Internet -- wlod, 2002-02-07

[Senna Jawa]

internet -- wlod, 2002-02-07

Recently, somehow prompted by "Lit blog", I have translated and posted there my "Internet". A few days later BooMerengue polished my English ( ). I am incorporating her suggestions completely in stanzas 2 and 3, while for the moment the more complex stanza 1 remains intact, waiting for further dwelling upon (comments, suggestions, etc). Thank you, Boo!


***



internet

the from a trance pouring
lava stream of poems
about mary jane
ended in a statement
by the author's boyfriend
about her suicide

many forum participants
expressed their sadness
some asking about her city
and a newspaper notice and
the boy announced that he too
is about to end his life

the account was blocked even before
the guild of insane poets
stopped functioning
gone were the children crying
advice consolations cheering up and laughing
gone without a trace
the poetry about mary jane
​

wh,
2002-02-07






*************

Enjoy,

Senna Jawa
​

 

[BooMerengue]

For what little I did, Senna, you are very welcome. I still think that the 1st stanza- 1st 2 lines, needs something. I understand what you said about it, but it still feels a bit awkward.

 

[champagne1982]

the from a trance pouring
lava stream of poems
about mary jane
ended in a statement
by the author's boyfriend
about her suicide

A quick over-all impression of this stanza is one of native american shamans, amidst pungent smoke, drawing sand paintings on the smooth floor of a sacred cave.

Line-by-line:

the from a trance pouring

If you prefer keeping a gerund here, perhaps you could denote it through hyphenating the phrase from-the-trance-pouring or if the image is correct, you could always arrange the wording to eliminate the passive and bring the idea into the active tense​

lava stream of poems

The artists would employ ground minerals or stained powders to colour their paintings such as yellow ochre or the red of iron ore, instead of lava maybe one of these.​

about mary jane

Without the name being capitalized, I don't see an individual, I see slang for marijuana, thus the pungent smoke which brought on the earlier trance.​

ended in a statement

Would punctuated work as well as ended? To keep with the first thought of shamans I'd toss in with the drumbeat wail, but that's only if my first impression were correct.​

by the author's boyfriend

Unless the sex of the "author" is important why would you need to use boyfriend? Couldn't you simplify the whole idea of death, suicide and the obituary here by cutting and pruning this and the last​

about her suicide

into one line? I submit, of the suicide's surviving friends.​

Of course, I could be completely off the wall, nevertheless, these are my thoughts as I bounced them at it.

 

[champagne1982]

I'd have thought I could have gleaned at least a "piss off, you're wrong" comment from my suggestions. Live and learn.

 

[Senna Jawa]

I'd have thought I could have gleaned at least a "piss off, you're wrong" comment from my suggestions. Live and learn.

I am so sorry, champagne. Somehow I missed your comment till now. I am glad, that at least now I ran into it. I decided to glance one more time at the forum before I leave for an indefinite time. Let me read carefully what you have written and I will respond to your comment before I leave.

Once again, I apologize for missing your post,

best regards,

Senna Jawa​

 

[champagne1982]

I am so sorry, champagne. Somehow I missed your comment till now. I am glad, that at least now I ran into it. I decided to glance one more time at the forum before I leave for an indefinite time. Let me read carefully what you have written and I will respond to your comment before I leave.

Once again, I apologize for missing your post,

best regards,

Senna Jawa​

Thank you for your gracious reply. I wait, now, for your commentary.

 

[Senna Jawa]

Whoever reads this post, please, do yourself a favor and read the whole poem first, like you never saw any discussion of it. Be a straight reader before getting into a critic mode. Let me present it below again for your convenience.




internet

the from a trance pouring
lava stream of poems
about mary jane
ended in a statement
by the author's boyfriend
about her suicide

many forum participants
expressed their sadness
some asking about her city
and a newspaper notice and
the boy announced that he too
is about to end his life

the account was blocked even before
the guild of insane poets
stopped functioning
gone were the children crying
advice consolations cheering up and laughing
gone without a trace
the poetry about mary jane
​

wh,
2002-02-07



***************************************


With the exception of the hard to scan beginning, the poem is written in a simple language, while its texture is rich. This poem is a witness of its time.

Let me respond to the champagne comments.

A quick over-all impression of this stanza is one of native american shamans, amidst pungent smoke, drawing sand paintings on the smooth floor of a sacred cave.

Wonderful!

Line-by-line:

the from a trance pouring

If you prefer keeping a gerund here, perhaps you could denote it through hyphenating the phrase from-the-trance-pouring​

The first 2-3 lines (are supposed to) induce the reader her/himself into a state of hypnotic trance. Your reaction seems to indicate that that's what has happened in your case. Hyphenation would destroy some of this effect (the reader would be given things on the plate). What is equally or more important, these lines don't scan uniquely, which adds to the unreal effect of feeling lost. There is entropy in these lines (I mentioned entropy on the occasion of commenting on Anna's poem in the "Poetry Circle"). Hyphenation would remove the entropy which is so crucial here for the poetic effect.

The idea is to use the structure of the text to play on reader, to actually do something to the reader, to affect the reader not just abstractly, by the meaning of the text, but to affect the reader more materially, literally, to a much greater degree than it is done commonly. (In some poems I did it even more physically. But all such artistic means have to be discrete, natural, not in your face).

