Oral Sex & Submissiveness

[intothewoods]

When I was in my teens/early 20's I dated primarily black men. None of them ever went down on me. Then again, a lot of the white men I dated (back then) weren't too "into it" either, but they would at least try.

I have often said that you can tell alot about how good a man or woman is at eating pussy by how they kiss/make out. Anyone else agree? Disagree?

Disagree! No, I don't care to elaborate...

 

[midwestyankee]

Disagree! No, I don't care to elaborate...

Apparently someone else didn't care to, either.

 

[Homburg]

So doms are eating pussy nowsadays?

Like, for real?

Sure. I do whatever the hell I want with her. Sometimes that includes oral.

It goes into how I look at various activities. Is it something I like? I'm going to do it whether she likes it or not. If I like it and she hates it, I will probably limit it to when I'm feeling particularly selfish.

If it is something she loves, but I'm ambivalent about, I'm not likely to do it all that often, but it does become an excellent activity of choice when I want to reward, or just make her feel particularly good.


-----

Additionally, I've never confused myself as being the Dominant or Top whenever I've been given oral. Hard to think of yourself as in control when your tied up and can't do anything to stop the oral. Or you're told to hold a position while you're shaved and then given oral. I can think of dozens of scenarios where, believe me, I knew I was on the bottom and had no control while oral was done upon my body. It's not the act per se, it's the way it's done or set up.

Very much so. There are all sorts of ways to put the submissive in the proper headspace prior, and that is literally the only thing the differentiates submissive from dominant in an activity that does not have an explicit power dynamic to it.

And truth be told, I feel more powerful when I'm the one giving the oral that more submissive. [but that can be a short lived notion as well] When I'm giving a man oral I'm in more control over his pleasure and orgasm. Or so the theory goes in my head when I think about it. LOL

Again, total agreement. I feel the same when when I receive to the point of orgasm. I dislike it. Worship the cock, sure, but don't expect an orgasm from it. I won't give up that control usually.

[I wonder sometimes if some of this doesn't go back to the original gay leather designations for top/bottom activities. Where whoever is giving oral is the bottom and whoever receives it is on Top.

Strong theory.

 

[ownedsubgal]

on the oral sex/race thing, i've been with many african-american and african men throughout my life, and have never come across any who had any hang-up about performing oral sex on a woman. there were some who just weren't into it, but it wasn't by any means a taboo or icky subject. but i do know that quite a few years back, maybe 15 or 20 or so, there was quite a stigma in the AA community about publicly admitting that you would have oral sex, especially if you were a man and giving oral sex to women. but people still did it and did it plenty (according to my Master), it just wasn't openly talked about.

anywho i feel extremely fortunate to have found one of the seemingly rare men who have little interest in pussy licking, as i can't think of a more uncomfortable/awkward/pointless/unpleasant sexual activity.

 

[RawHumor]

anywho i feel extremely fortunate to have found one of the seemingly rare men who have little interest in pussy licking, as i can't think of a more uncomfortable/awkward/pointless/unpleasant sexual activity.

There are a few women I know from Lit who share your attitude - that a man going down on a woman is just, ummmm... girly, or something.

 

[ownedsubgal]

There are a few women I know from Lit who share your attitude - that a man going down on a woman is just, ummmm... girly, or something.

hehe...i wouldn't go so far as to call it girly, but yeah i certainly wouldn't describe it as the ultimate act of dominance and masculinity.

 

[TeachMeSir]

......

 

[HottieMama]

Apparently someone else didn't care to, either.

Were you referring to me? LOL.

I admit it. I instantly judge if I want to be "sexual" with someone by how they kiss. I LOVE LOVE LOVE kissing...seriously can do it for hours and be PERFECTLY happy. I have found that the men and women I consider the best kissers have also been the ones that were best "down South." It's in the pressure they apply with their lips, the way they move their tongue, the amount of tongue they use, the build-up...the amount of wetness...the nibbles...etc..etc... The more passionate they are while "making out," the better... If you are reserved, timid, or a generally shitty kisser it just doesn't work for oral which is all about how you use your lips, tongue, and sometimes teeth..

Just my observation.

