Thoughts on releasing your submissive

[Loverskitten]

Not that I wouldn't enjoy watching a cat fight here and there...but...

Are you seriously trying to determine whether getting impregnated and dumped is worse or better than getting conditioned and dumped?

Huh? Impregnated? I must have missed this entire part of the thread?

 

[blulilacgrl]

Huh? Impregnated? I must have missed this entire part of the thread?

[laughs] On this point we are in agreement. I am also scratching my head.

I also didn't think it had devolved into a cat fight. I thought we each presented our points and counterpoints in a remarkably civil manner. Double

 

[IrisAlthea]

The proper way is the way that does not cause any delays and misconceptions.

If "the nice and proper way" takes 3 weeks for the person to prepare, get courage for, find the "perfect" timing etc. pp., then I really would prefer the immediate email.

You are not going to prevent the 5 stages of grief, if it's not a consensual break and you are not going to prevent the "How the fuck could he do this to me?" stage, no matter what the other person does.

Heh, I have actually yelled "How the fuck could he do this to me?" at the top of my lungs to the universe. The universe didn't answer.

As for the breaking up part, I agree:
Tell me as soon as possible, preferably face to face if possible.
I will not yell or throw things at you. I'll handle that part later with the universe in the woods. =)
If it's about a long term relationship with practical things to handle, I'd appreciate if we could do that with some dignity left.

Sometimes when people ask questions like this, I think there is a kind of reasoning where D/s is a higher, more evolved kind of relationship and a dominant some kind of superhuman or sometimes the classic gentleman.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Sometimes when people ask questions like this, I think there is a kind of reasoning where D/s is a higher, more evolved kind of relationship and a dominant some kind of superhuman or sometimes the classic gentleman.

For which-- aarggh.

It's like people transfer all of their Harlequin Romance expectations onto this new and exciting version of Happy Ever After.

 

[BiBunny]

I have friends who "stalk" their exes Facebook pages. Me? Nope, I don't even want to know. It's over. I guess I'm kind of hard-hearted.

Ditto.

I've been Interweb-stalked by more than one ex. I may still be, who knows? But me? I'll put up with a lot--way more than most people will. I will ride that sinking ship all the way down to the bottom, even after all the rats have gotten the hell out of Dodge, partly because I'm stubborn and partly because I don't believe in giving up. But when I'm done, I'm done. You are dead to me, to which anyone who's ever pushed me past my tolerance will attest. (This applies to more than just romantic relationships, BTW.)

 

[neci]

I am emerging from the end of a year long D/s relationship that began first online and moved to realtime in 6 months, collared 3 months later. This was the first real time either of us played in realtime and also my first submission. He had 3 other shorter online only submissives in the past.

Long story short, he is moving 1000 miles away and as a result of the distance & other factors we would not be able to maintain our relationship.

That is not what this topic is about however....

What I would love to hear from people is - what do experienced (and not so experienced) people feel is the proper way to release your submissive - collared or not? Online vs. realtime? I have learned so much and at this time only know what it felt to be left twisting in the wind with barely an email to close a very important chapter for both of us.

The ironic part for me is this - can you really know what it means to be a true Dominant if you neglect and throw away your toy which you professed to cherish and protect? To me that is either a possessive assclown who thinks he is a Dominant. Lower case dominant as an adjective might be better for such a person in the future. My thought and understanding was that my Dom knew the gravity and responsibility of his role but perhaps it was just an escape...I am not a mind reader so this will forever be a mystery for me as he is unwilling/unable to give the closure I thought would have been more helpful.

you go. when the contract is over, it is over. no more. it has nothing with being or not being a twue dominant or submissive. it's the termination of a relationship. find people other than that person to help you through. what kind of person would lead someone on, when they knew they could no longer give what was needed? you have to put yourself first and carry on. grieve, do what ever you need to do, but the fat lady sang. i don't understand this "providing closure" thing. do you need him to see you cry and beg? do you need to scream at him? what more can be said than, i can't do it anymore, i am leaving, it will no longer work? sometimes it's just that simple. he can't close your door anymore. that's no longer his job. you have to do that one for yourself.

