On the basic skill of writing.

[Breaker_Morant]

Not at all. The entire series is a beautiful piece of work. I enjoy the music as well. My favorite part is when Sam Waterston reads the Gettysburg Address as Lincoln. It brings on a flood of tears

I think the "voices" were excellent choices.

 

[Netzach]

If you guys love the Civil War, try the Lewis and Clark one too. It's really stirring stuff.

 

[Homburg]

I don't know how I got there - I think I was researching queer cowboy stuff maybe, but I wound up reading this amazing academic article on video games, marketing and gender. They talked about the fact that realistically, in a suburban/urban area, it's not as safe or as feasible to send your kids off into the woods or whatever, so the virtual space of the video game becomes a way for boys to retain that exploratory space, the "adventure" space...

I can see that. The lack of exploratory space is something that bothers me. I grew up on military bases, which are surprisingly safe, or were when I was a kid, and spent summers running around in the mountains near the family farm in NC. I got my exploration any time I wanted it. That world is far and gone away from my kids, and I worry that they will not have the same chances I did.

Video games are a crap substitute, but better than nothing I guess. It would also explain the fascination that boys have with games.

 

[Netzach]

I can see that. The lack of exploratory space is something that bothers me. I grew up on military bases, which are surprisingly safe, or were when I was a kid, and spent summers running around in the mountains near the family farm in NC. I got my exploration any time I wanted it. That world is far and gone away from my kids, and I worry that they will not have the same chances I did.

Video games are a crap substitute, but better than nothing I guess. It would also explain the fascination that boys have with games.

Uh huh, the upside is it's safer, the downside is the lack of physical movement. They went on to talk about how games marketed to girls tended to be about interiority and "secrets" and sleuthing - but that the "virtual town" interactive model was one that leapt the gender divide and appealed to both sexes for different and overlapping reasons. IE: boys AND girls are just as liable to be second life junkies.

 

[Breaker_Morant]

Uh huh, the upside is it's safer, the downside is the lack of physical movement. They went on to talk about how games marketed to girls tended to be about interiority and "secrets" and sleuthing - but that the "virtual town" interactive model was one that leapt the gender divide and appealed to both sexes for different and overlapping reasons. IE: boys AND girls are just as liable to be second life junkies.

Okay those of you that know me will think I'm just beating my own drum here..

The 100yr anniversary show about Lionel Company/trains it was mentioned that part of the product's popularity was because it gave boys (very stereotyped comment for today's world) the opportunity to be their own "captains of industry" and to control their world. I see today's video games all the same vein except now we live in a world where violence is the norm in terms of entertainment versus the exception as it was back then.

Incidentally, Lionel did try to appeal to girls too, with pastel colored cars, etc. They didn't take off but are not considered collectables.

 

[celticsunspiral]

As an educator of today's youth I have seen first hand the result of childrens lessing skills in writing. We have had many discussions about why this is happening. Parents working more, less focus on reading, not as much writing in school. In my state we instituted required writings (various types of pieces) to be done in 4th, 7th, 12th grades. The first several years only 4% of the states students wrote on a distinguished (highest) level. After that they started lowering the standards. Which they have done twice in the past 10 years. They first year I graded these writings I was astounded and sad at what the students were turning in.

I read to my daughter for years and have always held reading as very important , I add books into my budget each paycheck. Reading her work truly spoiled me as to what level a 7th grade student should be writing. Now as a graduated High School student I know that at least my daughter can write. In fact we were discussing writing this morning. One of her friends a senior sent her a writing piece he was about to turn in. Her comment was "Is he joking, he is older than me and writes like an elementary student," she was appalled at how bad this kids writing was and he thought it just needed a little grammar work.

I know that we as a country have realized our children are not reading and that is one of the reasons that we have so many reading initiatives. That is also why many states have instituted on-demand and portfolios. Hopefully this will help, but they also need support at home and we have a whole generation of adults out there who do not value reading and writing.

Thanks to those who posted the lovely works by Sullivan Ballou and Wilfred Owen .