 

[ownedsubgal]

But oh, I can be so controlled with just a tongue! Very easily dominated that way! (read the first post)

Now on the other hand, a guy "down there" who keeps stopping to ask me if he's doing it right (and hence messing with my rhythm!) will find that I have no patience for his lack of ability to read clues and occassional "yes there, like that" moan. He is the man I thik is insecure in himself, and therefore I wold not feel submisisve & he may get "the tap".

oh i hear you TeachMe. done the right way, it's obviously something you enjoy very much and therefore can be used by a Dominant as a tool of control. however soooo many women enjoy receiving oral sex that many men falsely assume that ALL women must love it, and then perform it with the intention or hope of arousing their partner. it's very uncomfortable and unnatural-feeling for me when a man does ANY thing sexually with that intent in his mind (trying to please me), and although intellectually i understand this is not necessarily true, i also tend to associate the strong desire or intent to please a partner with submission.

now of course you have those men who are exceptions to the rule (usually Dominant) who do not particularly care about arousing a woman sexually and perform oral sex solely for their own pleasure. this makes the act more tolerable for me mentally (though still icky and unpleasant).

 

[TeachMeSir]

......

 

[Caitlynne]

I wonder if this is the same for guys in genaeral as far as receiving a BJ? I thought every guy loved it!?

No, not every guy does. Especially if power and control are his primary fetishes. It's been my experience that if power and control is sough above even physical pleasure, then no this isn't the favorite activity.

As Homburg said above:

Again, total agreement. I feel the same when when I receive to the point of orgasm. I dislike it. Worship the cock, sure, but don't expect an orgasm from it. I won't give up that control usually.

When a man is controlling his orgasm, the pleasure of the act seemed irrelevant to the men I've known.

There was a movie a long time ago called "White Castle". Susan Sarandon played an older woman having an affair with a younger man. At some party his young ex-lover was confronting the Sarandon character asking "What does he see in you?" She replied [and I have never forgotten it] "Never underestimate the value of a good Blow-job."

Believe me women, submissive or not, know the power of a blow job. Men have made it very clear how valued it is. Knowing this is power. Sorry guys, but it is. Except for the Dominant male who knows this is power and refuses to cede it to a sub. No orgasm from oral. Just like Homburg just stated.

It is a power and control issue. There is nothing quite like thinking "oh I can get back into good graces, or whatever races through a poor subs mind, if I just give him a mind blowing blow job," and have that activity mean nothing to a Dom. Nothing. You see the last vestige of sexual power go down the drain. After that, even if you are allowed to suck it, it's never an act of power. It's a treat.

And with men who value control and power, they never really enjoy it the way you wish they would. It was my experience that I would try and try and try to bring pleasure, but instead it became a battle of wills, mine to get him off and his to deny me that power--and I always lost. In the end, I just gave up and did things they way he wanted and not the way I thought he should want it.

*sigh* a blow job used to be such an equalizer of sorts. Damn the man who can resist a BJ. LOL [OK not really.]

 

[Dreamliner]

I enjoy oral, both giving and receiving.

When I provide oral to a partner I love seeing her loose all control, to be totally captive to my tongue, my fingers, my words......to see her hips jerk up as I languidly play with, her labia distending, thickening with her desires...........listening to her maons, listeing to her beg for more...



....when I receive a bj, if I want to cum, a partner will need to ask for me to cum. Sometimes I will pleasure her, at others I will not. I enjoy watching and feeling, esepcially a new partner who tinks all guys cum from bj's and has not realised yet the power I hold over her.

I mentioned in another thread the many woman have submissive and BDSM tendencies, it is with use of words and language that I realise this side of them...many are surpirsed...none have regreted the experience.

 

[YourCaptor]

Nice little story... what was your question again?

 

[ownedsubgal]

No, not every guy does. Especially if power and control are his primary fetishes. It's been my experience that if power and control is sough above even physical pleasure, then no this isn't the favorite activity.

As Homburg said above:

When a man is controlling his orgasm, the pleasure of the act seemed irrelevant to the men I've known.