 

[hisdarlingslut]

It is what it is

"you go. when the contract is over, it is over. no more. it has nothing with being or not being a true dominant or submissive. it's the termination of a relationship. find people other than that person to help you through. what kind of person would lead someone on, when they knew they could no longer give what was needed? you have to put yourself first and carry on. grieve, do what ever you need to do, but the fat lady sang. i don't understand this "providing closure" thing. do you need him to see you cry and beg? do you need to scream at him? what more can be said than, i can't do it anymore, i am leaving, it will no longer work? sometimes it's just that simple. he can't close your door anymore. that's no longer his job. you have to do that one for yourself."

That's it- any relationship is a contract. It's either renewed, amended or ended. Hitting the pause button when I am not sure what the current contract is at any time is part of the many lessons I will walk away with. Loved the idea that a douche is a douche by any other name smells just as.....well we all know.

*******************************************************************

"Every time I’m walking down that tunnel, every time. And once I find out what’s at the end, I’ll figure it out then. But at least I’ll know. I’ll know.

Why would you not want to know?”

-Weeds Nancy Botwin

 

[TJReilly]

I read this thread and just had to throw my 2 cents in. In my opinion as a Dom, how you end a D/s relationship, depends on what the long-term intent is when the relationship begins. When limits and goals are being discussed and agreed upon, Doms and subs rarely, (if ever), discuss the long-term intent of the relationship.

Most D/s couples play at D/s, (and even M/s), with no expectation of a long-term future together, and there’s nothing wrong with role-playing either online or in real life, if that’s what you want in the relationship. When I say playing at D/s, in many D/s relationships, the couple will be Dominant and submissive and times and vanilla at other times; however, if the intent is a 24/7, lifetime committed D/s relationship such as marriage, (which the OP indicated in another thread), it is a horse of a different color.

If there is little or no emotional commitment in the relationship between the couple, (other than commitment to the D/s lifestyle), then when it ends, it ends and there is usually no need of closure. The couple just moves on. However, when the intent of the sub is a lifetime together with her Dom, she becomes emotionally bonded to the Dom. When this is the case, any responsible Dom, (who takes his chosen lifestyle seriously), has to take into consideration that the relationship may not endure, and plan to give his sub closure if it becomes necessary. And if she is willing to accept it.

Even though women these days seem to have an on/off switch on their emotions, some women don’t, and ending a D/s relationship can be devastating for them. When a true sub makes a lifetime commitment to her Dom, the Dom trains her to mold her life around his. Her happiness in life comes from his happiness. Training a woman to be emotionally/psychologically monogamous to a specific Dom is a complicated process that changes the woman emotionally, and to release her without closure can damage her emotionally. It can make her distrustful of men, and difficult to form another relationship of any kind.

Note to the trolls and day-trippers: Before you grab your keyboard and start typing the word “doormat”, I don’t want to hear it! A woman who can commit to the lifestyle at that depth is a rare gem and prized by her Dom. Few women have the inner-strength to make that kind of commitment. It’s easy to make a superficial commitment; then go do your own thing when the going gets tough.

There are ways to end a D/s relationship without damaging the sub emotionally. One, obviously, is to stay with the woman and support her psychologically, (without sleeping in her bed), until she can let go emotionally. Another way is to transition her to a new Dom. This doesn’t mean selling her on the market; this means staying with her, (again without sleeping in her bed), and supporting her psychologically until she can find a compatible Dom and make the transition. It’s a more complex process than I have space to write here, but you get the jest.

Just my opinion. I’m sure other Doms, (and most likely subs), will have other opinions, but this isn’t my first rodeo.

 

[ecstaticsub]

~snip~

There are ways to end a D/s relationship without damaging the sub emotionally. One, obviously, is to stay with the woman and support her psychologically, (without sleeping in her bed), until she can let go emotionally. Another way is to transition her to a new Dom. This doesn’t mean selling her on the market; this means staying with her, (again without sleeping in her bed), and supporting her psychologically until she can find a compatible Dom and make the transition. It’s a more complex process than I have space to write here, but you get the jest.