 

[jockdom]

If you guys love the Civil War, try the Lewis and Clark one too. It's really stirring stuff.

I liked cold mountain, I know it's fictonal and modern, but it's beautifully crafted and as good as the red badge of courage in a different way.

 

[bridgeburner]

Texting, slang and colloquial grammar can annoy those of us who value the more formal writing of past decades, but the fact of the matter is that real, vital language evolves. Only dead languages don't change.

I mean, when was the last time Latin had a new slang word?

 

[Netzach]

Are people counting the internet as reading though? I mean, when it's time for kids to read or turn in assignments or things like that, why is a book report more important than a website review? Technological access is going to be the biggest divide among have and have nots, I can imagine, so why not kill two birds with one stone AND make a lot of kids feel like there may just be some relevancy with their lives.

Honestly, I haven't cracked a book in years and I don't have the time I used to have for fiction. But I just found that academic article, I don't think Salon is horrible writing, and I have reconsidered my answer to whether I read a lot or not. I do read, but with the pace of my life. I always preferred short stories to novels anyhow and rarely have I loved a book that's exceeded 300 pages. Poetry, like a resume really has to be brilliant to justify additional pages. If it's more than a page it had better be Milton - concise is a virtue to me.

 

[intothewoods]

Are people counting the internet as reading though? I mean, when it's time for kids to read or turn in assignments or things like that, why is a book report more important than a website review? Technological access is going to be the biggest divide among have and have nots, I can imagine, so why not kill two birds with one stone AND make a lot of kids feel like there may just be some relevancy with their lives.

Honestly, I haven't cracked a book in years and I don't have the time I used to have for fiction. But I just found that academic article, I don't think Salon is horrible writing, and I have reconsidered my answer to whether I read a lot or not. I do read, but with the pace of my life. I always preferred short stories to novels anyhow and rarely have I loved a book that's exceeded 300 pages. Poetry, like a resume really has to be brilliant to justify additional pages. If it's more than a page it had better be Milton - concise is a virtue to me.

This is kind of what I was getting at on the tv is evil point. You can't just shut it off. Their whole world is different now, and it makes more sense to get involved and integrate the new technology in a smart way.

 

[Breaker_Morant]

Good writing will survive no matter what format it is presented in.

 

[intothewoods]

Ahem. That will teach me to read a thread backwards. (speaking of shortcuts)

I don't know how I got there - I think I was researching queer cowboy stuff maybe, but I wound up reading this amazing academic article on video games, marketing and gender. They talked about the fact that realistically, in a suburban/urban area, it's not as safe or as feasible to send your kids off into the woods or whatever, so the virtual space of the video game becomes a way for boys to retain that exploratory space, the "adventure" space...

Interesting. Yeah, I tried to dismiss video games. I didn't want them in the house at all. But I have to look at my ex and all of his very square, non-violent friends and conclude that video games can be okay. I'm still not letting Grand Theft Auto into my house though.

I'm also not sure if only the pace and formality of bygone eras is going to produce amazingness - I think that speech, writing, visualization - they're all changing to suit the world and it's not all bad changes. I mean, I can't text-message. This IS a new lingua franca, and do I think it's stupid purely because I'm shut out?

I mean, watch a TV show or film from the seventies and it's almost painfully simple, even the good ones. Now there are plot threads, simultaneity, A B and even C storylines in one episode - multiplicity is really a good development if you're traditionally someone who isn't going to be counted.

Right, it's not as simple as technology bad! Obviously we wouldn't be on this forum if we didn't benefit from it in some way.

 

[Homburg]

Interesting. Yeah, I tried to dismiss video games. I didn't want them in the house at all. But I have to look at my ex and all of his very square, non-violent friends and conclude that video games can be okay. I'm still not letting Grand Theft Auto into my house though.

Oddly enough, I let my oldest son play Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas when he was four years old. GTA:SA has trains in it, and you can operate the trains. He was nuts for trains then, so, after I beat the game (which cuts out almost all of the random violence that occurs in the game), I would set him up in the trains and let him toodle around. I taught him how to keep the speed at the proper rate to keep the cars on the track, and what all the controls were, and let him loose.

