What do "Progressives" want?

[Rightguide]

This is an utter lie, as usual.

^^^

This is the true lie.

 

[Ann_Tagonist]

Because even with Dems in control of the WH and Congress, the health-insurance lobby was too powerful to ignore. Note how quickly Obama caved on the "public option."

If progressives were in control, that might play out differently.

The ACA was nearly the straw that broke the camel's back. You would be terrified to know just exactly how fragile the hospital system has become. Bare bones staffing. Infrastructure cuts. Another hit and you'll be setting your own broken bones.

 

[phrodeau]

The ACA was nearly the straw that broke the camel's back. You would be terrified to know just exactly how fragile the hospital system has become. Bare bones staffing. Infrastructure cuts. Another hit and you'll be setting your own broken bones.

How many years have Republicans had to improve health care?

BotanyBoy is correct for once. Improving health care is not what Republicans support.

 

[Ann_Tagonist]

How many years have Republicans had to improve health care?

BotanyBoy is correct for once. Improving health care is not what Republicans support.

Did you read my post. Step 1: Stop the ACA from destroying the hospital system or nobody gets their broken bones set.

 

[Kirkrapine]

Well, feel free to praise the short-term gain (including the prolonging of the Depression) . . .

That's really not established consensus.

In a survey of economic historians conducted by Robert Whaples, Professor of Economics at Wake Forest University, anonymous questionnaires were sent to members of the Economic History Association. Members were asked to disagree, agree, or agree with provisos with the statement that read: "Taken as a whole, government policies of the New Deal served to lengthen and deepen the Great Depression". While only 6% of economic historians who worked in the history department of their universities agreed with the statement, 27% of those that work in the economics department agreed. Almost an identical percent of the two groups (21% and 22%) agreed with the statement "with provisos" (a conditional stipulation) while 74% of those who worked in the history department and 51% in the economic department disagreed with the statement outright.[172]

but the long-term damage of enabling the State to rush in and fix every little grievance has led to a Leviathan that we simply cannot finance or rein in and with each new Congress, the need for the politicians to do "something" for the people to justify their existence further endangers our long-term stability. And even this morning we see a self-described Progressive clambering for the government to take over as the single-payer of healthcare.

All it does is bring us a tiny bit nearer to the likeness of the Euro social democracies, which are quite stable enough -- how does that endanger our long-term stability?! How, for that matter, does it even qualify as "damage"?!

The Progressive movement is like the Civil Rights movement; there is never a moment when they are sated and each and every "victory" just results in the redefinition of what they are fighting for at the moment.

From the start they wanted full political, social and economic equality for AAs. That never changed. And yes, the economic aspect was always there -- just before King was assassinated, he was planning a transracial "Poor People's March" on Washington.

And why in the world should they have been at any point "sated"? They still haven't entirely won what they wanted. If they had, BLM would not exist.

 

[Kirkrapine]

The only reason that you can even begin to make the contention that the National Government resembles the spending of the people is that it no longer has to answer to the people which is what happens when you surrender local control to a far-off "Forbidden City" run by a gaggle of Dowager Empresses who seem to exist only to enhance their personal and family wealth. Each representative now represents hundreds of thousands of people who they don;t have to meet or interact with. That's what the Founders feared. Government only works well when it's close to home and you have to look your neighbor's in the eye when you make a decision.

Can't find it online, but in May 1997 Michael Lind wrote an article in the now defunct New Leader, "A Horde of Lilliputian Governments," where he decried the chaotic and unsystematized swarm of local governments, including the countless special-district governments, in America. In the course of it he mentioned that after experience with government at various levels, he had formulated Lind's Law: "The further down you go in the hierarchy of governments, the more corrupt and incompetent the government."

 

[Kirkrapine]

In essence, DC has become an extension of the financial habits of the people themselves. There is no thought for the future, just spend and grab the newest shiny object and let tomorrow take care of itself.

Well, none of that has changed with Pubs in control of all three branches, and it doesn't look likely to. Trump was never a paragon of fiscal responsibility.

 

[bellisarius]

See here. Note all the subject-buttons on the left side of the page.

Well, well, well, a new Communist Manifesto. Tell ya what, how about we just round up all the gimmee's that believe that crap and execute them? Do it now and save ourselves a lot of grief later.

Of course you're going to say, "You're a hater. Calling for wanton murder of your fellow citizens." My reply would be that THAT is EXACTLY what folks that believe in that bull shit have done to the opposition EVERY TIME they've gotten into power. Over and over and over again. I'm merely exercising my right to self-defense.

 

[SpeareChucker]

https://spectator.org/how-living-two-years-under-socialism-made-me-a-capitalist/

Jump down to part 3: Health Socialism

This is basically what Progressives clamor for.

 

[von_Bismarck]

Well, well, well, a new Communist Manifesto. Tell ya what, how about we just round up all the gimmee's that believe that crap and execute them? Do it now and save ourselves a lot of grief later.

