Punishment as issue closure

[Ginlover]

Out of interest, what if it's the PYL who screws up? How would the pyl prefer the issue be resolved?

Praise be to BDSM someone asked the most important question.

Every dynamic is different, it also usually changes and develops over time over. Punishment dynamics are not as common in rl as they are in fiction. An agreed consensual brat type dynamic can include agreed punishment or funishment as one part of the dynamic actively wants punishment and the other side wants to give it.

To the OP consensual punishment should never IMHO be delivered in anger. A boring but important point is communication communication communication.

In a straw pole I took of pyl the punishment all said was the worst was to be ignored. And PYL who use that without prior communication or consent — again just my opinion — is an abuser.

Cathartic release in a pyl who wants and needs it shouldn’t be delivered by a PYL in anger. It’s an exceptionally caring and giving interaction.

Sadly that’s not the popular consensus in fiction, I’ll emphasis that FICTION not real life in on going dynamics.

If the PYL has done wrong (ignoring a safe word, not following through on an agreed action, cheating, lying; and guess what? Tops fuck up too) can any pyl imagine needing to hit their PYL? Or make them complete a task like lines or walking around naked? If it’s part of their agreed dynamic then yes they should. For us lesser mortals who fuck up on either side of the slash communication makes a lot more sense.

 

[Master_Doctor]

Praise be to BDSM someone asked the most important question.

Every dynamic is different, it also usually changes and develops over time over. Punishment dynamics are not as common in rl as they are in fiction. An agreed consensual brat type dynamic can include agreed punishment or funishment as one part of the dynamic actively wants punishment and the other side wants to give it.

To the OP consensual punishment should never IMHO be delivered in anger. A boring but important point is communication communication communication.

In a straw pole I took of pyl the punishment all said was the worst was to be ignored. And PYL who use that without prior communication or consent — again just my opinion — is an abuser.

Cathartic release in a pyl who wants and needs it shouldn’t be delivered by a PYL in anger. It’s an exceptionally caring and giving interaction.

Sadly that’s not the popular consensus in fiction, I’ll emphasis that FICTION not real life in on going dynamics.

If the PYL has done wrong (ignoring a safe word, not following through on an agreed action, cheating, lying; and guess what? Tops fuck up too) can any pyl imagine needing to hit their PYL? Or make them complete a task like lines or walking around naked? If it’s part of their agreed dynamic then yes they should. For us lesser mortals who fuck up on either side of the slash communication makes a lot more sense.

I couldnt agree more with you on this. Well said.

 

[Apple_of_Eden]

Nuanced Situation and Resolution

Everyone makes some good arguments to support their point of view, but in reality, it comes down to what the two (or more) people in this situation find important to resolve the situation. Regardless if you're on the "D" or the "s" side of the slash, you both carry the responsibility for the way things go down in your relationship.

As it most always does, it comes down to communication. It doesn't matter if you're the dominant or the submissive, if you're responsible for the screw up, the error, the mistake, the misunderstanding, or any other issue that has a negative effect within the relationship dynamic, it is your responsibility to take ownership of it. It is both of your responsibilities to discuss it and agree on a resolution that works for both of you to resolve the error and move forward in a more united, healthy, happy, and positive manner.

I'm not saying the dominant has to give up any control or power in the situation. She/He is always the leader, but a good leader knows when to be open to feedback. In this type of case, if you want to resolve the situation and to move on in a positive manner, the resolution has to ensure a few things:

1. Someone has to take responsibility and ownership of the wrong doing. The other has to take the same in regard to forgiving.

2. The action (or inaction, if communication is an acceptable resolution on its own) has to relieve any guilt or ill feeling for the person responsible for the error. It also has to give a sense of assurance to the other partner that the PYL is truly remorseful, and that they will do their best to not repeat the error.

3. Again, as always, if punishment is the option of choice, it has to fit the crime. It also has to serve its purpose and remind/ensure that the same error isn't repeated. Also, if punishment is to be used as a reinforcement agent, choose wisely.

Suggestion: think of using positive reinforcement in place of punishment if you can. Communicate and dissect the error that took place. Be open about how it made you feel...disrespected, unhappy, disappointed, etc. Find out the reason behind why it happened. Was it purposeful, was it done with mal intent? Or was it simply a mistake? Then, acknowledge the issue, identify the preferred behavior, accept the apology etc, and give positive reinforcement so that good behavior (or lack of bad behavior) is the path chosen in future situations.

