The "insurrectionary theory" of the Second Amendment is nonsense

[Missys_boytoy]

Ummm you really wish to discuss monikers?

Really?

LOL

I am her boy toy. Jealous? She's 5 years older than me. Got a problem with that? I'm sure there are other couples here in the same situation. So, what were you saying?

 

[Sean Renaud]

I'll say it again, you're a DUMB FUCK. Your name says it all. A Fraud. The beauty of our Constitution and Bill of Rights is they are timeless documents. Societal changes don't matter, contrary to what you say. The Constitution puts limits on the government so we stay a free people. If you don't like this arrangement, you can pack your shit and leave. The Declaration of Independence, The Constitution and our Bill of Rights are NOT going anywhere, despite what you loons might want to do.

Nothing is timeless. Absolutely nothing and the Bill of Rights is ignored constantly (I don't know why you mentioned the Declaration since it's entirely pointless here) because society has changed and we all acknowledge it. Except dumb fucks like you.

And no, we're not going to pack up and leave. We're going to change the country just as our parents did and their parents before them and their parents before them. It's our birthright.

I'm pretty prepared and though I was in town for one week before Sandy hit, everybody came to my house. I have a huge box that I update every year for disaster preparedness. A nice long list of being ridiculously overprepared so that everybody made fun of me for some of the stuff in the box that means "Zombie Apocalypse Has Hit And There Is No Water" but it would have worked to keep people alive in Katrina. Nobody is sorry to see preparedness when it's needed. I didn't see anybody turning down air mattresses or flashlights or extra blankets or a deck of cards.

No, I'm not afraid of civil war or Aliens or "insurrection" whatever the fuck this is about.

I'm cautious about what I've already experienced.

I don't know your individual circumstances and I'm in no way knocking being prepared for it. Far from it I'm supporting it and saying perhaps we should push that A LOT HARDER than we do. Like goddamn PSAs on emergency prepardness on par with how anti-smoking ads were, not the once in a while bullshit of today I mean late 80's early 90's you can't hardly ignore it PSAs. I'm talking episodes of popular television shows showing how catastrophic not having this shit is.

That said wasn't Katrina, like most hurricanes, something where you had pretty damn good warning time and staying behind was your own fucking fault? Like I feel bad for the guys caught in the Japanese Tsunami. They had little warning (and not a lot of places to run) but those who got hit by Super Storm Sandy? I'm sorry, they should have been gone when the government told them to get out.

Which doesn't negate wanting to be prepared up to an including weapons for such a scenario.

 

[Missys_boytoy]

See this is where you are such an imbecile and should shut up so you do not look stupid.

Looking like and being are two different things. We are talking about banning REAL FUCKING MILITARY STYLE GUNS NOT A FUCKING FACSIMILE YOU IGNORANT STUPID FUCKING CUNT !!!!!!!

Jesus Christ some people are so fucking stupid. YOU ARE EXACTLY THE TYPE OF STUPID THAT SHOULD NEVER OWN A GUN.

Fucking dolt.

Now that I got under your skin, I see you are still a DUMB FUCK. The only legal weapons to own in the USA, unless specially permitted, are SEMI-AUTO weapons. 1 bullet for 1 pull of the trigger. The 2nd amendment guarantees my right to own a gun, scary military style or not. It is not up to YOU to decide what I can own or not. If I could buy a tank, I'd own one. Your fanaticism with military style guns is laughable and just shows your ignorance on the subject. Also, your usage of clip vs. magazine gives your lack of knowledge away, DUMB FUCK. Feel free to fill out a hurt feelings report, as linked in my signature below.

 

[Recidiva]

don't know your individual circumstances and I'm in no way knocking being prepared for it. Far from it I'm supporting it and saying perhaps we should push that A LOT HARDER than we do. Like goddamn PSAs on emergency prepardness on par with how anti-smoking ads were, not the once in a while bullshit of today I mean late 80's early 90's you can't hardly ignore it PSAs. I'm talking episodes of popular television shows showing how catastrophic not having this shit is.

