It's the Poem-A-Week Challenge Discussion Thread

[liChat]

I imagine you fuck up and write a poem. Lit”s tiniest troll.

???

 

[SapioSexual9]

Lol what comes next? 42 will ignore it it will pull the preDictable move (look ??? it wriggles it squirms so entertaining)

 

[SapioSexual9]

It will copy

 

[Angeline]

Currently I am working on a free verse based on in 1950s Paris, a homage to Hemingway's A Movable Feast. What is the most romantic song in french? I want to include some lyrics for my main character development. She is a torch singer. TIA

I've been thinking about this. Obviously Édith Piaf is renowned as a torch singer and her songs would be a great source of material. When I was a teenager in between bouts of Beatlemania my BFF and I would swoon over Charles Aznavour. He's also a good resource for French torch songs. And if you just want a film to soak up Paris ambiance I'd recommend Paris Blues. It's a bit later timewise (released in1961), but it was filmed on location and really gives a sense of city life and nightclub society. It's streaming on Tubi for free.

Hope these help!

 

[liChat]

@Angeline, thank you for Charles Aznavour and "Une enfant".

Aznavour was professionally singing for more than seventy years (will I sing like this in 70 years?).

Ok, sure:

 

[SapioSexual9]

42! How do you click from Blues to Rust In Peace?

Sour man Whisk’y n’ rain

Mamma don’t tell me I don’t work no how
What I gotta do for love
Mamma don’t tell me I don’t work some how
What I gotta do for love

More n’ years I been liv’n at midnight now
drink’n down, stay’n down under this no how sun.
Should never have done dollar married that woman
But she do for love

Should never done laced my boots up now
With that garden snake, a dollar an hour
Now my love I’ve been
renting n’ a blue house

Anyhow my paper owed to th’ reaper now
I gotta pay I gotta pay
Anyway my paper paid to the reaper now
But I do for— I did it for—
more love’n


Rust In Peace.

Brother,
I see your bike
on the fast side
of the river

and wonder why
you had so much
water and
nothing to drink

Now I hear your
Motorcycle near
and beyond me
up ahead knowing

There wasn’t any moss
in the rapids where
sieved through the
river you

became my hands cupped
holding you but you were
already flowing away to
the other side of the river.

 

[42BelowsBack]

42! How do you click from Blues to Rust In Peace?

Sour man Whisk’y n’ rain

Mamma don’t tell me I don’t work no how
What I gotta do for love
Mamma don’t tell me I don’t work some how
What I gotta do for love

More n’ years I been liv’n at midnight now
drink’n down, stay’n down under this no how sun.
Should never have done dollar married that woman
But she do for love

Should never done laced my boots up now
With that garden snake, a dollar an hour
Now my love I’ve been
renting n’ a blue house

Anyhow my paper owed to th’ reaper now
I gotta pay I gotta pay
Anyway my paper paid to the reaper now
But I do for— I did it for—
more love’n


Rust In Peace.

Brother,
I see your bike
on the fast side
of the river

and wonder why
you had so much
water and
nothing to drink

Now I hear your
Motorcycle near
and beyond me
up ahead knowing

There wasn’t any moss
in the rapids where
sieved through the
river you

became my hands cupped
holding you but you were
already flowing away to
the other side of the river.

Hey @sapio, what would you write about if you didn’t write about sex? I appreciate that you don’t write cyber, but in answer to your question, if you didn’t write about sex what would you write about?

 

[SapioSexual9]

Hey @sapio, what would you write about if you didn’t write about sex? I appreciate that you don’t write cyber, but in answer to your question, what would you write about if you didn’t write about sex?.

Being thirsty

 

[SmilingLez]

Should we have a separate Valentine's Day 2026 poetry thread or just include them in the weekly thread?

 

[Angeline]

Should we have a separate Valentine's Day 2026 poetry thread or just include them in the weekly thread?

Good question. I've been so wrapped up with my jazz poems I hadn't realized we're so close to V-Day! If you want to start a thread go for it. I'm sure it'll get some interest and folks can always put their Valentine poems in the week thread too if they want.

