Authors- how do you deal with objectification?

[Bramblethorn]

Both my sons and mybest friend have "secret personal meaning tattoos". I know what they're all about.

There are two reasons I never had one (although my wife loves them on guys): Firstly, I don't want to decalre, even to myself, anything about myself for "all time" -- I want to remain mutable as much as possible. I reserve the right to withdraw any statement I make about myself. And the second reason is that I'm scared shitless of needles.

I never thought I'd get one either - what if I change my mind? But with that one I was pretty sure I wouldn't. I was wary about the idea of permanently changing myself but eventually I got to thinking, my body's always changing whether I want it to or not, what's one more thing?

I'm okay with needles. It hurt of course, but after a few minutes I got into a "it hurts and that's okay" headspace, and by the time it was done I was at "this is kind of nice, do we have to stop?" I could understand why some people find it addictive.

 

[M_K_Babalon]

As you say. The issue is when a woman’s appearance is all that matters. Not her intellect. Not her heart. Not her brain.

To put it the other way round. Someone might be beautiful inside while falling short of our silly standards outside.

I’ve said before, I don’t really go on a guy’s appearance. Most I have slept with (look at me using grown up language!) are ones I have got to know and attraction has developed over time. I’ve had hook-ups with girls though.

The other aspect is hooking up with a female stranger feels a lot safer.

Em

If all I wanted to do was fuck, then all that might not matter. Now if it was dating or a fwb thing, then it would to some degree.

 

[onehitwanda]

I never thought I'd get one either - what if I change my mind? But with that one I was pretty sure I wouldn't. I was wary about the idea of permanently changing myself but eventually I got to thinking, my body's always changing whether I want it to or not, what's one more thing?

I'm okay with needles. It hurt of course, but after a few minutes I got into a "it hurts and that's okay" headspace, and by the time it was done I was at "this is kind of nice, do we have to stop?" I could understand why some people find it addictive.

try acupuncture coupled with massage. First time I had it done to me (RSI in my arms) I stumbled home and fell asleep on my couch and woke up at midnight.

 

[forgotmyantidepressants]

This is a question I have asked myself a thousand times. (Probably more)
I realise what I am about to write, is going to get me in hot water. I also gather, it will not be appreciated by many here.

Women are treated appallingly around the world.
Banned from education
Not allowed to vote
Not allowed to hold office
Not allowed to travel unaccompanied by a male.
Killed at birth because the family cannot afford a dowry.
Cannot borrow money, get credit
Cannot own property
Traded as sex slaves. Prostitures... Women are a currency.
Sold for prices less than a donkey.

Even in 1st world countries, some of these problems are still in use.

The world is governed by men, and they are treated differently. They think they are the superior gender. The saying "It's a mans world." Rings very true.

Women in the work place have to work harder, for less pay to try and make it....

Pornography, is geared towards male satisfaction. Females are nothing more than objects for their gratification. Women are tortured, humiliated, raped, gang banged and used as nothing other than somewhere to squirt their junk. Bukaki....

I like erotica, sexy stories filled with romance and positive emotions.
I think that erotic stories, feed the negative aspects of how women are seen and treated.
Are we adding to this pile of feces?
Yes, I think we are (That is my opinion)
It does concern me, and I have considered many times stopping writing. Anything to stop adding fuel to the fire.

I have tried to convince myself that I portray women positively, and I'm not adding to the misogynistic swamp of porn. Literotica is (IMO) 90% male readership. The same proportion stands for writers. IMO.
I fear that I am doing as much damage as everybody else.
Writing though has become somewhat of an addiction, one that I am struggling to give up.
Now, I try.... probably unsuccessfully to write strong, positive women characters. If I can only convince myself....

Cagivagurl

I'm simply curious as to what makes you think literotica is 90% male readership? I've been wondering about the demographic since I started posting stories. Romance novels (erotic and non-erotic alike) are mostly consumed by women, so I figured there were probably a lot of other women reading stories on here. I've read stories on here for ages.

 

[AchtungNight]

I don't want to decalre, even to myself, anything about myself for "all time" -- I want to remain mutable as much as possible. I reserve the right to withdraw any statement I make about myself. And the second reason is that I'm scared shitless of needles.

This is why I’ve never gotten a tattoo. When my wife wanted one and refused to discuss it with me… it was a sign our marriage was about over.

 

[M_K_Babalon]

Both my sons and mybest friend have "secret personal meaning tattoos". I know what they're all about.

There are two reasons I never had one (although my wife loves them on guys): Firstly, I don't want to decalre, even to myself, anything about myself for "all time" -- I want to remain mutable as much as possible. I reserve the right to withdraw any statement I make about myself. And the second reason is that I'm scared shitless of needles.

