Bernie!

[BoyNextDoor]

Best speech of the campaign.

 

[sr71plt]

Yep, he's only some 700 plus primary delegates behind now as we get ever closer to the end and the aheader he goes the behinder he gets.

I'll check the enthusiasm after the New York primary (which, no, I'm not calling).

 

[AlwaysHungry]

No you really aren't. And I want you to win but here on earth you're desperately hoping the big boys come to your aid and I don't know if we will. Only that I'll do my part.

Huh?

 

[sr71plt]

It would be fine with me if Bernie won the White House--certainly against any Republican I can see--but it would, I think, be a recognition of defeat in getting anything at all done in a progressive agenda for as long as Bernie could survive in office. And I see that in the pie-in-the-sky supporters here. First, an unrealistic view of his chances (I'll go with reality and just be satisfied if a miracle happens), expressed in insufferably unrealistic, Pollyanish terms, and then an apparent acceptance that nothing, even incrementally, can be achieved on a progressive program for as long as he's president. He even wants to tear down the progress that has been achieved (and isn't finished) in universal health care in favor of something he doesn't have a prayer of achieving. Most of the demographic I see supporting him just seems clueless on how work gets done--and could be done--at the federal level.

The Democrat who really could move progressive legislation was Lyndon Johnson, and he was no one's starry-eyed endearing grandfather with zero political advantages going for him.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

In some ways, Bernie's success is arguably the revenge of the Old Left, the unions and blue-collar workers left behind by the New Democrats, the college-educated professionals, the identity/community activists, and the greenies. Many of the latter causes are noble, but in pursuit of them, it has often been the case that the hard hat voters have been brushed aside and their grievances (low pay, anti-union politics, no health insurance) given the bum's rush.

To put it mildly, the FDR/LBJ Democrats can either come home now with Bernie, or else they can be tossed aside again. If Hillary wins the nomination, as still seems most likely, she's going to have to reach out to those votes, plus the youth who ironically share the concerns of the Old Left as much as they do with the New.

 

[BoyNextDoor]

Yep, he's only some 700 plus primary delegates behind now as we get ever closer to the end and the aheader he goes the behinder he gets.

I'll check the enthusiasm after the New York primary (which, no, I'm not calling).

Please do.

ETA: I'll look forward to your enthusiasm going into California.

 

[AlwaysHungry]

He even wants to tear down the progress that has been achieved (and isn't finished) in universal health care in favor of something he doesn't have a prayer of achieving. Most of the demographic I see supporting him just seems clueless on how work gets done--and could be done--at the federal level.

What a steaming pile of crap. The insistence on single-payer health care is, for me, the most attractive feature of Sanders' platform (I have my doubts about the rest of it). The so-called Affordable Care Act does not represent progress toward universal health care -- I mean, give me a break! It represents mandatory, universal Wall Street bailouts. Private insurers should be banned altogether from health care, because there is an inherent conflict of interest. They want to increase shareholder profits, and to do so, they simply withhold health care -- it's a simple equation. Obama has turned the entire national health care system in to one big, murderous HMO.

If you think that you have seen "work get done at the federal level", you are deluding yourself. The US has been sinking deeper and deeper into bankruptcy, and our role with respect to the rest of the world has become more and more parasitic.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Yep, he's only some 700 plus primary delegates behind now as we get ever closer to the end and the aheader he goes the behinder he gets.

I'll check the enthusiasm after the New York primary (which, no, I'm not calling).

No he's not...he's only 250 off and that gap closes tonight.

Hillary has the advantage of 469 super delegates that account for Goldman Sachs vote.

Which yes does equate to her being out front....but only by so much because of Wall St. Reality is she's not that far ahead and her major advantage has already been spent and Sanders has just started.

Largely blue states could EASILY close that 249 delegate gap, spotlighting just what a corrupt bunch of shit stains the DNC and Clinton really are, which is all he really needs to do to shit all over the future of the DNC.

 

[AlwaysHungry]

To put it mildly, the FDR/LBJ Democrats can either come home now with Bernie, or else they can be tossed aside again. If Hillary wins the nomination, as still seems most likely, she's going to have to reach out to those votes, plus the youth who ironically share the concerns of the Old Left as much as they do with the New.

She won't need to reach out to those votes. She'll simply use the same tactic as Obama: "Wouldn't you prefer your neo-con wars and Robin-Hood-in-reverse economic policies under a Democratic administration, with the cool symbolism of America's first woman president? Or would you rather have those same policies implemented by an icky Republican?"

