What To Do With Bullies

[GrrlFriday]

Hey there. It sounds like your kid is really doing it rough - being tired all the time (and being a kid in constant contact with these bullies) makes it harder to shake off stuff. If someone is not sure how to handle a situation, it becomes even more stressful. There might be more relevant anti-bullying stuff specifically aimed at autistic kids.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Or you could hire another bully to be your kids body guard.

Just a thought.

 

[StarTwinn]

Wow my heart really aches for your son. He should not gave to go through this. I had a situation with a teacher that said some " bully type words" and not only did I talk to the principal, I talk to the school district's main office. I told them that if they didn't do anything and that I would be waiting and watching , I'd be only to happy to contact the local news station and newspapers. I told them if they think I'm just talking, they'll be seeing...themselves on TV. I don't know if you've tried with the district itself, but I would. The teacher not only profusely apologized but was denied a position she had been working for and sent to another school starting the next school year.

 

[MisterDark]

Assault is assault, you don't need an adult witness to file charges. It might be word against word, or perhaps there will be physical evidence, but the police will take a report, they will contact the bully for a statement and now you have it on record. Do it as often as you must, once the problem is addressed, people will notice and a persistent parent and child cannot be ignored forever. Do as others have done, local TV and social media.

The limited options excuse sounds like a person who doesn't want to go through any hassles .... what is your child's protection worth?

There is nothing limited about my suggestions so long as a parent you are willing to follow through and not let the first hurdle cause you to turn around and go back home.

That's about it from me.

If you knew me, you would know there is nothing very subtle or passive about me. If there ever IS physical evidence, trust me, I will record it and have it recorded by my local law enforcement. Up to this point, it has largely been the harassment, intimidation and some really ugly things being said type.

I videoed my boy 2 nights ago as he sought out a way to deal with his rage. He sat and tore an entire edition of the evening paper into little tiny shreds as he rocked and tried to fight back the tears saying, "I don't know. Maybe they're right. Maybe I do suck. Maybe it would have been better if I had never been born. I don't know. Are they right dad?" There's no outside marks to that.

I have become a thorn in the side of the organization where my boy goes to day camp. Even calling the executive director at home. When I have caught kids bullying him or others, I confront the bully and take them to their parent.....whether they want to go or not. In my experience - immediately confronting the offender and their parent pays the most dividends.

 

[MisterDark]

This pisses me off. So what if they think you LOOK like a bully; What's that supposed to mean? What's a bully look like—I know what they act like, but I'm pretty sure they don't all have the same look. And, what I know about you MisterDark, is that you are not a bully, and that you care deeply for Ryan. Whoever said that to you... well, that person is a bully... and you can tell 'em I said so. I would think a big, strapping, nice man such as yourself would be a most welcome addition to an anti-bullying organization, especially given that you experienced bullying yourself as a child. That's such crap. Grrrrrr.

Thanx PF....but you've seen my picture. When not in a suit and tie, there are many people that are intimidated by me. Yes - you have also heard me talk about Ryan. he is my world right now. I made the choice to take care of him first even if that meant being alone. People that get to know me find I'm rather likable, same as those that don't prejudge Ryan based on his legs or disease.

Being the youngest in my house with a different father who you could say spoiled me I got picked on a lot at home and at school for being fat. Kids are cruel mean little shits I had to stop caring and just be myself.

It is something that is a problem but has happen since the beginning of civilization. We will see when world peace comes around.

I've seen Ryan withdrawing more and more. I am afraid of the consequences of that later in life and therefore am trying to draw him out more and more. He just wants to be liked by everyone. Don't ever stop caring Xanderra - that's the beginning of stopping feeling.

Has been suggested, but, unfortunately, when my son was being bullied by high school kids on his way home from grade school (a 3rd grader getting shoved and threatened), I received zero help from the schools. I ended up "hiring" a neighbor who went to school with the bullies to have him and a friend beat the bullies up. They left my son alone after that. Best $50 I ever spent! I still talk to that helpful neighbor, who's now almost 30, when he mows his mom's yard.

And thus it's handy to have a big dad that looks scarier than the bullies.....lol....

I always found movies to be a good way to teach a lesson to kids.

Let me suggest one starring James Caan. It was titled The Killer Elite and was directed by Sam Peckinpah.

