thought of that fills me with both excitment and concern in equal measure.

I could be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time, but this to me sounds more like a loss of control brought on by your anger, memories and hopes for the former relationship, and simple old lust overtaking your ability to rationally control and decide what would and would not happen, more so than dominance. After all, she walked into your space as you say, uninvited and too late, and said what SHE wanted, and basically she got it. Are you sure she enjoyed it as much as you thought, or was she more interested in using the situation to get what she wants, or keeping quiet about her real reactions to the scene until she feels she has you where she wants you again? You are now trying to sort yourself out while feeling you still do not have complete control of the situation because of you difficulty in resisting physical temptations as you say. For me that is not dominance, but is natural. Dominance is where you are the one in control, both of yourself and the submissive, and act in ways which are in your best interests...it is not always easy, you may not always succeed, and definately no-one is perfect, but losing control does not equal natural dominance otherwise every rapist, abuser and murderer could claim that title proudly. Hope you can sort it out soon and too the best outcome for you long term.

Catalina

 

[O'Mac]

I could be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time, but this to me sounds more like a loss of control brought on by your anger, memories and hopes for the former relationship, and simple old lust overtaking your ability to rationally control and decide what would and would not happen, more so than dominance. After all, she walked into your space as you say, uninvited and too late, and said what SHE wanted, and basically she got it. Are you sure she enjoyed it as much as you thought, or was she more interested in using the situation to get what she wants, or keeping quiet about her real reactions to the scene until she feels she has you where she wants you again? You are now trying to sort yourself out while feeling you still do not have complete control of the situation because of you difficulty in resisting physical temptations as you say. For me that is not dominance, but is natural. Dominance is where you are the one in control, both of yourself and the submissive, and act in ways which are in your best interests...it is not always easy, you may not always succeed, and definately no-one is perfect, but losing control does not equal natural dominance otherwise every rapist, abuser and murderer could claim that title proudly. Hope you can sort it out soon and too the best outcome for you long term.

Hmmmm, I had actually considered what you had pointed out as well. Was it just one big ploy to have another fling before I commit myself fully to a new relationship? Perhaps. That's an entirely reasonable assumption, now that you've mentioned it. I am of the belief that it has become a lot more than that simply because this overall feeling I've had since then is very "Domineering" in nature. And it hasn't applied to just my former partner. My new partner has noticed a distinct change in attitude. Whereas before we had agreed to take things slowly with regards to intimacy, I have demanded (and have received) what I want from both of them, although my initial issue was only with one.

I would totally agree that during the first experience it definitely was an instance of losing control. But what I am wondering is whether this new attitude is new, or (as Marquis had mentioned) a natural tendency that had just been held in check by personal social conventions. I don't believe losing control makes anyone Dominant, but in this case, I think it was an essential occurence to sort of "jump-start" natural Dominant tendencies.

 

[MechaBlade]

I'm really glad I stumbled across this thread, Marquis, because very recently I've undergone a dramatic shift in my own personality that has similar connotations to what you are referring to.

In a nutshell, up until last Monday I considered myself a "nutured Dominant" (to paraphrase what you've already mentioned) and did not truly consider myself a "legitimate" Dom in some respects. I'm not sure why exactly, but I've always suspected I was holding myself back in some regards. In many ways, being the Dom I wanted to be seemed "unnatural" to me when I actually tried to do some of the things I wanted to do. I felt that I was still in the early stages of development with regards to the lifestyle. And I would readily agree that, to me Dominance WAS a lot of hard work as well. Basically I think that I didn't receive the gratification I felt I deserved.

However, all of that came to a head last week. It felt like a total mind-snap and I've yet to totally recover mentally and emotionally from the experience. To give you some background, I've recently ended a very serious relationship with my former partner and friend. and for a few weeks now I've been doing the regular online seaching and meet-and-greet that I'm most comfortable with. Well, I hit paydirt two weeks ago and met a girl from Collarme.com that I've had my eyes on for quite some time. We arranged to meet-up and she came over for the weekend. Needless to say, we hit things off well and ended up getting very intimate with each other. She left on the Sunday afternoon and immediately afterwards my former partner walked into my room, spilling her heart out in front of me. She talked about how she didn't want me to leave her, and how much of a mistake it was to call things off. She begged and pleaded for me to take her back.

