Voter Fraud in New York Primary

[Sean Renaud]

Because it is not his home, he's just passing through.

It is his home. That's where he lives for the duration of his job which in the military or college could easily be a four year stint or longer. Additionally at the Presidential level he is a resident of the US.

Beyond even that not everybody lives in a tiny state. Some of us commute. The fact that I drive to LA to work shouldn't mean I need a day off from my business to vote.

Course we could just computerize the damn thing.

As for Absentee ballots (sorry got lost in your fucked up quote but it was in there) nobody seems to care enough to make a stink. And there could be massive fraud there. Of course shy of sending pollsters to peoples homes there isn't much of a way to fix that aside from outright eliminating it.

Credit card fraud, Ponzi schemes, etc. They are still belong to the came type of crime.

No they don't. Those are all specific crimes with their own codes.

 

[Real_American12]

It is his home. That's where he lives for the duration of his job which in the military or college could easily be a four year stint or longer.

Doesn't matter, if you are from PA and in CA for school/military/work, you should not be able to vote in CA.

Additionally at the Presidential level he is a resident of the US.

That's not how the election works, they look at votes from each state, and each state goes to one candidate or the other.

A bunch of voters from a populous liberal state like CA shouldn't be able to change the voting demographic of a low population state like AK.

Beyond even that not everybody lives in a tiny state. Some of us commute. The fact that I drive to LA to work shouldn't mean I need a day off from my business to vote.

That's why they have absentee ballots.

Also, it's the 21st century, technology has changed, I'm sure they can come up with some tech savvy and secure way to tele-vote.

Course we could just computerize the damn thing.

I'd be worried about removing to much from human interaction... seems to easy to commit fraud.

As for Absentee ballots (sorry got lost in your fucked up quote but it was in there) nobody seems to care enough to make a stink. And there could be massive fraud there. Of course shy of sending pollsters to peoples homes there isn't much of a way to fix that aside from outright eliminating it.

Have sworn officers sent to verify under penalty of prosecution.

Just like when they issue a court summons and carry out a search warrant.

No they don't. Those are all specific crimes with their own codes.

They are all crimes related to rigging elections.

 

[Sean Renaud]

It's your opinion that they should not be able to vote. But really it has no basis in reality. Either voting is a right and my physical location at the time a vote comes up shouldn't matter or it's not.

California should have more sway than it does to begin with but if people are willing to to register in another state for that so be it.

Yes both voter fraud and voter supression are about changing elections. But voter supression isn't even illegal and they are from opposite stand points. Your essentially saying that theft (me taking your car from you) is the same as me firing you so you can't afford your car and have to sell to me. The end goal is the same (sorta) but the methods are different.

Additionally voter fraud is much less effective. I couldn't vote 100k times if I tried. 60 minutes in an hour, 24 hours in a day (not that pols are open all day) if I could vote once a minute I could only accomplish 1440 and that's not possible. By contrast intentionally or not New York knocked out over 100k on just the Democrat side and then reports of perhaps thousands of ballots lacking Trump's name on the Republicans. So yeah not remotely the same in terms of real problems.

 

[phrodeau]

Politicians know that, without elections, they can't be voted out of office.

 

[Real_American12]

Either voting is a right

It is not a right.

my physical location at the time a vote comes up shouldn't matter or it's not.

It should, why should a student from CA going to college be able to effect the politics of PA?

California should have more sway than it does to begin with but if people are willing to to register in another state for that so be it.

Because you are scum and believe in rule of mob not rule of law.

But voter supression isn't even illegal and they are from opposite stand points.

What? How can it be legal?

Your essentially saying that theft (me taking your car from you) is the same as me firing you so you can't afford your car and have to sell to me.

Apples and oranges.

Rigging the ballots so a candidate is not on it and can't be voted for is the fame rigging the votes so that a candidate gets more votes than in reality.

Additionally voter fraud is much less effective. I couldn't vote 100k times if I tried. 60 minutes in an hour, 24 hours in a day (not that pols are open all day) if I could vote once a minute I could only accomplish 1440 and that's not possible. By contrast intentionally or not New York knocked out over 100k on just the Democrat side and then reports of perhaps thousands of ballots lacking Trump's name on the Republicans. So yeah not remotely the same in terms of real problems.

What Dems like to do is get bus loads of their voting-crop and send them to multiple locations.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Honestly I don't believe that rights exist to begin with but most Americans would argue that being able to vote is a right. You disagree. Fair enough. The reason why a student from CA going to college should be able to effect the politics of PA is because he fucking lives there and their politics directly effect him. Honestly I think a better question is why is allowed an absentee ballot to make decisions that largely don't effect him and in many cases he has limited ways to directly gather information on.

