Smarts is what its all about

[NickisSora]

The whole point about this was that i didn't like people just bashing me for my writing. If you didn't like it don't tell me how much you hate it. No point to it. I know it sucked i was tired of people telling me so. I have gotten better and i continue to write because i enjoy it. Simple as that.

 

[Firmhanded_Daddy]

Look...I don't know what the point of this post really was or is, but I will say this:
Grammar and punctuation and spelling are important.
A comma? A comma changes the entire meaning of a sentence.
A misplaced or misused preposition? The same thing.
An article? The same.
Spelling problems are usually just ugly and annoying, but grammar and punctuation? You NEED to get those right.
This is language, this is the medium.
If you try and can't master them, that's fine.
If you choose not to master them, and choose not to get the tools to help, that's fine too.
But don't get pissy when people look at your work and find it incomprehensible.

I suck at Photoshop. I use it in the worst ways possible, and I find myself without time or sufficient inclination to learn how to use it well. So, when I put my stuff out in public, and people say so, well, I don't get all self-righteous and "HOW DARE YOU CRITICIZE ME FOR BEING SHITTY AT SOMETHING". Why? Because I'm shitty at it.

Writing is about communicating. If you can't communicate, you aren't writing.

Maybe it's just me. What do I know.

-Tips his hat-

One of the few times I am going to side with Vail, someone should be marking this down on a calendar.

Nick here is the deal as I see it.

If English is not your first language you have a valid argument for not forming sentence structure properly, for not using punctuation. The English language is one of the harder languages to learn from what I have heard. However if this is not the case you are simply not putting in the appropriate effort.

My spelling is absolutely atrocious. Anyone who has talked to me in IM (where spell check doesn't exist) knows this well enough. I am not an English major, and I'm not very good with punctuation myself.

When I read even what you are saying in this thread it takes a great deal of effort on my part just to comprehend what you are saying. Spelling errors aside the complete lack of punctuation is a major problem. Punctuation is admittedly difficult to grasp; however it can make the difference between a post being a single run on sentence or it being a coherent and readable post.

I'm sure there are punctuation issues in this very post as I do not use MS Word for normal posts like this but the difference between throwing in a comma and a period versus letting the sentence go with no breaks is staggering.

I think the overwhelming point people are trying to make is if you take an extra few moments to edit something before you post it, things might be easier on your readers.

From a first glance at your writing it seems like you type very quickly and I can say I do that too. I see a like of juxtaposed letters. Even lit has a spell checker in it, most forums do nowdays. So take an extra moment or two to right click the words and correct them.

If you write the RP posts in word not only will it show your spelling errors (Red squigglies) it will also attempt to show you grammatical errors (Green squigglies). It takes a little more time and effort but it is well worth it. A few small moments with attention to detail can take your writing to a whole new level.

I've been writing a long time and my writing used to be similar to what you write so I can say from personal experience it is possible to get better, you just have to work at it.

Good luck.

 

[NickisSora]

I actually been using it recently. Before though they didn't have it. I been on the site for some time now. and i seen it pop up recently. But i have been editing. Thanks Firm

 

[Firmhanded_Daddy]

I actually been using it recently. Before though they didn't have it. I been on the site for some time now. and i seen it pop up recently. But i have been editing. Thanks Firm

No problem man.

I also forgot to add I saw you asking about which versions of word spell check and what not. I have seen 2007 and 2010 both have the grammar checker.

 

[NickisSora]

Ok i will check it out. I guess my head and characters just act different when i see it.

 

[Scuttle Buttin']

I actually been using it recently. Before though they didn't have it. I been on the site for some time now. and i seen it pop up recently. But i have been editing. Thanks Firm

So.. can I ask a question? I don't even know if you're still checking this thread or.. whatever.. but, is this how you normally talk? Do you say "I actually been using it recently" instead of "I have been using it recently?"

Because that might be part of the problem right there. You can try as hard as you want with the grammar, but if you don't have a good grip on the language, you're still just sticking flowers in a turd.

