Anti Poetry

[twelveoone]

I doubt there are any neo-formalists in these parts targeting you, mein ubermensch. UYS is the closest to resembling a neo-formalist, and I'd bet she isn't taking the time to down vote your poems, mask ISP, create new email addresses and new lit names to down vote 1201's poems. I don't know that that strategy would even work. I've been around for some time writing and submitting stories and there isn't much that can be done post-2006/7 to manipulate the voting.

So there are likely a few, if not many, voting down the handful of poems that you used to have on your submissions page that had acquired an H. You've seen the idiocy and the nastiness with the folks complaining over the years about their scores, their H's etc. so why do you fixate?

Poetguy is the supreme poet of Literotica, whether he/she said something snide to you or not. Now who is challenging you? Who says they're a superior poet to you, looking for a challenge? I've looked for folks to write against now and then, but I don't think I've challenged anyone for a few years.

post script: your new poem is okay with a side of coleslaw, but it bothers me that the Monster isn't speaking French or even a Miltonian English as the family from which he learned to imitate were certainly not countrymen of Victor.

I thought he was Swiss, Lake Leman region.
why do I fixate?
1 it persists, H gone one recent poem, that one I didn't care about, the one you suggest "azure" as the better choice, the test was for "azurite", if it doesn't work, it fails for me
2 they showed up on a certain set of people, at least one was friend, three others where of more interest to me than either you/and or poetguy (personal taste, same as you have for the poetguy)
3 the anon has a certain tendency for either falsification of information and deception trying to make it look like it comes from another corner
4 both you and or/ the poet guy seem to operate under a certain restrictive set of criteria that is a determinate of poetry, neither one of you seem to be able to illustrate that certain it, however, the it seems to be center around largely what there own strengths are
5 from past experience you have been known to have alts, and comment on them; play games like the WilliamBYeats character
6 an anonymous commentor that slanderously refered to some people others is one that put one of your alts on the top list, that particular poem was idle for years
7 because you seemed to take a perverse pleasure in baiting me about the 52 pick up, which seemed to have popped up AFTER I mentioned that other sites require three comments for each poem posted
8 both you and/or the poetguy have no real propensity for sharing this secret information, but in the poetguy's case a great propensity for fishing for it, in yours it tends toward pontification.
9 those old H's meant something to me, validation and perhaps memories of people I liked and I regard it as an invalidation of real opinion.
10 because YOU made a issue about a comment of mine

I've been around for some time writing and submitting stories and there isn't much that can be done post-2006/7 to manipulate the voting.
Does it allow anonymous voting, comments?

Those votes, comments are anonymous, asshole, so what kind of bullshit are you pulling with that UYS, alt lit names, new email addresses mumbo jumbo, nice piece of disinformation to lead of this off with, similar to what I see from the some of the Anon posts.

so white, so white, so wonderful to be free of this desire to write, blank page, I'm done

to have written something that is composed of lines that are not allowed, to have done things that aren't supposed to work? Did you or your idol think to try half the shit, I tried? Ah, no. smoke and mirrors, strings and wires, and not for anything he wrote, oh, no, nor any comment made oh, no, but for the fact that comments should be made down the poetic hole.

Now, what is there left, to talk like an Englisher and stuff it with poetisms, (which I could probably do with a computer and if I could keep a straight face, remember it is all patterns, pattern, pattern) a rewrite of "Will you still love me tomorrow" as by sappho sister
ah the scent of sex and deceit
A laughter that mocked like the
sound of splitting ice . You did hear it, didn't you?

 

[twelveoone]

I get it now.
Anti poetry, antifreeze, Auntie Mame,
antidisestablishmentarianism.
Anti-heroes never shave and anti-poets never edit,
punk poets who scream at the mowhawked crowd
yur knot the boss of me
cuz I don't care so much it's all I care about.
It's clever, that's what it is,
that two edged sword of the intellect,
not quite smart, not really brilliant and so far from genius,
clever is the word.
Clever is a Balzac bronze carved from soap
and made into a table lamp. Clever.
Not Balzac, not much of a lamp, useless as soap,
but so clever.
The formless form, the edgeless edge,
not over the line, just tripped over the line.
As dark is defined by the absence of light,
let it be defined as the absence of poetics,
but it can't be killed, every severed hydra head spawns two,
every fractured poem breaks at the seams
and drips through the floorboards into the crawlspace of literature,
waiting for the ghost train of the tenure track
to declare it new and relevant.
So very clever.

I liked summer of 1989 better, I guess you didn't want comments, sorry.

 

[bflagsst]

...
Now, what is there left, to talk like an Englisher and stuff it with poetisms, (which I could probably do with a computer and if I could keep a straight face, remember it is all patterns, pattern, pattern) a rewrite of "Will you still love me tomorrow" as by sappho sister
ah the scent of sex and deceit
A laughter that mocked like the
sound of splitting ice . You did hear it, didn't you?

Sapphos Sister is a much better version than PhaonsBrother. I don't know that the English Lady has ever pestered anyone. If you keep placing me at the scene of your supposed victimizations I might cease speaking to you for a few years. I have time for arguing about poems and poetry, not about who is an internet scoundrel.