 

[12oclocktales]

Good question. I've been so wrapped up with my jazz poems I hadn't realized we're so close to V-Day! If you want to start a thread go for it. I'm sure it'll get some interest and folks can always put their Valentine poems in the week thread too if they want.

Yes. Busy week coming up: I’ve got 3 poems honoring 3 events in the next 7 days ready to post.

 

[SapioSexual9]

This has got my knees glued together. A scary good poem. Why I won’t read ‘the’ book. I wonder if this is why the Romans feed them to the Elephants? My Bad Bunny poem will have to wait. Shivers.

 

[12oclocktales]

I was looking for a poem the other day, one by Mark Strand, and couldn’t find my copy of his Selected Poems, which pissed me off, but remembered the poem I was looking for was also in an anthology, though which one I couldn’t remember, which also pissed me off. But this soggy feeling evaporated quickly as I started pulling several anthologies off the shelf, which was great fun. Not the pulling so much, but flipping through them finding old favorite poems left and right. (Notice I didn’t immediately start looking for the poem online, which says a lot about me. Mainly that I’m ancient.) It turned out the Strand poem wasn’t in the anthology I thought it might be, which is called Staying Alive, edited by Neil Astley (2002), my favorite of the bunch. It was actually in something called A Geography of Poets, edited by Edward Field (1979), an old fat Bantam paperback, of all things. I know online searching is the way to go now, but does anybody have a favorite book-published anthology (maybe several) you’d find difficult parting with? Curious what they might be.

 

[Angeline]

I was looking for a poem the other day, one by Mark Strand, and couldn’t find my copy of his Selected Poems, which pissed me off, but remembered the poem I was looking for was also in an anthology, though which one I couldn’t remember, which also pissed me off. But this soggy feeling evaporated quickly as I started pulling several anthologies off the shelf, which was great fun. Not the pulling so much, but flipping through them finding old favorite poems left and right. (Notice I didn’t immediately start looking for the poem online, which says a lot about me. Mainly that I’m ancient.) It turned out the Strand poem wasn’t in the anthology I thought it might be, which is called Staying Alive, edited by Neil Astley (2002), my favorite of the bunch. It was actually in something called A Geography of Poets, edited by Edward Field (1979), an old fat Bantam paperback, of all things. I know online searching is the way to go now, but does anybody have a favorite book-published anthology (maybe several) you’d find difficult parting with? Curious what they might be.

For me definitely The Young American Poets, edited by Paul Carroll and published in 1968. It has been out of print forever though used copies can be found occasionally. It has about 300 poems from emerging (at that time) poets and where I discovered Ted Berrigan, Saint Geraud (aka Bill Knott), Ron Padgett and many others whose poems I still read and treasure.

 

[Tzara]

I was looking for a poem the other day, one by Mark Strand, and couldn’t find my copy of his Selected Poems, which pissed me off, but remembered the poem I was looking for was also in an anthology, though which one I couldn’t remember, which also pissed me off. But this soggy feeling evaporated quickly as I started pulling several anthologies off the shelf, which was great fun. Not the pulling so much, but flipping through them finding old favorite poems left and right. (Notice I didn’t immediately start looking for the poem online, which says a lot about me. Mainly that I’m ancient.) It turned out the Strand poem wasn’t in the anthology I thought it might be, which is called Staying Alive, edited by Neil Astley (2002), my favorite of the bunch. It was actually in something called A Geography of Poets, edited by Edward Field (1979), an old fat Bantam paperback, of all things. I know online searching is the way to go now, but does anybody have a favorite book-published anthology (maybe several) you’d find difficult parting with? Curious what they might be.

I have several. Like Angie, one of my favorites is an early (1972) anthology of (then) young writers, In Youth, ed. by Richard Kostelanetz. Some of the poets it features are Margaret Atwood, Saint Geraud/Bill Knott, and James Tate, though I'd have to admit that I really appreciate it mainly for the fiction writers.