That's why the ones I have a significant and not just spur of the moment.

 

[M_K_Babalon]

This is why I’ve never gotten a tattoo. When my wife wanted one and refused to discuss it with me… it was a sign our marriage was about over.

Not everything is a discussion. It's her body.

 

[AchtungNight]

Not everything is a discussion. It's her body.

Well, yeah, but I had always told her my reasons (listed above) and thought she agreed with me. Turns out she just understood my viewpoint. Sometimes you’re never ready to split until you realize how far apart you already are.

When she makes the latest video game I play a discussion… and tattoos can alter the body and be a lot more expensive to get and maintain… probably good that relationship is over, I know.

 

[nice90sguy]

A tat can sometimes be a promise to oneself: "Carve this into your soul..."

But it's more often seems to be simply a badge to show which tribe you belong to (at the time you got the tattoo).

Unlike 1980's padded shoulders, if they go out of fashion, they're pretty hard to undo

 

[M_K_Babalon]

Well, yeah, but I had always told her my reasons (listed above) and thought she agreed with me. Turns out she just understood my viewpoint. Sometimes you’re never ready to split until you realize how far apart you already are.

When she makes the latest video game I play a discussion… and tattoos can alter the body and be a lot more expensive to get and maintain… probably good that relationship is over, I know.

I'm not going to speak on your divorce, nor do I think it's my place to do it. All of my tats were free, all six of them and I don't need to do anything to maintain them, except make sure they don't get damaged, like when I wreck my bike, or not scratch the shit out of them with my nails. I don't know about the video game thing either. I have realized[ I guess] my adhd has me hyperfixating on things, so it's hard to tear away and that has been contention in past relationships.

 

[M_K_Babalon]

A tat can sometimes be a promise to oneself: "Carve this into your soul..."

But it's more often seems to be simply a badge to show which tribe you belong to (at the time you got the tattoo).

Unlike 1980's padded shoulders, if they go out of fashion, they're pretty hard to undo

That's because people get them as fads. Or at some moment in life, then regret it. That's another reason why I'll never get a free tat from a parlor or convention. I'd rather get the shirt.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

That's because people get them as fads. Or at some moment in life, then regret it. That's another reason why I'll never get a free tat from a parlor or convention. I'd rather get the shirt.

It's frightening how true this is. One of my co-workers is married to a tattoo artist. He's the belle of the ball at our company Christmas party every year because he has ALL the best stories. He's in his 40s and been doing it his whole life, and the stuff he's seen...

My favorite was he had a group of 4 college girls come in one afternoon. All four of them wanted a tattoo of a line drawing of cartoon sperm on the inside of their lower lip.
He gives them his usual ethical, "you've thought this through, you really want to do this?"
"Yes!" all the way around, so they do the paperwork and he goes to work.
He's tattooing the last girl, they've all be laughing and joking the whole time, and one of them says, "Who's will wear off first?".
He stopped, looked at the girl and says, "Excuse me?"
"We were betting who's tattoo would wear off first".
Long story short, they knew tattoos are permanent, but they figured being on the inside of the mouth that was somehow different and that it would be gone in 5 or 6 years.

 

[AchtungNight]

Now imagine if these girls were Holocaust victims or Yakuza… They’ll always be part of a certain gang. LOL

 

[Cagivagurl]

I'm simply curious as to what makes you think literotica is 90% male readership? I've been wondering about the demographic since I started posting stories. Romance novels (erotic and non-erotic alike) are mostly consumed by women, so I figured there were probably a lot of other women reading stories on here. I've read stories on here for ages.

That statement was not quoted as fact. It is my opinion only.
I'm not sure exactly of the %. I do believe that that the ration if not 90%. It must be fairly close. Definitely above 80%
In my opinion.
Cagivagurl.

 

[EmilyMiller]

That statement was not quoted as fact. It is my opinion only.
I'm not sure exactly of the %. I do believe that that the ration if not 90%. It must be fairly close. Definitely above 80%
In my opinion.
Cagivagurl.

It’s not robust data, but based on comments I get on stories, I’d say that’s about right.

AH leans much more female than the site as a whole. Feels like it might be 30% female here.

Em

 

[Cagivagurl]

It’s not robust data, but based on comments I get on stories, I’d say that’s about right.

AH leans much more female than the site as a whole. Feels like it might be 30% female here.

Em

I think that is true...
Much stronger presence here.

Cagivagurl

 

[policywank]

There is a difference between thinking that some attribute or combination of attributes of a woman is attractive and thinking that this is the only thing that she has to offer.

IRL, I like being called sexy. I like being called cute. What I don’t like is people who don’t see anything beyond physical appearance.