Just as a lesson that a man does not have to be a prime physical specimen to be dangerous.

Later on, when he understands subtlety then introduce Stephen Hawking.

I helped him write a paper for a fifth grade class this year on Stephen Hawking. I was a physics major in college so had read some of Hawking's work. Also had him watch the comedian Josh Blue. He is coming to terms with what his disability means both now and long term. He has gotten more serious about doing his therapy and working out with Dad to not let the disease define him. I will look into that movie.

D. All of the above.

-Long conversations with your son on how to handle bullying from the POV of the target of the bullying, conversations that are consistent with your values and the values of your family.

-Notify the organization (school) in writing and request a meeting with the principal, dean, guidance counselor, and their legal representative.

-If you do not have a relationship with the parents of the other child (or children), request that the school provide you with that information and that they attend the meeting as well.

Try and approach it as a problem to be solved together, not as a confrontation.

It's a delicate path, but one that has to be walked.

Thanx Paul. I appreciate your comments. I've been taking more and more steps and working to not be shut out on the anti-bullying groups at my boy's school and now I've started talking with the organization he goes to for day camp. Also doing as much as I can to teach him to grow his self esteem. Unfortunately, it doesn't take much effort by kids to kill it - then we start over again. He's learning. It's painful for him and even more so for me to watch.

 

[MisterDark]

Hey there. It sounds like your kid is really doing it rough - being tired all the time (and being a kid in constant contact with these bullies) makes it harder to shake off stuff. If someone is not sure how to handle a situation, it becomes even more stressful. There might be more relevant anti-bullying stuff specifically aimed at autistic kids.

Wow - you really do know what the disease entails - the fact that to do the same thing as a normal person takes 2 to 3 times the energy for him (yes I read your PM). I guess given Ryan's history - and there's much of it I haven't disclosed here - I am amazed at his resiliency and willingness to attempt to overcome. He has done so much to learn constructive ways to deal with his anger or hurt as opposed to lashing out and I am extremely proud of him for that.

Or you could hire another bully to be your kids body guard.

Just a thought.

I think I saw that movie Zeb.....lol.....

Wow my heart really aches for your son. He should not gave to go through this. I had a situation with a teacher that said some " bully type words" and not only did I talk to the principal, I talk to the school district's main office. I told them that if they didn't do anything and that I would be waiting and watching , I'd be only to happy to contact the local news station and newspapers. I told them if they think I'm just talking, they'll be seeing...themselves on TV. I don't know if you've tried with the district itself, but I would. The teacher not only profusely apologized but was denied a position she had been working for and sent to another school starting the next school year.

That's much tougher when coming from someone that you are supposed to be able to trust and even confide in when being the victim. I have not progressed to the district level, however, most of the problems at school had ceased by the end of the year. Granted, it was largely Ryan avoiding any situation that would put him in direct contact with those that had bullied him, but it was also teaching him to be proactive. Teaching him that most bullies are afraid themselves and if he finds himself being bullied he needs only to get the bully to follow him to a school staff member and then tell him to repeat themself (or the threat or whatever).

 

[MisterDark]

I am absolutely blown away by the PM's and the posts here and thank each and every one of you for your time and concern. Many of your ideas are great and all are appreciated very much.

I will continue to teach my son as my dad taught me; no matter how big you think you are, there is always somebody bigger looking to knock your head off. In other words....might or violence doesn't solve problems. Working proactively to stop them has the best effect. He has been taught not to ever judge by how somebody looks (not just the color of their skin or whether they have all their limbs), but by the content of their character. He has been taught to always be kind.

In no way is my boy perfect and I certainly don't mean to portray him that way. He can be as braggadocious and egotistical or vain as anybody. But he also tends to be the first one to feel compassion for another and I don't want that to ever change. Sports is helping to draw him out - and although he will never be an all star, he is an extremely hard worker that earns the admiration of his team mates with his work ethic and his attitude and how hard he tries. Those are the building blocks I want him to learn on.

This post was originally to help me to figure out what is my next best step (without resorting to anger myself) in dealing with these kids when I don't see the actual events happen. What I've come away with is a wealth of respect to the members of the Lit community for their compassion towards a child they don't even know nor will probably never meet. I am truly amazed and grateful to each and every one of you that has taken time to comment or post here or to drop me a PM. Mere words will never express what I feel towards all of you.

