Socialism brings people down - lowers quality of life

[Blue]

-Snip lots of regulation stuff -

All true, but still not a valid critique of socialism. Not even an example of socialism in fact. What our corporate overlords do is gamble with our money, and when they lose their bets, they socialise the losses by dumping the financial burden and economic results on us lesser beings and privatise all the gains. It's an indirect plutocracy/oligarchy by special interests, not even a foot in the door of socialism.

 

[L1tTleD1fferent]

All true, but still not a valid critique of socialism.

Actually, none of it is even true. (The OP is "NeverEnding" largely due the fact that their posting of truth/facts never begins.)

What our corporate overlords do is gamble with our money, and when they lose their bets, they socialise the losses by dumping the financial burden and economic results on us lesser beings and privatise all the gains.

Once again, a popular, oft-stated opinion, but only opinion & not fact.

 

[Blue]

Actually, none of it is even true. (The OP is "NeverEnding" largely due the fact that their posting of truth/facts never begins.)

I was referring to what Botany had said on the previous page, not the very start of the thread.

Once again, a popular, oft-stated opinion, but only opinion & not fact.

Um, no? Here's a little timeline of the 2008 financial crisis as an example:
-US Economy collapses due to predatory lending and orchestration of public legislation which funnelled money up to the 0.01% carried out by huge syndicated banks, causing a massive burst in the housing bubble.
-Largest syndicated banks fiscally crash and burn thanks to Karma.
-Banks call on their puppets and get completely bailed out by the US government, their CEO's get multi-billion dollar personal bonuses, all at the expense of the taxpayer, and ultimately they lose nothing and come out richer on top of it.

So when the corporate banks collapsed, they took billions of taxpayer dollars so that they could continue existing, got richer, and paid absolutely no price for it all. What is that if not socialising the losses?

When it comes to their profits, the government is totally hands-off, because they control the government. Unreasonably low corporate and personal tax for the rich (assuming they even pay it), massive deregulation and a free table secured to the floor to bend the American people over.

Just as one example.

 

[L1tTleD1fferent]

I was referring to what Botany had said on the previous page, not the very start of the thread.

Matters not. Most times, both are PTB (Posters of Total BS).

Um, no?

Just as one example.

Who starts their example with a question, let alone one that seems to be questioning the truth/existence of what their succeeding example will be given to prove? Nobody.

Therefore, let us respond by skipping your so-called example, & asking the question why you chose to post it, or anything else in this thread.

 

[BotanyBoy]

All true, but still not a valid critique of socialism. Not even an example of socialism in fact. What our corporate overlords do is gamble with our money, and when they lose their bets, they socialise the losses by dumping the financial burden and economic results on us lesser beings and privatise all the gains. It's an indirect plutocracy/oligarchy by special interests, not even a foot in the door of socialism.

I said it wasn't socialism and it was an oligarchy/feudalism.

It is a valid critique of socialism however.

From an economic perspective the only difference between the two is which group of elitist shit bags is calling the shots, plutocrat or bureaucrat. You can even toss theocrat on the same pile as there have been a number of theocracies in the past who have done the same thing. Organized religion after all was the original government.

At the end of the day the lack of upward mobility, absurd debt and astronomical income disparity is 110% because the government regulated it that way.

 

[L1tTleD1fferent]

I said it wasn't socialism and it was an oligarchy/feudalism.

It is a valid critique of socialism however.

From an economic perspective the only difference between the two is which group of elitist shit bags is calling the shots, plutocrat or bureaucrat. You can even toss theocrat on the same pile as there have been a number of theocracies in the past who have done the same thing. Organized religion after all was the original government.

At the end of the day the lack of upward mobility, absurd debt and astronomical income disparity is 110% because the government regulated it that way.

So says you... But you also said,

Organized religion after all was the original government.

Which can be the first post in a new thread just for you (same as "RUlookingup" has for themselves) called, "BS posted by BB".

 

[BotanyBoy]

So says you... But you also said,

And anyone who has a clue.

Private companies aren't restricting licencing or legislating any of the market into rich peoples pockets.

Subsidies/bailouts for the rich while families/people get fucked?

That's all done by power of government.

Which can be the first post in a new thread just for you (same as "RUlookingup" has for themselves) called, "BS posted by BB".