(In my original Polish version of "internet" there was no language problem; somehow I got the trance effect without any grammatical obstacles).

Perhaps these lines are not correct English wise, but if they are correct and only hard to scan, if this is their only problem, then it's not a problem but a big advantage in this specific case.

or if the image is correct,

Your image, as an association, is correct of course. It is not an interpretation though. Look at your av. When one looks at the top and the center of it, one may see two swans. But it will be only an association and not an interpretation. This is because such a view doesn't explain the total. The total tells me that I see two elephants rather than two swans. The bottom of the picture contradicts the idea of two swans. And in the case of my poem the title reads "internet". The whole poem, and even the first stanza alone already contradicts the idea that the poem is about the native american shamans.

The associations are very important. When they their mood and texture harmonize with the poem they contribute to the poetic power. And when the reasonable, truly induced by the text associations are awkward, clumsy, make no sense, then it means that the poem is weak. In the given case I was very happy about your association. But it shouldn't be treated just as an association.

you could always arrange the wording to eliminate the passive and bring the idea into the active tense.

This is a standard, routine advice. It doesn't apply here. The passive verb "pouring" does not play the role of a verb in the given context. Functionally "pouring" is a part of an adjective (of a description of a noun); it is not a part of the action ("ended" is nthe action, abstract as it sounds). Also, despite the formally (gramatically) passive form the phrase actually is dynamic both due to the image and to its mountain-creek-after-a-spring-rain like flow (you see, here I hyphenate but in a poem I wouldn't, I would avoid any eyesore; well, you never know, each case is individual--see monk).

lava stream of poems

The artists would employ ground minerals or stained powders to colour their paintings such as yellow ochre or the red of iron ore, instead of lava maybe one of these.​

It may be tempting to add extra goodies but a mature texts avoid such temptations. This poem has a clear 3-part composition. The dynamic intro, almost violent in its flow. Then a quiet, mundane description of the scene follows. It ends abruptly in the third part with its nostalgic accent at the end. To add more colors etc would disrupt the pure composition of the poem.

about mary jane

Without the name being capitalized, I don't see an individual, I see slang for marijuana, thus the pungent smoke which brought on the earlier trance.​

It is possible to read and interpret "mary jane" as someone's name. It would be only a secondary interpretation though. It only enriches the poem, adds to its composition, to the balance (male versus female). The primary interpretation is that "mary jane" stands for marihuana. It is the primary interpretation because it gives the poem justice.

It's a pity that these days the readers and the authors do not treat the text of the poem seriously. They often consider pseudo-interpretations, which hardly make sense, which hardly connect to the text in any consistent manner. Many poems simply are so bad that they do not admit any true interpretation (despite being meant to be meaningful). Instead, the author's intention or preaching or whatever is treated as the interpretation. There are also a few ad hoc metaphors inserted into such texts, and they do not connect, they do not form any composition. On the other hand, it is great when there is more than one interpretation, and when they harmonize in one of many possible ways--they can either quietly complement each other or they may even contrast/contradict one another, as long as the effect is artistic; I can't develope this theme here further).

I have to run now! I'll continue later.​

 

[CharleyH]

Recently, somehow prompted by "Lit blog", I have translated and posted there my "Internet". A few days later BooMerengue polished my English ( ). I am incorporating her suggestions completely in stanzas 2 and 3, while for the moment the more complex stanza 1 remains intact, waiting for further dwelling upon (comments, suggestions, etc). Thank you, Boo!


***



internet

the from a trance pouring
lava stream of poems
about mary jane
ended in a statement
by the author's boyfriend
about her suicide

many forum participants
expressed their sadness
some asking about her city
and a newspaper notice and
the boy announced that he too
is about to end his life

the account was blocked even before
the guild of insane poets
stopped functioning
gone were the children crying
advice consolations cheering up and laughing
gone without a trace
the poetry about mary jane
​

wh,
2002-02-07






*************

Enjoy,

Senna Jawa
​

The title is internet and I will start there. Small ‘i’ in the title and no capitals in the whole poem means to me that the author finds no significance in the topic at hand, or anything worth emphasising. It reminds me of ee cummings and in that respect, it reminds me of the absurdists and miscommunication.

The medium perhaps, is not the method, nor the madness - at least that is my first reading impression.

Reading the poem as a whole a second time, I have problems with the meaning and metaphor and that’s my best strength. I immediately think of pot – mary jane – an illusion – you use it twice and so it has significance and in the context of the title, I need to assume the poem itself is somewhat of an illusion and so is the author. Words like trance and insane guide me toward emphasizing that thought, yet it does not seem a strong enough point, especially considering small caps and the title.

The poem as a whole does not speak to what I think it guides me toward and that is illusion in some form after all the poetry of mary jane would be one of illusion and no comfort, gone without a trace, as soon as one is not high ….

'who cares' is perhaps a better title, but the poem does not fly with me completly on an intellectual or semiotic plane - if written by you or not - there are some great lines though.

"lava stream of poems
about mary jane"

Is my favourite and so gorgeous!

CH

 

[CharleyH]

Whoever reads this post, please, do yourself a favor and read the whole poem first, like you never saw any discussion of it. Be a straight reader before getting into a critic mode. Let me present it below again for your convenience.

God you are a drag queen!

I have to run now! I'll continue later.

Hmm. (not to running, just to the rest of the post). Why did you suddenly feel the need to "explain the poem"?