For anthologies more focused on poetry, there are some featuring certain forms or themes that I especially like: The Incredible Sestina Anthology, ed. by Daniel Nester, The Paradelle, ed. by Theresa M. Welford, and The Best American Erotic Poems: From 1800 to the Present, ed. by David Lehman. There are also various textbooks I keep around that are either anthologies of poetry or instructional books that include a lot of poems. An Exaltation of Forms: Contemporary Poets Celebrate the Diversity of Their Art, ed. by Annie Finch and Kathrine Varnes is especially useful as it consists of brief essays on various forms (including such interesting ones as Quantitative Meter and Oulipian Poetry) along with examples from various authors.

 

[SapioSexual9]

Shiver me with kisses. Make me want more. More.

MORE MORE This is so damn SEXY

 

[Angeline]

MORE MORE This is so damn SEXY

Thanks! I think it's an ahem less is more kinda poem.

 

[Tzara]

The triolet is both a fairly easy form to write and at the same time a difficult form to write well. These conflicting judgments are, at least in part, both due to the same characteristic—the repetition intrinsic to the form. On the one hand, a triolet is an eight-line poem with only five different lines (the first line is reused as both the fourth and seventh line, and the second line is reused as the last/eighth line). Pretty simple, eh?

The problem with the repetition is to keep it interesting. Merely repeating lines is easy, but unless the repetition figures somehow into the meaning of the poem, or can be varied by the context in which the repeated lines appear (Thomas Hardy is particularly good at this), it has a tendency to be boring. One way to try and deal with the problem is to slightly vary the repeated lines, which strictly speaking is a violation of the form but mucking with form rules is a feature of much modern form poetry.

Besides the line repetitions, there is the limited rhyme scheme; a triolet traditionally rhymes ABaAabAB, where the capital letters are the repeated lines (and, of course, there are all the repeated rhyme words). So, again—not much variation, either in actual rhyme word or sound.

Metrically, there is some room for variation. As a French form, it is traditionally octosyllabic, i.e. eight syllables per line without regard to stress pattern (French forms are syllabic rather than based on metrical feet as is typical in English language poems). English language triolets are often iambic (tetrameter, most frequently), but irregular line lengths are not uncommon.

All of this is a kind of lengthy preface to talking about this poem by 12oclocktales, which is a triolet that succeeds pretty well as an example of the form, especially so in how it employs meter.

While basically iambic tetrameter, the poem somewhat unusually employs feminine endings to all of the lines (i.e., they all end on an unstressed syllable that is part of a two syllable rhyme like bower/flower). This changes the sound of the poem to, at least in my opinion, make it less sing-songy that the usual straightforward (masculine rhymed) tetrameter. In addition, the poet uses metrical substitutions (anapests at the third foot of several lines, a trochee at position two in line seven) that varies the rhythm of the poem:

I kissed / you once / be·neath / the bow·er,
Our bod / ies close, / in fact, / hard pres·sing,
Your lips / as fresh / as a dew- / splashed flow·er.
I kissed / you once / be·neath / the bow·er,
My mem / ber ris /ing, a Nor / man tow·er,
You smiled / coy·ly / and be·gan / un·dres·sing.
Oh, how / I kissed / you be·neath / the bow·er,
Our bod / ies close, / in·deed / hard pres·sing!​

All of this gives the poem a quite different, more natural feel than the usual motoric iambic meter. This also helps solve the repetition problem as line seven not only slightly varies the wording of the repeated line, it also slightly changes the sound of it with the anapestic substitution.

One last comment: While the poem is thematically straightforward, even a touch ornate, the poet includes the (appropriately courtly, though funny) metaphor "My member rising, a Norman tower". I'd certainly never thought of male arousal quite that way before. It seems kinda, um, noble or something.

Well done.

 

[12oclocktales]

Tzara, thank you for the close analysis. I decided to try my hand at a triolet while in the middle of putting together a limerick sequence, thus the sing-song pattern which was stuck in my head. I wrote a second triolet, which also has several iambic tetrameter lines, though a few others are not and sound rather jagged to my ears. I need to sit on that one yet before posting it. The limericks I’ll probably begin posting next month, 3-4 at a time. Thanks again.

