Crackdown on Porn

[Guest]

Hmm? just a simple thought....Maybe Janet flashed her tit to take the heat off of her Brother Jacko? Tit for Tat.

I know I shouldn't have laughed at that, but I did.

"Tit for Tat"

Lou

P.S. I'm outta here again...

 

[raphy]

I have to come to Raphy's defense on this. He's certainly not the only one who feels that way. I've heard the same things from friends, relatives, even my husband.

After all, most people feel that their vote makes absolutely no difference in the end, hence the huge campaigns underway every 4 years to get people to just vote. If there wasn't a general state of apathy, those campaigns wouldn't be needed.

I've got to say, I don't really blame him. People get so up in arms over the presendential thing - I've had people here on this forum call me names just for daring to disagree with them - and I guarantee you those same people will be up in arms again, against whoever is elected president, the next time elections roll around. You can't please everybody, and the more vocal shout down the ones that disagree with them respectfully. After awhile, you start to figure "what the hell" and just don't worry about it anymore.

I'm not saying its right, or that its wrong, just offering an explanation for why some people feel that way.

I've always respected your opinions, Dr. M, but just look at the way you answered Raphy. It wouldn't be conducive to keeping a discussion going with me, but then maybe he's a little thicker skinned than I am. Just because he thinks differently than you doesn't mean he's "joking."

Just my two cents - and you can start bashing me now, I guess.

Thanks Cloudy. I appreciate the support, but it's not really necessary. I'm not saying that I have far thicker skin than you, or anyone else on the AH, but it's hard to upset a person who doesn't give a shit

Dr M, Ken, you all are more than welcome to carry on your little crusades. I'm certainly not trying to change anyone's minds. I'm just pointing out that there are others who don't agree with you here and their opinions are no less valid than yours.

I didn't start this as an I'm right, you're wrong argument. If you want to turn it into that sort of thing, be warned - You'll lose, because you'll never convince me that I'm wrong. So don't even bother, guys, it's a waste of energy and effort on your part.

That said, I think getting riled up about political issues is a waste of energy and effort as well, so maybe you're the sort of folks who are into wasting energy and effort in hopeless causes. Ah well, some people have to have a cause to fight to give meaning ot their lives, I suppose.

As a semi-reply to you, Dr M - Hypothetical situation: We need a new head of the FBI. Previous outgoing head of the FBI says: Hire this man. No ifs, no buts, just do it. President hires him, but who made the actual decision?

And... Sorry Ken - Yes, the relevant of the two-terms of office thing had escaped me, being a transplanted Brit. Certainly doesn't change anything though.

Sorry guys. When those with power come to ME and say 'Dude, we'd like to hear your opinion on issue X,' then maybe I'll start believing, but only if I can see concrete proof that they actually wanted to know it and take it into consideration, even if they later reject it.

Until that day, I don't give a shit

 

[raphy]

You're joking. You really think an outgoing Democrat gets to pick his Republican successor and vice versa? That's just insane. That just doesn't happen. The President picks his cabinet who are approved by congress, and they appoint the people below them. Yes, they're very often political hacks, but the agenda is set at the top.

Oh, I forgot to reply to this. Um, you really think the people that tell the President what he's allowed to say are affiliated with any particular politcal party?

Personally, I don't think they are. They're pro-themselves, and pro-american, probably in that order.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Gore???? Obviously you've never lived in Tennessee.

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you on Bush. I'm more of the "Raphy" philosophy personally, but, c'mon.....Gore?

People from Tennessee consider him a joke - doesn't that tell you something?

You want Gore? Fine - I don't suppose you realize that his wife, Tipper (sounds sorta like "Biff" and "Muffy" doesn't it?) was heading up the campaign in Tennessee while he was in office there, to censor cd lyrics and choose which books were "proper" for people to read?

To echo cloudy, and touch on something said earlier, the person of the candidate does make a difference. Al Gore had a pullman car full of steamer trunks as baggage and he lost the election because no one in the millde of the country wanted more of what he was selling. He was Clinton light, all the baggae and 2/3rds less charisma.

While Gore was forced upon the party, as sitting Vp to an outgoing president, they inflicted Kerry upon themselves. His appeal is, IMHO, limited to only those places where they are going to win anyway, the highly industrialized NE old NW and west coast. You can almost win enough electoral votes carrying that, but not quite. What appeal does he have to southerners? Midwesterners? Anyone not living in a big city? Practically none.

A charismatic man, preferably one who is from the SE or Mid West and is very popular in his home state would have made infintely more sense than a man from the NE who has Kerry's baggage.

Speculation on what Gore would ahve done or wouldn't have done is prety pointless. He lost and thus never had the chance. The bigger issue is, if electability was such a key issue to Democratic caucus & primary voters, what did they see in Kerry that made them think he will get independents or crossover from the GOP?

I think their hope is Anyone but Bush is appeal enough. I wonder if they realize when it's anyone but bush, they get great support, when you plug a real man into that anyone spot, that's a horse of a different color.