That said wasn't Katrina, like most hurricanes, something where you had pretty damn good warning time and staying behind was your own fucking fault? Like I feel bad for the guys caught in the Japanese Tsunami. They had little warning (and not a lot of places to run) but those who got hit by Super Storm Sandy? I'm sorry, they should have been gone when the government told them to get out.

Which doesn't negate wanting to be prepared up to an including weapons for such a scenario.

Warning is one thing. Leaving is another. If you've weathered lots of hurricanes that people thought were going to be worse than they were, people become inured to the warning. They know that leaving is a huge expense and if there are pets or kids or abandoning their home to vandalism or looting or arson is an option, many, many people will choose to stay home.

Also, many people didn't have anywhere to go or money to spend. If you're asked to arbitrarily drop your life enough times and it's a huge expense and loss, maybe you wouldn't do it either the seventeenth time.

Many people leave and don't come back to their home anyway, they lose it to storm damage or human damage, doesn't matter, and you can't protect yourself from both simultaneously.

I've had to make the choice myself several times and it's much more complicated in its implications than it seems. So great, so you go to a hotel and you can't get back home and you can't afford the hotel, but if you'd stayed at home maybe you could have done something to protect your home that is now trashed and you are stuck at a hotel for which you can't pay the bill.

A lot of people would rather go down with their ship and for good reasons. It isn't laziness or ignorance that makes someone stay. It's not having a second home or a car or options or they know they'd have to leave behind someone helpless who would need them.

 

[SigmundFraud]

I don't walk around with one because I actually live in a culture that is anti-gun and most places have signs saying you can't go in. That's the right of the business owner and I don't disagree with it. But travel and destination is very complicated if you're carrying a gun.

Guns mean different things to different people. I respect that. I don't think everybody should be forced to learn to use one if they're opposed.

I do not, however, understand how other people feel they get to tell me what my gun "means" to me as if they were explaining to a small child about how I believed in Santa and that my gun isn't really real and all my ideas about it are wrong.

I would prefer an open carry policy after testing so people could see how many people actually do carry guns or know how to use them or aren't afraid of them. There's so much concealed carry and it looks like nobody has one. It's skewing reality and making it look like they don't exist.

So yes, the only people we see carrying guns because it's so very complicated otherwise and you're bound to attract attention and frighten people because your jacket parted and people think you want to rob them...are the crazy ones.

I'm not so sure I would agree with an open carry. I see the pro and cons but I feel very uncomfortable with people strapping it down like this is the Wild West.

Truth be told most people who own guns are not really competent with their weapons or responsible. How many keep their weapons in a safe or have trigger locks? Most don't.

 

[Missys_boytoy]

Nothing is timeless. Absolutely nothing and the Bill of Rights is ignored constantly (I don't know why you mentioned the Declaration since it's entirely pointless here) because society has changed and we all acknowledge it. Except dumb fucks like you.

And no, we're not going to pack up and leave. We're going to change the country just as our parents did and their parents before them and their parents before them. It's our birthright.



I don't know your individual circumstances and I'm in no way knocking being prepared for it. Far from it I'm supporting it and saying perhaps we should push that A LOT HARDER than we do. Like goddamn PSAs on emergency prepardness on par with how anti-smoking ads were, not the once in a while bullshit of today I mean late 80's early 90's you can't hardly ignore it PSAs. I'm talking episodes of popular television shows showing how catastrophic not having this shit is.

That said wasn't Katrina, like most hurricanes, something where you had pretty damn good warning time and staying behind was your own fucking fault? Like I feel bad for the guys caught in the Japanese Tsunami. They had little warning (and not a lot of places to run) but those who got hit by Super Storm Sandy? I'm sorry, they should have been gone when the government told them to get out.

Which doesn't negate wanting to be prepared up to an including weapons for such a scenario.

