Why do people vote Republican?

[p_p_man]

I'm comparing the Republican Party with the Conservative Party in the UK as they have close enough philosophies to make it relevant.

I could never understand why the ordinary man in the street who is just getting through life the best he can would vote for a party which has blatantly no interest in him at all.

Unless it is politically expedient for it to become involved.

 

[Kymberley]

Not sure about the differences there but here, my reasons are simple. I work for a living. I work very hard to care for my two sons on my own without support from their dad.

If I wanted to, as I was told by a social worker years ago, I could give up the business I know and love, take a huge pay cut and be eligible for welfare.

Food stamps and free medical. It was what women in my position needed and the government was more than willing to add me to their books provided I would just sit on my couch and watch TV all day.

Why did I choose to do the opposite and work harder? So my sons would not have to hear, "no we can't afford that." Nor would they have to stand in line at the lunch room and when told how much their lunch cost, say, "free lunch program." They knew if they did not want the basic meal that day, they had choices because I was paying for it.

I don't want a party telling people that it is okay to be needy. It creates too many people willing to do less than what is expected of them. Strive harder. Make something of your life. Don't just lay around and let the rest of us do it for you.

I do agree with a few things in the democratic party, but the republican holds more of my views. I am sick of getting up at 2am and starting my work day so early just to afford to send them to private school. But I will do it until they graduate to avoid sending them to a corrupt, violent school system that would be dangerous and detrimental to their well being.

I see hundreds of people each day that sit on their front porches and do nothing but sit there. Their entire day is filled with whining about how they can't do anything because they have no money. They don't get real jobs because they would lose their welfare.

We have created a mentality that says, "Do nothing, we will provide for you."

Why do so many feel so trapped? Because if they attempt to better themselves, we will take away the only security they know. Welfare.

We need a better transition from being helped by the government to being a productive member of society. Will we ever get that? Probably not. But I just can't support a party that uses the poor and minorities as their own personal display of human beings unable to provide a life for themselves. These people can become more, if they were just helped off those porches.

 

[unusuallyconfused]

Oh but I adore you PP Man, but I am going to have to disagree with you on this one. I do want to say one thing. I never used to vote straight line party in the past. I voted for the person and what they stood for. However, the democrat party for me has in my opinion really gone "out" there on several issues.

I grew up pretty much with "white trash" parents. I educated myself, worked really really hard (you never heard me say like a lot of whiners "that isn't my job" and excelled. I worked day and night while the others went home. Now I am not saying my priorities were completely straight but the fact was that I was a better worker. I eventually started my own company. Now what I hate is to "HELP" those who are lazy and indifferent and I have enough relatives to know that there are many that are that way and the Democrats will call me rich because of the income I achieve. That sucks. Why should I give the money I earn to those that choose not to. I believe in social programs for the needy. I give a significant amount of money to a local mission. I am not unfeeling, but I don't believe government knows whats best. I do not believe they help people as much as my mission does. So, thats where I stand.

Now we go to "religious issues". I do believe. I also think that those on the democrat ticket despise me because what I believe. Now the thing is that there are hypocrits on both parties. There are self serving power seeking hungry zealots in BOTH parties. I am not "pro" any party. I just think that lately the democrats are far worse than the republicans who believe that "Government" should not be so large. I know some of their talk is just that but overall the picture is better for me on the republican side.

 

[Expertise]

Alchohol!!!!

 

[Guest]

I see hundreds of people each day that sit on their front porches and do nothing but sit there. Their entire day is filled with whining about how they can't do anything because they have no money. They don't get real jobs because they would lose their welfare.

That's funny, because as a democrat that works nights I sit around on my front porch all day relaxing. I see hundreds of people walking around just staring at me sitting on my porch. These busybodies just wander the streets looking for people on their porches to imagine stories about. They seem so bitter and condescending while they wander the neighborhoods looking for other people to blame for their problems rather than worrying about their own lives.

