Trump Gives NATO A Kick In The Pants

[Meekly_Anna]

Bosnia, Vietnam, WW2.....like 30 "armed conflicts" ranging from singluar raids in the middle east to keep the straights open and dropping Lybian Mig's violating European airspace to smoking north african pirates causing problems in the Med.

We've been policing Europes back yard since the end of WW2 and they haven't taken it seriously since the fall of the USSR.....time to let them stand on their own two feet.

Yes, yes, you are right.
And now hop along and proceed playing hero with your mates at the asylum.

 

[LoneMilf]

Bosnia, Vietnam, WW2.....like 30 "armed conflicts" ranging from singluar raids in the middle east to keep the straights open and dropping Lybian Mig's violating European airspace to smoking north african pirates causing problems in the Med.

We've been policing Europes back yard since the end of WW2 and they haven't taken it seriously since the fall of the USSR.....time to let them stand on their own two feet.

I'll just take one of those..

The NATO intervention in Bosnia and Herzegovina, which began on December 14, 1995, was a significant military operation aimed at implementing a peace agreement following years of brutal conflict among the country’s ethnic groups: Bosniaks, Croats, and Serbs. Triggered by a series of atrocities, including the massacre in Srebrenica, the intervention sought to replace the ineffective United Nations peacekeeping mission with a robust NATO presence of approximately 60,000 troops, including 20,000 from the United States. The operation was characterized by an initial lack of resistance from the warring factions, who welcomed the NATO forces and cooperated with their efforts to establish peace.
(https://www.ebsco.com/research-starters/history/nato-intervention-bosnia-and-herzegovina)

So the US mustered 1/3 of the forces used in Bosnia. How is that equal to the EU using the US as their private military?

 

[Chadrone]

So the US mustered 1/3 of the forces used in Bosnia. How is that equal to the EU using the US as their private military?

1) They didn't do shit except write some strongly worded letters until the US finally agreed to bring overwhelming firepower to the show.

2) 1/3 of the manpower doesn't = 1/3 of force application......when it came to flying into contested airspace to put warheads on foreheads and sneaking miles in through the night to kick the bad guys doors in while he's still sleeping?? The VAST majority of that was done by US forces.

 

[LoneMilf]

1) They didn't do shit except write some strongly worded letters until the US finally agreed to bring overwhelming firepower to the show.

2) 1/3 of the manpower doesn't = 1/3 of force application......when it came to flying into contested airspace to put warheads on foreheads and sneaking miles in through the night to kick the bad guys doors in while he's still sleeping?? The VAST majority of that was done by US forces.

Do you have any sources showing that difference in what the forces did? Or is that purely your speculation?

 

[LLCox]

I love how the orange pervert divorces himself from NATO but continues to tell them what to do. NATO should put a golden sign on their door saying STFU. The US has been suckers for too long to complain now.

 

[Cogan]

Bosnia, Vietnam, WW2.....like 30 "armed conflicts" ranging from singluar raids in the middle east to keep the straights open and dropping Lybian Mig's violating European airspace to smoking north african pirates causing problems in the Med.

We've been policing Europes back yard since the end of WW2 and they haven't taken it seriously since the fall of the USSR.....time to let them stand on their own two feet.

And you taking home your forces in Germany and telling the Germans to not increase their forces is our fault?
USA told Europe what to do from ww2, and when two idiots took over and call themself President and Vice President, then all of a sudden it was our fault that you decided how strong our forces should be.
If you'd let us we would manage on our own all along! At least the last 40 years.

 

[Chadrone]

Do you have any sources showing that difference in what the forces did? Or is that purely your speculation?

Not on hand, but you can look at all the damage done on wiki.

Who's F-16's and F117 stealth jets got shot down over Bosnia?? They weren't European.

I'm sure you can FOIA all the "peace keeping" operations info... if you want to be the typical lefty/democrat and pretend the US did nothing except be racist Nazis, go right ahead, most do that untill the racist nazis decide to grab their weapons of war and go home.

 

[Meekly_Anna]

Donald Trump dies and, if anyone should, goes straight to hell. The devil is generous and says that such a compliant fool, who has made so many people's lives hell, is entitled to one wish.
The devil leads him through hell and shows him the various punishments available. Since Donald is a cowardly worm who doesn't even have any decency after his death, he rejects everything. The devil slowly begins to doubt and then says that there is one more thing Donald could have. He opens a door and they enter a room that looks exactly like the Oval Office. There are cold drinks and, unlike the rest of hell, it is quite pleasant there.
Bill Clinton is sitting at the desk watching a baseball game on television, while Monica Lewinsky is sitting under the desk giving Bill Clinton a blow job.
Donald Trump is delighted and shouts that he could do much better. The devil smiles and says, ‘All right, Monica, you can go.’