 

[Annisthyrienne]

I'm not sure why I'm posting my opinion here. I don't really care if anyone agrees with it, or even reads it. But here it is anyway.

You write the way you do and people complain about it. Okay, it has already been pointed out that it is silly for them to waste their time reading your posts if they don't like them. But have you considered that you should write better for yourself? Not for your co-writer, not for your readers, not for anyone else but you.

You see, I believe that what we say and do, and how we say and do it makes a statement about who and what we are. So with each thing you do, you are making a statement that defines you. To make this an example that relates to this discussion: if you write poorly, you are saying something about yourself. Maybe you are saying that you just don't care how you are perceived and whether or not you communicate clearly. Maybe you are saying that you're the kind of person who is in too much of a hurry to do something the right way. Maybe you are saying something else. I don't know what you intend to say about yourself with your writing, but I know what I as a reader interpret it as. And it's not a very good statement about you.

But, having said that, honestly, I just don't read your posts. That's my choice. It's the statement I make about myself in response to your statement. To me, your writing makes the statement that you don't have enough pride in yourself to want to do a decent job of communicating. Maybe that's not the statement you intended to make, but that's how I see it. And so I make the statement about myself that if you can't be bothered to take the time to write decently, then I can't be bothered to waste my time trying to decipher your secret code. Once again, just my choice in the matter. I don't get all bent out of shape about it. I don't PM you about it, nor post in your story thread or anything like that. The only reason I posted here is because I saw the discussion and thought I'd offer a slightly different way of looking at it.

So having said all that, which was probably way more than anyone wanted to read anyhow, I'll now offer this. You role play here for the enjoyment of the experience, right? The only people who matter in that endeavor are you and your co-writer. You should try to do a good job for yourself and for your co-writer, but not for anyone else. If neither you or your co-writer care about your writing, then don't let it bother you. I'm only suggesting that you try to do better as a matter of pride in yourself, but it's your own call.

When I write anything, I want it to be the best I can make it, both in quality (creativity, nuanced expression of my thoughts and ideas, etc.) and in execution (proper spelling, grammar, punctuation, etc.). I feel that how well I do this reflects directly on me; on what kind of statement I am making about myself. I want to make the statement that I care enough about the impression I make on others to do my best every time. As a result, I'd rather wait for weeks to respond to a story post if it takes that long before inspiration and motivation strikes me enough to do a proper job of it, than to post any old piece of crap writing I can bang out on my keyboard. I want it to be good for my co-writer, but mostly I want to be able to be proud of it myself. If I can't do that, I'd rather not write at all.

Again, that's just my opinion.

 

[Bevatoria]

I actually agree with everything in the above post, but the most important part is below:

You role play here for the enjoyment of the experience, right? The only people who matter in that endeavor are you and your co-writer. You should try to do a good job for yourself and for your co-writer, but not for anyone else. If neither you or your co-writer care about your writing, then don't let it bother you. I'm only suggesting that you try to do better as a matter of pride in yourself, but it's your own call.

If you enjoy what you do that's all that matters. This thread has proven that if you want to do better there are kind folk here who are willing to help. Smarts isn't what it's all about; the question is what do you value?

Cheers, bro.

-B

 

[NickisSora]

Scuttle butt: YEah sometimes i do miss speak and use word in a sentence i probbably shouldn't.

Ann: I have been doing that since i joined. I unfortunately i am just dreadfully slow at progression. I have gotten better.

Beva:I say this is true. I just Value a story and a honest co - writer.

 

[Scuttle Buttin']

Scuttle butt: YEah sometimes i do miss speak and use word in a sentence i probbably shouldn't.

Well yeah, everyone misspeaks sometimes.

But there's a difference between knowing it's "I have actually been using it recently" and not knowing it.

If you know, then it's simply a matter of taking a little more time on your posts. If you don't, then it's simply a matter of learning. Both are fixable with some effort. It just takes effort in different areas, is all.

