What is happening to public schools ?

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Has that become legal?

Epidemic. But its bound to be legal once the union gets behind it.

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

Why does having a school entirely accountable only to the parents that choose to send their kids there frighten you? Those same kids could be home-schooled. Does that frighten you too?

Since when do you care about tax dollars? There is an unlimited supply of them, is there not?

Or does it bother you that charter schools spend LESS tax dollars per pupil?

That doesn't scare me at all. Public schools are already accountable to parents AND everyone else. Which makes sense, since everyone uses the school in one way or another. There is NO accountability at all with charter schools. That's the scary part.

Home schooled children have a curriculum to follow and are accountable.

Tax dollars are limited. Unless you are a military program.

I'm not so sure charter schools do cost less to the parents. The costs are just shifted. Busing is a huge expense for public schools, in a charter school the parent is responsible for getting the kid there. Charter schools don't have to take on costs they don't want. If a charter school feels that a kid is more trouble than they're worth they can deny admission.

 

[doubleover]

That doesn't scare me at all. Public schools are already accountable to parents AND everyone else. Which makes sense, since everyone uses the school in one way or another. There is NO accountability at all with charter schools. That's the scary part.

Home schooled children have a curriculum to follow and are accountable.

Tax dollars are limited. Unless you are a military program.

I'm not so sure charter schools do cost less to the parents. The costs are just shifted. Busing is a huge expense for public schools, in a charter school the parent is responsible for getting the kid there. Charter schools don't have to take on costs they don't want. If a charter school feels that a kid is more trouble than they're worth they can deny admission.

I never said that.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Some states are putting more of their education dollars into voucher programs, which effectively means less money for the public schools.

Well maybe if they didn't suck so fucking bad they wouldn't have that worry, competition is a real bitch you liburhulz fucking hate with a passion ain't it?

And they are not holding those private, in some cases for-profit voucher-backed schools to the same standards as the public schools.

So?

This frightens me greatly. Having a good education should be more than just a privilege. If the kids in your community go to good schools, it makes your whole community a better place. IMHO.

Newsflash....public educations isn't very good, it's gone to total fucking shit.

Local prep school? They do calculus, O-chem and speak at least 2 languages before they can graduate.....they have a VERY high ivy league acceptance rate.

The kids at the public school? Can't spell calculus....

What is also frightening is that voters have little to no control over charter schools.
Tax dollars would go to schools and the public would have no say in what is or isn't taught there.
Assuming of course that the charter school stays open the entire school year.

OH NOES SGT SPIDY WON'T BE ABLE TO TELL PEOPLE WHERE TO SEND THEIR KIDS TO SCHOOL OR WHAT THEY WILL BE TAUGHT!! PARENTS WILL GET TO CHOSE!!! OH THE HORROR!!

 

[CandiCame]

Has that become legal?

Not in theory, but often in practice. The way that male victims, and in particular, underage male victims are treated in this country is appalling. That's a big thing and I have to get ready for work but you should read into it if you want to have yourself a good little heartbreak.

 

[NeverEndingMe]

Not in theory, but often in practice. The way that male victims, and in particular, underage male victims are treated in this country is appalling. That's a big thing and I have to get ready for work but you should read into it if you want to have yourself a good little heartbreak.

since you've admitted to committed fraud by stealing tax payer money, guess that you would label yourself a victim

 

[RobDownSouth]

Newsflash....public educations isn't very good, it's gone to total fucking shit.

Glittering generalities much?

Local prep school? They do calculus, O-chem and speak at least 2 languages before they can graduate.....they have a VERY high ivy league acceptance rate.

The kids at the public school? Can't spell calculus....

Yes, there is a difference between public schools and prep schools.
Whatever would we do without you, Captain Obvious?

OH NOES SGT SPIDY WON'T BE ABLE TO TELL PEOPLE WHERE TO SEND THEIR KIDS TO SCHOOL OR WHAT THEY WILL BE TAUGHT!! PARENTS WILL GET TO CHOSE!!! OH THE HORROR!!

That's Murica, chum.

The social contract has always been that everyone has a right to a baseline education, which is provided by public schools.