 

[BotanyBoy]

Please do.

ETA: I'll look forward to your enthusiasm going into California.

Hillary better have a miracle down in Los Diego b/c she's not getting the bay area or the rest of the north state for that matter.

 

[sr71plt]

No he's not...he's only 250 off and that gap closes tonight.

Hillary has the advantage of 469 super delegates that account for Goldman Sachs vote.
.

What have you been smoking? Going into tonight Clinton had over 1,700 delegates and Sanders fewer than 1,100. Sanders won "big" tonight, and will pick up a net of what? Only about 15 delegates. This is the death by a thousand cuts.

This is what I find maddening. Fooling yourself like this. Nobody wins by doing a ridiculous job of their own assessments of possibilities. He could win, yes. It isn't going to happen with hairy fairy ridiculous claims on Internet porn discussion boards.

And if he does win, the progressive agenda gets flushed down the toilet. You can't possibly make an intelligent down-the-road assessment of possibilities/probabilities/realities? Have you been living in a cave for the last fifty years?

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

How precisely does it go "down the toilet?"

 

[AlwaysHungry]

And if he does win, the progressive agenda gets flushed down the toilet.

There is a progressive agenda? Maybe on paper.

 

[BotanyBoy]

What have you been smoking?

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/democratic_delegate_count.html

Clinton has 1274 delegates and 469 Super delegates.

Sanders has 1025 delegates and 31 Super delegates.

Clinton is not actually that far ahead as far as votes go, she just has the 1% backing her so she's currently got the majority of the Supers who clearly don't give a fuck about the voters.

If Sanders does anywhere near as well in CA/NY as he has in other deep blue states Hillary is going to need all the Wall St. Delegates she can get because she won't have the peoples vote, not even close.

Fooling yourself like this.

How am I fooling myself?

And if he does win, the progressive agenda gets flushed down the toilet.

No that would be the very start of a progressive agenda.

The only people fooling themselves around here are the ones who think Clinton, a Goldman Sachs employee, is a liberal progressive. Reality she's about as progressive as Romney was conservative, because they are both nothing more than mouthpieces for the 1% elitist class. Whispering sweet nothings in our ears while their campaign contributors fuck us for every dollar possible.

 

[sr71plt]

How precisely does it go "down the toilet?"

He cannot possibly push through his agenda. He couldn't even pay for it if he could get it passed. He is powerless in terms of national power. All of his stats are bad: old, Jewish (without much Jewish support going either way), far left socialist, tiny state, no party--he's only a Democrat by temporary convenience, zero foreign affairs knowledge/experience; all bluster and no cajoling ability on the underpinnings of the economy. And most of his supporters are pie-in-the sky clueless (mostly wet-behind-the-ears youngsters with no sense of reality) without a hint of the political maneuvering and arm twisting required to get anything done in Washington.

Back to delegate count as posted by CNN a few minutes ago: Clinton 1770, Sanders 1090.

 

[BotanyBoy]

He couldn't even pay for it if he could get it passed.

Bullshit...ACA is a scam and nationalized HC would be considerably cheaper.

Nationalized education? Also would cost nearly 1/2 the price the scam they are running now.

Ending the war on drugs? That's almost 80 billion saved federally and nearly 180 billion when you add state/local savings.

But big money doesn't want those gravy trains to end! VOTE CLINTON! Keep paying magnitudes more than everyone else for less!! Prison for profits!! YEAAA CLINTON!

Back to delegate count as posted by CNN a few minutes ago: Clinton 1770, Sanders 1090.

CNN wants to sink Sanders so bad. Clinton News Network.

LOL all he has to do is win the popular vote and it won't matter....DNC will be right where the Republicans are now.

 

[sr71plt]

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/democratic_delegate_count.html

Clinton has 1274 delegates and 469 Super delegates.

Sanders has 1025 delegates and 31 Super delegates.

Stop dreaming. As long as the primaries go along as they are, those super delegates aren't going to switch. They are party workers and they are sophisticated in how government works. Sanders has done nothing for the party (bogging down the primary campaign is hardly a plus in this regard). He has paid no dues to the Democratic Party. Until he decided to jump into the campaign, he wasn't even a Democrat. Again, if you think the party faithful holding the super delegate votes are going to switch to him just because this would make his stats look good to folks like you, you are, indeed, smoking something that's taken your ability to think away.

By the way, Sanders hasn't even won the total vote count in the Democratic primaries. Super delegates aside, Clinton is still winning the total vote by Democrats. Without any reference to delegates at all, she is 2.5 million individual votes in primaries and caucuses ahead of Sanders at this point.