 

[NickisSora]

When i miss speak i end up putting a chain of words together that sound fine and i do not think on it any further normally. It is not the fact that i have to learn. Yes i was a horrible English student. It is just the way i talk. 98 Percent of the time i speak just fine. but there is the 2 percent I put together a sentence as such and most people know what I mean.

 

[Scuttle Buttin']

When i miss speak i end up putting a chain of words together that sound fine and i do not think on it any further normally. It is not the fact that i have to learn. Yes i was a horrible English student. It is just the way i talk. 98 Percent of the time i speak just fine. but there is the 2 percent I put together a sentence as such and most people know what I mean.

Then it sounds like it's simply a matter of taking more care, or of just not caring.

At the end of the day, as far as Lit goes, you're in a text-based world. Right or wrong, people are going to judge you based on how you appear in that text-based world, just as people would judge you if you went to the mall wearing a t-shirt two sizes too small and pants with holes that showed your ass.

If you don't give a fuck, then don't give a fuck, but it makes this thread and your continued posting in it basically pointless. If you do care, then think of it as you would showering and dressing in properly fitting clothes before you go somewhere.

For better or worse, the way you type is 90% of how you present yourself here. What you type, of course, is the other 10%, but it's going to be hard to even get to that 10% if they have to wade through a river of crazy grammar and typos to get there.



At the end of the day, writing is both a science and an art. Putting together words into sentences into paragraphs into compelling and interesting stories is an art, but the mechanics behind doing that is a science that virtually anyone can learn, if they want to.

 

[Nina327]

Ya know what...

There are several kinds of writers around here...

I see it as a scale.

Those that don't give a flying shit because its a fucking porn site and they are only typing with one damned hand anyway.

And

Those that enjoy the process of writing quality erotica; shorter posts to longer novellas.


Not everyone will like your chosen preference or range on that scale.

If you choose to seem like you wish to do no more than wank one out in type or even literally... go for it.

Do not get butthurt when most others seem as though they don't care. I know its a porn site. Most here spend some time typing one handed. I personally choose not to decipher a run-on sentence while trying to get my literary rocks off.

It's that damned simple.

 

[NickisSora]

OK I can agree to all of these posts. I care to a extent because frankley it up sets me to be told certain things and they are not true. I do care for what i do and sometimes i do not catch what i type out. Even reading over it. I can admit theoriginal reason was that my typing was ilegable that is the reason for the first post. That was my original stand point. Now i could try and delete this thread as it was just a sign of expression to show how i was feeling. Now a days i could really care less. I progress and I am trying to make my self better. I can write some pretty awesome storylines and build it up. I can also go straight smut. I do enjoy this though. Writing I mean and because of all the help i have gotten i have evolved. I can not comprehend the reasoning for extending posting a bit to a few paragraphs. I am just character concious and try not to inolved the story to far where some people may not want ot be or end up. This i went over with La_ Riena and she helped me pull my posting together. That was another example of comunication that i have with writers. I guess i also never bothered to ask how far could i control yoru character or what can i do to expand my posting in this specific SRP. Just glad i got this off my chest and Glad i had feed back....feedback is good.

 

[Scuttle Buttin']

OK I can agree to all of these posts. I care to a extent because frankley it up sets me to be told certain things and they are not true. I do care for what i do and sometimes i do not catch what i type out. Even reading over it. I can admit theoriginal reason was that my typing was ilegable that is the reason for the first post. That was my original stand point. Now i could try and delete this thread as it was just a sign of expression to show how i was feeling. Now a days i could really care less. I progress and I am trying to make my self better. I can write some pretty awesome storylines and build it up. I can also go straight smut. I do enjoy this though. Writing I mean and because of all the help i have gotten i have evolved. I can not comprehend the reasoning for extending posting a bit to a few paragraphs. I am just character concious and try not to inolved the story to far where some people may not want ot be or end up. This i went over with La_ Riena and she helped me pull my posting together. That was another example of comunication that i have with writers. I guess i also never bothered to ask how far could i control yoru character or what can i do to expand my posting in this specific SRP. Just glad i got this off my chest and Glad i had feed back....feedback is good.