Those that can afford it can opt for private schools. Private schools are not a "right".

There is a third option in homeschooling.

"Charter schools" (and their bastard child "school vouchers") are nothing more than an attempt to siphon public tax dollars for what is essentially a private school education. This is supported primarily by Catholics (who have a long-standing preference for Catholic schools but want the public to pay for them) and fundie Christians (who value religious indoctrination above education, and also want the public to pay for their childrens' indoctrination).

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

Well maybe if they didn't suck so fucking bad they wouldn't have that worry, competition is a real bitch you liburhulz fucking hate with a passion ain't it?



So?



Newsflash....public educations isn't very good, it's gone to total fucking shit.

Local prep school? They do calculus, O-chem and speak at least 2 languages before they can graduate.....they have a VERY high ivy league acceptance rate.

The kids at the public school? Can't spell calculus....



OH NOES SGT SPIDY WON'T BE ABLE TO TELL PEOPLE WHERE TO SEND THEIR KIDS TO SCHOOL OR WHAT THEY WILL BE TAUGHT!! PARENTS WILL GET TO CHOSE!!! OH THE HORROR!!

Parents already have choice. I've already said that.
Just what are you basing your opinion about public schools on?

 

[Sean Renaud]

Parents already have choice. I've already said that.
Just what are you basing your opinion about public schools on?

In most cases they don't and to a large degree they shouldn't. It would be nice if they had more choice as to where to send their children but most schools are set to where you live and you don't get a choice.

And there is good reason why we don't let parents choose what their kids are taught. You want creationism and religion, handle that at home.

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

In most cases they don't and to a large degree they shouldn't. It would be nice if they had more choice as to where to send their children but most schools are set to where you live and you don't get a choice.

And there is good reason why we don't let parents choose what their kids are taught. You want creationism and religion, handle that at home.

Parents have full choice in where they live.

 

[unregistered]

 

[Sean Renaud]

Parents have full choice in where they live.

Sort of. I mean from what I've read the quality of the school system is a major deciding factor in where parents move. But what do you know beyond what it says on the brochure at that point? Especially if you aren't making a little hop of a move?

I have to remain within X of my job, I need to be able to afford the location as well. I'm sure my parents would happily have had me in a Beverly Hills school instead of an LA school given the choice.

 

[NeverEndingMe]

Parents have full choice in where they live.

when were you banned from being in the classroom? Do you have to report to a P.O.?

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

Sort of. I mean from what I've read the quality of the school system is a major deciding factor in where parents move. But what do you know beyond what it says on the brochure at that point? Especially if you aren't making a little hop of a move?

I have to remain within X of my job, I need to be able to afford the location as well. I'm sure my parents would happily have had me in a Beverly Hills school instead of an LA school given the choice.

Those are all factors of the choice.

Beyond the brochure parents could,
* Email the school principal for further information.
* Meet with members of the Board of Ed.
* Take a tour of the facilities.

Those are just off the top of my head.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Those are all factors of the choice.

Beyond the brochure parents could,
* Email the school principal for further information.
* Meet with members of the Board of Ed.
* Take a tour of the facilities.

Those are just off the top of my head.

Maybe life moves slower where you are than for me. Moving usually isn't the sort of thing where I have that much time. And again I still have to be near where I work, able to afford rent/mortgage. Lots of factors beyond directly what I want.

But yes, parents can pick their schools.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Maybe life moves slower where you are than for me. Moving usually isn't the sort of thing where I have that much time. And again I still have to be near where I work, able to afford rent/mortgage. Lots of factors beyond directly what I want.

But yes, parents can pick their schools.

Um, put a honkin' big asterisk by "pick their schools"....most public school districts have attendance boundaries. Yes, I'm aware of the "failing schools" relocation option, and the old minority-to-majority program, and heck their might even be some school busing programs still going on, but as I recall where you go to (public) school is a function of where you live.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Um, put a honkin' big asterisk by "pick their schools"....most public school districts have attendance boundaries. Yes, I'm aware of the "failing schools" relocation option, and the old minority-to-majority program, and heck their might even be some school busing programs still going on, but as I recall where you go to (public) school is a function of where you live.