I'm not defending GTA, just saying that I actually found a way for the boy to be able to enjoy the game without being exposed to all the bad stuff in the game. Other than that, I would only play when the kids were in bed.

GTA:SA was the last time I played a video game too. Haven't had the urge since.

Edit: Oldest son, not youngest. Ugh.

 

[intothewoods]

Oddly enough, I let my youngest son play Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas when he was four years old. GTA:SA has trains in it, and you can operate the trains. He was nuts for trains then, so, after I beat the game (which cuts out almost all of the random violence that occurs in the game), I would set him up in the trains and let him toodle around. I taught him how to keep the speed at the proper rate to keep the cars on the track, and what all the controls were, and let him loose.

I'm not defending GTA, just saying that I actually found a way for the boy to be able to enjoy the game without being exposed to all the bad stuff in the game. Other than that, I would only play when the kids were in bed.

GTA:SA was the last time I played a video game too. Haven't had the urge since.

Sure, if you can hack the game to take out the violence and mysogyny, go for it.

Part of it is a respect for me thing as well. I don't allow toy guns or any sort of violent entertainment, but my kid still makes shooting noises and has played bad guys and good guys with his friends at school. Preschool. Fine, I don't care. But the rules in my house are no shooting noises and no pretend guns because "I" don't like guns. What he chooses to do at school during playtime is his choice though.

 

[Homburg]

Sure, if you can hack the game to take out the violence and mysogyny, go for it.

Part of it is a respect for me thing as well. I don't allow toy guns or any sort of violent entertainment, but my kid still makes shooting noises and has played bad guys and good guys with his friends at school. Preschool. Fine, I don't care. But the rules in my house are no shooting noises and no pretend guns because "I" don't like guns. What he chooses to do at school during playtime is his choice though.

In this case it wasn't a hack. It's just that beating the game seriously curtails the random violence factor. To be frank, you have to go looking for trouble if you beat it properly. And the mysogyny? Well, there isn't much interaction when you are driving a train, so it worked out nicely =)

I haven't seen too awful much gunplay with the boys yet. A bit, sure, but nothing really serious.

 

[midwestyankee]

The cover story in this month's issue of The Atlantic is entitled, "Is Google Making Us Stupid?" and so it's quite germane to the current topic. The thesis is that the experience of gathering information by reading online sources changes not only one's reading habits but possibly even the manner in which we think. The author points out how such technological changes as the Gutenberg press and the mechanical clock changed thinking patterns. The Internet is simply another such sea-change that is affecting our minds and patterns of thought.

Here's a sample:

"I can feel it, too. Over the past few years I’ve had an uncomfortable sense that someone, or something, has been tinkering with my brain, remapping the neural circuitry, reprogramming the memory. My mind isn’t going—so far as I can tell—but it’s changing. I’m not thinking the way I used to think. I can feel it most strongly when I’m reading. Immersing myself in a book or a lengthy article used to be easy. My mind would get caught up in the narrative or the turns of the argument, and I’d spend hours strolling through long stretches of prose. That’s rarely the case anymore. Now my concentration often starts to drift after two or three pages. I get fidgety, lose the thread, begin looking for something else to do. I feel as if I’m always dragging my wayward brain back to the text. The deep reading that used to come naturally has become a struggle."​

Source

That such changes in reading patterns exist - and of this I have no doubt - inevitably leads to changes in the ways in which we express those thoughts.

 

[Betticus]

July 14, 1861
Camp Clark, Washington

My very dear Sarah:
The indications are very strong that we shall move in a few days—perhaps tomorrow. Lest I should not be able to write again, I feel impelled to write a few lines that may fall under your eye when I shall be no more . . .
Sullivan Ballou was killed a week later at the first Battle of Bull Run, July 21, 1861.

http://www.pbs.org/civilwar/war/ballou_letter.html

(it still draws a tear or two)

That is a beautiful letter.