I think, if I understand this correctly, part of the problem is that you think long posts and not controlling the other person's character can't happen. It's not at all true, and there are a myriad of examples littered all over the SRP forum.

I actually have a thread with La_Reina as well, and while we're only a few posts in, we've both been able to put out posts of a good length without the need to control each other's character beyond the obvious.

The problem with taking over someone else's character, even in minor non-obvious ways, is that it sticks them instantly into a corner. If your character is about to walk away from them and you do something as simple as have their character grab your character's arm to stop them, you've instantly set the tone for their post without them even having a say in it.

So, instead, have your character simply turn to walk away, and stop there. If they grab his arm, good. If they don't, also good. Stories, and even small interactions in stories, can go in good and surprising places if you just allow them to.


And, it's worth pointing out that I'm not saying there must never be typos. I know that I toss them out all the time (my fingers, for example, like to type "actually" when I mean "actual," and because it's still a real word and thus not underlined by my Firefox, I rarely catch it), but there's a difference between the occasional typo, and a sentence that you almost need a decoder ring to get through.

 

[NickisSora]

I find....hmmm how can i put this. I find making a detailed post very....pointless some times. I truely do. Not saying i never made a detailed post. Plenty of times i have made a decent length post to very limited detail. but it is more. going on and on and on about a particular scene to the point where the picture is polaroid and it is there. As much as i can appreciate reading detail for me as a writer i hate typing it. I guess mainly i have a hard time to just describe what i think my character woudl see in so much detail it makes my head explode. I like detail.....just not.....to much of it. Example: Leon walked in to the Saloon his Coal Black hat on his head and the vest to match it was on his form. A White shirt and Grey pants completed the outfit away form his dress shoes.- That is fine but i read some posts and the detail is over whelming and i just step back from it. If i need to visualize that much detail at once. there is very little for me to write about later. I have a clear view of the land and that leads me to type and write in what i picture and visualize. But all the same. I see what you say, I guess i don't know.....I know what I can do and I know what i can work on. What i do not know is......What can i grasp from here on in. I will continued to learn because i have a desire to type and tell a story...hoe many people ar ewilling to rp with me and help me work on that.

 

[Scuttle Buttin']

I find....hmmm how can i put this. I find making a detailed post very....pointless some times. I truely do. Not saying i never made a detailed post. Plenty of times i have made a decent length post to very limited detail. but it is more. going on and on and on about a particular scene to the point where the picture is polaroid and it is there. As much as i can appreciate reading detail for me as a writer i hate typing it. I guess mainly i have a hard time to just describe what i think my character woudl see in so much detail it makes my head explode. I like detail.....just not.....to much of it. Example: Leon walked in to the Saloon his Coal Black hat on his head and the vest to match it was on his form. A White shirt and Grey pants completed the outfit away form his dress shoes.- That is fine but i read some posts and the detail is over whelming and i just step back from it. If i need to visualize that much detail at once. there is very little for me to write about later. I have a clear view of the land and that leads me to type and write in what i picture and visualize. But all the same. I see what you say, I guess i don't know.....I know what I can do and I know what i can work on. What i do not know is......What can i grasp from here on in. I will continued to learn because i have a desire to type and tell a story...hoe many people ar ewilling to rp with me and help me work on that.

I think much of that goes to the art side of it. Some people want to read a post and almost be able to hear the crunch of gravel under someone's shoe or feel the tension in the air between two people. Some people simply want to lay out a couple details and let someone's imagination fill in the rest.

I have my ideas about which I think is better, but that may just be a matter of preference. What really matters, I think, is whether or not you can get a compelling and interesting story out of it.

Unless, of course, you're just here to write sex, in which case it doesn't much matter either way.

 

[NickisSora]

Well now that you say it like that....I am glad it is more Artistic preference. Thanks for that. I always been able to get a nice story out of my threads untill they die lol