Sarah Palin

[Belegon]

That might have been a bit disrespectful, but most of the time he reffered to him as "Senator Obama." What was the context? If he was referring to members of the Senate collectively, and referred to Obama as "that one" meaning that senator, it wasn't as bad. Still, he should have referred to him by name.

I did hear the reference, but I don't remember the context.

Don't worry, you'll see it again... and again... and again.

 

[sr71plt]

I'm quite sure the administration knew how rotten Saddam was. However, he was considered to be not as rotten as the government of Iran, so we were on his side. This was somewhat akin to the Anglo-American alliance with Stalin during WW2. Stalin was scum, but Hitler was even worse, so he alliance was made by England, and sort of inherited by the USA.

Close, but not quite on Saddam. He was recognized as rotten on about the same level as Iran. As long as they were helped to expend all, or nearly all, of their energies on each other, that was fine with us.

It therefore was only barely akin to Stalin/Hitler. We did want the Soviet Union to absorb as much of the German expense of resources (and thus expend its resources also), but we did want the Stalin to prevail. In Iran and Iraq, we didn't really want either one of them to prevail. If Iraq had gotten the upper hand, we were prepared to ship help to Iran too.

When you get into identify good allies and bad ones, you get onto rocky ground. We've had to support and shelter a whole lot of bad guys in genuine national self-interest. (Even have created a couple. Noreiga, for instance, started out as an agent of the U.S. government, doing what we paid him to do. And we came "that close" to putting Ho Chi Minh on the payroll too.)

 

[Boxlicker101]

Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetsubsarahh
I finally put Box on ignore.

He doesn't want to think.

It's too frustrating.

If only we could put his vote on ignore.

NO.

He is in California. I need his vote against Prop. 8.

Obama will win California, have no doubt.

Actually, my wife is going to vote for Obama so our votes will offset each other. If I did not go to the polls, she probably wouldn't go by herself, so it will make no difference.

Unfortunately, unless I can talk her out of it, she will probably vote for Prop. 8, so our votes will offsert there too. Besides that, my vote for Congress and most of my other ones will be for Democrats.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Close, but not quite on Saddam. He was recognized as rotten on about the same level as Iran. As long as they were helped to expend all, or nearly all, of their energies on each other, that was fine with us.

It therefore was only barely akin to Stalin/Hitler. We did want the Soviet Union to absorb as much of the German expense of resources (and thus expend its resources also), but we did want the Stalin to prevail. In Iran and Iraq, we didn't really want either one of them to prevail. If Iraq had gotten the upper hand, we were prepared to ship help to Iran too.

When you get into identify good allies and bad ones, you get onto rocky ground. We've had to support and shelter a whole lot of bad guys in genuine national self-interest. (Even have created a couple. Noreiga, for instance, started out as an agent of the U.S. government, doing what we paid him to do. And we came "that close" to putting Ho Chi Minh on the payroll too.)

This is an unfortunate fact of life, part of Realpolitik. Actually, I think Ho was helped by the US during WW2. We also helped the Taliban in their fight with the Soviets.

 

[ishtat]

NO.

He is in California. I need his vote against Prop. 8.

Obama will win California, have no doubt.

But how about his vote on Prop 2. Larger cages for animals!

 

[DesertPirate]

This is an unfortunate fact of life, part of Realpolitik. Actually, I think Ho was helped by the US during WW2. We also helped the Taliban in their fight with the Soviets.

Ho was helped by the U. S. He asked again aftewr the war and we said no so the French wouldn't get upset, that's when he turned to Mosccow. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot!

We trained and armed the Taliban when the Soviets were occupying Afganistan.

There are many times when the "The enemy of my enemy is my friend" philosophy has bitten us on the ass.

 

[Safe_Bet]

...Unfortunately, unless I can talk her out of it, she will probably vote for Prop. 8, so our votes will offsert there too. ...

What possible motivation would you have for voting against Prop 8?

 

[Boxlicker101]

What possible motivation would you have for voting against Prop 8?

I would think almost everybody on this forum who lives in California would vote against Prop. 8. If passed, it would change the state constitution to outlaw gay marriage.