It was very interesting to hear everyone's input to the dilemma at hand. My thank you to Meek and cookie for their very personal insight and shares. I will definitely remember your feedback and utilize it in the future. Thank you both

Good luck. If your issue is resolved, it would be interesting to hear how you went about it.

Wishing everyone a safe, healthy, and happy holiday.

 

[zali]

If I've fucked up, I know He knows I've fucked up too.

If I weren't punished I'd be seriously worried that something far worse than my transgression was in the air.

 

[Primalex]

Her Majesty painfully caned my scrotal sacs/ballz4Flirtin' wid' our attractive housekeeper. Ow, Mistress, Mercee....sob.....sigh......

Thank you for contributing nothing to the discussion.

 

[cookiecat]

Thank you for contributing nothing to the discussion.

Did you find anything useful from this thread?

 

[LustyScribe]

This very much captures my train of thought.

Same here, although it is a moot point as my S.O. isn't even slightly inclined in this way.

 

[LittleSwitchy]

Praise be to BDSM someone asked the most important question.

Every dynamic is different, it also usually changes and develops over time over. Punishment dynamics are not as common in rl as they are in fiction. An agreed consensual brat type dynamic can include agreed punishment or funishment as one part of the dynamic actively wants punishment and the other side wants to give it.

To the OP consensual punishment should never IMHO be delivered in anger. A boring but important point is communication communication communication.

In a straw pole I took of pyl the punishment all said was the worst was to be ignored. And PYL who use that without prior communication or consent — again just my opinion — is an abuser.

Cathartic release in a pyl who wants and needs it shouldn’t be delivered by a PYL in anger. It’s an exceptionally caring and giving interaction.

Sadly that’s not the popular consensus in fiction, I’ll emphasis that FICTION not real life in on going dynamics.

If the PYL has done wrong (ignoring a safe word, not following through on an agreed action, cheating, lying; and guess what? Tops fuck up too) can any pyl imagine needing to hit their PYL? Or make them complete a task like lines or walking around naked? If it’s part of their agreed dynamic then yes they should. For us lesser mortals who fuck up on either side of the slash communication makes a lot more sense.

If I may chime in.
You mentioned giving a punishment while upset. TBH. Let’s call that what it is…. Abuse. If someone is upset. Give a time out/ corner time. That lets both people calm down. Letting them figure out what to do next.
Omg. A top dominant makes mistakes? No way. How’s that possible? Did the earth orbit change? Hell freeze over? Lol
We all make mistakes. If a mistake is made. Let’s own up to it. Sit down with them and talk it over.
For the record. I’m not pointing fingers at anyone. I saw the comments and thought I might add to it.

 

[LustyScribe]

Let's say you screwed up somehow and your PYL is justifiable not in the best mood about it and you feel bad about it.

How would you prefer to have this currently lingering problem be resolved, so everyone can move on?

Would you rather
- hide and wait for it to become a non-issue over time?
- try to make up for this somehow on your own?
- prefer to be sentenced to a punishment with the mutual understanding that this resolves the issue?
- ...?

Hands down, # 3 for me, but it has to be thoroughly discussed and understood that #1. This HAS to be the "end" of it, and #2. There can be no later shaming of either party for choosing the option. Wanting to punish someone who wronged you IS a natural and tension-releasing response, just as enduring the punishment can be cathartic for the offender. Of course, establish limits for both, and separate it from any BDSM "play" you might normally enjoy.

Just a free opinion from someone wanting to incorporate it into his own life.

 

[Master_Doctor]

It never fails to amaze me how people jeep coming back to these old conversations.

As a Dom/Master with substantial experience with many different dynamics let me make some core facts know for anyone that is not aware.

Punishment is to only be used to correct bad behavior. Additionally, the rules that were broken and the levels of punishment should have been negotiated BEFORE hand. Do not confuse punishment with funishment.

Someone above suggested that punishing someone while the Dom/ Authority figure is angry is abuse. Just so, absolutely. In an example above it was suggested that the offending sub be placed in the corner while the Dom cools off so they can make level headed decisions to determine if and what punishments might be levied. I would suggest that since being put into a corner for many IS in of itself punishment (one of the most emotionally harsh for my personal slave of 16 years), I would reconsider that option. I think both parties need to take a time out and seperated to think. In addition to this helping to avoid abuse and mistakes, In my expereince often times the sub comes back

 

[cascadiabound]

It never fails to amaze me how people jeep coming back to these old conversations.