Thank You.....
-Ric

 

[Zeb_Carter]

I think I saw that movie Zeb.....lol.....

Yeah, I did too, but it's still a viable option.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Group hugs and get-well cards do shit about bullies. The only human trait more common than bullying is cowardice, and both are epidemic.

 

[may_I_please]

This is probably the wrong place to put this - and this is not meant to be the start of a sexual thread rather - a real issue that I'm unsure how to approach.

I have a son that has Cerebral Palsy and is slightly autistic. Lately he has been the target of a lot of bullying and having lived through bullying during my high school years, I am fed up with it. I am now bigger than my bullies from high school and have worked as a bouncer and bodyguard. My boy is large for his age (11 years old - 5 foot 3 inches 125 pounds) however not as coordinated as most kids his age and still a little socially awkward.

Now, my immediate reaction to seeing my boy crying and saying, "I don't know, maybe they're (his bullies) right, maybe I do suck, maybe I shouldn't have been born...." is to lash out in anger and want to beat the holy crap out of his parents. I've watched all the anti-bullying stuff - and I don't see any solutions coming out of it. Sure, we all should have learned to treat each other nice as children - but apparently some folks were gone on that day......

Just wanted some opinions.....

Have you informed the school?

Is this happening in school? Involve them

Reinforcement of his worth ...what is he good at, what does he like? Children just need one friend ...does he have any?

Social stories may help about why people bully? http://www.autism.org.uk/living-wit...al-stories-and-comic-strips/how-to-write.aspx

Also look here http://www.autism.org.uk/living-wit...ansition/bullying-guide-for-young-people.aspx

 

[Bramblethorn]

I can certainly sympathise with the "teach him to clobber them" voices here, but it's a high-risk strategy and I don't know that I'd advise it for an autistic child.

When I was a little older than your son, I had a lot of trouble with bullying at school. I found a book on self-defence in the school library, full of advice on how young ladies and gentlemen could protect themselves against "teddy-boys". I went out and applied that advice and nearly blinded a boy who'd been picking on me, because I lacked the judgement to realise that the sort of violence that's considered acceptable self-defense in a back-alley mugging might not be accepted in a Year 7 classroom*.

I was lucky that I didn't blind the kid; also, I was a lot smaller than him and I had a classroom full of witnesses to confirm that he'd started it. But with a few things different, it could easily have ended up with me getting expelled or going down a "juvenile justice" type pathway, which isn't something you want. Especially with a kid who's large and socially awkward, there's a big risk if he fights back that he will be cast as the bully.

I don't think there's a simple fix to this, but some recommendations:

- Discuss with the school and with the parents of these kids, where possible. The best-case outcome is that they listen to you, take it seriously, and crack down on the bullying from their side. But if that doesn't happen, and things go pear-shaped, at least you can show that you tried to resolve things in good faith.
- Speaking of which: make sure you have a record of those discussions. Email is great here; even if you have a verbal conversation with people, you can send an email afterward saying "hi, just confirming my understanding of the discussion we had today..." so that if things blow up later, you can document stuff.
- If the school and/or parents don't take it seriously, consider getting legal advice (not from the internet). A formal letter from a lawyer can shake people up.
- If you do teach him self-defense, make sure that comes with EXTENSIVE training on acceptable and unacceptable use of force. He needs to treat violence as a last resort, and he needs to be smart about ensuring that he can't be cast as the aggressor. You don't want him to be the schoolyard version of this guy.

Good luck!

*I still think my reaction was entirely proportionate to the provocation, but the school didn't see it that way...

 

[jsmiam]

@ the OP: Remember that turning them is also a form of defense. It's not the "stand up to them and fight with fists" defense in the traditional sense, but it's still a form of standing up and fighting, just by turning them in. It's naive to think that regulating bullying will work perfectly, but it's better than before.

In no way is the "new" way perfect, but it's an improvement. There's stigma. They have to be more sneaky about it. Others are more hesitant to join in on the action, laugh out loud, or encourage the main bully. And if a chronic bully (multiple victims) gets turned in enough, the schools/etc. have no choice but to do something more decisive about it. Overt bullying is diminishing in the same way that overt racism is diminishing. It doesn't mean it's all better and magically fixed, but it is at least SOME progress.