Enjoy that thread, let me know how it goes

 

[NeverEndingMe]

anyone that can defend or believe in socialism is a fucking retard.

period.

 

[L1tTleD1fferent]

anyone that can defend or believe in socialism is a fucking retard.

period.

You've got it backwards, as you are the retard... Who might also be BotanyBoy, referring to people who have a clue after quoting too much of my post so his reply makes no sense.

 

[DeYaKen]

Collecting welfare became a valid career choice before Obama, especially in CA. I don't know just when it started to be so.

I take it that the lack of an answer to my questions,

"So how many people do you have on Welfare? How much do they get? and can you actually live on it?"

means that it is largely a media myth.

Since the banking crash your government and ours has poured huge amounts of money into the banking sector to keep it afloat. This was done to cover the huge losses caused by people gambling with other people's money. Those gambling bankers walked away with bonuses amounting to billions of dollars while their losses were made good by the taxpayer. In Effect they are living a life of luxury paid for by the taxpayer. Somehow it would seem that you think that that is OK, but handing out a few hundred dollars to someone with nothing is a terrible sin.

It cost the British taxpayer something in excess of £300 trillion to bail out our banks and that was just the start. That's enough to pay our total benefit bill for several years. However, rather than being outraged about that, sections of our media, and I suspect yours, search out what we call "Social Security Scrounger" stories. It seems that the bigger the amount the less the crime.

 

[NeverEndingMe]

You've got it backwards, as you are the retard... Who might also be BotanyBoy, referring to people who have a clue after quoting too much of my post so his reply makes no sense.

Dude, did you know that when giving yourself a dental exam all you have to do is open your mouth...not your ass. going through your ass, well its the long way.

oh you liberals are so fucking stupid

 

[oggbashan]

anyone that can defend or believe in socialism is a fucking retard.

period.

You prove your lack of intelligence by not understanding what socialism is.

It has a multitude of interpretations and many different countries support socialism as part of their system of government. None of them would recognise your version as valid.

Start school again. You didn't learn anything last time.

PS Universal education is a socialist concept.

 

[NeverEndingMe]

You prove your lack of intelligence by not understanding what socialism is.

It has a multitude of interpretations and many different countries support socialism as part of their system of government. None of them would recognise your version as valid.

Start school again. You didn't learn anything last time.

PS Universal education is a socialist concept.

and 90% of professors are mentally and morally bankrupt ... this is why higher education is so freaking expensive

you and your kind need to be re-educated. this is why France and the UK are in the shit crapper and becoming a 3rd world nation

 

[dan_c00000]

War on drugz.

Arbitrarily restricted and or excessively priced licencing/permits.

Such as liquor licences or permits to run a cab service etc.

That's market protection/control....point blank and it goes on all over the country.

I can go on. Would you like to hear about how ACA was all about a HC/insurance industry special interest group getting paid?

Or do you really think ACA was all about getting the US citizens the best HC possible for at reasonable price?

Maybe you can explain why Monsanto gets paid to waste water on empty fields while CA shuts down independent farmers for water reasons during a terrible drought?

It's all money grabbing and control. None of that shit has a fucking thing to do with general welfare or public/environmental safety.

It's not socialism, it's a corporate oligarchy/feudalism, but from the bottom looking up they are effectively the same fucking thing. Government control over the markets.

1. The war on drugs I don't know how's that a regulation so let's skip that.

2. So which permits are you for? Should doctor's have medical licenses to practice? How about driver's licenses?

3. You are sort of right about the ACA accept for the part where the government expanded Medicaid.

Given all this do you drive on the highway? Because that's socialism in action.

 

[L1tTleD1fferent]

and 90% of professors are mentally and morally bankrupt ... this is why higher education is so freaking expensive

you and your kind need to be re-educated. this is why France and the UK are in the shit crapper and becoming a 3rd world nation

We don't need to be re-educated at all... Especially when it's solely the opinion of people like you who were never educated a first time.

Waiting for an Admin or someone here to gather up your "Contact Us" contacts & reported posts, & shut you up & down simultaneously & permanently.

 

[BotanyBoy]

1. The war on drugs I don't know how's that a regulation so let's skip that.

Try to make a living selling drugs lately?