I have no personal stake in it, nor do most Californians, but I think it is WRONG.

 

[xssve]

Quote:I am referring, of course, to personal relationships and political allies of the candidates. There are times when heads of state or their representatives have to associate with some of the worst people in the world. Obama has said he would do that with no pre-conditions, which would be quite foolish.

Should he do so, and sit down with the heads of state of North Korea or Iran or similar places, he would have to be civil and shake hands and make nice, even though he didn't want to.

How do you people look at yourselves in the mirror?

If I presume innocence, my suggestion is that you should get another mirror and look over your shoulder: you have a big a big "kick me" sign taped to your back.

You honestly think a democrat could make things any worse than they already are?

 

[Safe_Bet]

I would think almost everybody on this forum who lives in California would vote against Prop. 8. If passed, it would change the state constitution to outlaw gay marriage.

I have no personal stake in it, nor do most Californians, but I think it is WRONG.

Sorry, I misread your posting. You ARE planning for voting against Prop 8. Good. Thank you. Now go convince your wife!

 

[Boxlicker101]

How do you people look at yourselves in the mirror?

If I presume innocence, my suggestion is that you should get another mirror and look over your shoulder: you have a big a big "kick me" sign taped to your back.

You honestly think a democrat could make things any worse than they already are?

I think that a person who says and does foolish things would make things worse, regardless of party label.

 

[Sandy_Fox]

I don't understand how anybody can be for Prop 8! I fought and bled for EVERYBODY in this country, not just a bunch of bible thumping bigots!

 

[matriarch]

I finally put Box on ignore.

He doesn't want to think.

It's too frustrating.

Me too.
I'm not part of this blasted, interminable election but he's driving me totally, and completely insane. I've been close to shoving my fist into my lappie a few times when reading his totally naive and irritating posts.


Aaarrgggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[shereads]

I think that a person who says and does foolish things would make things worse, regardless of party label.

As a stalwart apologist for GWB, you are no credible judge of what is or is not foolish.

 

[Selena_Kitt]

New Newsweek photo of Sarah Palin. Her supporters are having a fit about it.

What, no photoshop?

http://bittenandbound.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/palin-on-newsweek-cover.jpg

Very unflattering, isn't it? Wrinkles, hooked nose, little mustache going on...

 

[Boxlicker101]

As a stalwart apologist for GWB, you are no credible judge of what is or is not foolish.

"Apologist" is too strong a word. I don't defend W, except to point out that sometimes people put too much blame on him. He wasn't really responsible for the failure of the levees in NO and, although his appointee for FEMA was a flop, the governor and the mayor certainly deserve some of the blame. I saw photos of dozens of school buses under water. Why were they not used, by local authorities, to carry thousands of people inland to safety, which would also have prevented damage to the buses?

 

[Boxlicker101]

New Newsweek photo of Sarah Palin. Her supporters are having a fit about it.

What, no photoshop?

http://bittenandbound.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/palin-on-newsweek-cover.jpg

Very unflattering, isn't it? Wrinkles, hooked nose, little mustache going on...

It figures that Newsweek would print the most unflattering photo they could. This is much like the cover photos of celebrities on The Enguirer and similar trashy mags.

 

[Selena_Kitt]

It figures that Newsweek would print the most unflattering photo they could. This is much like the cover photos of celebrities on The Enguirer and similar trashy mags.

Well it's a LITTLE better than THAT. But... not much.

 

[cloudy]

It figures that Newsweek would print the most unflattering photo they could. This is much like the cover photos of celebrities on The Enguirer and similar trashy mags.

Heaven forbid St. Sarah been seen as she really is.

 

[Sandy_Fox]

http://bittenandbound.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/palin-on-newsweek-cover.jpg

I'll be God damned! I've never seem a "Dead Wolf" earring before!

 

[sr71plt]

Seems a little snarky to go after her for a Newsweek photo. Looks fine to me, and she's running not for a beauty contest (for which she still looks pretty good) but for high political office--which I would think was the point people should be focusing on--and being scared about. This seems as irrelevant and sidetracking as the Ayers business and just waters down the real issue.