And I was angry.

In fact, I was furious.

From start to finish with her crying I had only the utmost comtempt for her in the back of my mind. I don't think I showed it so much on the outside, but in my own thoughts I was absolutely enraged. Thoughts of: "How dare she in interfere with my life" or "Why would she choose now instead of earlier to tell me this". I was so mad I could hit her.

Then I snapped.

I remember the moment so well, now. One second I had my hands curled up into fists and keeping myself as controlled as I could hope for, and the next second I was literally tearing the clothes right off her body. I must honestly admit that I was just as shocked as she was. It felt like all the anger and resentment I had flowing through my brain was suddenly converted into a mix of equal parts lust and sadism. Before I could even think to stop myself, my hands were pulling at her hair and grabbing her arms hard as I moved myself into her. It was absolutely beastial and was unlike anything I ever experienced before. I knew right then and there that things had been taken to a completely new level for both of us. And the more I grabbed and pinned her down, and pushed myself into her, the less resistance she offered.

She was mine. Totally and without question. There was no longer any room for self-doubt.

I had the most intense session right then and there. Raking my nails across her back until she cried out, spanking her so hard she climaxed just from the touch of my hand on her bottom. It was unlike anything else. I was swearing and calling her slut and bitch, snarling at times if she deviated the slightest from what I wanted. These were all things that I have done in the past, but never in this manner with the sort of mental state I was in.

Like I said, before that day I had never considered myself a "natural" Dom. Now though, I've realised that I have surpassed just another mental barrier. In some ways the thought of that fills me with both excitment and concern in equal measure.

um... pics plz.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Hmmmm, I had actually considered what you had pointed out as well. Was it just one big ploy to have another fling before I commit myself fully to a new relationship? Perhaps. That's an entirely reasonable assumption, now that you've mentioned it. I am of the belief that it has become a lot more than that simply because this overall feeling I've had since then is very "Domineering" in nature. And it hasn't applied to just my former partner. My new partner has noticed a distinct change in attitude. Whereas before we had agreed to take things slowly with regards to intimacy, I have demanded (and have received) what I want from both of them, although my initial issue was only with one.

I would totally agree that during the first experience it definitely was an instance of losing control. But what I am wondering is whether this new attitude is new, or (as Marquis had mentioned) a natural tendency that had just been held in check by personal social conventions. I don't believe losing control makes anyone Dominant, but in this case, I think it was an essential occurence to sort of "jump-start" natural Dominant tendencies.

Be careful with confusing domineering with dominating...they are not the same animal, nor on the same playing field...there are many domineering people in this world.

Catalina

 

[Marquis]

Be careful with confusing domineering with dominating...they are not the same animal, nor on the same playing field...

I disagree, they are at least on the same playing field.

there are many domineering people in this world.

I forget that domination is such an exclusive club.

 

[Recidiva]

Marquis, I just think you have PMS. It'll pass.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I disagree, they are at least on the same playing field.

Guess it depends on the mindset of the one dominating but I have always seen dominating as positive and in control, while the other (domineering) as negative and in a way determined by a loss of self control to often become abusive. Guess it is a matter of interpretation of the recognised meanings, but is usually the more common one IME.

Dominate:
1 : RULE, CONTROL
2 : to exert the supreme determining or guiding influence on
3 : to overlook from a superior elevation or command because of superior height or position
4 : to have a commanding or preeminent place or position in <name brands dominate the market>
intransitive senses
1 : to have or exert mastery, control, or preeminence
2 : to occupy a more elevated or superior position

Domineer:
Function: verb
Etymology: Dutch domineren, from French dominer, from Latin dominari
intransitive senses : to exercise arbitrary or overbearing control
transitive senses : to tyrannize over

I forget that domination is such an exclusive club.

Is it? Guess perhaps you are right as it requires responsibility, and that is something which is lacking more and more in the western and capitalist world as each year passes.

Catalina

 

[Recidiva]

Guess it depends on the mindset of the one dominating but I have always seen dominating as positive and in control, while the other (domineering) as negative and in a way determined by a loss of self control to often become abusive. Guess it is a matter of interpretation of the recognised meanings, but is usually the more common one IME.

