the art of power

[Adakgirl]

What does it feel like? Where does it come from? How do you harness it? Develop it? Learn it? Practice it? How does your experience of sexual power or powerlessness relate to your experience of power in the rest of your life?

What are you seeking?

I'm less interested in why it appeals to you (since that seems to fall primarily in the realm of fantasy), and more in how the experience of power and/or powerlessness has influenced your thinking and your actions. And how your creative imagination has influenced your exercise of power.

How have you practiced the art of power?

OK back on topic...These questions are very difficult to absorb and think about all at once. Perhaps we might break them down into easier to handle pieces. I tried to answer the "where does it come from"...perhaps to scientifically but that's pretty much the only answer..it comes from the mind. The sexual power comes from the Limbic system of our minds. However, the creativity that is born of sexual power...comes from??

I have to answer this as I have known it since I was in my early teens. My sexual power correlated exactly with the full blossoming of my breasts, and the start of my menstrual cycles. I realized my sexual power when the HOT SHOT forest fire teams ran past where I lived every morning. 25 or 30 shirtless, tanned, sweating young men would turn their heads and wave if I was outside.

At first I thought they were just being nice, polite. Later a few would wolf whistle at me. I liked that, it made me feel powerful. I would get up really early, go down get my horse and ride back up and sit in the yard waiting for them. She was a magnificent Paint, brown and bright white...soon I started cutting my levi cut offs...off shorter. With every little change I made I garnered more attention from them, they started to slow down running past and then I knew what it was like to feel sexually powerful.
It felt energizing, it felt wonderfully elating, I felt blissfully happy, my confidence shot up and my sexual ego was in the making.

When I was a teen, I learned to use that feminine power "charms" assets to my advantage to get my way when I could, to coherse, to manipulate...men. and THAT felt powerful as well.

I may be wayyy off on what you are asking..but to me sexual power is sexual power regardless if it's powerful or powerless.

 

[rosco rathbone]

Before I foray into the questions posed, I'd like to try and explain this:

The sexual power a Dominant exerts over his submissive is not the same kind of power a rapist exerts over his victim. Though they both may use fear, one kind of fear is consensual, the other is not.

With most (say a serial) rapists, taking a woman by force, unexpectedly and without consent, is the only way in which he is able to feel sexually powerful. It is impossible for him to have any kind of power over women because he hates them and is to inept, to emotionally inadequate to have normal relationships with them. When and if he has tried, he has failed miserably. Those failures feed his hate for women. Some develop such inadequacy by being raised by a domineering mother. By female sexual rejection or experiences of that nature.
He needs to rape to get back at women, to take his hate out on them. He soon learns that he must sexually control a woman by force in order to do that.
of course that is the simplistic version.
That's what they mean when they say rape is not about the sex it's about power.

I hope I wrote that comprehensibly...


Dominants do possess sexual power, a rapist does not.

All well and good, but in my case, I possess both sexual dominance power, as evidenced by my domination of many, and also the ability to be turned on by the idea at least, if not the reality, of nonconsensual rape sex. I understand the mindset of rapists perfectly well.

 

[rosco rathbone]

It's comforting to think that all rapists are twisted geeks who are easy to spot and avoid, but plenty of them seem normal on the outside and have normal-seeming relationships.

 

[ZRT]

All well and good, but in my case, I possess both sexual dominance power, as evidenced by my domination of many, and also the ability to be turned on by the idea at least, if not the reality, of nonconsensual rape sex. I understand the mindset of rapists perfectly well.

I don't think that's contradictory to what she says. You have the ability to outlet your taste in a consensual fashion and can find partners willing to go along with it.

 

[rosco rathbone]

I don't think that's contradictory to what she says. You have the ability to outlet your taste in a consensual fashion and can find partners willing to go along with it.

I'm actually not exactly sure what she's saying.

 

[Adakgirl]

It's comforting to think that all rapists are twisted geeks who are easy to spot and avoid, but plenty of them seem normal on the outside and have normal-seeming relationships.

Apparently not.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I have a question about power, which is maybe really stupid, but I'm posting it anyway. I hope it's not too much of a hijack.

I remember rape awareness type speakers in college saying the following: Rape is not about sex. Rape is about power.

I must have heard that 100 times between age 15 and 22.

Frankly, I never bothered to question that. So is rape about power? And if dominance is about power, is that urge the same as the urge to rape, but expressed in a healthier and/or socially acceptable (somewhat) way?

