Being a woman in geek culture

[Stella_Omega]

this and its related articles make for some interesting reading;
http://www.beesgo.biz/reality.html

The story is both an indictment of the tech industry-- an outsider had heard about the misogyny and wanted to cash in on that for cheap thrills-- and an exoneration -- the game dev community would not take his bait, and reacted to stop him.

 

[satindesire]

Nice stereotype it's perfect for this thread

TROLL! IN THE DUNGEON!

Just thought you outta know....*faints*

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Happy Birthday, Satin!!!

 

[satindesire]

Happy Birthday, Satin!!!

Shush. It's not til July you silly beast!

On a side note:

How men deal with role reversal--
http://www.upworthy.com/see-how-these-men-respond-when-a-woman-makes-sexist-remarks?c=ufb1

 

[KoPilot]

Hey! It's this thread!

Boy has there been a metric ton of shit going on the comic book world. And a lot of it is, quite frankly, stuff I thought I'd never see, let alone see happen so quickly.

It all started with this guest article on CBR: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?id=52103&page=article

Which led to rape threats, death threats, doxing, and an attempt at hacking her bank account. All over a fucking cover critique. Janelle is an immensely smart woman, though, and she has a lot of knowledge specific to the harassment of women in comics and geek culture. She let a panel at ECCC this year about harassment in the industry (it wasn't that good, tbh, basically an introduction to the thing rather than an in-depth conversation about the role industry pros and publishers play in the whole culture).

She happened to be conducting a survey at the time about harassment in comics culture, which, when 4chan found out about it, exploded with horseshit, thus proving her point even more.

Anyways, she's been very public about the level of harassment she's been getting about this, and a lot of folks have stepped in to say something about it. Pros, especially, who are used to keeping their head down and nose to the grindstone, who are usually afraid to rock the boat for fear of being more or less blacklisted by editors. Here are some responses:

http://thebirdandthebat.tumblr.com/...to-burst-your-masturbatory-comic-bubble-no-im
http://angryampersand.tumblr.com/post/82947786527/angryampersand-im-really-glad-people-are
http://alewing.tumblr.com/post/83886512561/ive-been-reblogging-some-sexual-harassment-related
http://davidmarquez.tumblr.com/post/82927154146/yes-i-should-say-something-about-harassment
Greg Rucka's epic rant: http://ruckawriter.tumblr.com/post/83527917580/contents-under-pressure
A response from the writer of the comic book that started this whole thing: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=52253

Janelle ended up making the blog called We Are Comics in response as well, which has gotten tremendous support from all sorts of folks: http://wearecomics.tumblr.com/

And now CBR has made the pretty unprecedented decision to wipe their forums and instate a zero-tolerance policy for harassment and trolling. And This is a forum that's at least as old as Lit with probably as many posts and posters. Read about that here: http://www.themarysue.com/comic-book-resources-new-forums/

All in all, a pretty chaotic and amazing few weeks for the comic book industry. Now I just wish video games would suffer a revolution like this.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Heh, I don't even want to bring my news in. I'm so sick of the bullshit. And I don't like the sound of heads exploding.

I'm sorry to be so gnomic. maybe tomorrow I can talk about it.

 

[satindesire]

All in all, a pretty chaotic and amazing few weeks for the comic book industry. Now I just wish video games would suffer a revolution like this.

DAMN now that's what I'm talking about!

The voice of the minority who want to keep women out of "the boys' club" will soon fade into obscurity.

Heh, I don't even want to bring my news in. I'm so sick of the bullshit. And I don't like the sound of heads exploding.

I'm sorry to be so gnomic. maybe tomorrow I can talk about it.

*supportive hug*

 

[KoPilot]

DAMN now that's what I'm talking about!

The voice of the minority who want to keep women out of "the boys' club" will soon fade into obscurity.

Waa... going through the We Are Comics blog, some submissions I'm seeing: a ton of publishing editors (IDW, Dark Horse, Image), an ex-Disney animator who now works on MLP, pretty much every webcomic creator under the sun, the ENTIRE Fantagraphics team, a judge for the Eisner awards, Steve Lieber, Joe Glass, and wayyyy more.

:']

Heh, I don't even want to bring my news in. I'm so sick of the bullshit. And I don't like the sound of heads exploding.