I entered this thread to conjure PoetGuy, someone I'd forgotten if not for your words, not to bait 1201.

I barely remember you being around until you began your campaign of who should do what and where and to whom.

1201, you're somebody and I'm not you so why even venture toward the abyss? I read your work in Jenn's magazine then sent you an email or private message telling you how I appreciate your poetry here and there. You're a fantastic poet, I hope you don't doubt my sincerity since I've said it more than twice now.

WilliamButlerYeats arrived to specifically be outed to teach a certain poet a lesson in manners. I'm slightly irritated that his contest poem wasn't received better.

 

[Angeline]

That's not true. Some languages of tribes int he rain forest have a vocabulary of as little as 500 words. There is a whole encylopedia of stuff they can't define with language which we know exists.

The problem with rigid definitions is that you will end up with the poetry police telling you what is and what is not poetry. You could simply define prose from poetry if you feel it needs to be differentiated, prose is the use of language to communicate information and concrete ideas while poetry is language as art.

And to me the problem with the poetry police is that they're on both sides. Beyond a certain point a good poem is a good poem, no matter how the author or its readers define it. If I consider what I think are the best poems I've written there are both form and free verse poems on the short list.

Now as to anti-poetry I understand it's a thing, maybe a genre. I don't claim to know a lot about it nor about the art movements that help define it. Maybe I should educate myself and maybe I will but we each explore poetry in our own way. I'm not sure what crime against art that commits, not enthusiastically jumping on a bandwagon when I'm happy on my own so to speak. Personally I think we need to put flowers in each other's rifles but I'm an old hippie.

I noticed them.

Maybe this thread wasn't a very good idea or it was just put too clumsily saying, why not push the boat out and experiment, why keep regurgitating the past. We inhabit a new century with new technology, the world is changing faster than ever, why stay in the 20th, 19th, 18th, 16th century or whatever, when the world is in the 21st century.

It's not a case of dismissing the past, its a case of not living there.

The thread is fine but there seems to be an underlying assumption that everyone will understand and appreciate anti-poetry as the better way to write. Maybe that's a misinterpretation on my part.

The problem with regurgitating the past, as you so charmingly put it, is that the big sticky web of sentiment is always waiting to ensnare you. And sometimes a little sentiment might be just what I want to convey, but the danger of going overboard is huge. Still it is possible to either avoid sentiment or achieve a balance that results in good poetry. It may not be to everyone's taste but how to define a poem's "goodness" is an even bigger web.

And if, for example, I am fascinated by the American jazz culture in the mid-20th century and want to write about that, how am I living in the past? That's something I love and have passion for, as you do for anti poetry. Shouldn't we be writing about what inspires us? Would I write a better poem if I shifted to what you like because it's more current?

 

[bronzeage]

I liked summer of 1989 better, I guess you didn't want comments, sorry.

I like comments. You were right about the need feed thing. It will be edited after it digests a while.

I don't really understand this thread, or any of the posts in it, but I want to participate.

 

[Angeline]

I like comments. You were right about the need feed thing. It will be edited after it digests a while.

I don't really understand this thread, or any of the posts in it, but I want to participate.

I found your poem funny and quite clever. (Yeah, very clever.) Do I think it's perfect? No. But my assumption is that most of us write live here and reshape once we get the poem down. Some people do it before they hit submit post, some let it digest for a while. *shrug*

This thread might deserve a :caning: but moreso comic relief so I'm calling in the chorus:

 

[bronzeage]

I found your poem funny and quite clever. (Yeah, very clever.) Do I think it's perfect? No. But my assumption is that most of us write live here and reshape once we get the poem down. Some people do it before they hit submit post, some let it digest for a while. *shrug*

This thread might deserve a :caning: but moreso comic relief so I'm calling in the chorus:

I don't think there ever was a perfect editorial poem, so there's no point in trying too hard.

 

[Angeline]

I don't think there ever was a perfect editorial poem, so there's no point in trying too hard.

One of the people I've edited for regularly would send me texts with a stamp on the cover, a rubber stamp, that said "OK PER MKL." MKL was her, the author. I wanted to make a stamp that said "LOL."

 

[UnderYourSpell]

I don't know what I've walked in on (and I think I wish I hadn't) but I can assure you this is my one and only name ........... for one thing I don't know how to make another because I've never felt the need to find out. A poem would have to be absolutely dire for me to one bomb it and as I recall the only person I have done it to was to Ramona something or other.

 

[bronzeage]

I don't know what I've walked in on (and I think I wish I hadn't) but I can assure you this is my one and only name ........... for one thing I don't know how to make another because I've never felt the need to find out. A poem would have to be absolutely dire for me to one bomb it and as I recall the only person I have done it to was to Ramona something or other.

Ramona was a special case.

 

[Angeline]

Ramona was a special case.

/thread

 

[bronzeage]

/thread

Ramona was a presence on numerous poetry sites. She had a variety of names, but never made any attempt to conceal the connection between them. She especially liked sites which had monthly contests or awards.