It is probably semantics, but most of the material and lectures I have experienced in terms of rape mention it being about control more so than straight out power. It is often the only way the rapist can feel they are able to control another or a situation, and by so doing may translate to feelings of power but above all, being in control of the other person. The psychology related to it goes a lot deeper and is triggered by a variety of life situations and/or experiences. Needless to say, it is not a big stretch to see why many people who do not understand BDSM and related areas, feel that rape is a real part of it and in most ways the same, and that those who give up control do so out of fear or a position of no choice.

Catalina:caning:

 

[catalina_francisco]

I'm curious about how you experience power and powerlessness. We talk a lot about the trappings and the sex and the rightness of a relationship match, but what about the core of this sexual experience. . .

the feelings and exercise of power.

or the feelings and experience of powerlessness.

My own experience leads me to believe that a tremendous amount of creativity and thought goes into the exercise of sexual power. I'm curious in how you play with power.

What does it feel like? Where does it come from? How do you harness it? Develop it? Learn it? Practice it? How does your experience of sexual power or powerlessness relate to your experience of power in the rest of your life?

What are you seeking?

I'm less interested in why it appeals to you (since that seems to fall primarily in the realm of fantasy), and more in how the experience of power and/or powerlessness has influenced your thinking and your actions. And how your creative imagination has influenced your exercise of power.

How have you practiced the art of power?

I think if you try to separate sexual from overall it does then for many become more about fantasy and being able to get into the mind zone where power/powerlessness can be believed by those involved. OTOH, if it is part of the relationship you live and in actuality is the backbone of that relationship, then the sexual part of it is not so much about actions, in fact can look anything but what it is if looked at by someone who is not privy to the reality of the positions the people involved fulfill in their relationship. It then becomes more about the overall psychology and relatedness and the core feeling. I also think it takes time to develop, sort of like sliding down a slippery slope in stages...each time you think you have slid as far as is possible, you slide a little more and find yourself even deeper than before until you reach a point where you know (not think or wonder) there is no other choice available, and then you slide some more. Is it easy, is it always perfect, is it always happy, is it always without risk and/or damage....not in my world. I'm not sure if that is what you were asking (the hour is late).

Catalina

 

[bridgeburner]

I have a question about power, which is maybe really stupid, but I'm posting it anyway. I hope it's not too much of a hijack.

I remember rape awareness type speakers in college saying the following: Rape is not about sex. Rape is about power.

I must have heard that 100 times between age 15 and 22.

Frankly, I never bothered to question that. So is rape about power? And if dominance is about power, is that urge the same as the urge to rape, but expressed in a healthier and/or socially acceptable (somewhat) way?

I've always had a problem with that mantra because, however well-intentioned, it's also bullshit.

If rape isn't about sex then what's with all the fucking? Why not just beat the shit out of someone and walk away?

I think in an attempt to drive home the fact that rape isn't provoked or inspired or caused by sexiness on the part of the victim the well-meaning have erred in their definition.

Rape is about power. Rape is about rage and selfishness and the desire to humiliate, denigrate and destroy another person in some way. Rape is also about sex. Sex is the vehicle.

Saying that rape is about power and not about sex is like saying a road trip is only about the final destination and nothing that occurs while driving between points A and B has any significance.

 

[00Syd]

I've always had a problem with that mantra because, however well-intentioned, it's also bullshit.

If rape isn't about sex then what's with all the fucking? Why not just beat the shit out of someone and walk away?

I think in an attempt to drive home the fact that rape isn't provoked or inspired or caused by sexiness on the part of the victim the well-meaning have erred in their definition.

Rape is about power. Rape is about rage and selfishness and the desire to humiliate, denigrate and destroy another person in some way. Rape is also about sex. Sex is the vehicle.

Saying that rape is about power and not about sex is like saying a road trip is only about the final destination and nothing that occurs while driving between points A and B has any significance.

Yeah, that was always my thinking on it. Saying rape is about power and not sex always sounds like bullshit, just like when people say that BDSM isn't about sex. Bullshit.

 

[rosco rathbone]

Rape is about power. Rape is about rage and selfishness and the desire to humiliate, denigrate and destroy another person in some way. Rape is also about sex. Sex is the vehicle.

Saying that rape is about power and not about sex is like saying a road trip is only about the final destination and nothing that occurs while driving between points A and B has any significance.