There was a movie a long time ago called "White Castle". Susan Sarandon played an older woman having an affair with a younger man. At some party his young ex-lover was confronting the Sarandon character asking "What does he see in you?" She replied [and I have never forgotten it] "Never underestimate the value of a good Blow-job."

Believe me women, submissive or not, know the power of a blow job. Men have made it very clear how valued it is. Knowing this is power. Sorry guys, but it is. Except for the Dominant male who knows this is power and refuses to cede it to a sub. No orgasm from oral. Just like Homburg just stated.

It is a power and control issue. There is nothing quite like thinking "oh I can get back into good graces, or whatever races through a poor subs mind, if I just give him a mind blowing blow job," and have that activity mean nothing to a Dom. Nothing. You see the last vestige of sexual power go down the drain. After that, even if you are allowed to suck it, it's never an act of power. It's a treat.

And with men who value control and power, they never really enjoy it the way you wish they would. It was my experience that I would try and try and try to bring pleasure, but instead it became a battle of wills, mine to get him off and his to deny me that power--and I always lost. In the end, I just gave up and did things they way he wanted and not the way I thought he should want it.

*sigh* a blow job used to be such an equalizer of sorts. Damn the man who can resist a BJ. LOL [OK not really.]

wow, i have to say that in my experiences in and outside of the lifestyle over the years, i just haven't found the above to be true. i haven't seen any connection between a man's need for power and control and his like or dislike for receiving oral sex. true, in the case of some women, perhaps even many, giving oral to a man can be a heady power rush because it is they who are in control of the action and reaction, and they may also use the pleasure they a bring a man during this act to manipulate him in other areas of the relationship (as you mentioned in your example of a sub doing this to get back in a Dom's good graces).

however this will not be the case with a truly controlling and dominant man, because he will only allow fellatio on his terms...only when he wants it, and always precisely how he wants it. a woman giving oral to such a man has no more power and control over him than humankind has over the rising and setting of the sun.

now my Master has told me many times that i am the best cocksucker he has ever encountered, however there is never so much as a single fleeting moment when i am serving him this way that i feel any sense of power or ego. and that is all because of him...he is controlling my mouth, tongue, throat, as much as he is controlling his own physical arousal. i may do only what he demands and must do it exactly as he demands it, or there are consequences to pay. kiss the head. suck the pre-cum. swallow the full length in one smooth motion, without any licking. suck on the head while it's deep in my throat. pull back, flicking out my tongue along the way. wrap my lips. don't dare place a finger on the cock. rub my face in the balls, kiss them. swallow the length again. slower. faster. harder. gentler. deeper...the instructions are endless and obeying them requires constant focus and adjustment. and then when he is ready to cum....and ONLY when he is ready, he will empty himself in my throat. fellatio is by far his most beloved erotic activity, and he demands it frequently. never have i sensed any lack of control on his part.

for those Dominants who view a full enjoyment and release during oral sex as giving up power or control, perhaps it's an issue of confidence or just plain over-analyzing. if you are in control while stringing her up from the rafters and whipping her bloody, you can be in control while getting head.

 

[Netzach]

Was there any other data along with those numbers? I ask, because I'm curious as to what kinds of cultural influences exist between the white community and the black community in this regard. Those are some big discrepancies even if the raw data is old.

Edited to add: My own opinion on this is that people confuse Top/bottom activities with D/s activities. I've known tops who would never give oral sex, but I know dozens of Dominants who if they are into it, don't give a rats ass if it's viewed by tops as a bottom only activity. They like it and they do it. In fact, I can do without it, and it's a bit of an edge scene if I have to do it [receive it]. That's not being on Top by any stretch of the imagination.

Additionally, I've never confused myself as being the Dominant or Top whenever I've been given oral. Hard to think of yourself as in control when your tied up and can't do anything to stop the oral. Or you're told to hold a position while you're shaved and then given oral. I can think of dozens of scenarios where, believe me, I knew I was on the bottom and had no control while oral was done upon my body. It's not the act per se, it's the way it's done or set up.

And truth be told, I feel more powerful when I'm the one giving the oral that more submissive. [but that can be a short lived notion as well] When I'm giving a man oral I'm in more control over his pleasure and orgasm. Or so the theory goes in my head when I think about it. LOL

I wonder sometimes if some of this doesn't go back to the original gay leather designations for top/bottom activities. Where whoever is giving oral is the bottom and whoever receives it is on Top.