I'm sorry to be so gnomic. maybe tomorrow I can talk about it.

Uh oh.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Fuuuck. I just don't know what to say. Obviously, these guys don't see what the problem is, titties are totally awesome and people need to lighten up and what difference does it make anyway.

http://codebabes.com/

Goofily enough, I ended up moderating a twitter convo between one of the models who declared that it was silly for women to be upset, because SHE had so much fun doing the job-- and a slut-shaming protofeminist of about the same age.

No, and also no.

 

[satindesire]

Fuuuck. I just don't know what to say. Obviously, these guys don't see what the problem is, titties are totally awesome and people need to lighten up and what difference does it make anyway.

http://codebabes.com/

Goofily enough, I ended up moderating a twitter convo between one of the models who declared that it was silly for women to be upset, because SHE had so much fun doing the job-- and a slut-shaming protofeminist of about the same age.

No, and also no.

*wince*

I don't know if I want to go there today. I've been up and cleaning since 7am and I am bloody TIRED.

 

[satindesire]

"The U.S. State Department estimates that between 600,000 and 800,000 people are trafficked across international borders each year and 80% of those trafficked are women and girls, mostly for sexual exploitation."

http://www.change.org/petitions/ove...geria-please-help-find-them-bringbackourgirls

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/01/w...ay-of-protests-over-mass-abductions.html?_r=1

 

[Stella_Omega]

and in answer to their own faux pas, the codebabe boys have published this;
http://codedudes.com/

Wouldn't it be amazing if they got it right? Do you think they will?

 

[KoPilot]

and in answer to their own faux pas, the codebabe boys have published this;
http://codedudes.com/

Wouldn't it be amazing if they got it right? Do you think they will?

Dunno, but I just tweeted at them.

 

[satindesire]

This is possibly one of the best articles on the internet, hands down.

http://thisrecording.com/today/2011...h-you-how-to-be-a-woman-in-any-boys-club.html

"Allies And Enemies: Some guys will hate you for being superior to them at the thing they care most about being good at. They are Paul Kinseys. This generally looks like it sounds, and involves sputtering. Cool guys will respect you and your hustle without being personally or professionally threatened. The coolest guys (Ken Cosgroves) will be secure in themselves enough to respect you specifically because of your hustle.

Most cool girls are totally fucked up because they are used to guys telling them they are "cool" or "funny" or "smart" and they assume it's a euphemism for "not hot" because they already feel like dudes with boobs. But that's okay because a hundred percent of cool guys are fucked up too and secretly feel like girls with dicks. Straight men are sooooooooo pink inside. They just can't tell you or anyone, because they have been socialized expressly not to. But I just told you you, and now everybody knows.

The idea that men will be turned off by ambition or success is just another part of the big lie. It is meant to scare you and keep you from questioning the system. The only men who are turned off by ambition and success are men that are insecure about their own talents and success or lack thereof. You don't really want to know those guys anyway, because they suck and they will constantly attempt to undermine you, and even if you are secure enough in yourself not to care it's still really fucking annoying.

Everyone feels like the worst awkward looking junior high version of themselves at times and has conflicted feelings about whatever demographic they usually date. The best thing you can do is team up to fight all the lame assholes of both genders.

If You Are A Straight Guy Who Figured Out Girls And Gays Are The Most Fun:

- Of course you can join, but you have to shut up. I mean, you can talk, obviously. But you have to realize and recognize that traditional male privilege becomes your liability in these situations. The same thing that puts you at the top of the pecking order in most social situations (glass elevator) puts you at the bottom of this one. Get used to bottoming. Realize it can be the best. Think about how intense it is to be a woman.

- If anybody makes fun of straight dudes and the lame bonehead things they sometimes do, you are not allowed to get defensive and say that you never do any of those things. Relax, we're aren't talking about you. We're just talking about privilege denying dudes in general, and admitting that they exist is not the same as being one. The best first step to demonstrating that you are not one is to admit that they exist.

How About When You're The Privileged Person In The Situation? Golden rule. Don't deny that the privilege exists or that while some people might have it, certainly you are not one of those people because blah blah blah. Nope. Don't do that. Admit that the world is unfair, that there are ideologies and systems in place that benefit some people and hurt others, often one at the expense of the other.