My own kid was bullied, and my wife marched straight to the principal at a time that I wasn't so sure it was the right thing to do (I still harbored some of those old fashioned sentiments echoed by lots of people here about fight back, chin up, etc. etc.), and I have to admit I was wrong. Even if going to the principal didn't make all problems vanish with a single dash of pixie dust, it made things better than before. Additionally, my kid also has gone straight to the principal on their own initiative (standing up for themselves on their own, using the resources available to them).

Results: One bully totally backed off and even started basically being a normal person, and all the others more or less just keep away now. No, results won't always be great, but don't overlook turning their butts in. Many bullies just aren't that dedicated. If it becomes hard to pick on one kid, most will move on. Probably just to another kid, but we can also be optimistic, that maybe, just maybe, at least some of them will also change their ways.

 

[Collar_N_Cuffs]

To the OP, in regards to the comment the bully made to your son, making him contemplate the value of his own existence.

Perhaps you could turn the bully's (hereafter, "B") logic around in a way your son can deal with. B wishes your son were never born, because he isn't able to cope with extraordinary people. His limited capacity for compassion, understanding, etc only equip him to deal with hum drum, "normal" people. Because he cannot adapt, he resorts to brute strength, much like a caveman would do. People of this limited capacity are worth being wary of, but shouldn't exactly be looked towards for the meaning and value of life.

To further bring this into perspective, ask your son if his world wouldn't be better off if B were never born? So the question really only has value for the asker, and not the target. I would, however, caution him not to let the B know that he isn't as smart as your son as this would probably only cause him to lash out more, so this is a bit of a double edged sword. Probably best just for rumination and not for discussion with B.

I think this portion of the problem is just as important as how to get B to stop, so best of luck with this battle as well

 

[MisterDark]

Well.....it's certainly good to see that the justice system towards bullying really hasn't changed much if at all since I was the one being bullied.

Yesterday, my son came home from Y-Camp with a note. He had called one of his bullies "Chicken Legs" in the pool area and he was immediately told to leave the area and he is no longer allowed to swim (only 3 days left to day camp). The counselor suggested that maybe the girl telling him he sucked and shouldn't have been born last week was in response to my son actually being the bully.

So, I am working from home the rest of the week and not subjecting him to such jackasses. Of course the girl knew Ryan was going to call her a name this week so obviously she had to take retaliatory measures last week and suggest that in return for calling her chicken legs, he should not even be alive.

The camp will not allow me to talk with the other parents nor do they have any plans to discipline the other children for the ganging up on Ryan last week since none of them witnessed it and for all they know the video taken of Ryan rocking himself and crying was "staged". I'm ready at this point to do a little very private bullying of my own and when nobody witnesses it, claim it is just their word against mine.

I'm fed up with it, so I will wait until school starts and he is around more of his friends and more people that are accepting of him and his handicap. The drawback is, all of the kids were to raise money to go to a local waterpark on Wednesday of this week and Ryan raised the 3rd most money (out of 40 some kids). He wouldn't be allowed to participate anyway since his calling her chicken legs was considered sexual harassment and well........BULLSHIT!!!

 

[1sickbastard]

@ the OP: Remember that turning them is also a form of defense. It's not the "stand up to them and fight with fists" defense in the traditional sense, but it's still a form of standing up and fighting, just by turning them in. It's naive to think that regulating bullying will work perfectly, but it's better than before.

I found that the most effective way to 'stand up' to a bully is a third path:
Face the bully calmly, relax, say nothing, do nothing except for look directly at the bully's face.

See, bullies are predators, and like most predators, are only equipped to respond to either fight or flight. By facing down a bully, but neither fleeing or fighting (verbally of physically), the bully finds he/she unable to cope and usually leaves in confusion.
Moreover, the act of facing down a bully in this manner also sends a strong message that the bully's primary tool, fear, is neutralized.

Afterwards, of course, reporting the incident and the bully, preferably with witnesses is the right way to follow up.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

^^^^^needs A Group Hug And A Get Well Card

 

[hashtag45]

A friend sent me these. Not sure if /but hoping that they might be of some use :

http://www.bullyingnoway.gov.au/

https://www.psychology.org.au/publications/tip_sheets/bullying/

https://www.aacap.org/aacap/Families_and_Youth/Resource_Centers/Bullying_Resource_Center/Home.aspx