Just my opinion. I’m sure other Doms, (and most likely subs), will have other opinions, but this isn’t my first rodeo.

Your suggestions are fine however, they still instill a dependency on the dominant. Instead how about asking the submissive how he/she would like closure?

When my relationship first began almost 9 years ago we didn't discuss if it would be a short term relationship or if we both envisioned it lasting 9 yrs or a lifetime. We just took it one day at a time.

If my dominant/owner were to release me right now neither of your suggestions would be what I would want. I do know what I would want, what I would need for closure.

Closure is very personal. In a long term relationship I am sure both partners will be at least a little sad in it's ending. I believe it is right to give a partner closure in the way they would like it to be unless of course that way is too painful/ too unrealistic/too drawn out for the other partner. It is in this case that a dominant should not assume they know best.

 

[TJReilly]

Your suggestions are fine however, they still instill a dependency on the dominant. Instead how about asking the submissive how he/she would like closure?

When my relationship first began almost 9 years ago we didn't discuss if it would be a short term relationship or if we both envisioned it lasting 9 yrs or a lifetime. We just took it one day at a time.

If my dominant/owner were to release me right now neither of your suggestions would be what I would want. I do know what I would want, what I would need for closure.

Closure is very personal. In a long term relationship I am sure both partners will be at least a little sad in it's ending. I believe it is right to give a partner closure in the way they would like it to be unless of course that way is too painful/ too unrealistic/too drawn out for the other partner. It is in this case that a dominant should not assume they know best.

Just by the nature of a D/s relationship, the sub is dependent on the Dom, at least on some level, either emotionally, psychologically, physically or financially, etc. If the sub were not dependent on the Dom at least to some extent, then why would the sub need the Dom in the first place? It just the nature of the beast. With that said, I agree with your 100%, the Dom should ask the sub how she wants closure. Communication and honesty is the foundation of any D/s relationship, just as much at the end as it is in the beginning. However, there is a flaw in both your suggestion and mine, relationships rarely end on an amiable note; more often there is anger and hurt involved, and when anger and hurt are involved, communication becomes difficult if not impossible.

As far as closure, we are saying the same thing, just a difference in semantics. Whether it is closure after a loved one has passed, or the end of a relationship, closure is letting go of the hurt and accepting things as they are.

Again, this is just my opinion, admittedly, a male opinion. However, if you would, I would like a woman's view of closure. I'm always willing to learn.

BTW, I love your Frieda Norris quote.

 

[ecstaticsub]

Just by the nature of a D/s relationship, the sub is dependent on the Dom, at least on some level, either emotionally, psychologically, physically or financially, etc. If the sub were not dependent on the Dom at least to some extent, then why would the sub need the Dom in the first place? It just the nature of the beast.

During the relationship the submissive may be dependent on the dominant but as soon as release occurs, and I mean the very second it occurs the last thing I would want is anything that feels like he is telling me what to do, or how to do it. If he no longer owns me he has no right to do that anymore. Maybe it's just me but my first reaction if my dominant released me and then tried to have me lean on him for support would be to tell him to fuck off. lol

With that said, I agree with your 100%, the Dom should ask the sub how she wants closure. Communication and honesty is the foundation of any D/s relationship, just as much at the end as it is in the beginning. However, there is a flaw in both your suggestion and mine, relationships rarely end on an amiable note; more often there is anger and hurt involved, and when anger and hurt are involved, communication becomes difficult if not impossible.

As far as closure, we are saying the same thing, just a difference in semantics. Whether it is closure after a loved one has passed, or the end of a relationship, closure is letting go of the hurt and accepting things as they are.

Again, this is just my opinion, admittedly, a male opinion. However, if you would, I would like a woman's view of closure. I'm always willing to learn.

My dominant and I are at a very good place right now but we have had our ups and downs just has any couple in a long term relationship. What I would want is to be told in person somewhere private--even a hotel room if he wanted a neutral place. I would want to be able to spend some time talking about the good times that we shared. The times that meant a great deal to both of us. I want to be able to tell him what I love and like about him and for him to tell me the same.