You're not changing the Constitution or the Bill of Rights. Sorry. We'll go to war over that. BTW, the Constitution and Bill of Rights are timeless. You need to go get re-educated. They apply equally today as they did 200 years ago. NO need to change them.

 

[Recidiva]

I'm not so sure I would agree with an open carry. I see the pro and cons but I feel very uncomfortable with people strapping it down like this is the Wild West.

Truth be told most people who own guns are not really competent with their weapons or responsible. How many keep their weapons in a safe or have trigger locks? Most don't.

The way I see it is it's like a gay person in the 50's. Didn't exist. Gay was a myth. You only saw a few on TV as stereotypes and otherwise you knew no "gay" folks at all. Never mind that a great number of your acquaintances and co-workers were, and that they were perfectly fine and not the guys that would be associated with all the weirdness that "gay" was when it could be marginalized and humiliated out of "polite" company.

It would surprise you.

 

[SigmundFraud]

I am her boy toy. Jealous? She's 5 years older than me. Got a problem with that? I'm sure there are other couples here in the same situation. So, what were you saying?

You are missing the point but it is as I expected.

Now that I got under your skin, I see you are still a DUMB FUCK. The only legal weapons to own in the USA, unless specially permitted, are SEMI-AUTO weapons. 1 bullet for 1 pull of the trigger. The 2nd amendment guarantees my right to own a gun, scary military style or not. It is not up to YOU to decide what I can own or not. If I could buy a tank, I'd own one. Your fanaticism with military style guns is laughable and just shows your ignorance on the subject. Also, your usage of clip vs. magazine gives your lack of knowledge away, DUMB FUCK. Feel free to fill out a hurt feelings report, as linked in my signature below.

The 2nd Amendment guarantees you the right to own a gun but not what kind of gun. I suspect you never really read the Constitution or really read much at all.

Sonny I have a Class 3 Federal Firearms License and I collect antiques. I have forgotten more about small arms weaponry than what "expertise" you think you may have.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Now that I got under your skin, I see you are still a DUMB FUCK. The only legal weapons to own in the USA, unless specially permitted, are SEMI-AUTO weapons. 1 bullet for 1 pull of the trigger. The 2nd amendment guarantees my right to own a gun, scary military style or not. It is not up to YOU to decide what I can own or not. If I could buy a tank, I'd own one. Your fanaticism with military style guns is laughable and just shows your ignorance on the subject. Also, your usage of clip vs. magazine gives your lack of knowledge away, DUMB FUCK. Feel free to fill out a hurt feelings report, as linked in my signature below.

Why are you making a big deal about SEMI-AUTO and then the 2nd Amendment. The 2nd Amendment means you can own fully auto, tanks and nukes if you want. Except common sense prevailed over your bullshit and did so a long time ago.

Warning is one thing. Leaving is another. If you've weathered lots of hurricanes that people thought were going to be worse than they were, people become inured to the warning. They know that leaving is a huge expense and if there are pets or kids or abandoning their home to vandalism or looting or arson is an option, many, many people will choose to stay home.

Also, many people didn't have anywhere to go or money to spend. If you're asked to arbitrarily drop your life enough times and it's a huge expense and loss, maybe you wouldn't do it either the seventeenth time.

Many people leave and don't come back to their home anyway, they lose it to storm damage or human damage, doesn't matter, and you can't protect yourself from both simultaneously.

I've had to make the choice myself several times and it's much more complicated in its implications than it seems. So great, so you go to a hotel and you can't get back home and you can't afford the hotel, but if you'd stayed at home maybe you could have done something to protect your home that is now trashed and you are stuck at a hotel for which you can't pay the bill.

A lot of people would rather go down with their ship and for good reasons. It isn't laziness or ignorance that makes someone stay. It's not having a second home or a car or options or they know they'd have to leave behind someone helpless who would need them.