Dominate:
1 : RULE, CONTROL
2 : to exert the supreme determining or guiding influence on
3 : to overlook from a superior elevation or command because of superior height or position
4 : to have a commanding or preeminent place or position in <name brands dominate the market>
intransitive senses
1 : to have or exert mastery, control, or preeminence
2 : to occupy a more elevated or superior position

Domineer:
Function: verb
Etymology: Dutch domineren, from French dominer, from Latin dominari
intransitive senses : to exercise arbitrary or overbearing control
transitive senses : to tyrannize over





Is it? Guess perhaps you are right as it requires responsibility, and that is something which is lacking more and more in the western and capitalist world as each year passes.

Catalina

Crap. Definitions. Gloves are off.

I agree, though, except for the cheap shot at blaming someone's moods and attitude on global politics. What's with that?

 

[catalina_francisco]

Crap. Definitions. Gloves are off.

I agree, though, except for the cheap shot at blaming someone's moods and attitude on global politics. What's with that?

LOL, you haven't noticed the decline in responsibility if it means losing money in some way? Sheesh, was just watching a show yesterday which was interviewing survivors of the hurricane and were still homeless and who Bush and state politicians were not doing anything for because they could not agree who shouls pay the bills....notice Bush has no problem spending on his war machine though when he can smell all that oil...and that is the tip of the iceberg. It goes through most of our western societies at the moment...responsibility is tied to capital gain constantly.

Catalina

 

[Recidiva]

LOL, you haven't noticed the decline in responsibility if it means losing money in some way? Sheesh, was just watching a show yesterday which was interviewing survivors of the hurricane and were still homeless and who Bush and state politicians were not doing anything for because they could not agree who shouls pay the bills....notice Bush has no problem spending on his war machine though when he can smell all that oil...and that is the tip of the iceberg. It goes through most of our western societies at the moment...responsibility is tied to capital gain constantly.

Catalina

Well, those are politicians. I consider them to be a separate, parasitic species.

 

[bridgeburner]

politics --- from the greek "poly" meaning many and "tics" meaning bloodsuckers

 

[WriterDom]

The government teat is a hard thing to pull off of when you've been relying on it for generations. But even Jesus said we'd always have the poor among us.

Without capitalism there is no motivation to do anything. Instead of the Internet you'd be posting notes on the bulletin board at the laundry, and we'd all be driving Yugos.

Oil is a reason not to go to war. Which is way we aren't in Iran right now sending the faithful to heaven for their 62 virgin reward. Though I'm afraid it might come to that one day.

Why don't you bad mouth America when there are 25 million trying to get out instead of in? You miss Europe? Delta is ready when you are.

 

[catalina_francisco]

The government teat is a hard thing to pull off of when you've been relying on it for generations. But even Jesus said we'd always have the poor among us.

Without capitalism there is no motivation to do anything. Instead of the Internet you'd be posting notes on the bulletin board at the laundry, and we'd all be driving Yugos.

Oil is a reason not to go to war. Which is way we aren't in Iran right now sending the faithful to heaven for their 62 virgin reward. Though I'm afraid it might come to that one day.

Why don't you bad mouth America when there are 25 million trying to get out instead of in? You miss Europe? Delta is ready when you are.

LOL, well I think a lot of people are missing what is happening in America in 2006. First the borders are closed tight against anyone entering without good reason and lots of checks, and then we hear on TV last week about a part of Florida banning people from going to London because they believed they might be endangered on the trains there...this is democracy when your own governments can tell you where and if you can go to another country? I think most of the western world has lost the plot long ago.

As to capitalism being the only productive method of government and society, I think history has shown there have been many cultures who thrived and were productive (even enough for modern western society to now be borrowing ideas and concepts from) and were not based on capitalism.

Not into ridiculing another culture based on my own experience, but last I heard, America was hell bent on attacking Iran again and gearing up.

Catalina

 

[WriterDom]

It's not just America that is concerned about the current Iranian government. If push comes to shove I imagine the US and Brits will have to carry the load. It's a shame because there are a lot of pro Western people in Iran.