You are right that most relationships end with anger and hurt. I would hope that even if my relationship would end that way that we could be adults and still have the day of closure I described above. Maybe even especially if it ended with pain and anger. I wouldn't want either of us to look back on our relationship and remember anger and pain. It is the good that should be remembered and it is the healthiest way to end a relationship.

BTW, I love your Frieda Norris quote.

Thanks. I am a total shoe whore so it fits me perfectly

 

[Netzach]

I would like a woman's view of closure. I'm always willing to learn.

Hurt, cry in beer, pull up big girl panties, get the fuck on with life? Or do you just mean "sub women who agree with me."

 

[TJReilly]

Hurt, cry in beer, pull up big girl panties, get the fuck on with life? Or do you just mean "sub women who agree with me."

Actually, I meant it as a legitimate question. Certainly there is hurt involved, and crying is part of how a woman finds closure, but, as you say, “pulling up her big girl panties”, I’m not sure that is will result in healthy closure. It seems to me that could cause her to just bottle up her pain, and to get real closure, I think a woman would have to move past the pain, not carry it around inside. Women seem to be more healthy, (emotionally), when they are able to share their pain. And with that said, I will be the first to admit, I am a man and can only have a limited view of how a woman finds closure. And this is why I asked the question: “How does a woman find closure”, from a woman’s point of view?

 

[MeekMe]

Actually, I meant it as a legitimate question. Certainly there is hurt involved, and crying is part of how a woman finds closure, but, as you say, “pulling up her big girl panties”, I’m not sure that is will result in healthy closure. It seems to me that could cause her to just bottle up her pain, and to get real closure, I think a woman would have to move past the pain, not carry it around inside. Women seem to be more healthy, (emotionally), when they are able to share their pain. And with that said, I will be the first to admit, I am a man and can only have a limited view of how a woman finds closure. And this is why I asked the question: “How does a woman find closure”, from a woman’s point of view?

It's different. Women aren't part of some collective brain. We deal differently as individuals. It's been a long time since I've been through "rejection" but honestly there was crying, hobbies, and moving on. I'm sure in most instances it's kind of the same. You feel hurt, you dust yourself off, you get back on.

 

[Loverskitten]

Actually, I meant it as a legitimate question. Certainly there is hurt involved, and crying is part of how a woman finds closure, but, as you say, “pulling up her big girl panties”, I’m not sure that is will result in healthy closure. It seems to me that could cause her to just bottle up her pain, and to get real closure, I think a woman would have to move past the pain, not carry it around inside. Women seem to be more healthy, (emotionally), when they are able to share their pain. And with that said, I will be the first to admit, I am a man and can only have a limited view of how a woman finds closure. And this is why I asked the question: “How does a woman find closure”, from a woman’s point of view?

NEWSFLASH!!!! ALL WOMEN AREN'T THE SAME!





Get it now?

 

[DaddysSatine]

It's the same as ending any other relationship - sometimes you get the closure you want and need; sometimes, you don't.

Yes ... but.
I had two relationships this year end in texts ... one was expected. It was long distance 'vanilla' and we each had lives in the states of residence. But that ending was given on my way to work. Trying not to cry all day was an exercise in self control. I blame him only for the timing. He was a gentleman about the whole thing and admitted he was wrong to handle it that way. We are still distant friends.
The second was Daddy ... months of calls, emails, texts, dinners, in my bed, out for lunch, hotels. He took me as His eye to eye, with intent and sincerity. He was 'Blessed to have me', talk was of long term, the future being bright. Then three days of silence ... and release via text in the midst of a work day ... and never another word of explanation. I have begged and pleaded for just the barest of explanations.
Dominant or vanilla ... such behavior is just rude and selfish. He meandered on to greener pastures (I guess) and left me to pick myself up and forever wonder what was wrong with me. How I had offended him.
I do see a greater emotional dependence and intertwining in the D/s relationship than the vanilla ... but Dominant does not give the D a free pass on being a jackass in how he handles the end of the relationship. You accept the emotional aspect of the Dominant role (as my Daddy did), I feel you actually do owe the submissive a bit of a buffer and the time of day to understand the why. You get to accept the tears or the rage. The choice was not mutual and the sub is entitled to be outraged/upset at you. There are consequences for actions. If I had asked for release, it would have been in person ... I would have accepted his feelings.
My opinion is only mine, and may differ from others ... but that does not make it patently wrong.