 

[icanhelp1]

Basically that's how it's been since the fall of the Soviet Union.



Yea your absolutes that you threw in there were wrong but the basic message was right.



LMFAO!!!! No they haven't FOUGHT any....they love starting them though. Even Vietnam was started by the French.....



Pissant help from nearly non-existent militaries that wouldn't be able to deploy out of their backyards if it wasn't for us.

And again most of them were for European interest.



Sure, the 80's was a wild time and a totally different geopolitical climate.



He never assumed it was, he's telling Europe that the US is not their bitch....and they can't deal.

No it's comming to an end because Europeans look at America like shit on their shoes while expecting us to fund/fight their wars....and America has had about enough.



Not liking how I say something doesn't make it half wrong, I was wright about everything I said, you just didn't like how I said it. Just like a woman.....



Ohh look it's Officer Anna from the Tone Police.....sure your name isn't Karen??

They fund these massive welfare programs, take in migrants they can't afford at the expense of their own defense. National healthcare is easy to afford when they strip funding required for their own defense while relying on the US to wipe their ass.

We, over the years find ourselves in the same downward spiral as the Europeans...FREEBIES FOREVER... ACCEPT ALL ILLEGAL MIGRANTS because DEMOCRATS ARE ALL ABOUT SUICIDAL EMPATHY and AMERICA LAST ideology. We too, as a nation, are in deep shit.

 

[icanhelp1]

Can you give any examples of this happening at all?

When Russia was building up a huge military presence on the Ukraine border where was the EU?

 

[Meekly_Anna]

When Russia was building up a huge military presence on the Ukraine border where was the EU?

Where were the USA? Weren't there security guarantees that you promised?
What? Donald doesn't remember? But he's a genius!

 

[Cogan]

When Russia was building up a huge military presence on the Ukraine border where was the EU?

When Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons USA promised to keep them safe, as they have promised Europe before.
But promises isn't important to your so called leader.

 

[icanhelp1]

Where were the USA? Weren't there security guarantees that you promised?

First off who's more impacted by Russian expansionism, the US or Europe? Ukraine is in Europe's back yard. In the beginning Biden pretty much funded Ukraine's defense. Europe's response other than humanitarian aid was a dereliction of their own defense posture.

The Budapest Memorandum was not a legally binding military security guarantee especially since Russia was also a signature.

What? Donald doesn't remember? But he's a genius!

Trump never forgot. He stopped massive spending of tax payer money and transferred that responsibility back to where it belonged... Europe.

 

[LLCox]

When Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons USA promised to keep them safe, as they have promised Europe before.
But promises isn't important to your so called leader.

I support six acres in WNC. I ask for no help but Smith and Wesson.

 

[HisArpy]

When Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons USA promised to keep them safe, as they have promised Europe before.
But promises isn't important to your so called leader.

You need to look at the calendar and then google who was President when Russia invaded Ukraine.

Because what you believe is true, isn't. It's nothing but a product of stupidity and blindly following the narrative because you're too dam lazy to think, or do, for yourself.

 

[LoneMilf]

I'm sure you can FOIA all the "peace keeping" operations info... if you want to be the typical lefty/democrat and pretend the US did nothing except be racist Nazis, go right ahead, most do that untill the racist nazis decide to grab their weapons of war and go home.

I've never claimed the US did nothing. I believe all forces involved in NATO made significant and professional contributions - regardless of what nation they happened to be from. I haven't seen any proof that the US does this any more or less than other NATO members in general, which is why I think it's a little silly to claim that the EU has been using the US as their private military. NATO has always been a collaboration.

 

[Chadrone]

I've never claimed the US did nothing. I believe all forces involved in NATO made significant and professional contributions - regardless of what nation they happened to be from. I haven't seen any proof that the US does this any more or less than other NATO members in general, which is why I think it's a little silly to claim that the EU has been using the US as their private military.

Are you fucking serious???



I guess if an anti-Americal Europhillic professor or media personality doesn't hand it to you, it's not proof.

Just ignore the INSANELY disproportionate ammount of money and firepower the US spends

 

[LoneMilf]

Are you fucking serious???



I guess if an anti-Americal Europhillic professor or media personality doesn't hand it to you, it's not proof.

Just ignore the INSANELY disproportionate ammount of money and firepower the US spends

Money isn't spent on NATO, it's spent on building up and maintaining national armies. What matters is what is put into action in missions - and we've just seen how the US contributed 1/3 of the troops in Bosnia.