There is a lot of wisdom and experience in some of these old conversations. And while I vaguely recall reading these posts in real time, they hit me differently now because I have evolved and changed.

Thanks for added your thoughts about corner time - I agree completely. Separation is very potent and can be a very damaging way to punish.

 

[Dearelliot]

My Mistress uses abuse and punishment to remind me who is in charge. Especially cock abuse! a good hard cock spanking to keep me on my toes and show total respect and worship to her body.

A woman with a riding crop in hand is a person a man must respect.

 

[Master_Doctor]

There is a lot of wisdom and experience in some of these old conversations. And while I vaguely recall reading these posts in real time, they hit me differently now because I have evolved and changed.

Thanks for added your thoughts about corner time - I agree completely. Separation is very potent and can be a very damaging way to''" punish.

Separation is very potent and can be a very damaging way to punish'. It is as you say. Sadly, thats why it is used by many... because of its effectiveness. Many subs need someone to look after them, support them in a variaty of ways (im not even talking financially). Once they think they have finally found someone that can meet their needs.. the pospect of loosing them is earth shattering for them. Often times an inexpereinced or irresponsible Dom/Domme will threaten them with abandonment to ensure obedience. I can tell you, this is hard core abuse. Its bad enough w/ the internet and Social media how often people are ghosted, but to be treatoned to be ghosted by someone you need to be funfilled. Once that connection or bond is established its very damaging to be even threatoned with dismissal or just left alone on the curb.

 

[Master_Doctor]

My Mistress uses abuse and punishment to remind me who is in charge. Especially cock abuse! a good hard cock spanking to keep me on my toes and show total respect and worship to her body.

A woman with a riding crop in hand is a person a man must respect.

Well, Im glad you seem to be enjoying it. But I have to say for eveyone elses' benfit that abuse is never needed or should it ever be employed. Its not even necessary. Ive owned my wife/slave for over 16 years... and never needed to abuse her and rarely needed to punish her. Punishments are very uniquely suited for individual sub/slaves. What works on one may not be effective at all for another. You have to spend time to get to know them to know what will work. Abuse is a tool used by the lazy and power hungry. Normally I will not even associate such persons with the Title of Dom/Domme/Master/Mistress.

"A woman with a riding crop in hand is a person a man must respect." I respectfully disagree. Just as a Dom carring a scale mail flogger is neither worthy of instant respect. Respect is earned by a persons character. Let me give you an example. This has nothing to do with YOUR Mistress and is not ment as a slight against her at all.

I went to a party a couple of decades ago (yeah been doing this a long time). A woman and her sub boy came in. She openly acted like she was better than anyone else. She even spoke down to male Doms as though we were unworthy of her mere presence. To their credit the room full of experienced Doms merely ignored her. I was fairly new (few years under my belt) and so I watched her. Listened to her ever rant with the ears of a Doctor w/ Psych background.

Later that night she got tired of not getting the attention she clearly came there for and openly challenged the room full of male Doms. Challenging us all as a group of being unfit to even be called men and openly mocked us to man up and prove she was wrong. So, as she stood their with a beautiful crop, custom made. I casually walked up to her, looked her in the eye and took it from her and then asked her," So what now?" she looked at me dumfounded and trembled. I had some bindings I had taken to the event to show a friend and Put them pining her arms around her back. Took by the hair and put her into a closet. With the rest of the room watching. Once sealed in the closest it only took about 30 minutes for her to start crying and begging to be allowed to come out. With promises of doing anything I wanted.

She was no Domme. I have some good friends that are Domme's who HAVE earned my respect because of their character. They actually thanked me for what I did because this FAKE made them all look bad. So you see, its the crop you respect and the damage it can inflict. It anyone inflicts pain just to be cruel... they are unworthy of respect. They are breaking the law and are abusing other people. So yes.. I respectfully diagree that just because a woman is carrying a crop that she should be respected by all men. Just like if im holding my all metal flogger women are not going to respect me. Only the ones that know my character.

 

[Dearelliot]

Sure, for you maybe, and maybe not for everyone. I'm not sure what you say is written in stone somewhere for all. I'm 90 and have played in the scene since I was 21...and disagree. I suppose in the end it's what the person wants. Maybe no one size fits all in D/s

 

[ToPleaseHim]

There’s a very long and diverse continuum of all things BDSM. The beauty of finding someone whose kinks match your own is incredible.