That's always the point I want to make in this argument but I'm willing to accept the idea that not all rapists eroticize power to the extent I do. Adakgirl posted a good summation of psychological thought on the issue.

Still, my basic point is that it is not necessary to draw an absolute and sharp line between "crime of sex" and "crime of anger/power" since those emotions can easily be sexualised.

What percentage of rapists do this is an empirical matter I suppose.

And of course I see the political reasons why people would be very leery of allowing rape to defined as "about sex". Whole other can of worms.

 

[rosco rathbone]

I've always had a problem with that mantra because, however well-intentioned, it's also bullshit.

If rape isn't about sex then what's with all the fucking? Why not just beat the shit out of someone and walk away?

That's how I figure it. If you express your urge to dominate and humiliate someone in the billiards hall, you are a pool shark. On the track, a NASCAR driver. In the ring, a heavyweight contender. In their sexual organs, a rapist.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

Wait - you're in college. You never got one of those rape-prevention-awareness lectures?? I don't remember going to those voluntarily! Was that, like, a 90s thing? All I remember is, rape isn't about sex. Rape is about power.

Then I remember this big talk about getting consent every step of the way. I think it was a rule at Oberlin or some school in Ohio. I thought it was bullshit. Because date rape is about miscommunication??

Anyway, I also remember a T.A. telling the class, sex is about power. He was hot, on an unrelated note.

Maybe I just have a really selective memory. All sentences that end in "___ is about power."

When I went to uni we had a talk on sexual promiscuity among students, BC/barrier contraceptives and sexual assault/rape. We were even given condoms and beer bottle stoppers to prevent drug rape, as though a pissed student is going to remember to cork her San Miguel before she staggers to the toilet. It was a whole 3 hour fiasco that also covered clubbing, drugs, letting partying get in the way of grades, the whole bit.

The talk about rape featured a 'no means no' lecture on how drink is no mitigation if wires get crossed and unwanted activity occurs. Being safe when out, using licensed cabs, ensuring friends didn't get left alone at the end of the night. Because we were nursing students, there was a chat about unsociable hours, not lingering in deserted parts of the hospital late at night, going out to smoke safely etc.

The whole thing was fairly comprehensive.

Later in my training, we also did lessons in dealing with distressed, volatile people, diffusing anger, negotiation, summoning back-up within house and basic self defence techniques aimed at freeing yourself from a physical assault in order to leave the situation. I had a few hairy moments when I worked on casualty but only one assault was sexually motivated.

I suppose this stuff is perhaps more prescient when working in the pressured environment of an over-filled, understaffed hospital where everyone has a grudge against the way the NHS is managed and funded. In our litigation happy times, it's also crucial to disengage without giving a violent assailant any cause to turn the tables and accuse you of unreasonable behaviour. Vulnerable people like dementia patients can also get nasty and it can be really difficult to disengage from that without causing injury or bruising to fragile, elderly tissue.

Anyway, I'm veering way off topic here so I'll shut up now.

 

[Lizzie_Borden]

What does it feel like? Where does it come from? How do you harness it? Develop it? Learn it? Practice it? How does your experience of sexual power or powerlessness relate to your experience of power in the rest of your life?

What are you seeking?

I'm less interested in why it appeals to you (since that seems to fall primarily in the realm of fantasy), and more in how the experience of power and/or powerlessness has influenced your thinking and your actions. And how your creative imagination has influenced your exercise of power.

How have you practiced the art of power?

I'm tired as all get up... but, I think my desire for sexual powerlessness is directly tired to my desire to control every other aspect of my life.

I feel like I want to harness that control, and have it in my hot little hand, and hand it over to someone who I can trust will take care of it, and me.

And that handing over is an act of control itself, probably the greatest.

Thus, I've yet to put it into any real practice... just briefly for moments here and there have I let my imagination put me into a situation where I've been powerlessly sexually, powerless to respond in the way of my choosing, powerless to stop responses I would have prefered not reveal themselves.

There's undoubtably more, but I struggle with my words and framing feelings into thoughts at the best of times.

 

[eastern sun]

It's interesting that an "art of power" thread in the BDSM section would include a discussion of rape. I would think it might reinforce some people's perceptions of BDSM as something criminal, abusive, or antisocial.

edited to add - on the other hand, I hid my sexuality, and effectively shut down my sexual power, for a number of years because I was afraid of rape. I was also a heavy drinker at the time and couldn't count on my own common sense.