Of course you're going to say, "You're a hater. Calling for wanton murder of your fellow citizens." My reply would be that THAT is EXACTLY what folks that believe in that bull shit have done to the opposition EVERY TIME they've gotten into power. Over and over and over again. I'm merely exercising my right to self-defense.

Jesus Christ, Ismale. Time to lay off the Franzia.

 

[Sean]

https://spectator.org/how-living-two-years-under-socialism-made-me-a-capitalist/

Jump down to part 3: Health Socialism

This is basically what Progressives clamor for.

I'm just going to laugh at anything that uses "deep state moles", thanks anyway.

 

[Adre]

Jesus Christ, Ismale. Time to lay off the Franzia.

If he were in my family I’d seriously consider committing him.

 

[pointless]

Jesus Christ, Ismale. Time to lay off the Franzia.

it isn't the wine that makes him a psychopath. it's his ASPD.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Just as the Republicans do now. SFW?

The Republicans platform doesn't revolve around taking my shit and spending my money for me.

The progressives does.

Because even with Dems in control of the WH and Congress, the health-insurance lobby was too powerful to ignore. Note how quickly Obama caved on the "public option."

If progressives were in control, that might play out differently.

Oh so what you're saying is that despite all that good talk when it came down to doing the do instead of just running their mouths about it, the Democrats sold out.

I agree.

 

[CandiCame]

You... you were literally given the answer. There was no need to keep going.

 

[Kirkrapine]

The Republicans platform doesn't revolve around taking my shit and spending my money for me.

Republican practice does. What have the Pubs done since 2016 to pare back entitlements? And they seem to have been all for Trump's needlessly expanded defense budget -- if that's not spending your money for you, what is?

Oh so what you're saying is that despite all that good talk when it came down to doing the do instead of just running their mouths about it, the Democrats sold out.

I agree.

But they would not have, if they were really the doctrinaire leftists you are always trying to make them out to be.

Dems and Pubs in Congress alike are mainly concerned to avoid anything that might cost them re-election -- whether through losing them votes, or losing them campaign contributions.

 

[Kirkrapine]

Well, well, well, a new Communist Manifesto. Tell ya what, how about we just round up all the gimmee's that believe that crap and execute them? Do it now and save ourselves a lot of grief later.

If we're going to do something like that, it would save us a lot more grief to do it to the redhats. They are a problem; the progressives, marginal as they are, cannot be.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Republican practice does.

How? They cut taxes.

They peeled back government control over the means of production.

But they would not have, if they were really the doctrinaire leftists you are always trying to make them out to be.

Oh no that's your idolization of the left and the Democrats not mine.

I think lefties are full of fucking shit and none of them actually buy into their own delusions, they're just looking for a handout.

Dems and Pubs in Congress alike are mainly concerned to avoid anything that might cost them re-election -- whether through losing them votes, or losing them campaign contributions.

Democracy has it's downsides.

 

[Rightguide]

See here. Note all the subject-buttons on the left side of the page.

^^^
This is an affiliate of the CPUSA. You're a committed Communist, right?

http://www.cpusa.org/article/houston-tx-party-club-building-a-front-against-trump/

 

[Kirkrapine]

I'm just going to laugh at anything that uses "deep state moles", thanks anyway.

Oh, the Deep State is real enough, it's just not what Trump makes it out to be. It is not simply the intelligence and law-enforcement sectors. The Deep State is a network of government agencies, major corporations, etc., whose main concern is to maintain the present limits of the Overton Window and to preserve the Washington Consensus of economic neoliberalism and foreign-policy neoconservatism, effectively barring serious discussion or consideration of all alternatives.

 

[Kirkrapine]

^^^
This is an affiliate of the CPUSA. You you're a committed Communist, right/

http://www.cpusa.org/article/houston-tx-party-club-building-a-front-against-trump/

And the Communists always endorse the Democrat. That's no reason not to vote Democrat. Did you refuse to vote for Trump because David Duke was on his side?

 

[Curmudgeonly]

They want what most Americans want. Someone to do for them what they don't wish to do for themselves. The only difference between the various factions is who gets stepped on or over and who benefits.

 

[Oblimo]

So, your dream is to have a minority of the country dictate to the majority of the country how their money should be spent?

Currently, 30% of the country’s population has 70% of the representation in the Federal legislative branch.

So this is your dream, and our nightmare.

 

[Oblimo]

Oh, the Deep State is real enough, it's just not what Trump makes it out to be. It is not simply the intelligence and law-enforcement sectors. The Deep State is a network of government agencies, major corporations, etc., whose main concern is to maintain the present limits of the Overton Window and to preserve the Washington Consensus of economic neoliberalism and foreign-policy neoconservatism, effectively barring serious discussion or consideration of all alternatives.

It sounds more like preservation of the status quo by the status quo’s vested interest than a willfully coordinated meta-enterprise.

At the very least, preservation of the Overton Window has failed spectacularly in the past two decades, as Overton discovered his window as part of a long and successful campgain of think tanks to shift radical conservative ideas up the window into policy.

 

[Liar]

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess they want progress.