I respect that. I really do. My main point here is that you volunteered, against advice, to stay in a place that had a high probability of becoming a war zone. I have a difficult time pitying people who stick around. I can say first hand from going to war that your absolutely right, after the fifth code Red in a day you not only aren't running for the bunkers you're making damn sure you cleared that room on Halo before you paused cus there's nothing as bad as losing your groove. And that was a much more immediate sort of life or death than a storm that often turns out to be a bad case of the sprinkles. So I get it. Doesn't make me any less responsible for the possible end results though.

You're not changing the Constitution or the Bill of Rights. Sorry. We'll go to war over that. BTW, the Constitution and Bill of Rights are timeless. You need to go get re-educated. They apply equally today as they did 200 years ago. NO need to change them.

First it's been changed before and will be changed again. If you insist on being killed this time that's your business. We can handle this like gentlemen or we can get into some gangsta shit. Choice is yours.

The Constitution and the Bill of Rights are not timeless. There is no need for me to get re-educated only to take a look at the world around me and understand that those 200 year old words at the very least need some tweaking to survive the modern world. It's not a matter of debate it's a matter of fact and nobody really believes they are timeless or apply equally today.

 

[SigmundFraud]

You're not changing the Constitution or the Bill of Rights. Sorry. We'll go to war over that. BTW, the Constitution and Bill of Rights are timeless. You need to go get re-educated. They apply equally today as they did 200 years ago. NO need to change them.

Hey douchebag the Constitution has been changed like 17 times. All without a war.

There is no cure for stupid

 

[Recidiva]

I respect that. I really do. My main point here is that you volunteered, against advice, to stay in a place that had a high probability of becoming a war zone. I have a difficult time pitying people who stick around. I can say first hand from going to war that your absolutely right, after the fifth code Red in a day you not only aren't running for the bunkers you're making damn sure you cleared that room on Halo before you paused cus there's nothing as bad as losing your groove. And that was a much more immediate sort of life or death than a storm that often turns out to be a bad case of the sprinkles. So I get it. Doesn't make me any less responsible for the possible end results though.

Yup. Your choices would be yours, it's just not cut and dried and a clear choice with a clear outcome.

People in New Orleans suffered from having weathered so many hurricanes that it was a yawn. People in New Jersey suffered from "What the fuck, there's a WHAT coming this way?"

BUT...the people in New Jersey and New Orleans had both had circumstances where "the big one" was predicted and then it turned out to be a backed up drain down a street over. Weather prediction is not an exact science and the practical side of that is that some people just think they can read a book without a lamp like last time the National Guard was called out for no reason.

So a lot of people that dutifully evacuate are out cash and worry and have family members that tell the story about how scared they were in 2007 when that wimpy thing passed by.

 

[SigmundFraud]

The way I see it is it's like a gay person in the 50's. Didn't exist. Gay was a myth. You only saw a few on TV as stereotypes and otherwise you knew no "gay" folks at all. Never mind that a great number of your acquaintances and co-workers were, and that they were perfectly fine and not the guys that would be associated with all the weirdness that "gay" was when it could be marginalized and humiliated out of "polite" company.

It would surprise you.

You know I own about 700 firearms. I been collecting since I was a kid going to gun shows. I have some very unique items. I have never carried a firearm. I do have several shutguns strategically placed, concealed around the house encase of home evasion out of reach of children. All my collectables are in safes or secured. I do have a glock that I keep concealed in my bedroom. Other than that my dogs will most likely eat a burglar before I actually have to shoot one.

 

[Recidiva]

You know I own about 700 firearms. I been collecting since I was a kid going to gun shows. I have some very unique items. I have never carried a firearm. I do have several shutguns strategically placed, concealed around the house encase of home evasion out of reach of children. All my collectables are in safes or secured. I do have a glock that I keep concealed in my bedroom. Other than that my dogs will most likely eat a burglar before I actually have to shoot one.

Yes, and yet the proximity of firearms hasn't made you mad with power or crazed with fear.

I mean, I hope. I'm assuming, because to hold your hands still enough to type would be an achievement otherwise.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Yup. Your choices would be yours, it's just not cut and dried and a clear choice with a clear outcome.