Accept that while you didn't create and don't directly control these systems, you have definitely benefited from them at one time or another. Equality isn't about fucking anyone over. It's about learning how not to do that. Listen to what other people have to say. Do not mistake your personal lived experiences for universal truths or cite them as if they were such. Genuinely listen. Pay attention. Listen."

 

[BlondieSinner29]

So just in case anyone has missed the recent goings-on on the interbone about women in geek culture, I'm going to link a few articles/pages that will brush y'all up on what's happening lately.

http://whatever.scalzi.com/2012/07/26/who-gets-to-be-a-geek-anyone-who-wants-to-be/

http://www.examiner.com/article/tim...-facts-women-are-and-have-long-been-geeks-too

http://www.dailyillini.com/opinion/columns/article_90391094-4347-11e2-8805-001a4bcf6878.html

http://www.doctornerdlove.com/2011/11/nerds-and-male-privilege/

As a woman who was introduced to geek culture while still wearing diapers, I feel frustrated that my "geek cred" has been questioned simply due to my gender. I feel frustrated that I cannot identify with many female characters due to their one-dimensional and heavily sexualized portrayals. I feel frustrated that when I speak about this, my concerns are outright dismissed as "hysterical", "irrational", or being told that the way women are portrayed in mainstream geek culture is "just part of the way it is and it's not going to change because mostly men are geeks".

What are your thoughts about this?

Have you experienced sexism in geek culture due to your gender?

How do YOU deal with it?

Not really. I know like three Jasons at work, it's funny. The tattoed jason, the nerdy jason with glasses, and the other jason I completly forgot about, I think he cleans the toliets.

He wanted to know the other day why everybody else but me and Cody didn't have to wear a red company shirt.

I said, "Well.. it you must know you have to get a 9 on your customer service survey."

I just smiled and walked off .

So do geeks hate me? Probably not. But they are jealous.

 

[KoPilot]

Not really. I know like three Jasons at work, it's funny. The tattoed jason, the nerdy jason with glasses, and the other jason I completly forgot about, I think he cleans the toliets.

He wanted to know the other day why everybody else but me and Cody didn't have to wear a red company shirt.

I said, "Well.. it you must know you have to get a 9 on your customer service survey."

I just smiled and walked off .

So do geeks hate me? Probably not. But they are jealous.

You really need to try being less high when you post.

 

[satindesire]

Not really. I know like three Jasons at work, it's funny. The tattoed jason, the nerdy jason with glasses, and the other jason I completly forgot about, I think he cleans the toliets.

He wanted to know the other day why everybody else but me and Cody didn't have to wear a red company shirt.

I said, "Well.. it you must know you have to get a 9 on your customer service survey."

I just smiled and walked off .

So do geeks hate me? Probably not. But they are jealous.

Wut?!

You really need to try being less high when you post.

 

[satindesire]

" But if you think for one second, for one solitary second, that demanding tolerance for men as a group, that dismissing the reality of violence against women because not all men kill, not all men rape, if you think that’s more important than demanding justice for those who have been brutalised and murdered by those not all men, then you are part of the problem. You may not have pulled the trigger. You may not have raised your hand to a woman in your life. But you are part of the problem.

This is not the time, to use the refrain of apologists for bigotry, to play devil’s advocate. The devil has more than enough advocates today. On most days, I can put up with aggressive faux-objectivity being used to shout down women’s experiences and silence gendered trauma, but not today."

http://www.newstatesman.com/lifesty...-killings-what-they-were-misogynist-extremism

 

[satindesire]

""First, earlier this week the story of Alyssa Funke broke. She said yes to sex. And she agreed to film it for other people to enjoy while masturbating, and was paid to do so. When her friends and the internet found out about her porn video, she was harassed so vehemently she committed suicide with a shotgun. She was slut-shamed to death. She’s dead because she said yes to sex, and people (mostly men) tormented her about this fact. They tormented her about her decision the have sex until the point that she believed being dead was a better scenario that dealing with the torment.

BUT THAT WASN’T ENOUGH FOR THEM!

Even though she’s dead, men continue to tweet at her remarks that simultaneously shame her for saying yes to sex, relish her death, and delight in masturbating to her video. The tone I read over and over again was “She filmed herself having sex, so she deserved to die. I enjoyed watching her have sex, but she still deserved to die.”