 

[eastern sun]

All well and good, but in my case, I possess both sexual dominance power, as evidenced by my domination of many, and also the ability to be turned on by the idea at least, if not the reality, of nonconsensual rape sex. I understand the mindset of rapists perfectly well.

I like your new av, Rosco. I would love to hear more about your mindset.

 

[eastern sun]

OK back on topic...These questions are very difficult to absorb and think about all at once. Perhaps we might break them down into easier to handle pieces. I tried to answer the "where does it come from"...perhaps to scientifically but that's pretty much the only answer..it comes from the mind. The sexual power comes from the Limbic system of our minds. However, the creativity that is born of sexual power...comes from??

I have to answer this as I have known it since I was in my early teens. My sexual power correlated exactly with the full blossoming of my breasts, and the start of my menstrual cycles. I realized my sexual power when the HOT SHOT forest fire teams ran past where I lived every morning. 25 or 30 shirtless, tanned, sweating young men would turn their heads and wave if I was outside.

At first I thought they were just being nice, polite. Later a few would wolf whistle at me. I liked that, it made me feel powerful. I would get up really early, go down get my horse and ride back up and sit in the yard waiting for them. She was a magnificent Paint, brown and bright white...soon I started cutting my levi cut offs...off shorter. With every little change I made I garnered more attention from them, they started to slow down running past and then I knew what it was like to feel sexually powerful.
It felt energizing, it felt wonderfully elating, I felt blissfully happy, my confidence shot up and my sexual ego was in the making.

When I was a teen, I learned to use that feminine power "charms" assets to my advantage to get my way when I could, to coherse, to manipulate...men. and THAT felt powerful as well.

I may be wayyy off on what you are asking..but to me sexual power is sexual power regardless if it's powerful or powerless.

that's how I experience my sexual power too. and it never ceases to surprise me. never.

what do you think, adakgirl? I know that sexual power and the effect it has on other people can be ego-building. But what if it wasn't. What would it be then?

 

[Netzach]

that's how I experience my sexual power too. and it never ceases to surprise me. never.

what do you think, adakgirl? I know that sexual power and the effect it has on other people can be ego-building. But what if it wasn't. What would it be then?

It can be an absolute fucking millstone.

I have a very love-hate relationship with this particular power. It's a rush to be able to trigger all this desire but at the end of the day it's also a "so?"

My notion of sexual power is more woo woo and more intimate. I experience it most via giving hand jobs actually. I'm still, he's gone totally reactive. Helpless fucker. Everything I do makes all the difference. I like to put an arm behind their head and jerk them off in a pieta position.

 

[unknooown]

i don't know if this is typical or not but my need to be powerful and in control stems from past insecurities. i am without a doubt what you would call a pretty boy, and to top it off i look young (i'm 24 and i still get carded when i buy cigarettes). when i was in grammar school my older brother constantly called me a little girl, as did his friends, which not only cultivated my need to be perceived as masculine but also put the idea in my head that females are in some way less than males (this is something i'm still dealing with: i know logically that it's not true but my actions often say otherwise).

anyway, cut to me being an aggressive pre-adolescent. i got into several fights throughout middle school and was kicked out of the public high school as a result (although i did get quite good at fighting, and was able to beat the hell out of kids bigger than me). and still i remained petite, feminine looking, etc. fucking infuriating.

in 8th grade my old school let me back in. i had a thing for a cheerleader, so i joined football. i was still petite but i was a good runner and playing helped with my aggression. i started making friends which did wonders for the ol' self-esteem, then i grew 10 inches in roughly 10 months and suddenly the ladies were all over me. that i remember very clearly because it was the first time i was ever really in a position of power. i played them against each other which was thrilling. i especially liked how, if i was particularly cold or stand-offish on a certain day, the girl or girls i was talking to would trip all over themselves trying to make things right. playing mind games became a favorite past-time -- but being as i was still pretty young it hadn't yet crossed my mind to be physically aggressive with them.

cut to college, that cheerleader that i joined football for became a pretty good friend of mine, but was dating someone else. one day we were flirting innocently and the next thing i know i had pinned her to the floor and purposely ripped open her shirt. seeing how much it upset not only her but her boyfriend (who i fucking hated) gave me such a rush that i continued to do things like that until they eventually broke up. and every time she rejected me for two (two!) years following their break up, i would get violent. nothing terrible, but it had become clear to me at that point that she got off on it as much as i did. (that sounds pretty vile but we were best friends, hanging out every day, she had plenty of opportunities to walk away from me and never speak to me again, etc. not to mention that there were a few times where i found out first hand how wet our fights got her.)