 

[Betticus]

Bitte!
All quite on the western front is pretty powerful too.
Love your avatar great film tragic injustice.

I love that film, that one and Gallipoli.

 

[Betticus]

*gets out an extra large box of tissues*

With all the girlies running around here. . .we'll need it if you start a thread like that. . .

I think it's a good idea.

 

[JMohegan]

Those moved by soldiers' letters would appreciate the Armed Forces Memorial in Norfolk.

Twenty bronze replicas of actual letters, from service members who died in every American war from the Revolution to Gulf 1, are placed as if they had been scattered by the wind.

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa78/johnmohegan/memorial1.jpg


http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa78/johnmohegan/memorial2.jpg


http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa78/johnmohegan/letter1.jpg

 

[jockdom]

I love that film, that one and Gallipoli.

It showed that John Boy Walton and his Pa could act!
The book By erich Maria Remarque is pretty powerful reading.

 

[Homburg]

Those moved by soldiers' letters would appreciate the Armed Forces Memorial in Norfolk.

Twenty bronze replicas of actual letters, from service members who died in every American war from the Revolution to Gulf 1, are placed as if they had been scattered by the wind.

Sadly, I've never been to see this, and I go past this area on a somewhat regular basis. Admittedly, it's a bitch to park casually around there, but I still should go.

 

[Betticus]

I wonder what would happen if we were to start an anonymous open letter website where people could post their open letters to someone not there. To the ex, the future love, the ones taken from our lives, the child hoped for......

Or even just a thread, except their is already the dear x one.

 

[Netzach]

The cover story in this month's issue of The Atlantic is entitled, "Is Google Making Us Stupid?" and so it's quite germane to the current topic. The thesis is that the experience of gathering information by reading online sources changes not only one's reading habits but possibly even the manner in which we think. The author points out how such technological changes as the Gutenberg press and the mechanical clock changed thinking patterns. The Internet is simply another such sea-change that is affecting our minds and patterns of thought.

Here's a sample:

"I can feel it, too. Over the past few years I’ve had an uncomfortable sense that someone, or something, has been tinkering with my brain, remapping the neural circuitry, reprogramming the memory. My mind isn’t going—so far as I can tell—but it’s changing. I’m not thinking the way I used to think. I can feel it most strongly when I’m reading. Immersing myself in a book or a lengthy article used to be easy. My mind would get caught up in the narrative or the turns of the argument, and I’d spend hours strolling through long stretches of prose. That’s rarely the case anymore. Now my concentration often starts to drift after two or three pages. I get fidgety, lose the thread, begin looking for something else to do. I feel as if I’m always dragging my wayward brain back to the text. The deep reading that used to come naturally has become a struggle."​

Source

That such changes in reading patterns exist - and of this I have no doubt - inevitably leads to changes in the ways in which we express those thoughts.

Maybe our internal editors will improve though.

Also, while fine writing may be dwindling, the world is a much MUCH more interesting and challenging visual environment than it ever has been. Interpreting the imagery around us stops in mainstream schools with putting a round peg in a round hole though - which is why images manipulate so well.

If you look at the memorial, I think you get the impact even if you don't read English, just by the way the papers look wind-scattered, the scale of them, the dark steel. Also, the location. Imagine that in a different site and it doesn't work at all.

 

[intothewoods]

I wonder what would happen if we were to start an anonymous open letter website where people could post their open letters to someone not there. To the ex, the future love, the ones taken from our lives, the child hoped for......

Or even just a thread, except their is already the dear x one.

In this case it wasn't a hack. It's just that beating the game seriously curtails the random violence factor. To be frank, you have to go looking for trouble if you beat it properly. And the mysogyny? Well, there isn't much interaction when you are driving a train, so it worked out nicely =)

I haven't seen too awful much gunplay with the boys yet. A bit, sure, but nothing really serious.

Well, I've only seen "a bit" too, but it's weird for me since I didn't grow up with boys. It's an adjustment.