If some men believe the death penalty should be the punishment women, and women alone, receive for saying yes to sex, they must believe that sex is the worst of crimes, and we should therefore say no to sex. But saying no to sex resulted in women’s deaths this week too. The double standard isn’t just damned if you do, damned if you don’t anymore. It’s dead if you do, dead if you don’t.

A man killed 6 people and wounded 7 others at the University of California Santa Barbara two days ago, shooting into a sorority house, as promised, as "retribution" that since puberty women have denied him the sex and attention that he thought he deserved for being a “gentleman”. Women said no to sex, and now women are dead.

BUT THAT WASN’T ENOUGH FOR THEM!

Men began posting to twitter, Facebook, and Instagram that, well, these women got what they deserved. The tone I read over and over again was “This is what bitches get for denying the guy some pussy. He was a rich, good looking guy, and stuck up selfish prude sluts wouldn’t put out. Let this be a lesson to you ladies, the next time you refuse a man a blow job.”

http://sexologist.tumblr.com/post/86799922779/slut-shamed-to-death-for-saying-yes-to-sex-murdered

 

[Netzach]

I've been following the Belle Knox thing too, though. I'm wondering if she's not the right person in the right place to maybe signal some kind of a sea change at the same time that things are looking so shitty.

So far, Belle Knox has issued a resounding "so the fuck WHAT?" to the world. And the world really doesn't have anything to say back.

 

[Stella_Omega]

The Trinity Syndrome

Valka is just the latest example of the Superfluous, Flimsy Character disguised as a Strong Female Character. And possibly she’s the most depressing, considering Dragon 2’s other fine qualities, and considering how impressive she is in the abstract. The film spends so much time on making her first awe-inducing, then sympathetic, and just a little heartbreakingly pathetic in her isolation and awkwardness at meeting another human being. But once the introductions are finally done, and the battle starts, she immediately becomes useless, both to the rest of the cast and to the rapidly moving narrative. She faces the villain (the villain she’s apparently been successfully resisting alone for years!) and she’s instantly, summarily defeated. Her husband and son utterly overshadow her; they need to rescue her twice in maybe five minutes. Her biggest contribution to the narrative is in giving Hiccup a brief, rote “You are the Chosen One” pep talk. Then she all but disappears from the film, raising the question of why the story spent so much time on her in the first place.

 

[StrayKat]

The Trinity Syndrome

Could your Strong Female Character be seamlessly replaced with a floor lamp with some useful information written on it to help a male hero?

So we are back to old cliches.
It is 2014. and looks like collective male Ego has not yet developed enough to deal with anything more complex *sigh*

 

[satindesire]

I've been following the Belle Knox thing too, though. I'm wondering if she's not the right person in the right place to maybe signal some kind of a sea change at the same time that things are looking so shitty.

So far, Belle Knox has issued a resounding "so the fuck WHAT?" to the world. And the world really doesn't have anything to say back.

http://jezebel.com/belle-knox-loses-her-financial-aid-1592015314

So we are back to old cliches.
It is 2014. and looks like collective male Ego has not yet developed enough to deal with anything more complex *sigh*

We REALLY need to push our daughters to stop listening to this misogynistic culture and get them into producing art and film, and get them back into the STEM field.

It would make getting decent women-based science and decent female characters a LOT easier.

 

[Stella_Omega]

"I am in the business of making fun of video games and business is goooood"

 

[StrayKat]

We REALLY need to push our daughters to stop listening to this misogynistic culture and get them into producing art and film, and get them back into the STEM field.

I never raised my daughters to be feminists, at least not intentionally. I just gave them example of self respect, I believe. Yet they are both so military feminist oriented that my Mother, who is relatively "normal", gets horrified.
Personally I chuckle. I am glad my kids will not take any shit in life just because it comes from a male. They are both living with their men for years now and I am happy to see their boyfriends dont seem to be least concerned about their feminism.
They are very beautiful too so none can say they got into "that feminist crap" because they couldnt find more feminine ways to express themselves. The older one is studying art so hopefully she will get to work on that too.

I am extremely proud of my children (as one may notice), I think they turned out better than I could dream of and sure better than I did. And even though I dont consider myself a feminist I am proud that is what my daughters picked to be by their own choice.

/brag over