meanwhile i was seeing other girls, beating the shit out of them in bed, and loving it. naturally there were a few miscommunications where i was aggressive with someone who didn't want it, but these were luckily always minor.

now after 10 years i'm finally with that girl. our sex life is great but the fact that my aggression stems from something i haven't exactly come to terms with sometimes causes problems. i'm controlling in more ways than she's comfortable with, and my attitude (as a fairly sadistic person) is that it's not my fuckin problem. truth is if i want to keep her it is my problem, and i do want to keep her. so this is something i'm currently struggling with and it isn't easy because something in me feels as if it's her duty to obey me, etc etc etc. but i digress.

jesus christ that's my life story right there. i've never put that into words. sorry if it's boring, but at the very least it was pretty therapeutic for me.

 

[ChainedEros]

Interesting story unkooown. It's very similar to my own. Except that I was a lot more aggressive and sadistic - to men and women - and not always in a sexual manner. But, that's a story for another day.

I only have one comment. If you truly want to keep a woman, then you may want to reconsider being controlling. In my experience, that's the quickest way to drive a woman away (unless she enjoys that).

It is possible to be dominant and powerful without being controlling. Learn to separate those things. It will help the relationships.

 

[intothewoods]

It's interesting that an "art of power" thread in the BDSM section would include a discussion of rape. I would think it might reinforce some people's perceptions of BDSM as something criminal, abusive, or antisocial.

edited to add - on the other hand, I hid my sexuality, and effectively shut down my sexual power, for a number of years because I was afraid of rape. I was also a heavy drinker at the time and couldn't count on my own common sense.

Hmm, well, if my perception of BDSM is as something crimina, abusive or antisocial, it's a subconscious one. It's more that I wonder about the different uses of the word power that I've heard. I can't remember ever being afraid of rape or even thinking it could ever happen to me. Naivete, isolation, privilege? I'm not sure.

 

[unknooown]

Interesting story unkooown. It's very similar to my own. Except that I was a lot more aggressive and sadistic - to men and women - and not always in a sexual manner. But, that's a story for another day.

i would be very interested to hear your story when you have the time.

I only have one comment. If you truly want to keep a woman, then you may want to reconsider being controlling. In my experience, that's the quickest way to drive a woman away (unless she enjoys that).

It is possible to be dominant and powerful without being controlling. Learn to separate those things. It will help the relationships.

thanks for the advice. she does enjoy it, but to an extent. i cross the line often. it don't know if i need to find another outlet for my controlling tendencies or if it's something i need to concentrate on remedying.

as for separating dominance/power and control, you're right. i've only recently begun to understand the differences amongst them and i have yet to apply these new discoveries to my relationship. this is something i need to focus on asap.

 

[JMohegan]

It is possible to be dominant and powerful without being controlling. Learn to separate those things. It will help the relationships.

What is the difference between behavior that is "dominant and powerful" and behavior that is "controlling?"

 

[rida]

To connect back to female power and sex.

Around the age of 17, I had an epiphany: boys were divided in two groups; the one I could not have and the one I could. Simply put: if a boy did not belong to the "impossible" group, it meant that I could make him want me. (the impossible group would have been the ones that wanted only blonds, or only tall women, or only skinny ones, or ... any other attribute I did not have and could not have or not want to have, so pretty much I did not care about them either).

Being a scientific mind, I went ahead to test the theory, and sure enough it worked pretty well. Only I did not care much for boys yet, so I did not use that power a lot. Also, I always hated playing the tease-game if I was not serious about offering what I was making them want (kisses or pussy or what not), so I rarely played it.

Skip ahead a decade or two to nowadays: the man I cannot have are still man I cannot have, and I don't care about them. The man I can have easily? fun vanilla toys, perhaps, but they have to have some good conversational skills to keep my interest. The men that turn me into mush? The ones that take that power away from me, that are effected by it but can control it and play the game on their term. *sigh*

 

[ChainedEros]

What is the difference between behavior that is "dominant and powerful" and behavior that is "controlling?"

I didn't say being controlling was not dominant or powerful.

I said that it is possible to be dominant and powerful without being controlling.

What separates controlling behavior from dominance and power is choice. The difference between being coerced to follow and choosing to follow.