 

[calmlikeabomb]

The triolet is both a fairly easy form to write and at the same time a difficult form to write well. These conflicting judgments are, at least in part, both due to the same characteristic—the repetition intrinsic to the form. On the one hand, a triolet is an eight-line poem with only five different lines (the first line is reused as both the fourth and seventh line, and the second line is reused as the last/eighth line). Pretty simple, eh?

The problem with the repetition is to keep it interesting. Merely repeating lines is easy, but unless the repetition figures somehow into the meaning of the poem, or can be varied by the context in which the repeated lines appear (Thomas Hardy is particularly good at this), it has a tendency to be boring. One way to try and deal with the problem is to slightly vary the repeated lines, which strictly speaking is a violation of the form but mucking with form rules is a feature of much modern form poetry.

Besides the line repetitions, there is the limited rhyme scheme; a triolet traditionally rhymes ABaAabAB, where the capital letters are the repeated lines (and, of course, there are all the repeated rhyme words). So, again—not much variation, either in actual rhyme word or sound.

Metrically, there is some room for variation. As a French form, it is traditionally octosyllabic, i.e. eight syllables per line without regard to stress pattern (French forms are syllabic rather than based on metrical feet as is typical in English language poems). English language triolets are often iambic (tetrameter, most frequently), but irregular line lengths are not uncommon.

All of this is a kind of lengthy preface to talking about this poem by 12oclocktales, which is a triolet that succeeds pretty well as an example of the form, especially so in how it employs meter.

While basically iambic tetrameter, the poem somewhat unusually employs feminine endings to all of the lines (i.e., they all end on an unstressed syllable that is part of a two syllable rhyme like bower/flower). This changes the sound of the poem to, at least in my opinion, make it less sing-songy that the usual straightforward (masculine rhymed) tetrameter. In addition, the poet uses metrical substitutions (anapests at the third foot of several lines, a trochee at position two in line seven) that varies the rhythm of the poem:

​

I kissed / you once / be·neath / the bow·er,​

Our bod / ies close, / in fact, / hard pres·sing,​

Your lips / as fresh / as a dew- / splashed flow·er.​

I kissed / you once / be·neath / the bow·er,​

My mem / ber ris /ing, a Nor / man tow·er,​

You smiled / coy·ly / and be·gan / un·dres·sing.​

Oh, how / I kissed / you be·neath / the bow·er,​

Our bod / ies close, / in·deed / hard pres·sing!​

All of this gives the poem a quite different, more natural feel than the usual motoric iambic meter. This also helps solve the repetition problem as line seven not only slightly varies the wording of the repeated line, it also slightly changes the sound of it with the anapestic substitution.

One last comment: While the poem is thematically straightforward, even a touch ornate, the poet includes the (appropriately courtly, though funny) metaphor "My member rising, a Norman tower". I'd certainly never thought of male arousal quite that way before. It seems kinda, um, noble or something.

Well done.

One day, I too hope to recieve the @Tzara bump. Till then, I'll keep posting and tryng to improve.

 

[Wonderer67]

Anyone ever question reality?

I typically plow forward. Things to do. Commitments.

I was walking at lunchtime the other day and had this idea that maybe I am a replicant. Just jotting down these ideas and moments.

Capturing them somehow. I don’t know why or for what reason.

But the idea that I was a replicant seemed kind of poetic or poignant.

And yes, my name is Al.

I guess it’s a pretty human thing actually. With all this stuff to distract us, I don’t know why I am distracted by a picture of a flower or why it captures me enough to want to take its photo or write about it.

Or the angle and color of the sunrise on a cold day. The sun was just breaching the horizon and it was pink, backlighting the the smoke from a chimney I was driving past.

Wished I coulda taken a pic but I was driving.

Is this what being human is?