There really isn't a clearly defined difference between rule of mob and rule of law. I know you keep clinging to crap people said that doesn't really make sense but still. In this case the laws are wrong and were simply put in place for a number of reasons primarily that Congress was getting out of hand. I'm not certain fucking California was an intentional goal but it sure as fuck happened.

How is voter suppression legal? You have the guys who write the laws make laws. Like Voter ID laws that knock out hundreds of thousands of voters. Or you change the hours of the voting. Or you cut the number of voting locations drastically. It's all perfectly legal. The fact is that "legal" and "right" are two very different words.

Could you stick to your script? If voter fraud and voter suppression are apples and oranges (which is correct) why did you say they were the same a few posts back? And removing Trump's name from the ballot doesn't mean you can't vote for him. Not unless they also took away the write in portion. It just means you have to have heard of Donald Trump and know he was running for President. A tall order for Trump supporters who collectively have an IQ of banana but not impossible. Not even difficult.

I am not justifying it. That is wrong, whoever did it should be sent to jail. But lets not confuse the effect of a few thousand ballots needing someone to write in a name and a hundred thousand or more once you talk nationwide being denied the ability to vote all together. You're comparing speed bumps to mine fields and claiming they both impede progress. You ain't wrong but. . .

Dems can't get busloads of voting-crop and send them to multiple locations. It's simply not possible. You have to be registered to vote. So in order for this kind of scheme to work you'd have to bus in a bunch of people, know which individuals hadn't voted yet/wouldn't vote at all, have your minions memorize the correct names.

Basically you need an inside man. The kind that if you had going through this much trouble to screw with the vote would be absurd to the nth degree.

 

[phrodeau]

(edited)
As far as (Un)Real_American is concerned, this Web site has marked this poster as banned, and I'm fine with honoring that and pretending that poster isn't here, even as (Un)Real pretends not to get the message.

He's still in the troll infancy stage, where he just posts lies in order to get responses.

 

[Real_American12]

...

I told you before about you text walls.

He's still in the troll infancy stage, where he just posts lies in order to get responses.

"In a time of universal deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act." - George Orwell

 

[Sean Renaud]

And I told you I refuse to parse your shit out that far. I only parse actual text walls and neither of us are in the habit of posting anything that justifies that many micro quotes which in turn make quoting it back a bitch.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Except the states that have tried to implement voter ID laws have also made those ID's very difficult to obtain by closing down DMV offices forcing voters to travel long distances to obtain voter ID, opening some DMV offices one day per week or even as infrequently as one day per month.

Alabama for example closed 31 satellite DMV offices throughout the state.
Every single county in which blacks make up more than 75 percent of registered voters had their driver license offices closed. Every one.

Put these two things together—Voter ID and 29 counties without a place where you can get one—and Voter ID becomes what the Democrats always said it was. A blatant attempt to disenfranchise voters, not to prevent in person voter fraud which is so rare as to be statistically zero.

All that may be true but it doesn't make voter ID racist.

And so what if Republicans are trying to disenfranchise voters? They do it all the fucking time and so do democrats....neither party has any fucking interest at all in the other teams people voting and they have built in mechanisms to disenfranchise their own voters all along the political process just in case they don't like what their own voters have to say.

And America seems to like it that way.

We seen exactly who ends up unable to vote when these laws are enacted and it is predominantly minority people. Why at the end of the day doesn't really matter only that it clearly does.

It certainly does matter, you're only dismissing it because 'why' just makes those minorities look like lazy fucks who clearly don't give that much of a shit about voting and the claims of racism laughable.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Even if they are lazy fucks it doesn't change the results.

If for the sake of argument I'm a seven foot tall Asian named Yao Ming and I live in a house with Tom Cruise, Danny Devito, Sarah Michelle Gellar and 6'5" Dwyane Johnson it's racist against white peopel to put the cookies on top of the fridge.

But make no mistake. If you look at the results of an election and decide you could turn things in your favor if you got rid of all the fucks who refused to touch the door frame on the way in and found that 90% of Hispanics don't touch door frames the end result of your action is racist. It may or may not have been a mistake at the time but that doesn't change the results.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Even if they are lazy fucks it doesn't change the results.

If for the sake of argument I'm a seven foot tall Asian named Yao Ming and I live in a house with Tom Cruise, Danny Devito, Sarah Michelle Gellar and 6'5" Dwyane Johnson it's racist against white peopel to put the cookies on top of the fridge.

Except no one is putting cookies on top of the fridge.....they are just taking them from the couch and putting them at the dining room table. There is no extra paperwork or special line for minorities. We all have to go down and do the same song and dance for the man, fill out the same paperwork, take a number from the same machine and wait in the same line.

If Cruse, Devito and Gellar decide 'fuck it' Real Houswives of Whogivesafuck is on and decide to stay on the couch instead of going to eat in the dining area it's not racist.

White folks in the house just aren't hungry...more for you, The Rock and Yao.