Em

I think that this is true. I'd like to think that the "old school" attitudes that a woman with certain sexual attributes must be lacking in other key areas have at least faded. I know it is still out there, but I'd like to think that we are past the point of the early wave feminism which (understandably for their time) associated any recognition of sexual characteristics with a lack of respect overall.

In my view, the best way to build this into your story telling is to pair recognition of a woman's sexual attributes with other positive or interesting attributes. Don't be patronizing or treat it as though she needs validation. Just allow for the possibility that she makes some genuinely witty remarks or is a high achieving professional or if she is particularly sexual portray her as owning that. Make her multi-dimensional. By all means put me in a slinky cocktail dress or slightly too tight business suit, but then have the other characters talk to me as someone who has earned her own sexual agency and the right to be treated with respect.

Just as importantly in my opinion is when putting the women in the story into sexual situations take into account what a woman would actually want and not just what men wish we wanted. I don't mean hearts and flowers and romance. We can enjoy raw, raunchy sex as much as a man, but one needs to think through what we would want. For instance, multi-partner sex. I enjoy being with multiple men and I have no problem with it being focussed on raw animalistic sex, including me doing dirty things. But I don't want to be abused (physically, mentally or emotionally) and I don't want to be with men who disrespect me for enjoying that activity. If a guy thinks that the same sex act that makes him a hero makes me a piece of garbage then he won't be invited. He needs to be able to see me engage in sexual adventure while maintaining respect in much the same was as he would for other men.

A lot of it is about respect. If you want to be able to write about a woman enjoying sex you need to be able to respect her choice to engage in that activity.

 

[EmilyMiller]

I think that this is true. I'd like to think that the "old school" attitudes that a woman with certain sexual attributes must be lacking in other key areas have at least faded. I know it is still out there, but I'd like to think that we are past the point of the early wave feminism which (understandably for their time) associated any recognition of sexual characteristics with a lack of respect overall.

In my view, the best way to build this into your story telling is to pair recognition of a woman's sexual attributes with other positive or interesting attributes. Don't be patronizing or treat it as though she needs validation. Just allow for the possibility that she makes some genuinely witty remarks or is a high achieving professional or if she is particularly sexual portray her as owning that. Make her multi-dimensional. By all means put me in a slinky cocktail dress or slightly too tight business suit, but then have the other characters talk to me as someone who has earned her own sexual agency and the right to be treated with respect.

Just as importantly in my opinion is when putting the women in the story into sexual situations take into account what a woman would actually want and not just what men wish we wanted. I don't mean hearts and flowers and romance. We can enjoy raw, raunchy sex as much as a man, but one needs to think through what we would want. For instance, multi-partner sex. I enjoy being with multiple men and I have no problem with it being focussed on raw animalistic sex, including me doing dirty things. But I don't want to be abused (physically, mentally or emotionally) and I don't want to be with men who disrespect me for enjoying that activity. If a guy thinks that the same sex act that makes him a hero makes me a piece of garbage then he won't be invited. He needs to be able to see me engage in sexual adventure while maintaining respect in much the same was as he would for other men.

A lot of it is about respect. If you want to be able to write about a woman enjoying sex you need to be able to respect her choice to engage in that activity.

Agree 150%.

Em

 

[ElectricBlue]

"Yes!" all the way around, so they do the paperwork and he goes to work.
He's tattooing the last girl, they've all be laughing and joking the whole time, and one of them says, "Who's will wear off first?".
He stopped, looked at the girl and says, "Excuse me?"
"We were betting who's tattoo would wear off first".
Long story short, they knew tattoos are permanent, but they figured being on the inside of the mouth that was somehow different and that it would be gone in 5 or 6 years.

And now they're all working in corporate insurance or banking. God save us from dumb college girls. Why would you even do that?

 

[StillStunned]

AH leans much more female than the site as a whole. Feels like it might be 30% female here.

I can't speak for the rest of you lot, but according to my wife I'm about 30% female.

I think she's referring to my slim ankles.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

And now they're all working in corporate insurance or banking. God save us from dumb college girls. Why would you even do that?

And I suspect they are the talk of the dentist's office.

 

[onehitwanda]

I can't speak for the rest of you lot, but according to my wife I'm about 30% female.

I think she's referring to my slim ankles.

She told me it's your lovely round knees.

 

[ElectricBlue]

And I suspect they are the talk of the dentist's office.

Didn't think of that! That's brilliant!

 

[StillStunned]

She told me it's your lovely round knees.

Quite possibly. Ankles and knees, that adds up to about 30%, right?

 

[onehitwanda]

Quite possibly. Ankles and knees, that adds up to about 30%, right?

depends if you're deboned or not.