 

[unusuallyconfused]

That's funny, because as a democrat that works nights I sit around on my front porch all day relaxing. I see hundreds of people walking around just staring at me sitting on my porch. These busybodies just wander the streets looking for people on their porches to imagine stories about. They seem so bitter and condescending while they wander the neighborhoods looking for other people to blame for their problems rather than worrying about their own lives.

I would not judge you, I swear. I personally know lots of people that milk the "system" for as much as they can get. Good for you that you don't know such type of people but I really do. The only time I form an opinion is when I see someone at the grocery store with food stamps to purchase food that I can't afford to buy routinely and I go to the Sav A Lot for the deals. Thats what I don't like. Help those that need it, not those that expect its there due for "being". Sigh* it is always the same between both parties and I think the politicians themselves like the division they create.

 

[Ambrosious]

They grew up?

 

[Texan]

I'm comparing the Republican Party with the Conservative Party in the UK as they have close enough philosophies to make it relevant.

I could never understand why the ordinary man in the street who is just getting through life the best he can would vote for a party which has blatantly no interest in him at all.

Unless it is politically expedient for it to become involved.

p_p_man, you seem to usually present a balanced and rational argument, even when I disagree with you. I tend to ignore those posts which demonstrate a substitution of emotion for reason. Your question is fair.

I don't know what the conservative party in England stands for, so I can't make an informed comparison. Let me tell you what makes me vote Republican. You can make the comparisons with English parties.

Republicans tend to stand for a smaller centralized government with more of the necessary govermental services being moved to the states or localities. This is an attempt to shrink the size of the bureaucracy necessary to run those programs and to move the decision making closer to the need. In a country the size of England, that might not be important, but in a country of 250 million people it seems important to many of us.

Republicans tend to favor lower taxes and fewer federal programs, rather than the other way around. Currently our federal government collects the majority of taxes, and then redistributes a large part of that money back to the states for programs that have been "decided" in Washington. This applies to education, environmental enforcement, social welfare, highways and infrastructure, and countless "special projects" that are intended to strengthen the popularity of the incumbent elected representatives. (we call these "pork barrel" projects.) Republicans tend to be in favor of moving this kind of spending back to the states to make the decisions and to raise the money.

Republicans tend to believe in individual responsibility. In this area, opinions vary widely among Republicans. Many of us see the need for some level of social "safety net', but think it should be only as large as is absolutely necessary to prevent poverty and hunger.

Republicans tend to believe in a "free market" economy. This applies to domestic protections as well as international trade. Republicans are often accused of being "pro-business". This is true, because we tend to believe that what is good for business is good for the economy as a whole. (jobs, tax revenue, etc.) Unionized labor tends to be strongly Democratic because of this issue.

Republicans tend to be for a strong defense capability. Opinions vary widely as to how "big" our military should be, but this tends to be one of those defining issues.

Republicans tend to be in favor of measures that strengthen the nuclear family. There are tremendous differences of opinion among Republicans as to what these issues are and what the solutions are.

Republicans also tend to be:
anti-abortion
for the rights of gun ownership
against environmental extremism
for controlling our national borders

I don't agree with all the Republican positions. (I am pro-choice) However, of the two parties that have a legitimate chance to win an election, the Republican party comes closest to representing the values I believe in. There are Republicans politicians that I don't like or respect. There are also Democratic politicians that I abhore. I don't paint all of either party with the same brush.

I do resent the characatures that have been made by so many people about G.W. Bush. My reason for resentment, is because I have met the man. My in-laws and the Bush family are friends. I have sat down on the living room sofa and talked with G.W. several times. He is very intelligent. He seems honest and open. He sincerely cares about the things he advocates. He has a maturity and calmness that this discussion board could learn from.

just my opinion... but it's a considered opinion

 

[pabloback]

one thing you may not understand pp is that even the democrats in the U.S are more right wing (in general) than the conservatives in G.B. on most issues
left, right, or moderate depends on where you start from , be it facist, socialist , capitalist , marxist, liberal democrat or whatever you choos to call your self.
in real life , working class socialists tend to be further left than middle class communists . it is not the label it is the policies
[good example tony blair, stealing all the conservative policies }

 

[Texan]

there is an old saying.... that may have a kernel of truth in it somewhere....

anyone under 25 who is not a liberal.... has no heart....
anyone over 25 who is not a conservative..... has no brain...