 

[TJReilly]

It's different. Women aren't part of some collective brain. We deal differently as individuals.

Certainly, not all women are the same; however, as any psychologist will tell you, people, (both men and woman), share certain common characteristics when working through emotional pain: shock, denial, anger, acceptance, etc. Men in general when faced with an emotional situation they can’t fix, (such as a broken relationship), the will work through the emotional stages, then when they realize they can’t fix it, will let go emotionally and move on. But women have more difficulty in letting go of pain and anger. A woman can be divorce for 20 years, and still harbor anger at her ex-husband for reasons she can’t even remember, and that’s not healthy. When a woman bottles up her anger, it makes her less trusting of men, and more difficult for her to establish a new relationship. And when a woman experiences enough disappointments and broken relationships, she comes to a point where she can’t trust at all. If you don’t think this is the case, go to a grocery store where seniors buy groceries and take a look at some of the old ladies with their jaw clinched and an angry look on their face. How do you think they got that way? So, back to the question: “how do women let of emotional pain and move on with their life in an emotionally healthy way?”

 

[IrisAlthea]

Certainly, not all women are the same; however, as any psychologist will tell you, people, (both men and woman), share certain common characteristics when working through emotional pain: shock, denial, anger, acceptance, etc. Men in general when faced with an emotional situation they can’t fix, (such as a broken relationship), the will work through the emotional stages, then when they realize they can’t fix it, will let go emotionally and move on. But women have more difficulty in letting go of pain and anger. A woman can be divorce for 20 years, and still harbor anger at her ex-husband for reasons she can’t even remember, and that’s not healthy. When a woman bottles up her anger, it makes her less trusting of men, and more difficult for her to establish a new relationship. And when a woman experiences enough disappointments and broken relationships, she comes to a point where she can’t trust at all. If you don’t think this is the case, go to a grocery store where seniors buy groceries and take a look at some of the old ladies with their jaw clinched and an angry look on their face. How do you think they got that way? So, back to the question: “how do women let of emotional pain and move on with their life in an emotionally healthy way?”

Yes, I'm sure there is some kind of statistical mean "typical woman" if you really look in to it.
It's just that no woman can answer the question about how women get over a break up. How do I get over it or at most how do the women I know get over it is the most you are going to get.
Even if you would get to know how this "typical woman" handles break up it would do you absolutely no good, because the difference between individuals within the group "women" is greater than the difference between the statistical mean women and men.

 

[TJReilly]

Yes, I'm sure there is some kind of statistical mean "typical woman" if you really look in to it.
It's just that no woman can answer the question about how women get over a break up. How do I get over it or at most how do the women I know get over it is the most you are going to get.
Even if you would get to know how this "typical woman" handles break up it would do you absolutely no good, because the difference between individuals within the group "women" is greater than the difference between the statistical mean women and men.

I didn’t mean to imply that my question *had* to be answered, rather I was indicating it is still on the table. My point is, if a Dom can understand how a woman bottles up and releases her emotions, (or sometimes not), it would be an invaluable tool for the Dom. Emotional trauma isn’t only the result of a broken relationship, women can experience the same emotional upheaval from any kind of loss. When a Dom is the stabilizing force in a subs life, it is normal for her to turn to her Dom for help when she suffers emotional upheaval. Honestly, how to help his sub through an emotional crisis is one of the most difficult situations a Dom has to deal with. Where the phrase, “get over it”, works with male subs, it doesn’t work very well with female subs.