 

[Tzara]

Written for a Prosodic Exercise

There was a young woman from Boston
Who loved to submit and be bossed on.
She would shiver with glee
An astounding degree
And climax when finally tossed on.

Week 9 : Poem 1 : Total 18

I've been down sick most of the week. Before I came down with the flu, I had been thinking about scansion (metrical analysis), which involves "the division of verse lines into feet as well as the organization of syllables within a foot" (Hirsch, A Poet's Glossary, 560). It is how one illustrates one's contention that a poem is in, say, iambic pentameter or trochaic trimeter.

Marking scansion in sample poems is a classic exercise for student poets, though much less common now than in the twentieth century, probably due to the predominance of free verse. I've always found it useful in understanding the rhythmic foundation of a poem, but it is certainly not always a straightforward process.

Take the rather wretched sample limerick above. I wrote this before I got really sick as an example of the potential inconsistency of metrical analysis. I think most descriptions of the limerick form would note that it is based on an anapestic meter—the first, second, and fifth lines being anapestic trimeter and the third and fourth being anapestic dimeter (an anapest is a three syllable foot consisting of two unstressed syllables followed by a stressed syllable, as in "in the spring" or "on the hour"). But if you scan this example, you run into some ambiguities, as the lines are not all straightforwardly anapestic:

There was / a young wo / man from Bost·on
Who loved / to sub·mit / and be bossed on.
She would shiv / er with glee
An as·tound / ing de·gree
And cli / max when fin / al·ly tossed on.​

Here, the feet are marked presuming an anapestic rhythm, but note that while lines three and four are perfectly anapestic, the first, second, and fifth are missing the first unstressed syllable in the first foot of the line and they have an additional unstressed syllable at the end of last foot of each line.

The first irregularity is dealt with by simply descibing the lines as "acephalic" (i.e. that they are "missing their heads"), so the poem theoretically scans like this:

(x) There was / a young wo / man from Bost·on
(x) Who loved / to sub·mit / and be bossed on.
She would shiv / er with glee
An as·tound / ing de·gree
(x) And cli / max when fin / al·ly tossed on.​

where (x) indicates a technically missing, but metrically implied syllable. The extraneous unstressed ending syllable is similarly handled by labelling it as a feminine rhyme ("A rhyme of two syllables, the first stressed and the second unstressed" Hirsch, 230). So the poem adheres to the anapestic meter, albeit with a little variation to give it some interest.

But what if the poem were written like this?

There was a young woman from Boston
Who loved to submit and be bossed on.
She'd shiver with pleasure
Aquiver in leather
And climax when finally tossed on.​

This version of the poem actually follows a consistent metrical pattern in all the lines. The problem is that, while it is a triple meter, it isn't anapestic:

There was a / young wo·man / from Bost·on
Who loved to / sub·mit and / be bossed on.
She'd shiv·er / with plea·sure
A·quiv·er / in leath·er
And cli·max / when fin·al / ly tossed on.​

Here, all of the marked feet follow a dah DUM dah pattern, a pattern called an amphibrach. So you could consider the entire poem in amphibrachic meter except that most writers on prosody don't recognize an amphibrachic meter. So this version of the poem would likely still be classified as anapestic, with all lines acephalic and all with feminine rhymes.

It's the kind of thing that can make one a little crazy.

 

[Angeline]

I've been down sick most of the week. Before I came down with the flu, I had been thinking about scansion (metrical analysis), which involves "the division of verse lines into feet as well as the organization of syllables within a foot" (Hirsch, A Poet's Glossary, 560). It is how one illustrates one's contention that a poem is in, say, iambic pentameter or trochaic trimeter.

Marking scansion in sample poems is a classic exercise for student poets, though much less common now than in the twentieth century, probably due to the predominance of free verse. I've always found it useful in understanding the rhythmic foundation of a poem, but it is certainly not always a straightforward process.