 

[AlwaysHungry]

Sanders has done nothing for the party (bogging down the primary campaign is hardly a plus in this regard).

And the party oligarchy has done nothing for rank-and-file Democrats. Working people have been voting Republican for reasons that SEVERUSMAX partially analyzed in his earlier post. Even though Sanders is a cranky populist sloganeer, he actually seems to be interested in the problems that ordinary people face.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Stop dreaming. As long as the primaries go along as they are, those super delegates aren't going to switch. They are party workers

Oh I know...they are loyal to Wall St.

But the voter isn't.

Like I said, if Sanders does as well in CA/NY as he has in the other deeply blue states Clinton loses the popular vote by a good margin. If that very possible if not probable outcome occurs then those supers are had....do they tell big money to suck it and back the voters or do they totally and blatantly disenfranchise their voter base??? Rock and a hard spot I tell ya!

Should they chose to disenfranchise their voters they will all find themselves in the same boat as the GOP is now. Doing every thing they can to keep the voter from firing their bitch asses wholesale.

By the way, Sanders hasn't even won the total vote count in the Democratic primaries. Super delegates aside, Clinton is still winning the total vote by Democrats.

I didn't say he did.

I said she isn't all that far ahead and the biggest blue hitters have yet to come and so far he is CRUSHING Clinton in liberal states, suggesting he could easily close that vote gap by the time all the big blue states get done.

 

[sr71plt]

Oh, bullshit. The Republican Congress has cut off everything the Democrats have tried to do, and Obama was too wet behind the ears and too hopeful that "we can all get along" to do the dirty work to get the work done in the face of the Republican "just say no."

Look, I am capable of understanding that the bottom line here is that the job to be done is that of president--not of winning a nomination.

I think a whole bunch of you are clueless about what the bottom line is here.

 

[sr71plt]

Oh I know...they are loyal to Wall St.

Oh, bullshit. Stop that crap. I'm an Eleanor Roosevelt Democrat.

It's not my fault that you are politically stupid.

 

[Liar]

Votes doesn't count. Delegates do. If not, caucus states would be disenfranchised.

If Sanders can flip the race to a delegate lead sans supers, he has a case to make at the convention. What they need to ask themselves is, which candidate has the better shot at preventing the country from getting Trump'd? The one who wins Dem primaries in the South in states that will go red anyway, or the one that drives enthusiasm in the rust belt? If Sanders underperforms in places like PA and IN, he is toast, no matter what. We'll see.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Look, I am capable of understanding that the bottom line here is that the job to be done is that of president--not of winning a nomination.

I think a whole bunch of you are clueless about what the bottom line is here.

Gotta be able to do both.

I think you're the clueless one, look at you pushing that same ol' partisan buu shit backing up and parroting Clinton News Network spin.


The bottom line here is the voters are firing the GOP right now and if the DNC doesn't start listening to their voting base they will be next. Bobbing that 1% knob isn't going to help them.

 

[AlwaysHungry]

I think a whole bunch of you are clueless about what the bottom line is here.

I'm assuming that you mean the promo pix in your sig.

 

[JackLuis]

Winning Wisconsin won’t fix Bernie Sanders’ superdelegate problem

Bernie Sanders is on a roll.

He has won 6 of the last 7 Democratic nominating contests, including an impressive victory over Hillary Clinton in the Wisconsin primary on Tuesday. He outraised Clinton by US$15 million in March and trails her by only one percentage point in the most recent national poll of Democratic primary voters.

As the campaign heads into the home stretch, Sanders has more momentum than ever.

But despite his recent victories, he still faces one daunting and inescapable problem: the Democratic superdelegates overwhelmingly support Clinton. Sanders simply cannot win without them. Even if he keeps his winning streak going, he has no chance of securing the nomination without persuading the superdelegates to switch sides.

New York is crucial

So is there any hope for Sanders?

The answer is yes, if he can defeat Clinton by a big margin in her home state of New York on April 19.

The intense media coverage of the New York primary will give Sanders a unique opportunity to articulate the specific details of his domestic and foreign policies. Equally important, a victory in a state as diverse as New York would prove that he has appeal to minority voters. Most important of all, a Sanders’ victory in Clinton’s home state would undermine the notion that she is a stronger general election candidate.

If Sanders can achieve all of those goals in New York, he has a chance to start winning over the superdelegates who are so critical to his campaign. But it won’t happen if he loses on April 19.

The Sanders campaign will rise or fall in New York.