 

[unusuallyconfused]

Re: Re: Why do people vote Republican?

just my opinion... but it's a considered opinion

You said that very very well!

 

[Uncle Dennis]

Capital Punishment

Well, McVeigh is no more… The state has exacted their vengeance. Presumably, some people needed this to feel better about the whole thing (closure, they call it). In his case, I think it was due but I’m no fan of capital punishment. There are too many eyewitness mistakes made (which DNA evidence is proving) and too many politicians and prosecutors trying to make a ‘tough on crime’ name for themselves for me to trust the legal /political system.

You can’t give someone back time that you’ve taken away (if they are later found to be innocent) but you can compensate them – unless you’ve already killed them.

Evidence is also plentiful that the death sentence is no deterrent… the two states where they kill inmates more than any other state (Texas and Florida) also have the highest murder rates. The only argument I’ve heard that makes any sense at all is the one that notes that the recidivism rate among the chosen few is notably lower. Fiscally, it doesn’t make a lot of sense either. The cost of 10 or more years of constant legal appeal has to be at least as high as just keeping them locked up with no chance of parole.

I wonder why it is that our enlightened society never wonders why it is that the only governments that still kill their own citizens are dictatorships; like China, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Iraq …and us.

 

[Kymberley]

That's funny, because as a democrat that works nights I sit around on my front porch all day relaxing. I see hundreds of people walking around just staring at me sitting on my porch. These busybodies just wander the streets looking for people on their porches to imagine stories about. They seem so bitter and condescending while they wander the neighborhoods looking for other people to blame for their problems rather than worrying about their own lives.

I only wish I had time to be a busybody worry about what people are doing outside all night long. I am sick of these people sitting out front at all hours of the day or night waiting for my car to stop at the corner so they can offer to sell me drugs. Which is what these people do nightly.

Since I am out working at 2o am, I see them hanging out there all night while I am working. Then I go home, shower, change clothes, get my kids up for school, drop them off and pass these same people still sitting on their porches, while I am on my way to a second job that I work until 5 or 6 pm.

Then on the way home from work, I pass them again. Makes you wonder, is there job sitting on the porch?

Now put back into context what I said, and what I am referring to. These are the people who live in a part of town that is full of welfare recipeints with a crime level that is skyrocketing above other neighborhoods in the same city. They have drive by shootings nightly and the elderly and working families in these neighborhoods are held hostage by those sitting out all night long.

These people are the same ones that are screaming about life being unfare to them. So get off the fucking porch and go to bed so you can get up in the morning and get a job and get out of the life you have put yourself in.

I also don't care for the most part about the people sitting there relaxing after a hard days work. I also sit outside with my family or with my kids while they are playing. But, I do go inside.

Ps. Use your registered name next time.

 

[Guest]

p_p_man, as you can see from reading this thread the reason people vote republican is they've been taught to believe that Democrats support the lazy and shiftless but republicans support hard work. This is obviously not true. What these people fail to realize is when the GOP talks about the leeching poor, to them anyone making under $100k a year is poor. When they talk about "stopping the handouts to the lazy", they're talking about getting rid of social security.

Seems these days Conservatives have convinced themselves, and some of the American public, that being a Liberal is akin to being a card-carrying member of the Communist Party. While this may be a great smear tactic for an election year, to believe such a notion proves that the believer is uneducated in the fundamentals of the American political system. Our nation was founded on Liberalism. Embodied in the Declaration of Independence are its three tenets: "Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness." The very term, itself, is taken from the same root as the second of these precepts. To be a Liberal is to defend the freedom - the Liberty - of all people who make up our great nation. To be a Liberal is to trust individuals and families to run their own lives as they see fit. To be a Liberal is to create a nation where anyone can excel if they are willing to do the work.