-Colly

 

[cloudy]

Dr M, Ken, you all are more than welcome to carry on your little crusades. I'm certainly not trying to change anyone's minds. I'm just pointing out that there are others who don't agree with you here and their opinions are no less valid than yours.

Exactly the point I was trying to make. Thanks, Raphy.

 

[RenzaJones]

re: crackdown on porn

The freewheeling "Oral Office" Clinton years came to an abrupt halt when Bush took over. Suddenly, abstinence became the White House mantra, and men whose religiosity seemed to preclude doing the nasty occupied the highest offices in the land.

I'm sure there's going to be more measures taken to "weed out the evil" and so on. Janet was a fool to pull the nipple gate stunt not because the sight of her breast was deplorable but because she made herself into the scapegoat. This is after all the same administration that supported ashcroft in his quest to cover the breasts of the spirit of justice statue because apparently he couldn't handle the sight of her marble tits. (I'll bet he's got a filthy filthy mind.)

 

[KenJames]

I have to come to Raphy's defense on this. He's certainly not the only one who feels that way. I've heard the same things from friends, relatives, even my husband.

After all, most people feel that their vote makes absolutely no difference in the end, hence the huge campaigns underway every 4 years to get people to just vote. If there wasn't a general state of apathy, those campaigns wouldn't be needed.

It's true that most people are passive and just let life roll all over them. This doesn't strike me as a good thing.

There are two reasons why the United States doesn't have a viable third party. First, the Republicans and Democrats have stacked the deck against a third party. Second, most people are too passive or have just plain surrendered to the illusion of hopelessness. They're getting the government they deserve, but I hate them dragging me down, too.

I've always respected your opinions, Dr. M, but just look at the way you answered Raphy. It wouldn't be conducive to keeping a discussion going with me, but then maybe he's a little thicker skinned than I am. Just because he thinks differently than you doesn't mean he's "joking."

Just my two cents - and you can start bashing me now, I guess.

To me, "You must be joking" is a pretty mild way of expressing the belief that a statement is absurd. And with all due respect to Raphy, the idea that Bill Clinton's puppet masters chose George Bush's puppet masters is pretty silly.

This is the Literotica Author's Hangout, not some maiden aunt's tea party. I don't care for the occasional "shouting down" either, but people do have strong opinions here and sometimes express them forcefully. As Bucky said, "If you can't stand the heat, stay off the car hood."

 

[raphy]

And with all due respect to Raphy, the idea that Bill Clinton's puppet masters chose George Bush's puppet masters is pretty silly.

In your opinion *grin*

I don't sweat much in the heat, Ken - But I'm sure you've figured that out now

I just love people on soap boxes, that's all

 

[Colleen Thomas]

re: crackdown on porn

The freewheeling "Oral Office" Clinton years came to an abrupt halt when Bush took over. Suddenly, abstinence became the White House mantra, and men whose religiosity seemed to preclude doing the nasty occupied the highest offices in the land.

I'm sure there's going to be more measures taken to "weed out the evil" and so on. Janet was a fool to pull the nipple gate stunt not because the sight of her breast was deplorable but because she made herself into the scapegoat. This is after all the same administration that supported ashcroft in his quest to cover the breasts of the spirit of justice statue because apparently he couldn't handle the sight of her marble tits. (I'll bet he's got a filthy filthy mind.)

I think Mrs. J you give him far too much credit. To have a filthy mind presupposes he has a mind. I have yet to see an evidence of intelligent life there.

-Colly

 

[cloudy]

IThis is the Literotica Author's Hangout, not some maiden aunt's tea party. I don't care for the occasional "shouting down" either, but people do have strong opinions here and sometimes express them forcefully. As Bucky said, "If you can't stand the heat, stay off the car hood."

Thanks for being gentle with me, Ken, but I'm a big girl.

And no, I don't like people not respecting others opinions. Its just plain rude.

 

[RenzaJones]

I think Mrs. J you give him far too much credit. To have a filthy mind presupposes he has a mind. I have yet to see an evidence of intelligent life there.

-Colly

oh I din't know we were talking about intelligent life lol forgive me. Oh well make war not love isn't that the motto

 

[KenJames]

In your opinion *grin*

I don't sweat much in the heat, Ken - But I'm sure you've figured that out now

I just love people on soap boxes, that's all

If you don't give a shit, why do you bother posting?

Oh! You just like heckling. Got it!

 

[Colleen Thomas]

oh I din't know we were talking about intelligent life lol forgive me. Oh well make war not love isn't that the motto

Well, assuming you are around anyone who is thinking of making war more thn making love needs to be fitted for one of those lively white jackets with all the neato straps & escorted to the padded room.

-Colly

 

[raphy]

If you don't give a shit, why do you bother posting?

Oh! You just like heckling. Got it!