Whether Ramona was a real person, or someone's internet performance art is difficult to say. She claimed to be a virgin who wrote erotic poetry. At one point, I almost convinced her to become my puppygirl, complete with paw mittens, ear bonnet and tail panties. I could tell she was tempted. The ear bonnet is adorable.

One day, she and all her alter egos simply vanished from sight and sites.

 

[neci]

once the pot was pissed in
the anti became the art
bringing us back to the beginning
of formulating speech

you fucking bozon.

 

[UnderYourSpell]

Ramona was a presence on numerous poetry sites. She had a variety of names, but never made any attempt to conceal the connection between them. She especially liked sites which had monthly contests or awards.

Whether Ramona was a real person, or someone's internet performance art is difficult to say. She claimed to be a virgin who wrote erotic poetry. At one point, I almost convinced her to become my puppygirl, complete with paw mittens, ear bonnet and tail panties. I could tell she was tempted. The ear bonnet is adorable.

One day, she and all her alter egos simply vanished from sight and sites.

Perhaps her crap imploded one day and she disappeared up her own orifice

 

[UnderYourSpell]

once the pot was pissed in
the anti became the art
bringing us back to the beginning
of formulating speech

you fucking bozon.

>>>>>>>> goes to Google bozon or at least the copulating kind ......

 

[twelveoone]

I barely remember you being around until you began your campaign of who should do what and where and to whom.

1201, you're somebody and I'm not you so why even venture toward the abyss? I read your work in Jenn's magazine then sent you an email or private message telling you how I appreciate your poetry here and there. You're a fantastic poet, I hope you don't doubt my sincerity since I've said it more than twice now.

I did find it strange that you poked your head in with the prose poetry crap, after I pm'ed you that it looked like pabla was doing a little baiting and I wasn't going to get lured in. I also find a bit disconcerting what you say about all the safeguards is contradicted by the fact that you have four. Seriously, I thought about what you had said about Return on Investment, I thought about the anon comments on mine and others, my H's disappearing, which I half expect, when I am here. I also thought about the fact that in the past few weeks I saw four H's. Ok one of mine, one on someone I recommended, as best as I remember one on someone's I just wrote a poem and enough friends voted on it anonymously remained, one who I expect is an alt, or very conveniently networked gets one for something that is nothing more than a poetic noodle. I've been here about nine years, I've seen this pattern rather consistently, despite being the target more than once, I still had H's. They are gone, if I recommend someone they get an H it goes.
Message has been loud and clear, shut the fuck up, or your "friends" get hurt.
That helps that I have no friends.

So without revisiting the past too much, that was a paraphrase of what you where baiting me with, that was probably something you will never saw before and probably never see again. And as a very high percentage of any 10 syllable line can be forced into a pentameter reading whereas most of the lines in mine are disallowed in formal poetry, but stuck in a formal structure, my questions 1.) does the material fit the structure. 2.) isn't about time some of you revisit what you believe, and some of you still sling around and 3.) what does Literotica offer?

Message had been loud and clear your ROI here is less than nothing, because if I was 'fantastic poet' you would think some would still be there. After all in some cases the number of comments would seem to indicate it.

posted on a poem submitted 05/27/11 i.e. almost one year later, since I wasn't around at the time, it was not in response to something I may have said to an irate newb
by Anonymous05/16/12
I will post as an anonymous because you love it so much. you are anonymouse amongst other sarcastic and pathetic pseudonyms. Your poetry is often brilliant but more oft than naught it is aimed at nameless people whom .believe are the horrible anon yet you post anon comments under your fake names all the time. There was a time I respected you, now you just make me sort of ill. The forum has improved since you've been gone. Adios, comotose

I'm sure it will, it always seems that way doesn't it. Memory is such a transient thing. In your hollow skull after one year. I'm sure you heard that laughter like the sound of spiting ice.

But thanks bflagsst, ROI hit home. And Ash, you too, your email said mountains as to the average intent here.

Oh, and no hard feelings, it is a pain in the ass to write, and I just don't feel the need.

 

[twelveoone]

You're a fantastic poet, I hope you don't doubt my sincerity since I've said it more than twice now.

WilliamButlerYeats arrived to specifically be outed to teach a certain poet a lesson in manners. I'm slightly irritated that his contest poem wasn't received better.

I get the feeling that I'm in a movie, "1984", we have always loved....

"manners?" How is Emp doing? You two where playing games with a blind man. And this was precipitated, why? fridayam? who was taught and how?

Really, if I come here (i.e. the Abyss) , I have to play three games of chess. A poison pawn is one thing, but 24 on one board? The King changing to a Queen? Kind of makes it hard to check things. And not just you. "PoetGuise' viewed from stilts, blinder than I ever was.

Sorry to revisit, but I not letting that "teach a certain poet a lesson in manners." pass unscathed.

Now, when are they going to get rid of that anonymous voting crap? Or is it left for that reason "teaching certain poets lessons"?

Transparency, and bring the fucking thermometer back, if I can suffer the slings and arrows and lose H's, which happens... but usually when I am here, laughs