If they get hungry they can go sit at the same table and eat the same shit you guys are.

The only thing stopping them is their choice not to take the extra step.

 

[Real_American12]

The only thing stopping them is their choice not to take the extra step.

Hey, watch it... holding minorities to the same expectations as whites is considered racist these days.

Check your privilege!

 

[Sean Renaud]

Except no one is putting cookies on top of the fridge.....they are just taking them from the couch and putting them at the dining room table. There is no extra paperwork or special line for minorities. We all have to go down and do the same song and dance for the man, fill out the same paperwork, take a number from the same machine and wait in the same line.

If Cruse, Devito and Gellar decide 'fuck it' Real Houswives of Whogivesafuck is on and decide to stay on the couch instead of going to eat in the dining area it's not racist.

White folks in the house just aren't hungry...more for you, The Rock and Yao.

If they get hungry they can go sit at the same table and eat the same shit you guys are.

The only thing stopping them is their choice not to take the extra step.

Yes it is. The end effect is EXACTLY the same as is your goal. To deny white people cookies. It doesn't matter that they could choose to do something differently. They could choose to do a lot of things differently. Including buy cookie jars that are glued to the counter with tiny opening that big Samoan hands can't fit into.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Yes it is. The end effect is EXACTLY the same as is your goal. To deny white people cookies. It doesn't matter that they could choose to do something differently. They could choose to do a lot of things differently. Including buy cookie jars that are glued to the counter with tiny opening that big Samoan hands can't fit into.

The goal is not to stop white people from eating cookies, it's to keep cookie eating at the table where eating should be done. If white folks happen to not want cookies enough to go eat them, then that's not racism.

White folks calling it racism that's white people throwing a temper tantrum because they gotta eat at the dinner table instead of in front of the PS4/Interwebz. And their choice to throw the tantrum instead of going to the table to eat doesn't make the dinner table racist, it makes the white people tantrum throwing shits.

If they don't want to go to bed hungry or miss their chance to vote for tomorrows dinner being served on the couch they had better get in the dining room with the rest of the clan and participate.

Same way if I want to be a farmer I gotta comply with all the ridiculous irrelevant bullshit regulations CA puts on me. It's just stupid shit I have to put up with....like a drivers licence....like voter registration...like any number of other stupid fucking things I have to do for the government to get what I want. As long as everyone else trying to get the same things I am is putting up with the same fuckin' shit I am I don't get to cry racist/discrimination. Even if it makes most Asians/white people say "Fuck farming I'm going to medical school.".

 

[Real_American12]

Including buy cookie jars that are glued to the counter with tiny opening that big Samoan hands can't fit into.

That's such a funny mental picture!

 

[Sean Renaud]

The goal is not to stop white people from eating cookies, it's to keep cookie eating at the table where eating should be done. If white folks happen to not want cookies enough to go eat them, then that's not racism.

White folks calling it racism that's white people throwing a temper tantrum because they gotta eat at the dinner table instead of in front of the PS4/Interwebz. And their choice to throw the tantrum instead of going to the table to eat doesn't make the dinner table racist, it makes the white people tantrum throwing shits.

If they don't want to go to bed hungry or miss their chance to vote for tomorrows dinner being served on the couch they had better get in the dining room with the rest of the clan and participate.

Same way if I want to be a farmer I gotta comply with all the ridiculous irrelevant bullshit regulations CA puts on me. It's just stupid shit I have to put up with....like a drivers licence....like voter registration...like any number of other stupid fucking things I have to do for the government to get what I want. As long as everyone else trying to get the same things I am is putting up with the same fuckin' shit I am I don't get to cry racist/discrimination. Even if it makes most Asians/white people say "Fuck farming I'm going to medical school.".

You for whatever reason think that choice negates racism. Which simply isn't true.

Your example effects everybody equally as far as anybody has displayed. If you were to show facts that for whatever reason one of those things was just something most white guys had from High School and Asians didn't you'd be spot on. Even if it was something you could go and snag.

 

[BotanyBoy]

You for whatever reason think that choice negates racism. Which simply isn't true.

As long as everyone gets the same choice of the same options it does.

Voter ID doesn't block any minority group from voting. It inconveniences everyone equally. By every objective measure the law is in no way racist.

Now are there racist intentions in the origins of the law? Sure there are....but the law is not racist.

Play the game.....go get that ID...outvote them and put all the DMV's in the hood just for the lulz. As long as you don't make white men jump through any extra hoops, you're good! Manipulate it to your advantage. flip the script on them, quit fucking voting shitbags into office over and over and over again.


I only deleted the last part of that because I'm lost it made no sense to me.

 

[Sean Renaud]

As long as everyone gets the same choice of the same options it does.

Voter ID doesn't block any minority group from voting. It inconveniences everyone equally. By every objective measure the law is in no way racist.