 

[Chadrone]

And you taking home your forces in Germany and telling the Germans to not increase their forces is our fault?

Yes...starting and then losing WW2 was the Germans fault.

USA told Europe what to do from ww2, and when two idiots took over and call themself President and Vice President,

You mean DEMOCRACY elected two people as President and Vice President.....you like DEMOCRACY right??

then all of a sudden it was our fault that you decided how strong our forces should be.

We just put a limit. German growing stale and weak within those limits is still on Germany.

Japan did the exact opposite with even stricter limits up until just a few years ago and it's been just fine.

If you'd let us we would manage on our own all along! At least the last 40 years.

You'd already be in WW3 again and begging us to come police it up for you AGAIN.

 

[Chadrone]

Money isn't spent on NATO,

When we depoly to support NATO operations, we're spending astro-fucking-nomical ammounts of money.

it's spent on building up and maintaining national armies.

That is but a mere tip o' the iceberg. The F-16 is not that expensive....all the shit to keep it armed and flying? Insanely expensive.

What matters is what is put into action in missions - and we've just seen how the US contributed 1/3 of the troops in Bosnia.

1/3.....for 1 nation of 32, to send their military forces to the other side of the planet to police the other 27's back yard. Just on the personell numbers that's insanely disproportionate. Add arms and cash outlay for force projection, deploying carrier groups, SOF and combat brigades? And it's even more lopsided.

Like I said, INSANELY disproportionate of the arms and action is done by US forces. To the extent that without the US military? There is no NATO force. Just a bunch of Eurosnobs writing strongly worded letters.

 

[Cogan]

You need to look at the calendar and then google who was President when Russia invaded Ukraine.

Because what you believe is true, isn't. It's nothing but a product of stupidity and blindly following the narrative because you're too dam lazy to think, or do, for yourself.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum

 

[LoneMilf]

When we depoly to support NATO operations, we're spending astro-fucking-nomical ammounts of money.




That is but a mere tip o' the iceberg. The F-16 is not that expensive....all the shit to keep it armed and flying? Insanely expensive.



1/3.....for 1 nation of 32.

Like I said, INSANELY disproportionate of the arms and action is done by US forces. To the extent that without the US military? There is no NATO force.

So you think every country should contribute the same? Denmark, with a population of 6 million should contribute the same as the US? That makes no sense. The US has made very significant contributions to NATO no matter how you measure it, but to say that they are insanely disproportionate or that the EU is using the US as their private military also does not make sense.

 

[Cogan]

Yes...starting and then losing WW2 was the Germans fault.

But not the fact that USA decided to move out beginning in 1989 telling Germany that we'll be back if you need us.

You mean DEMOCRACY elected two people as President and Vice President.....you like DEMOCRACY right??

We'll see how long the democracy works...........

We just put a limit. German growing stale and weak within those limits is still on Germany.

Japan did the exact opposite with even stricter limits up until just a few years ago and it's been just fine.

Nope! When it comes to military force USA has put a limit on and now tell Germany to straiten up is unfair!
The people and country is no weaker than anybody else. They just had to play by the rules set up by the winning forces.

You'd already be in WW3 again and begging us to come police it up for you AGAIN.

And why would you care since you obviously don't now?

 

[Chadrone]

So you think every country should contribute the same? Denmark, with a population of 6 million should contribute the same as the US?

No I think they should pay for their own shit and fight their own wars.

That makes no sense.

I agree, America is getting fucked and we should GTFO of NATO. It's not good for us.

The US has made very significant contributions to NATO no matter how you measure it, but to say that they are insanely disproportionate or that the EU is using the US as their private military also does not make sense.

Then it won't matter if we take all of the force application and projection, because we have essentially all of it and leave.

Yet that's not the observable reaction we're getting at just the mention of doing so.

 

[Chadrone]

But not the fact that USA decided to move out beginning in 1989 telling Germany that we'll be back if you need us.

Why does the USA have that authority in the first place??

Right....

We'll see how long the democracy works...........

One of the longest running on the planet. Despite Democrats best efforts to subvert it.

Nope! When it comes to military force USA has put a limit on and now tell Germany to straiten up is unfair!

No it's not.

1) Being limited doesn't mean you don't have to pay your fair share.
2) They lost.

The people and country is no weaker than anybody else.

Then why don't you just tell Trump to STFU or you'll come kick our ass???

They just had to play by the rules set up by the winning forces.

Justify it all you want, you don't have the force projection power the US does, it's not even close.

And why would you care since you obviously don't now?

As long as they kept it over there, I wouldn't.