 

[Huckleman2000]

Has anyone else seen the clips of Cindy McCain speaking about the "chill down her spine" over one of Obama's war-funding votes? Holy crap! They'll need to measure that chill in degrees Kelvin.

What is it about McCain that leads him to women with sing-song, little girl speaking styles?

The more I see of McCain in crisis (in both real events and his own campaign), the more he's revealing himself as a desperate, flaming Narcissist, clinging to his own heroic image of himself as the emptiness of his ideology is laid bare by events larger than him.

He's spoken of how his time as a POW changed him from a sort of ne'er-do-well into the man of principle he is today. Instead, it now appears that his hard-found honorable self has metastasized into someone who feels entitled to public acclaim based on a few horrific years in his Navy career. No one has suffered more for his country than he has, and his country must reward him by making him President. And if it doesn't, he has little else to offer beyond stomping his feet and sneering at his opponent for having an insufficiently baroque resume' for a Warrior King.

 

[cloudy]

Has anyone else seen the clips of Cindy McCain speaking about the "chill down her spine" over one of Obama's war-funding votes? Holy crap! They'll need to measure that chill in degrees Kelvin.

What is it about McCain that leads him to women with sing-song, little girl speaking styles?

She's a fucking idiot....she didn't even know what Roe v. Wade is, ffs.

Transcript from an interview she did with Katie Couric on Sept. 23 this year:

Couric: And do you believe Roe V. Wade should be overturned?

C.McCain: No. no.

Couric: No. Why not? Your husband does.

C.McCain: No. I don't think he does.

Couric: He believes it should be overturned. That's what he told me, and that it should go to the states.

C.McCain: Well, in that respect. Yes, yeah, I do. I understand what you're saying now. It's a states issue.

Couric: So, you believe it should be overturned or shouldn't be overturned.

C.McCain: I believe it's a states issue. That I do believe.

note: it was the express purpose of the Roe decision to not let abortion become a "states issue."

 

[Roxanne Appleby]

from Camille Paglia's latest:

http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/2008/10/08/palin/print.html

. . . (B)othTodd and Sarah Palin, whom most people in the U.S. and abroad had never even heard of until six weeks ago, have emerged as powerful new symbols of a revived contemporary feminism. That the macho Todd, with his champion athleticism and working-class cred, can so amiably cradle babies and care for children is a huge step forward in American sexual symbolism.
Although nothing will sway my vote for Obama, I continue to enjoy Sarah Palin's performance on the national stage. During her vice-presidential debate last week with Joe Biden (whose conspiratorial smiles with moderator Gwen Ifill were outrageous and condescending toward his opponent), I laughed heartily at Palin's digs and slams and marveled at the way she slowly took over the entire event. I was sorry when it ended! But Biden wasn't -- judging by his Gore-like sighs and his slow sinking like a punctured blimp. Of course Biden won on points, but TV (a visual medium) never cares about that.

The mountain of rubbish poured out about Palin over the past month would rival Everest. What a disgrace for our jabbering army of liberal journalists and commentators, too many of whom behaved like snippy jackasses. The bourgeois conventionalism and rank snobbery of these alleged humanitarians stank up the place. As for Palin's brutally edited interviews with Charlie Gibson and that viper, Katie Couric, don't we all know that the best bits ended up on the cutting-room floor? Something has gone seriously wrong with Democratic ideology, which seems to have become a candied set of holier-than-thou bromides attached like tutti-frutti to a quivering green Jell-O mold of adolescent sentimentality.

And where is all that lurid sexual fantasy coming from? When I watch Sarah Palin, I don't think sex -- I think Amazon warrior! I admire her competitive spirit and her exuberant vitality, which borders on the supernormal. The question that keeps popping up for me is whether Palin, who was born in Idaho, could possibly be part Native American (as we know her husband is), which sometimes seems suggested by her strong facial contours. I have felt that same extraordinary energy and hyper-alertness billowing out from other women with Native American ancestry -- including two overpowering celebrity icons with whom I have worked.