 

[Dyslexicea]

Actually, I meant it as a legitimate question. Certainly there is hurt involved, and crying is part of how a woman finds closure, but, as you say, “pulling up her big girl panties”, I’m not sure that is will result in healthy closure. It seems to me that could cause her to just bottle up her pain, and to get real closure, I think a woman would have to move past the pain, not carry it around inside. Women seem to be more healthy, (emotionally), when they are able to share their pain. And with that said, I will be the first to admit, I am a man and can only have a limited view of how a woman finds closure. And this is why I asked the question: “How does a woman find closure”, from a woman’s point of view?

I'm with Netz, a person needs to move on, no matter what kind of relationship it happens to be. To think she needs a man to do so, shows just how limited your views about us are. From your other posts I have to say you have your head up your ass in regards to women period.

I'm not sure I really understand why this thread is only about women or even those who are submissive. I'm sure we all understand for a Domme the breakup of a loving relationship can be just as devastating on her as any other woman but what about a Dom? Men do have emotions, even when they play the role of macho man. Some of my male friends have had a very hard time even functioning after a breakup and the tears do fall, men are not immune from crying. Breakups are hard on both parties in any kind of relationship, even those where they've both ended up hating each other.

 

[IrisAlthea]

I didn’t mean to imply that my question *had* to be answered, rather I was indicating it is still on the table. My point is, if a Dom can understand how a woman bottles up and releases her emotions, (or sometimes not), it would be an invaluable tool for the Dom. Emotional trauma isn’t only the result of a broken relationship, women can experience the same emotional upheaval from any kind of loss. When a Dom is the stabilizing force in a subs life, it is normal for her to turn to her Dom for help when she suffers emotional upheaval. Honestly, how to help his sub through an emotional crisis is one of the most difficult situations a Dom has to deal with. Where the phrase, “get over it”, works with male subs, it doesn’t work very well with female subs.

All of the bolded parts in your posts are generalizations. They will hardly help anyone deal with a specific person.

I don't think anyone suggested that it would be a good idea to tell anyone to get over it. It's the point you get to yourself when the beer is starting to get too diluted and you need to take care of job, kids and other things that don't cease to exist because breaking up is hard to do.

 

[TJReilly]

.....

 

[MeekMe]

What I would love to hear from people is - what do experienced (and not so experienced) people feel is the proper way to release your submissive - collared or not? Online vs. realtime? I have learned so much and at this time only know what it felt to be left twisting in the wind with barely an email to close a very important chapter for both of us.

The ironic part for me is this - can you really know what it means to be a true Dominant if you neglect and throw away your toy which you professed to cherish and protect? To me that is either a possessive assclown who thinks he is a Dominant. Lower case dominant as an adjective might be better for such a person in the future. My thought and understanding was that my Dom knew the gravity and responsibility of his role but perhaps it was just an escape...I am not a mind reader so this will forever be a mystery for me as he is unwilling/unable to give the closure I thought would have been more helpful.

The OP didn't ask a gender specific question about heterosexual couples.
Even if she is heterosexual.

This thread was started by a heterosexual woman asking advice about how to deal a break up in a relationship with a heterosexual man. How could you possibly know anything about men or male/female heterosexual relationships! You need to butt-out and keep your nose out of other people’s business, particularly in matters you can’t possibly know anything about. Particularly keep your nose out of my business! On your profile, you say Iowa sucks, Iowa is a good state; you don’t like it because you don’t fit in. You don’t own this world, you just live in it!

I am done with this thread.

It doesn't matter if someone is or isn't homo/hetero/all the other things out there.

As for your business, I've also looked at some of your posts and feel the same way. I think you have a generalized view of D/s relationships and the way you see it, is everyone must be doing what you're doing. Truth is, there's no right or wrong way.

Again, everyone is different and we handle things differently. I know men who would cry sorely over the loss of a relationship and I know women who would blow it off and move on with their lives while not holding some crazy grudge for years.

 

[neci]

If you don’t think this is the case, go to a grocery store where seniors buy groceries and take a look at some of the old ladies with their jaw clinched and an angry look on their face. How do you think they got that way?

http://cdn.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/tumblr_mc7x09ozyX1rjv4j2o1_500.gif

 

[MeekMe]

http://cdn.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/tumblr_mc7x09ozyX1rjv4j2o1_500.gif

LMAO

Fantastic!