*points to his post above about liking people who have soap boxes*

 

[RenzaJones]

*points to his post above about liking people who have soap boxes*

lol Raph I like soapboxes to and flim flam. (did you bring the popcorn.) This could get interesting.

 

[raphy]

lol Raph I like soapboxes to and flim flam. (did you bring the popcorn.) This could get interesting.

I don't think it's likely to get much more interesting, Mrs J. They stood up on their soap boxes. I heckled from the peanut gallery. I think we're probably done

 

[RenzaJones]

I don't think it's likely to get much more interesting, Mrs J. They stood up on their soap boxes. I heckled from the peanut gallery. I think we're probably done

lol I'm surprised you understood my interesting comment what with my tongue wedged so firmly in my cheek and all

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Raphy—and anyone—is entitled to think what he wants and do what he wants regarding voting. But don’t come telling me that it deosn’t matter who’s in the White House. Maybe it doesn’t matter to you, but it matters. Maybe you don’t care what they do in your name, but they are doing things in your name. Your silence helps get them elected, and they count on your apathy. So even if you don’t vote, you vote.

In years past I would agree that there wasn't much difference between the parties, but this year it’s different. This will be a watershed election: a referendum on the entire war on terror and on Bush’s values, on the enviroment and social policy and a host of other issues. It’ll be a referendum on what sort of country we want it to be. You may be content with telling them, “Basically, I don’t give a fuck.” I would hope, though, that most people will choose to send a different message.

---dr.M.

 

[rgraham666]

In my opnion, the point of the vote is not to change things, but to participate.

Democracy is founded on our participation. We look at the issues, decide on our priorities and vote for the people and/or party we think best represents our views.

If we don't participate, we don't have a democracy.

I've probably voted in somewhere near sixty elections. Only twice have I voted for a person or party that won. And one of those times was a severe disappounment.

Has that stopped me from voting? No. The point of a vote is not to win, but to play.

 

[Guest]

... even if you don’t vote, you vote.

You may be content with telling them, “Basically, I don’t give a fuck.” I would hope, though, that most people will choose to send a different message.

Thanks for the whole message, Mab.

I don't see any soap boxes, maybe some peanuts.

Perdita

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Despite all the controversy. I do love the fact that I live in a country where I have the right to vote.
Maybe Democracy doesn't always seem to work, but it's better than the alternatives.

I can speak freely on this forum and not have to worry about someone knocking down my door and sweeping me away to unknown destinations.
I do not have to cover my face when I go outside my home.
I can choose to ignore things I don't like or voice my opinion on them freely.

I can appreciate the above authors opinions and be grateful that they can have a place to share them.

~A~

 

[neonlyte]

Completely correct ABSTRUSE, not voting, in my book, means you have no right to complain when things are not as you want them.

Of course politicians have an agenda, if you don't like it, vote it out. This is easier to do in some countries than others - the recent example of Spain comes to mind.

Where interest groups and business fund the media saturation that politicians need to spread their message, it may be a slower process to shift the direction. Keep pushing away.

I'm with Dr. M regarding the importance of the next US election, though have no way to participate. It might well be a 'watershed election' with implications not just for the US but the wider world, I will be wildly pissed if just 24% of the electorate extend the franchise for an American President.

When 51% of the electorate make the decision, we can have no arguement, in a democratic system.

You should know, the voting is barely higher over here. Politicians or electorate? Who knows. I fear the wake up call around the corner. The alarm has barely begun to ring.

NL

 

[raphy]

Completely correct ABSTRUSE, not voting, in my book, means you have no right to complain when things are not as you want them.

I've never complained about the decisions made by the people who run the country.

 

[raphy]

Thanks for the whole message, Mab.

I don't see any soap boxes, maybe some peanuts.

Then maybe you're not looking hard enough. Lots of soap boxes around here, trust me. And lots of people who take themselves (and the world) way, way too seriously.

 

[Guest]

Completely correct ABSTRUSE, not voting, in my book, means you have no right to complain when things are not as you want them.

...

NL

That's exactly my take on the issue, Neon.

It is (usually, aside from referendums) the only concrete say we have in who runs our countries.

Voter apathy is a sad thing. We are lucky enough to live in a democracy, lucky enough to be able to cast that, sometimes crucial, vote.

We might not particularly like any of the political parties, and agree 100% with their policies, but choosing who to vote for is a bit like choosing which new car to buy. The perfect one might not be out there, to suit our needs in every way, but we choose the closest one to our own personal specifications.

And, it must never be forgotten, how many people have laid themselves on the line and even sacrificed their own lives, to give us, fortunate enough to live in a Democracy, that right to vote.

Voting, for me, is a very sombre and humbling task, and I have never once failed to cast my vote.

Coincidentally, it's now exactly ten years since the end of apartheid in South Africa. Remember the joy in that country when the whole population was finally given the right to vote?

In my opinion, if you do not vote you are opting yourself out of any say and any valid opinion in how your particular country is run.

Lou