Liberalism is "Life." It is freedom from physical dangers that can kill or disable us. The Liberal believes it is a nation's job to protect its citizens from physical harm, whether from external sources, such as hostile nations, or internal ones, like crime, disease, or hunger. Without the solid ground of physical wellbeing, our nation and its citizens cannot enjoy the benefits of being free. Liberals believe in a strong military, well suited to defend the nation. Liberals believe in good laws, hard-working police, and a just legal system to protect its citizens from crime. Liberals believe in affordable health care for everyone, to keep our people strong. And Liberals believe in the availability of food and shelter for its needy, not as a hand out but as a reasonable step in moving all Americans toward self-reliance and the freedom that comes with it.

Liberalism is "Liberty." It is the freedom to do as your conscience dictates without impeding another's rights. Fleeing oppression in mother Europe, our founders established a nation where personal belief and self-determination are protected, not persecuted, where hard work is rewarded, not demanded, and where each person is bestowed with the ability to better his or her life because of citizenship, not class. Liberals believe in freedom of speech to protect us from political oppression. Liberals believe in sound regulations to protect us from economic oppression. Liberals believe in just laws to protect us from social oppression. And Liberals believe in quality education to protect us from the oppression of ignorance.

Liberals and Conservatives received their names for good reasons. Just as Liberals get their label by standing for Liberty, Conservatives get their label from the desire to "conserve" a style of living. They, too, claim they are fighting to conserve our personal rights and our economic opportunities, but they do it with a different ideal than the Liberal. The term they use for the difference is "values." Values are norms or codes by which people live their lives. While most Americans share some common values, such as the right to own property and the right to protect our families, we also have many divergent values with which we raise our children. So if we try to impose values into the political framework of the nation, we are forced to ask, "whose values?" And in the search for such absolutes, we must also ask, "which generation's values?"

As our nation ages and new generations take over leadership, the values of its population change. Where once a woman was valued for how well she cooked, cleaned and entertained, today's women are gaining recognition that they offer as much, if not more, to the work force than men. Where once African Americans were forced to live as second-class citizens, now they have a legal status equal to that of whites, even if we still have a ways to go in actual practice. Changing values brings confusing times for many - especially for those who believe that America was better with an older set of values. These people want to "conserve" a style of American living they believe once existed, what they call, "traditional family values." They want to conserve the system that they believe made America wealthy and strong. Unfortunately that also means they want to force all of us to live according to their values.

Conservatives don't really fight for our rights - they fight for what they think our rights should be - putting limits on our freedom of speech in order to "conserve" an older, more traditional norm of what should be said. Conservatives don't really fight for our family values - they fight for what they believe our family values should be - putting limits on our behavior, even behavior between consenting adults, in order to "conserve" an older, more traditional view of acceptable personal activity. Conservatives don't really fight for our income - they fight for little or no regulations - putting limits on our ability to be treated fairly by large companies, who if left without restriction, can form monopolies that choke out competition and drive down wages.

Conservatives are willing to curb our freedom of speech if it clashes with their interpretation of "traditional" values, values from an older time where woman were in domestic servitude to men, where child abuse, sexual abuse, wife abuse, and homosexuality were all kept locked in closets, where minorities were second-class citizens and discrimination was free from incrimination, and where the inability to plan a family's growth meant an explosion of mouths to feed - a population explosion that today threatens to bankrupt our nation's retirement funds. The Conservative position, therefore, is inherently contradictory. You cannot be for legislating away freedom in the name of "family values" and also claim you are protecting individual and family rights.

Face it, social welfare programs take up a tiny amount of our tax dollars, yet when people talk about lowering taxes all they talk about is the lazy welfare recipients. If we got rid of welfare altogether it would hardly make a dent in our taxes. Most of our taxes go to interest on the national debt, and people here say theyd rather get a tax rebate than pay down that debt. A good chunk of our taxes go to the military, but I don't hear any of these good republicans say we should cut defense. I wonder why!?

 

[Unclebill]

Kym, may I clarify

Originally posted by Kymberley
...Why did I choose to do the opposite and work harder?

for those who don't read between the lines so very well?

It's called personal integrity and pride in oneself, i. e., self-esteem or self-image. It is the validation of one's worthiness to think of oneself as a human being and is reinforced by the behaviors of self-discipline, self-reliance and achievement.