Now are there racist intentions in the origins of the law? Sure there are....but the law is not racist.

Play the game.....go get that ID...outvote them and put all the DMV's in the hood just for the lulz. As long as you don't make white men jump through any extra hoops, you're good! Manipulate it to your advantage. flip the script on them, quit fucking voting shitbags into office over and over and over again.


I only deleted the last part of that because I'm lost it made no sense to me.

Don't worry you nailed the important part and I bolded it.

I would go as far as to say if it had the opposite effect people would change it tootsweet. How long has that Drug War you love so much been going? By comparison how long was the war on Alcohol? The one where white guys started gangs?

 

[BotanyBoy]

Don't worry you nailed the important part and I bolded it.

Feeling wronged because you're forced to endure suck that some other asshole managed to squeeze in the game just because it suits their racist agenda doesn't make the law racist. It fits the rules....technically the law is not racist, that's the reality of politics.

I would go as far as to say if it had the opposite effect people would change it tootsweet.

EXACTLY.....but it worked and minorities proved the white man right, by just saying fuck it and not giving a fuck and it sends the minorities who do care to the fucking moon.

I get it...but the law itself isn't racist. They won this battle playing by the rules fair and square man. And you being in the military know god damn good and well the only way to fight that fire is with fire, follow the rules, play the bureaucracy game and make changes from within.

I.E. minorities need to prove the bigots wrong, not be lazy fucks, go down to the DMV and put up with that huge gubmint bullshit libz love until it bites them in the ass, and start voting to get rid of it.

How long has that Drug War you love so much been going? By comparison how long was the war on Alcohol? The one where white guys started gangs?

People love the war on drugs though for a long time it's been overwhelmingly popular.

But we the poteheads of America have worked HARD AS FUCK and we are effectively neutering the war on drugs state by state.

Minorities are going to have to get off their ass and stop this, or they will be subject to it.

 

[Sean Renaud]

I think we are in agreement here tbh. We're simply fixated on different aspects.

I think if the motivation for setting a standard is clearly based in race then the action become racist. That's not REALLY a value judgement so much as a fact. A law against fades isn't going to do much to the average white guy. Outlawing golf isn't going to do much to the average (well anybody but still my point remains.)

You seem to think that as long as it's on the up and up legally that means it's not racist. Because rules are rules and are essentially incapable of being racist.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I think we are in agreement here tbh. We're simply fixated on different aspects.

I'm 100 on that.

I think if the motivation for setting a standard is clearly based in race then the action become racist. That's not REALLY a value judgement so much as a fact. A law against fades isn't going to do much to the average white guy. Outlawing golf isn't going to do much to the average (well anybody but still my point remains.)

No argument.

You seem to think that as long as it's on the up and up legally that means it's not racist. Because rules are rules and are essentially incapable of being racist.

No, it's racist. I'm arguing the legal/political side of this...not the real world shit.

I think as long as it's on the up and up legally it's not legally racist so trying to play the race card ain't gonna fly to change this beyond pointing it out to get more people in the fight.

Taking advantage of a demographics apathy as racist as it is, is that groups fault to the extent it's just not going to stand up in court. As much as anyone might dislike it, it's a clean fight, we took the first hit this time but it was a clean shot and we're just going to have to dig deep and start hitting back in the voting booths.....or submit.

Honestly I don't think it's really that big of a deal to make it to the DMV every decade or so depending on state. It's really not that big of a deal....the overwhelming majority of all functioning adults already have the shit. And to get one is not any bigger of an ordeal than registering then going to the school gym, standing in line for a while and voting. It's not like we are asking them to win a superbowl ring or something for the right to vote.

It's the asinine snide smirking intent in the background no one can really do anything about that pisses people off. And it's a worthy/winnable social fight but it's a practically impossible legal one.

 

[SexyAlison]

Fuck Burnie

 

[BotanyBoy]

Fuck Burnie

Yea you love the rich elites and hate the working poor we got that.

 

[MichaelinChina]

Afraid I can't agree. I've done my time as a poll precinct chief. I've found more fraud attempts going in the other direction--trying to vote without being that person. (And those who didn't/couldn't produce ID weren't really totally turned away--they could vote provisional ballots against the time they did produce ID.) I see absolutely no reason why some form of ID shouldn't be required to be shown to verify that you are that voter. Where I served, registered voters were given voter cards (and, yes, I believe election processes should all be required to provide these). They got the card when they registered to vote. If they didn't register they didn't have the right to vote anyway. Absolutely no reason they couldn't take responsibility themselves to produce at least these when they voted.

As far as (Un)Real_American is concerned, this Web site has marked this poster as banned, and I'm fine with honoring that and pretending that poster isn't here, even as (Un)Real pretends not to get the message.

So Trumps' kids (despite currently being unregistered) might get to vote after all?
Ha! At least Australia doesn't have such an arcane law.