One of the most idiotic allegations batting around out there among urban media insiders is that Palin is "dumb." Are they kidding? What level of stupidity is now par for the course in those musty circles? (The value of Ivy League degrees, like sub-prime mortgages, has certainly been plummeting. As a Yale Ph.D., I have a perfect right to my scorn.) People who can't see how smart Palin is are trapped in their own narrow parochialism -- the tedious, hackneyed forms of their upper-middle-class syntax and vocabulary.

As someone whose first seven years were spent among Italian-American immigrants (I never met an elderly person who spoke English until we moved from Endicott to rural Oxford, New York, when I was in first grade), I am very used to understanding meaning through what might seem to others to be outlandish or fractured variations on standard English. Furthermore, I have spent virtually my entire teaching career (nearly four decades) in arts colleges, where the expressiveness of highly talented students in dance, music and the visual arts takes a hundred different forms. Finally, as a lover of poetry (my last book was about that), I savor every kind of experimentation with standard English -- beginning with Shakespeare, who was the greatest improviser of them all at a time when there were no grammar rules.

Many others listening to Sarah Palin at her debate went into conniptions about what they assailed as her incoherence or incompetence. But I was never in doubt about what she intended at any given moment. On the contrary, I was admiring not only her always shapely and syncopated syllables but the innate structures of her discourse -- which did seem to fly by in fragments at times but are plainly ready to be filled with deeper policy knowledge, as she gains it (hopefully over the next eight years of the Obama presidencies). This is a tremendously talented politician whose moment has not yet come. That she holds views completely opposed to mine is irrelevant.

Even if she disappears from the scene forever after a McCain defeat, Palin will still have made an enormous and lasting contribution to feminism. As I said in my last column, Palin has made the biggest step forward in reshaping the persona of female authority since Madonna danced her dominatrix way through the shattered puritan barricades of the feminist establishment. In 1990, in a highly controversial New York Times op-ed that attacked old-guard feminist ideology, I declared that "Madonna is the future of feminism" -- a prophecy that was ridiculed at the time but that turned out to be quite true. Madonna put pro-sex feminism on the international map.

But it is now 18 years later -- the span of an entire generation. The instabilities and diminishments for young women raised in an increasingly shallow media environment have become all too obvious. I had grown up in a vibrant pop culture with glorious women stars of voluptuous sensuality -- above all Elizabeth Taylor, sewn into that silky white slip as the vixen Manhattan call girl of "Butterfield 8." In college, I feasted on foreign films starring sexual sophisticates like Jeanne Moreau, Anouk Aimée and Catherine Deneuve. Sex today, however, has become brittle and superficial. Except for the occasional diverting flash of Lindsay Lohan's borrowed bosom, I see nothing whatever that is worth a second glance. Pro-sex feminism has worked itself out and, like all movements, has degenerated into clichés. And even Madonna, with her skeletal megalomania, looks like a refugee from a horror movie.

The next phase of feminism must circle back and reappropriate the ancient persona of the mother -- without losing career ambition or power of assertion. Betty Friedan, who had first attacked the cult of postwar domesticity, had long warned second-wave feminists such as Gloria Steinem about the damaging exclusion of homemakers from their value system. The animus of liberal feminists toward religion must also end (I am speaking as an atheist). Feminism must reexamine all of its assumptions, including its death grip on abortion, if it wishes to survive.

The hysterical emotionalism and eruptions of amoral malice at the arrival of Sarah Palin exposed the weaknesses and limitations of current feminism. But I am convinced that Palin's bracing mix of male and female voices, as well as her grounding in frontier grit and audacity, will prove to be a galvanizing influence on aspiring Democratic women politicians too, from the municipal level on up. Palin has shown a brand-new way of defining female ambition -- without losing femininity, spontaneity or humor. She's no pre-programmed wonk of the backstage Hillary Clinton school; she's pugnacious and self-created, the product of no educational or political elite -- which is why her outsider style has been so hard for media lemmings to comprehend. And by the way, I think Tina Fey's witty impersonations of Palin have been fabulous. But while Fey has nailed Palin's cadences and charm, she can't capture the energy, which is a force of nature.

 

[Selena_Kitt]

from Camille Paglia's latest:

http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/2008/10/08/palin/print.html

Will someone PLEASE give Paglia Palin's number already!?