Agreed.

Of course that's one of the things I'll say about California and much of the west in America. Sure we're going to have an earthquake again someday but it's San Frans turn right now anyway and we get one every decade or so. You guys get a hurricane several times a year. Sure it only wrecks your shit infrequently but natural disasters are more a matter of when and not a matter of if for you.

Back on subject I don't have a problem with you wanting a gun, in particular in those circumstances. I'd rather you had a few gallons of water, a raft, some food and a radio but as Bot would back up if you have those things and no gun you run the risk of losing those things, if you have a gun and not those things you can go and take it from the first chump who doesn't see you coming.

 

[Recidiva]

Agreed.

Of course that's one of the things I'll say about California and much of the west in America. Sure we're going to have an earthquake again someday but it's San Frans turn right now anyway and we get one every decade or so. You guys get a hurricane several times a year. Sure it only wrecks your shit infrequently but natural disasters are more a matter of when and not a matter of if for you.

Back on subject I don't have a problem with you wanting a gun, in particular in those circumstances. I'd rather you had a few gallons of water, a raft, some food and a radio but as Bot would back up if you have those things and no gun you run the risk of losing those things, if you have a gun and not those things you can go and take it from the first chump who doesn't see you coming.

I probably won't ever even visit California, as I was in the last two major earthquakes to hit the state, one in Los Angeles in 87 and then and the one in Los Gatos that collapsed the Bay Bridge. No thank you.

We've thought pretty carefully. We don't have a generator because the fuel is a storage risk and after a storm has been sighted, it becomes tough to get it before and after. So I just have my big-ass box and more food than is reasonable.

If it really is Armageddon and all society breaks down I'm not long for the world anyway unless we can loot the pharmacy for years' supply of specific medications and protect that cache.

I may not do the looting, but knowing me I'd want to protect someone from it and die that way. Oh well. Can't pick how I die, but I can pick how I live.

 

[SigmundFraud]

Yes, and yet the proximity of firearms hasn't made you mad with power or crazed with fear.

I mean, I hope. I'm assuming, because to hold your hands still enough to type would be an achievement otherwise.

Yesterday I had a pleasant surprise. My soon to be ex-wife finally has come to her senses.

She has dropped my gun collection and guitar collection from the division of property as well as family antiques. Which to me is fair because none of them has to do with her or us. I have just sent her flowers thanking her for her "generosity." This will save me from paying a hitman at least.

I have a few civil war pieces I plan to donate to a museum. I found them beneath the floorboard of a wreck of an old stone farmhouse on property we bought. The house had actually caved in and all that was left were the stone walls. I used the stones to build a giant two sided hearth in our house.

The rifle was in fairly good shape considering. I think now it could be fired but I don't wish to chance it. Legend has it that the old house was part of the underground railroad but there is nothing to support this claim which is what I used to defeat the preservation society. I'm like it is a caved in building WTF are you preserving actually?

 

[Sean Renaud]

Northridge was the last major quake and it was in '94 if I recall properly and I was in that. As in all those pictures of the mall twisted into a pretzel was about three miles from my house. I know all about earthquakes and I'll still take a once a decade occurance over an annual one. Snowmaggeddon happens so often the east coast celebrates not being buried up to their necks. And I don't love anybody enough to be snowed in for weeks at a time without murdering everybody. (It's also probably not a coincidence that everybody I know from the east coast is born between late July and early September) Fuck that noise.

Fuel also degrades pretty quickly. It's difficult to store for long periods of time. Nobody really thinks about it because pretty quickly in this case is measured I believe as in like 18 months or so most people never run into it as a problem but still. I'm of mixed feelings about gennies anyway. I'm much more a pro-batteries sort of guy and I don't particularly like how many modern electric devices don't take batteries. But it looks like we're getting enough solar (for all the good that'll do in a storm) and other ways of powering them.