Take the rather wretched sample limerick above. I wrote this before I got really sick as an example of the potential inconsistency of metrical analysis. I think most descriptions of the limerick form would note that it is based on an anapestic meter—the first, second, and fifth lines being anapestic trimeter and the third and fourth being anapestic dimeter (an anapest is a three syllable foot consisting of two unstressed syllables followed by a stressed syllable, as in "in the spring" or "on the hour"). But if you scan this example, you run into some ambiguities, as the lines are not all straightforwardly anapestic:

​

There was / a young wo / man from Bost·on​

Who loved / to sub·mit / and be bossed on.​

She would shiv / er with glee​

An as·tound / ing de·gree​

And cli / max when fin / al·ly tossed on.​

Here, the feet are marked presuming an anapestic rhythm, but note that while lines three and four are perfectly anapestic, the first, second, and fifth are missing the first unstressed syllable in the first foot of the line and they have an additional unstressed syllable at the end of last foot of each line.

The first irregularity is dealt with by simply descibing the lines as "acephalic" (i.e. that they are "missing their heads"), so the poem theoretically scans like this:

​

(x) There was / a young wo / man from Bost·on​

(x) Who loved / to sub·mit / and be bossed on.​

She would shiv / er with glee​

An as·tound / ing de·gree​

(x) And cli / max when fin / al·ly tossed on.​

where (x) indicates a technically missing, but metrically implied syllable. The extraneous unstressed ending syllable is similarly handled by labelling it as a feminine rhyme ("A rhyme of two syllables, the first stressed and the second unstressed" Hirsch, 230). So the poem adheres to the anapestic meter, albeit with a little variation to give it some interest.

But what if the poem were written like this?

​

There was a young woman from Boston​

Who loved to submit and be bossed on.​

She'd shiver with pleasure​

Aquiver in leather​

And climax when finally tossed on.​

This version of the poem actually follows a consistent metrical pattern in all the lines. The problem is that, while it is a triple meter, it isn't anapestic:

​

There was a / young wo·man / from Bost·on​

Who loved to / sub·mit and / be bossed on.​

She'd shiv·er / with plea·sure​

A·quiv·er / in leath·er​

And cli·max / when fin·al / ly tossed on.​

Here, all of the marked feet follow a dah DUM dah pattern, a pattern called an amphibrach. So you could consider the entire poem in amphibrachic meter except that most writers on prosody don't recognize an amphibrachic meter. So this version of the poem would likely still be classified as anapestic, with all lines acephalic and all with feminine rhymes.

It's the kind of thing that can make one a little crazy.

I'm sorry to hear the flu caught up with you (a lot of people in my area have had it too), so glad you're recovering. I'm feeling fine but your post made my head hurt a little lol. If you struggle with scansion I fear it's a lost cause for an acolyte like me. I'd love to have "teach-ins" (as our dear Annie used to call them) on the basics of each meter, just enough to gain a rudimentary understanding (for any beyond iambic in my case) of how to practice them, maybe a few examples from literature, and some guidance on what each might provide in terms of tone, sound, how their use affects a line.

Just saying.

But mainly I'm glad you're better. I was wondering where you were.

 

[Tzara]

I'd love to have "teach-ins" (as our dear Annie used to call them) on the basics of each meter, just enough to gain a rudimentary understanding (for any beyond iambic in my case) of how to practice them, maybe a few examples from literature, and some guidance on what each might provide in terms of tone, sound, how their use affects a line.

Just saying.

I've been making some notes on that topic, though more as a quasi-essay than a "teach-in." I suppose it could include some exercises if people were interested.

I firmly believe that practicing both the marking of the various meters and the writing of it is helpful whether or not one is interested in writing metrical poetry, somewhat in the way that practicing scales is for a musician. It develops one's sense of verbal rhythm and how that can impact the meaning of a poem.

 

[12oclocktales]

I came across some of Philip Levine’s jazz poems and thought of you. One I saw is a very long poem about Charlie Parker inspired by Phil Schaap’s “Bird Flight” radio show, a NYC institution for jazz lovers for over 40 years. Another one, which I like even better, is “I Remember Clifford” about Brownie; he made a recording of this about 10 years ago with Tom Harrell on trumpet, which you probably know about. It’s on YouTube.