Dunno if that even works because there's a powerful "stud person who licks, butch TOP" assumption in the lesbian world that a lot of Femme tops like me find amusing.

I don't feel like getting off is THAT much of a weakness either, frankly. I don't have a complex power relationship with my vibrator, which is reliable as M's tongue, and I don't find the moment of dithering weak knees to mean jack other than a job well done. When someone (my stud) gets too smirky about his ability I have him re-do the oral with a plug up his ass and it does help.

 

[intothewoods]

Dunno if that even works because there's a powerful "stud person who licks, butch TOP" assumption in the lesbian world that a lot of Femme tops like me find amusing.

I don't feel like getting off is THAT much of a weakness either, frankly. I don't have a complex power relationship with my vibrator, which is reliable as M's tongue, and I don't find the moment of dithering weak knees to mean jack other than a job well done. When someone (my stud) gets too smirky about his ability I have him re-do the oral with a plug up his ass and it does help.

Oh, that is just priceless. Thank you!

Does anyone here really believe that someone is more or less dominant because they cum from oral?

 

[BiBunny]

Oh, that is just priceless. Thank you!

Does anyone here really believe that someone is more or less dominant because they cum from oral?

I reckon they do. *Shrug* But not me.

 

[intothewoods]

I reckon they do. *Shrug* But not me.

You know what Freud said: sometimes a blow job is just a blow job.

 

[Caitlynne]

Dunno if that even works because there's a powerful "stud person who licks, butch TOP" assumption in the lesbian world that a lot of Femme tops like me find amusing.

See I wonder if this is a woman thing [both straight and lesbian]. Here it is viewed as a 'the one who gives the pleasure has the real power'. Which is true btw, it's just that women learn it much sooner in life [like as soon a puberty hits]. I doubt it is a lesson that is only learned by straight women.

I don't feel like getting off is THAT much of a weakness either, frankly. I don't have a complex power relationship with my vibrator, which is reliable as M's tongue, and I don't find the moment of dithering weak knees to mean jack other than a job well done. When someone (my stud) gets too smirky about his ability I have him re-do the oral with a plug up his ass and it does help.

LOL, exactly. Like I said it was a notion that I was taught to give up--both giving and receiving. But, regarding this, I was mainly referring to Doms who really value power and control above everything. I mean it is their kink. Which is why I stipulated that it is a power and control thing--not a Top/Dom thing.

I know plenty of non-power fetish people who have your POV. I've just known my fair share of Doms who did value the power of their control in this area and spent the time to arrange this activity on their terms because it was so highly valued.

 

[midwestyankee]

You know what Freud said: sometimes a blow job is just a blow job.

And sometimes a blow job just sucks.

 

[intothewoods]

And sometimes a blow job just sucks.

Nyah nyah nyah. Bad, yanks. Baaaad.

 

[midwestyankee]

Nyah nyah nyah. Bad, yanks. Baaaad.

I feel so appreciated now.

 

[Caitlynne]

Oh, that is just priceless. Thank you!

Does anyone here really believe that someone is more or less dominant because they cum from oral?

No. Of course not. I think you're missing the point I was making about Control and power being the main fetish. The Doms I have known like this did not think they were less Dominant at all. They just valued their own self-control. There's a difference there.

Maybe it is too fine a nuanced point to even be making. *shrugs*

 

[intothewoods]

No. Of course not. I think you're missing the point I was making about Control and power being the main fetish. The Doms I have known like this did not think they were less Dominant at all. They just valued their own self-control. There's a difference there.

Maybe it is too fine a nuanced point to even be making. *shrugs*

I wasn't just referring to you, fwiw, but I don't think Doms who get off with a blow job are believe control comes in second for themselves. I think they just see oral and their orgasms differently. But on the flip side, I don't think osg's comment that those who don't want to get off by oral are just over-analyzing the whole thing. I really think it's just a blow job/oral.

 

[ownedsubgal]

a blow job is NEVER just a blow job.


dang...maybe now i'm over-analyzing.