Try getting a liquor licence in a liberal or RW enough town?

How about a tobacco licence?

How about a grocery store?

Composting facility?

A microbrew?

Yeaaaaaaa LOL you won't get one because you're not cool enough and you're not rich enough to buy someone else's licence. Doesn't matter if you have the perfect spot zoned right, insurance, meet all standards tip top...fuck you, no licence.

2. So which permits are you for? Should doctor's have medical licenses to practice? How about driver's licenses?

I'm for all permits/licences really. I'm not for arbitrarily limiting them (fucking poor people) so that a handful of elites control the ____________ market across the city/state/country.

Regulation for public and environmental safety? Sure

To protect the established industries bank accounts?
http://i1110.photobucket.com/albums/h443/jackflag1/GIFS/21mhq1c.gif

3. You are sort of right about the ACA accept for the part where the government expanded Medicaid.

For what we are paying we should have UHC like 3 times over. I'm 100% right, ACA is a scam designed to enrich HC and insurance industry elitist, not give the USA the best HC system possible for a decent price.

They spit on it a little with the expanded coverage but we the general public still got fucked.

That's what happens when you let insurance companies write HC refrom.

Given all this do you drive on the highway? Because that's socialism in action.

I'm not anti socialism, I'm anti BAD socialism.

Yes Dan believe it or not socialism is NOT inherently 100% good 100% of the time, I know how shocking that must be to read but it's true.

Much like any form of government really it's who's doing what with it.

And when socialism/feudalism/the church etc. (the government in any form) starts arbitrarily and intentionally fucking the majority into the poor house/servitude to enrich the elites, shit starts going downhill.

Every time.

 

[phrodeau]

(edited)

Given all this do you drive on the highway? Because that's socialism in action.

I have personally witnessed the deterioration of the Interstate highway system since the mid-90's, when Republicans got control of the pursestrings. Our infrastructure is being driven literally into the ground, with hardly a trickle of support from Republicans to even restore the Interstate system to what it was in the 70's, never mind upgrading.

Bridge 9340, over the Mississippi River in Minneapolis, was completed in 1967. It collapsed in 2007. The replacement bridge, opened in 2008, is already showing signs of stress and wear. I highly doubt it will last more than twenty years.

http://www.startribune.com/new-35w-bridge-already-is-aging/268746561/

 

[underguy1]

I take it that the lack of an answer to my questions,

"So how many people do you have on Welfare? How much do they get? and can you actually live on it?"

means that it is largely a media myth.

Since the banking crash your government and ours has poured huge amounts of money into the banking sector to keep it afloat. This was done to cover the huge losses caused by people gambling with other people's money. Those gambling bankers walked away with bonuses amounting to billions of dollars while their losses were made good by the taxpayer. In Effect they are living a life of luxury paid for by the taxpayer. Somehow it would seem that you think that that is OK, but handing out a few hundred dollars to someone with nothing is a terrible sin.

It cost the British taxpayer something in excess of £300 trillion to bail out our banks and that was just the start. That's enough to pay our total benefit bill for several years. However, rather than being outraged about that, sections of our media, and I suspect yours, search out what we call "Social Security Scrounger" stories. It seems that the bigger the amount the less the crime.

No. It cost the government. Taxes don't pay for anything.

And it certainly wasn't 300 trillion.

 

[RUlookingup]

I have personally witnessed the deterioration of the Interstate highway system since the mid-90's, when Republicans got control of the pursestrings. Our infrastructure is being driven literally into the ground, with hardly a trickle of support from Republicans to even restore the Interstate system to what it was in the 70's, never mind upgrading.

Bridge 9340, over the Mississippi River in Minneapolis, was completed in 1967. It collapsed in 2007. The replacement bridge, opened in 2008, is already showing signs of stress and wear. I highly doubt it will last more than twenty years.

http://www.startribune.com/new-35w-bridge-already-is-aging/268746561/

This is what happens in an "everyone gets a trophy" society. Standards are lowered, if they exist at all. Everyone can't be an engineer, doctor, lawyer, etc., etc. In the liberal progressive mindset, it is this "pervasive, all encompassing oppression" which is to blame. Stop pointing fingers and pick up a book and read. Stop this blame game. Set aside your feel good trophies and achieve. Affirmative action is a feel good trophy, a conference title. Win the the championship!!! Smith Barney it and earn it.