 

[lavender]

 

[Kymberley]

for those who don't read between the lines so very well?

It's called personal integrity and pride in oneself, i. e., self-esteem or self-image. It is the validation of one's worthiness to think of oneself as a human being and is reinforced by the behaviors of self-discipline, self-reliance and achievement.

Thank you Uncle Bill, unfortunately though, some would just choose to use things they can put their own spin on to make their points.

I just believe that welfare increases the masses to believe they can't become any better so why bother. We don't need a welfare system that suppresses the people they are claiming to help.

And those who need their votes, want them to keep believing they can do no better so why bother.

 

[Guest]

I think I'm in some serious political lust with Vic!

I give his post a big ol' Texas size...Heeeellllll yeah!

Thanks lavender. Back at you, sexy lady.

I'm sure that my diatribe'll be buried unnoticed but I had to try. It's frustrating for me as a liberal to hear those who have no clue give a definition of what I am. I'm told I'm a bleeding heart and that I have no brain, and I'm told these things by people who get their definitions on liberal and conservative from talk radio or biased media. I wish these people would do the research and find out what the democratic party and the republican party support and THEN form their opinions. They'd see that much of their information is slanted, if not flatout incorrect. This country owes its life to Liberalism and to Progressives.

 

[Ordinary Bob]

At one time, perhaps 30 to 40 years ago it was the Republican party that seemed to watch out for the common man. At that time it was the Democrats that wanted the government to take care of everyone. They wanted to raise our taxes and make sure that they were the only ones capable of running our lives.

The republican party of today bears very little resemblance to the republican party of the 60s or earlier. And they definately bear no resemblance to the Republican Party of Abraham Lincoln.

Todays republican party is only interested in making the rich richer and confining the true power of America into the hands of the rich and wealthy. They have no care for the common man.

However, the alternative are the Democrats, which to a large degree are not a better choice. They would still prefer a welfare state where they take care of everyone.

Some of the reasons that in the United Stated today you see an ever larger growing segment of the population that are neither Democrat or Republican, because we are fed up with both parties. More and more people seem to want a true change in direction for America. And both of the major parties are fighting it all the way.

 

[Guest]

However, the alternative are the Democrats, which to a large degree are not a better choice. They would still prefer a welfare state where they take care of everyone.

You see lavender, this is the type of misconception I was referring to. Any amount of research into nonpartisan sources would show that statement to be utterly ridiculous. Still the stereotype lives on.

 

[lavender]

 

[Ordinary Bob]

You see lavender, this is the type of misconception I was referring to. Any amount of research into nonpartisan sources would show that statement to be utterly ridiculous. Still the stereotype lives on.

It may seem a sterotype to you, but it is very true.

 

[Ordinary Bob]

I'm not my usual verbose self tonight, so I'll keep this relatively short.

I am constantly mystified that Republicans STILL equate the Democratic Party with a welfare state. The Democrats have become much more moderate in this regard. Just look at Bill Clinton's version of welfare reform. It was much stricter than the bill that actually passed the Republican Congress. Much stricter!

Hell, I would prefer the democrats to be more liberal than they are. I believe they have become too moderate. But the myth of the correlation between the Democrats and the welfare state is simply inaccurate in this day and age.

When you consistently vote to raise taxes, to have the federal government become increasingly larger and assume more of a role in running every day events in peoples lives, the sterortype is very accurate.

However, what you say about the Democrats becoming more moderate in the recent past is true. And some of that is because of Bill Clinton. However, if Hillary had her way we would become a very socialistic state.

Lavendar, one thing I am not trying to do is defend the Republican party at all. I use to align myself with them, but they have become a party for the rich and powerful only. I have no use for them. I think America needs a true new direction. More inline with personal freedom, individual responsibility and being human, as what our forefathers intended.

Todays Republican Party is disgusting!

 

[Guest]

I am constantly mystified that Republicans STILL equate the Democratic Party with a welfare state. The Democrats have become much more moderate in this regard. Just look at Bill Clinton's version of welfare reform. It was much stricter than the bill that actually passed the Republican Congress. Much stricter!