If it's the the break down of society I'm not particularly long for this world either. Mostly because I get sufficiently frustrated sufficiently easily that sometime about eight months in my group would find something we couldn't take and needed and I'd be the guy who'd finally throw up my hands and say "fuck it. I vote we charge down the front door. If we win awesome, if we lose, well I'm quite bored of this shit anyway.

 

[Recidiva]

Yesterday I had a pleasant surprise. My soon to be ex-wife finally has come to her senses.

She has dropped my gun collection and guitar collection from the division of property as well as family antiques. Which to me is fair because none of them has to do with her or us. I have just sent her flowers thanking her for her "generosity." This will save me from paying a hitman at least.

I have a few civil war pieces I plan to donate to a museum. I found them beneath the floorboard of a wreck of an old stone farmhouse on property we bought. The house had actually caved in and all that was left were the stone walls. I used the stones to build a giant two sided hearth in our house.

The rifle was in fairly good shape considering. I think now it could be fired but I don't wish to chance it. Legend has it that the old house was part of the underground railroad but there is nothing to support this claim which is what I used to defeat the preservation society. I'm like it is a caved in building WTF are you preserving actually?

Good for her. I didn't ask for anything in my divorces because I figured just getting away was a good deal. I'm not big on revenge, just cutting losses.

Yeah, I wouldn't want to fire that rifle either. "Crap, hand's gone, didn't get out all the squirrel hair from the 18th century"

 

[Recidiva]

Northridge was the last major quake and it was in '94 if I recall properly and I was in that. As in all those pictures of the mall twisted into a pretzel was about three miles from my house. I know all about earthquakes and I'll still take a once a decade occurance over an annual one. Snowmaggeddon happens so often the east coast celebrates not being buried up to their necks. And I don't love anybody enough to be snowed in for weeks at a time without murdering everybody. (It's also probably not a coincidence that everybody I know from the east coast is born between late July and early September) Fuck that noise.

Fuel also degrades pretty quickly. It's difficult to store for long periods of time. Nobody really thinks about it because pretty quickly in this case is measured I believe as in like 18 months or so most people never run into it as a problem but still. I'm of mixed feelings about gennies anyway. I'm much more a pro-batteries sort of guy and I don't particularly like how many modern electric devices don't take batteries. But it looks like we're getting enough solar (for all the good that'll do in a storm) and other ways of powering them.

If it's the the break down of society I'm not particularly long for this world either. Mostly because I get sufficiently frustrated sufficiently easily that sometime about eight months in my group would find something we couldn't take and needed and I'd be the guy who'd finally throw up my hands and say "fuck it. I vote we charge down the front door. If we win awesome, if we lose, well I'm quite bored of this shit anyway.

Yeah, I'm about quality of life and although I am ridiculously stubborn, if I were on my own I'd probably do something ridiculously dangerous I've always wanted to try and count it as a good deal.

But then there's Ulaven who is not only ridiculously stubborn but also would like some company, so I'll encourage him to use me as bait and diversions and hope it works out for the best. He'll get sick of me offering myself as the cannibal option.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Great. We were having a conversation and now all I can see is you running around screaming

EAT ME!!!!

 

[Recidiva]

Great. We were having a conversation and now all I can see is you running around screaming

EAT ME!!!!

It could happen. I'm unpredictable and not necessarily out to preserve my own life.

 

[Sean Renaud]

It could happen. I'm unpredictable and not necessarily out to preserve my own life.

I'm out to preserve my own life, I just get equal parts bored and frustrated fairly quickly. In all but a few circumstances it's difficult to keep me from just saying screw it, doing anything is better than nothing.

 

[SigmundFraud]

Hey

Where did boytoy go?

He must be researching some more clever inaccurate comebacks.

Talking to him was like kicking a puppy.

Boytoy indeed.

I have alway been a mantoy no matter what age the slut was. But if you have a little dick you have a little dick. Not all men are created equal.

 

[ryan8558]

Here you go. A military weapon anyone can own. Well, if you have the $.

 

[unregistered]