His argument is we aren't serfs tied to the land. There is nothing stopping you from moving across said boundary.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Glittering generalities much?

Not really....M'uricuh ain't known for it's out of this world public ed. LOL

Yes, there is a difference between public schools and prep schools.
Whatever would we do without you, Captain Obvious?

Exactly.....you and your ilk are fucking TERRIFIED of the competition, because if let loose these kick ass schools are going to fucking OWN every voucher they can get leaving a hand full of public schools to babysit the rejects of society, while the rest of them close up shop b/c no one wants to send their kids to those shit hole schools.

That's Murica, chum.

The social contract has always been that everyone has a right to a baseline education, which is provided by public schools.

That's not america....they may have a right to a baseline education (only in the lefty world, in the real world no such right exists), but it does NOT have to be provided by public schools.

Those that can afford it can opt for private schools. Private schools are not a "right".

There is a third option in homeschooling.

Ahhhh so you don't want the kids parents to have the option of taking public money to a better school. You really worried about the kids education or you worried about who's getting that paycheck?

Yea the infamous homeskoolz....

"Charter schools" (and their bastard child "school vouchers") are nothing more than an attempt to siphon public tax dollars for what is essentially a private school education.

OH NOEZ!! THEY MIGHT USE PUBLIC MONEY TO SEND THEIR KIDS TO A BETTER SKOOL!!! THE HORROR ROB!!! THE HORROR!!!

This is supported primarily by Catholics (who have a long-standing preference for Catholic schools but want the public to pay for them) and fundie Christians (who value religious indoctrination above education, and also want the public to pay for their childrens' indoctrination).

Oh so it's not really about giving kids/parents the chance to pursue the best education possible....it's about keeping money out of christian hands and keeping it in the teachers unions hands isn't it?

Parents already have choice. I've already said that.
Just what are you basing your opinion about public schools on?

Some might most don't...you're fucking kidding yourself.

I'm basing my opinion on results and performance of the students.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Not really....M'uricuh ain't known for it's out of this world public ed. LOL

Bashing public education has been trendy for many years now.

Exactly.....you and your ilk are fucking TERRIFIED of the competition, because if let loose these kick ass schools are going to fucking OWN every voucher they can get leaving a hand full of public schools to babysit the rejects of society, while the rest of them close up shop b/c no one wants to send their kids to those shit hole schools.

Not TERRIFIED at all. Private schools serve a purpose in America. The public simply shouldn't have to pay for them.

That's not america....they may have a right to a baseline education (only in the lefty world, in the real world no such right exists), but it does NOT have to be provided by public schools.

The courts say otherwise, but you're much much smarter than them.

Ahhhh so you don't want the kids parents to have the option of taking public money to a better school. You really worried about the kids education or you worried about who's getting that paycheck?

If you're worried about your kid's education and don't want to send them to public schools, pay for yer own damned private schools. Quit asking me to finance your kids custom education.

Yea the infamous homeskoolz....

The Tard Factory.

OH NOEZ!! THEY MIGHT USE PUBLIC MONEY TO SEND THEIR KIDS TO A BETTER SKOOL!!! THE HORROR ROB!!! THE HORROR!!!

Public money should not be used to fund religious indoctrination. Church 'n state and that pesky Constitution Establishment Clause dontcha know.

Oh so it's not really about giving kids/parents the chance to pursue the best education possible....it's about keeping money out of christian hands and keeping it in the teachers unions hands isn't it?

You want a "better education" for your child, pay for it yourself.
And you went full vettebigot with your obligatory slam against teachers unions. Very few teachers relatively speaking are in teachers unions. Don't be stupid. That's query/cucumber lover's job.

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

Some might most don't...you're fucking kidding yourself.

I'm basing my opinion on results and performance of the students.

No, all parents have 100% choice in where they live and thus what school their child attends. There's no kidding anyone, that's a fact. If you have something that shows people are assigned exactly where to live in the US, let's see it.

You're not basing your opinion on results because those results don't exist anywhere. If you've suddenly done what no educational researcher has been able to do in 20 years, and you have data that shows on the whole charter schools are better than public schools you'd be too busy on a lecture circuit to be posting on Lit.