Absolutely. What's even more amazing to me is that these "hard-working" people who don't believe in handouts are the first to stand in line for the Big Tax Refund. They vote republican because the GOP promises them a tax cut, then have the nerve to sneer at politicians for selling their consciences. They expect to pay no taxes yet enjoy all the benefits that taxes provide; the military, the policemen, the firemen, the maintained roads, and yes even the welfare system, which many of them have used at one point.

Here's something I was sent a long time ago that explains the Liberal stance on many issues. I hope that those of you who are ill-informed will read this carefully. I've bolded the Taxation section because it explains my point more eloquently than I can.

Abortion/Contraception - Liberty means the freedom to control your body, your reproductive system, and your future.

Affirmative Action - Liberty means having fair opportunities for those in society who are discriminated against.

Education - Liberty means the freedom to learn in order to build a better future for yourself, your family, your community, and your country.

Environment - Liberty means the fair use of our nation's natural resources for all citizens. Where possible, without unreasonable restriction to private enterprise, the government should strive to protect our natural environment so all can enjoy its bounty.

Gun Control - Liberty means the freedom to protect yourself, your family, and your property, with deadly force if necessary. People have a right to keep guns for such a purpose. People also have a right to use guns in sporting activities and in the event that citizens should be called on to form a citizen militia. We do not, however, have a right to own all the latest people-killing technology. The People, through the government, can restrict some of the more deadly weapons being sold today.

Health - Liberty means the freedom to overcome physical limitations in order to better yourself, your family, your community, and your country.

Regulations - Liberty means the freedom to live and work in an environment that best allows individuals and families to grow in the pursuit of happiness. Bad air, bad water, bad living and working conditions only stifle that liberty.

Sexuality - Liberty means the freedom to share mutual intimate affection with the person of your choice, regardless of gender.

Substance Abuse - Liberty means the freedom to decide what you put in your body. Unless the use of a substance is a danger to unwilling victims, its use should be kept legal. In situations where use of a substance may or may not effect bystanders, regulations - such as in the case with tobacco - should be enacted to protect the bystander without denying the individual's choice to use the substance. Smoking and non-smoking areas in public places are a prime example of this.

Taxation - Liberty is found within a system. That system does not happen by itself. It is created and supported by us, the People, and it is funded by our labors. The money we pay in taxes is what allows us to thrive in Liberty and work in fairness. Reasonable taxation is necessary because without it, many of us would find it difficult to get paid even a fraction of what we are paid now. And those who benefit more from the system should expect to pay more to help support it.

Women's/Minority Rights - Liberty means the freedom to be valued and judged on talent and work, not on the physical characteristics over which we have no control.

 

[Texan]

Vic

I wrote a scathing reply to your earlier post... but then my browser locked up and I had to reopen the program and lost the message I was writing.

Then you posted that definition of Liberty.... strange... but I'm a conservative and I could agree with EVERY part of that definition of Liberty. I absolutely do not believe that is what "liberal" stands for today. The words "liberty" and "liberal" have about as much in common as the words "conservationist" and "conservative".

You remind me of a political science professor I had many years ago in college. He asked for a show of hands to indicate how many of his, mostly freshman and sophmore students were liberal and how many were conservative. When the majority indicated their leanings to a conservative position, he set out to define conservative in terms that any rational person would reject. The fact that his definition was a creation of his own mind rather than political reality was insignificant to him.

It is your right to define your own positions any way you want, then hang the liberal label on them if you choose. But your earlier definition of conservative is BULLSHIT. In the dictionary, conservative may have a "non-political" meaning, but there are very specific policy differences between liberals and conservatives that transcend the dictionary definitions.

I am not an uneducated man. Ask lavender, we have exchanged respectful posts in the recent past. I am moderately intelligent, and both politically active and informed. I am also old enough to remember much of the history to which you refer when it was "current events".

When I posted my opinions regarding "why I am a Republican", I intentionally avoided portraying a Democratic or liberal position. I can leave that to you... but don't portray what a conservative is if you don't (and obviously you don't) have any idea what it really is.