And outside of play that is not SSC or RACK, let’s not shame dynamics that work for others.

 

[lisaharlot]

I don’t personally like the idea of punishment in BDSM. I want my Top/Partner to like whipping me and that’s why they do it. If it’s punishment can I avoid it by being a “good girl”? I don’t want that. I hope all subs enjoy BDSM affection, if it’s used as punishment do they have an incentive to do things that may upset their Top or Partner in order get the treatment they’re craving? I’m sure there are ways to make this work but that’s my take on it.

Funishment on the other hand…

 

[seela]

I don’t personally like the idea of punishment in BDSM. I want my Top/Partner to like whipping me and that’s why they do it. If it’s punishment can I avoid it by being a “good girl”? I don’t want that. I hope all subs enjoy BDSM affection, if it’s used as punishment do they have an incentive to do things that may upset their Top or Partner in order get the treatment they’re craving? I’m sure there are ways to make this work but that’s my take on it.

Funishment on the other hand…

Punishment doesn’t have to be whipping or anything painful, though. In the case of someone who enjoys pain, the punishment could be for example having to research and write an essay on a topic perhaps relevant to the reason why they’re being punished. Or doing laps. Or detailing the car. Or cleaning. Or even just sitting quietly.

The point of a punishment is to find one that fits the people, and for a lot of people pain isn’t the way to go because they enjoy pain as is.

That said, punishment is not a necessary component of a BDSM relationship.

I don’t like punishment dynamics for myself, because I don’t find it helpful. It doesn’t allow me to move on any quicker, quite the opposite. I suppose I could try that kind of a dynamic if my partner insisted on it and said that it’s necessary for them to be able to move on, but I’m not sure.

The way I prefer to handle situations where I or my partner have screwed up is to talk about what happened and why, and what can be done to avoid it from happening in the future. Maybe the essay type of punishment I mentioned above could be useful for me, but I wouldn’t really see it as punishment.

 

[Master_Doctor]

I don’t personally like the idea of punishment in BDSM. I want my Top/Partner to like whipping me and that’s why they do it. If it’s punishment can I avoid it by being a “good girl”? I don’t want that. I hope all subs enjoy BDSM affection, if it’s used as punishment do they have an incentive to do things that may upset their Top or Partner in order get the treatment they’re craving? I’m sure there are ways to make this work but that’s my take on it.

Funishment on the other hand…

As Ive stated before, Punishment is only to be used to correct bad behavior. Let me add: in a consensual ongoing relationship dynamic. Not every dynamic needs it. Punishment has nothing to do with play or a scene.

@seela Agreed. Additionaqlly to properly and effectively punish a sub their Dom/ Master must take the time to get to know them, Find out what is effective and what isnt. For isntance. If you try to punish a painslut with pain (spanking etc) all you do is create a brat. Because you teach them that when they act out inappropriately, that gets them what they want. Learned behavior 101. A good punishment is an activity that the sub really dislikes A LOT but at the same time isnt mentally/emotionally damaging. For instance. One of the things my wife/slave HATES is when she as a mature woman has to stand in the corner. For her, that will correct any bad behavior so fast that your head will spin.

Again punishment is next to usless outside of a relationship mechanic. If you punish someone during a scene, its part of play and becomes funishment instead. Because doing so is brings arousal to one or both parties.

 

[Dearelliot]

I don’t personally like the idea of punishment in BDSM. I want my Top/Partner to like whipping me and that’s why they do it. If it’s punishment can I avoid it by being a “good girl”? I don’t want that. I hope all subs enjoy BDSM affection, if it’s used as punishment do they have an incentive to do things that may upset their Top or Partner in order get the treatment they’re craving? I’m sure there are ways to make this work but that’s my take on it.

Funishment on the other hand…

I like to have my Mistress receive pleasure from abusing me and making me beg...When I cry out in pain I want to see her smile

 

[SPARTAN047]

Unless the punishment is very harsh and cruel, disproportionate to my actions, I actually love being punished. Like taking a huge strapon, a naked bare ass spanking, licking and sucking their pussy, asshole, feet (even dirty and sweaty), belly, tits, back, etc. , perhaps covered in cum to put me in my place ... if it's a flogging for no reason I'd probably be out.