 

[DeYaKen]

No. It cost the government. Taxes don't pay for anything.

And it certainly wasn't 300 trillion.

Oh! so governments have other sources of income do they? There you go silly me. I seriously thought that all the money the government spends comes from us. Obviously, I was wrong. They have a private source of income that we know nothing about . All that money they collect just gets put in a big pot so they can share it out on a rainy day. I must remember that next time it rains.

The headline figure was £300,000,000,000,000. I believe that a million million is a US Trillion, correct me if I am wrong. That was just a starting figure, It takes no account of the amount poured in as quantitative easing, all of which went straight into bank reserves. During this time the people running the banks were still paying themselves huge bonuses. Effectively they were paying themselves with our, Oops sorry, the governments, money.

 

[DeYaKen]

This is what happens in an "everyone gets a trophy" society. Standards are lowered, if they exist at all. Everyone can't be an engineer, doctor, lawyer, etc., etc. In the liberal progressive mindset, it is this "pervasive, all encompassing oppression" which is to blame. Stop pointing fingers and pick up a book and read. Stop this blame game. Set aside your feel good trophies and achieve. Affirmative action is a feel good trophy, a conference title. Win the the championship!!! Smith Barney it and earn it.

No, it's what happens when the only important thing is the bottom line. When the people in charge are only interested in the cheapest deal that will last until they are no longer in office.

 

[dan_c00000]

And when socialism/feudalism/the church etc. (the government in any form) starts arbitrarily and intentionally fucking the majority into the poor house/servitude to enrich the elites, shit starts going downhill.

Every time.

Yeah except places like Canada, Denmark, and Norway. Those are just some countries with "arbitrary" regulations. You'll notice they're all doing much better than the United States.

I have personally witnessed the deterioration of the Interstate highway system since the mid-90's, when Republicans got control of the pursestrings. Our infrastructure is being driven literally into the ground, with hardly a trickle of support from Republicans to even restore the Interstate system to what it was in the 70's, never mind upgrading.

Bridge 9340, over the Mississippi River in Minneapolis, was completed in 1967. It collapsed in 2007. The replacement bridge, opened in 2008, is already showing signs of stress and wear. I highly doubt it will last more than twenty years.

http://www.startribune.com/new-35w-bridge-already-is-aging/268746561/

Yup, that's all true. And bot would have it continue because "socialism" is bad.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Yeah except places like Canada, Denmark, and Norway. Those are just some countries with "arbitrary" regulations. You'll notice they're all doing much better than the United States.

They have higher taxes and better social programs.

They do NOT keep common people from making money so that the elites can have it all. In that regard they are LESS regulated than most of America.

Denmark and Norway are MUCH more open markets than the USA. SOMEONE has to pay for all those lovely social programs. IDK about Canada but I suspect it's far less elitist than the US is as well.

Yup, that's all true. And bot would have it continue because "socialism" is bad.

That must be why I sent money and vote to Sanders

You're a liar and a shit bag.

Kill yourself.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Oh! so governments have other sources of income do they? There you go silly me. I seriously thought that all the money the government spends comes from us. Obviously, I was wrong. They have a private source of income that we know nothing about . All that money they collect just gets put in a big pot so they can share it out on a rainy day. I must remember that next time it rains.

The headline figure was £300,000,000,000,000. I believe that a million million is a US Trillion, correct me if I am wrong. That was just a starting figure, It takes no account of the amount poured in as quantitative easing, all of which went straight into bank reserves. During this time the people running the banks were still paying themselves huge bonuses. Effectively they were paying themselves with our, Oops sorry, the governments, money.

Governments do have other sources of income. They are such things as fees and tolls which are paid by people who use the infrastructure or other facilities.

 

[DeYaKen]

Governments do have other sources of income. They are such things as fees and tolls which are paid by people who use the infrastructure or other facilities.

Not in Britain there isn't. Fees and tolls got to the companies that built the facilities. In places where it goes to the Government, you have to ask who pays it? We the people, of course. Such charges and tolls are just another form of taxation.