Menaissance

[rosco rathbone]

i was reading the sunday paper's book review section the other day and there was an article about this "menaissance" thing.

in skimming it, i gathered that the author of whatever book they were talking about decided that it's time for men to be men again... that men have become too feminized, touchy-feely, compassionate, what have you... and that this is all contradictory to what women are biologically programed to seek out. women want men who can hunt and change a tire rather than men who empathize and comfort.

what did it mean to be a man? what does it mean now? what do women want? what do women need? discuss.

A passel of nonsense. Anyone who has spent any time with modern men in groups knows that they are the same barbaric animals they always were.

 

[amutantman]

i think that the trouble with todays society is that too many people are too "p.c" fuck that. a spade is a spade not a club with straight edges.

as far as im concerned a manly man is someone who stands up for what he believes in and for those he loves. someone who provides for his family, and thats his number one priority. whether he is an emotional being is up to him.im not here to judge others.

im not a very feely, emotional person but i do stand up and disagree.(quite a lot! ask kiwichyck!)

at least everyone knows where they stand with me. there is no "beating around the bush" or "sugar coating"

too many people give a toss about what others think of them and hurting someones feelings by telling them the truth.

political correctness will be the death of us all!

 

[Mr. Mann]

At one time, feminism was about a woman' legal right to own property, to vote, to education, etc.

Now... I'm not sure what it is really about. From my perspective, it seems a bunch of misandrists have hijacked the feminism ship and hoisted the Jolly Roger setting sail to attack the entire male gender. In doing this, it seems that the majority of women, not labored with such bile, have found themselves shanghaied.

I think much of any current "menaissance" would be largely in response to those women running about with their man-killing knife clenched between their teeth.

Maybe we need to stand a little taller so that those women who still desire such men can find us easier in the crowd. - We'll just have to guard our throats against the man haters while we do so.

 

[A Desert Rose]

A passel of nonsense. Anyone who has spent any time with modern men in groups knows that they are the same barbaric animals they always were.

this is great!!! I love it.

... Maybe we need to stand a little taller so that those women who still desire such men can find us easier in the crowd. - We'll just have to guard our throats against the man haters while we do so.

And this it too!!!

You guys are so smart.

 

[Guest]

 

[M's girl]

wow, imagine if it was that easy. This house would be spotless.

I knew I was doing something wrong..... ..... keeping the house spotless (myself) and giving BJ's anyway, haha, silly me!

 

[TBKahuna123]

God I hope this doesn't come off as chauvanistic. I've been avoiding this thread like the plague, but I have a thought.

I was watching Carlos Mencia last weekend and he had a very interesting line. He talked about women saying they wanted to be treated as equals, yet you can't tell a woman at work about he BJ you got last weekend without getting sent to sensitivity training. He said something that I found very true: Women say they want to be treated as equals. No you don't. You want to be PAID as equals and treated like a lady."

That struck me not only true, but not too much too ask. Why shouldn't it be that way? And if it should be that way, then why shouldn't men be allowed to be men? Why can't we be equals and still be who we are? Even more to the point, why should we be constrained to one set of behaviors in the first place? Who can say what traits are unique to a man or woman, to black or white, to rich or to poor? Why should our personalities be dictated by artificial social constraints which have nothing to do with who we really are? Why do we let society shape us instead of shaping our society?

 

[EJFan]

God I hope this doesn't come off as chauvanistic. I've been avoiding this thread like the plague, but I have a thought.

I was watching Carlos Mencia last weekend and he had a very interesting line. He talked about women saying they wanted to be treated as equals, yet you can't tell a woman at work about he BJ you got last weekend without getting sent to sensitivity training. He said something that I found very true: Women say they want to be treated as equals. No you don't. You want to be PAID as equals and treated like a lady."

That struck me not only true, but not too much too ask. Why shouldn't it be that way? And if it should be that way, then why shouldn't men be allowed to be men? Why can't we be equals and still be who we are? Even more to the point, why should we be constrained to one set of behaviors in the first place? Who can say what traits are unique to a man or woman, to black or white, to rich or to poor? Why should our personalities be dictated by artificial social constraints which have nothing to do with who we really are? Why do we let society shape us instead of shaping our society?

my inference to the original article i mentioned was pretty much this same point... that women have moved the male society into a place where it isn't meant to be and where men tend to become something that they shouldn't (and is potentially undesirable in the long run).

in the realm of societal norms, women have the upper hand in many ways. maybe this is a construct of the media and not entirely accurate. accurate or not, however, it's having/had an impact on men.

i don't think your point is chauvanistic at all... i think it's an objective observation. and, yes, i realize i've merely restated the original point here with offering any additional fodder to the conversation. carry on then.