 

[Asshungry]

Our local Middle school advertised for a Library Specialist, requires a Bachelors but prefer a Masters degree. For that they were willing to pay 25K.
Are you fucking kidding me, 25K for a Masters degree. No wonder the education in this country sucks. And this is from one of the top districts in our state.

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

Our local Middle school advertised for a Library Specialist, requires a Bachelors but prefer a Masters degree. For that they were willing to pay 25K.
Are you fucking kidding me, 25K for a Masters degree. No wonder the education in this country sucks. And this is from one of the top districts in our state.

I'd be shocked if they get anyone at that pay.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Bashing public education has been trendy for many years now.

Not TERRIFIED at all. Private schools serve a purpose in America. The public simply shouldn't have to pay for them.

Trendy, but true. They haven't been a real benefit to society and deserve the ridicule.

And I think you are, if public schools were so fucking awesome no one would care about the voucher system b/c they would all still go to public schools and the private education sector in general would be small and likely limited to christian cray cray.

The courts say otherwise, but you're much much smarter than them.

I could be mistaken, care to point out my legally guaranteed right to an education that must be provided by public schools?

If you're worried about your kid's education and don't want to send them to public schools, pay for yer own damned private schools. Quit asking me to finance your kids custom education.

Same price man...vouchers are only worth X amount or not you can rig it however you want.

So what you really mean is don't spend on what you decide is the best education for your child possible but spend at the gubbmint sector only.

The Tard Factory.

Public money should not be used to fund religious indoctrination. Church 'n state and that pesky Constitution Establishment Clause dontcha know.

Indeed...and you might have an argument with that point...but creationism is science as far as public school is concerned, so...public schools, christian schools....that line is already little more than a smudge.

You want a "better education" for your child, pay for it yourself.

Partisan politics > all else eh rob?

And you went full vettebigot with your obligatory slam against teachers unions. Very few teachers relatively speaking are in teachers unions. Don't be stupid. That's query/cucumber lover's job.

Ok...let me rephrase, all employees with a monetary interest in keeping a gun to parents heads to have that kid in their public classroom(s) daily.

Better?

No, all parents have 100% choice in where they live and thus what school their child attends.

There's no kidding anyone, that's a fact. If you have something that shows people are assigned exactly where to live in the US, let's see it.

That's a lie and total bullshit....there is a large ammount of that people don't have the economic ability to just pick up and move to the zip code that gets them to a good school.

You're not basing your opinion on results because those results don't exist anywhere.

Dozens of countries with voucher systems you condemn kick the fucking piss out of US students regularly.

Much like these countries UHC kicking the piss out of ACA and formerly Reagan care I don't need a Sgt.Spidy approved study to tell me that the current cluster fuck of an education system is clearly inferior to the systems being used in like 58 other countries of which only a dozen or so spend more than we do. The proof is in the pudding...and standing next to the rest of the world we are getting ripped the fuck off for a giant piece of shit.

If you've suddenly done what no educational researcher has been able to do in 20 years, and you have data that shows on the whole charter schools are better than public schools you'd be too busy on a lecture circuit to be posting on Lit.

Hey as soon as the currently perfect system you seem to think is the best thing since sliced bread starts competing with the rest of the westernized 1st world you might be able to defend that. But as it stands our public education system last I checked was pretty fucking far behind the rest of the 1st world.

 

[CandiCame]

Your assertion that people can just up and move if they don't like the school system... what are you basing that on, exactly? Are we pretending we live in a world where SES barriers don't exist and that schools aren't funded by local taxes that are directly pulled FROM those barriers or are we talking about the really real world?

For example. I have custody of my teenage brother. Every school in this town, where my rental properties are and where I am contractually obligated for live for the 5 years after my mamaw's death because of the way my land inheritance works are shitty. However, the one in town is less shitty than the rural one. I elected to drive him to town every day, taking an hour of my time and a fucking fortune in gas, to get him to the less-shitty school. Guess how many parents can afford to do that in America's shithole? Not that many.

 

[KingOrfeo]

Parents have full choice in where they live.

Errmm, no, a great many don't.