 

[Eilan]

I was watching Carlos Mencia last weekend and he had a very interesting line. He talked about women saying they wanted to be treated as equals, yet you can't tell a woman at work about he BJ you got last weekend without getting sent to sensitivity training. He said something that I found very true: Women say they want to be treated as equals. No you don't. You want to be PAID as equals and treated like a lady."

Call me a prude, but I fail to see how telling ANY coworker that I got fucked in the ass last night is ever appropriate workplace banter. A man (or woman) who has any class wouldn't be kissing and telling, anyway. Banter, innuendo, and double entendres are one thing, but I find overly explicit sexual talk in the workplace to be as inappropriate and offensive as religious folk prostelyzing to their coworkers.

When I was working, I didn't talk about my sex life at work, nor did I want to hear about anyone else's sex life, regardless of whether they were male or female. There are certain things that I don't want to share with (or know about) my coworkers.

That's why I'm at Lit--it's my outlet for those things that I can't share with my RL friends.

And, of course, we all know that things were so much better when women were merely property to be passed from father to husband in an economic transaction.

I really hate men sometimes. It's too bad my husband has to be one.

 

[TBKahuna123]

While I agree, keep in mind that he's a comedian exaggerating a story to prove a point. I just thought is was a good point.

 

[kiwichyck]

That is why I prefer the company of men

I find that a lot of women wear a pretty thick social mask. I prefer the directness of men. I agree that it is never appropriate to talk about your sex life in detail publicly, whatever your sex.

I find it difficult to make women friends mainly because it irritates me having to dig so deep to find the real person. Men are generally more reliable and honest as friends.

I say this because generally I find that sex isn't a topic for acquaintances. You usually sound people out a bit before the rauchy humour or sexually referenced comments come out.

IME Men put their 'real' selves out there sooner, that includes all 'men in herds' behaviour. Maybe my experience is like this because I've been in a relationship for so long that I don't see the 'dating behaviour' of men!

I think that we have all become so guarded of our speech and behaviour because of social expectation that nobody feels free to really be themselves. But now we've become accepting about expressing emotion, compassion and consideration, that it is unacceptable to express more 'manly' emotions and traits like agression, hostility, and direct blunt honest truthfulness.

It's like everybody knows that men do certain things. Women relate stories in hushed embarrassed voices, or jokingly, or with rolling eyes and shrugging shoulders about how their 'typical' man fooling around like a ten year old boy and hurt himself or broke something. Or he had a few beers one day and took the family stationwagon out in the paddock to do wheelies.

Men by and large have complied with the social 'rules'. I guess maybe this explains the 'bad boy' thing too. How women are attracted to bad boys. They're the ones that display the most male pattern behaviour arent' they?

Ok now I've lost my train of thought and I don't want to ramble. Anyway just my opinion

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Call me a prude, but I fail to see how telling ANY coworker that I got fucked in the ass last night is ever appropriate workplace banter. A man (or woman) who has any class wouldn't be kissing and telling, anyway. Banter, innuendo, and double entendres are one thing, but I find overly explicit sexual talk in the workplace to be as inappropriate and offensive as religious folk prostelyzing to their coworkers.

When I was working, I didn't talk about my sex life at work, nor did I want to hear about anyone else's sex life, regardless of whether they were male or female. There are certain things that I don't want to share with (or know about) my coworkers.

That's why I'm at Lit--it's my outlet for those things that I can't share with my RL friends.

And, of course, we all know that things were so much better when women were merely property to be passed from father to husband in an economic transaction.

I really hate men sometimes. It's too bad my husband has to be one.

Maybe I'm different. A lot of people I don't mind hearing about their sex lives. Just not my parents. Or my siblings.

 

[Eilan]

While I agree, keep in mind that he's a comedian exaggerating a story to prove a point. I just thought is was a good point.

I know who he is. My husband watches him.

Where I live, though, his line of thought is the norm.