For Those Who Might Be Wondering Why We Might Be In Ukraine

[ChloeTzang]

Minister of Defense Rustem Umerov and the First Lady of Ukraine, Olena Zelenska took part in the launching of the Ukrainian corvette "Hetman Ivan Vyhovskyi". It's the second Ada-class corvette, manufactured in Turkey for the Ukraine Navy. "Hetman Ivan Vyhovskyi" and "Hetman Ivan Mazepa" are equipped with cutting-edge weapons and will become a significant addition to the Ukrainian fleet, which is being rebuilt from the ground up following the Russian invasion, increasing the defense capabilities of Ukraine.

The Ada-class corvettes are being used by the Turkish (5), Pakistani (4) and Malaysian (3 ordered) navies, while another four have been exported to an unnamed Middle Eastern country. Now also to be used by Ukraine. They're a littoral combat ship, configured for ASW warfare with similarities to the Freedom-class littoral combat ship of the U.S. Navy. The Ada-class corvettes are more heavily armed and are equipped with more capable radar and sonar systems.

 

[Buffalogurl]

Hey, a new Technical, based of course on the wonderully versatile Toyota Landcruiser. The Armed Forces of Ukraine have expanded their fleet with a new domestically developed armored vehicle. The Ministry of Defense has codified and approved the use of the Dzura armored vehicle, which is designed for various tactical tasks and built by the Ukrainian armored vehicle manufacturer NVO Praktyka. Engineers modified the original chassis by reinforcing the suspension and improving the braking system to support the increased weight. The vehicle features an armored capsule providing protection equivalent to NATO STANAG 4569 level 1, capable of withstanding 5.45 mm caliber bullets and protecting against multiple grenade explosions under the wheels or floor. The armor is made from special ballistic steel, combining ultra-high hardness and high plasticity, and the multilayer bulletproof glass includes a polycarbonate anti-shatter layer to protect against secondary splinters.

Designed as a mobile armored wheeled platform, the Djura is primarily intended for low-risk tactical missions, mainly for police units and special operations forces. It allows for the rapid movement of command personnel and their protection in tactical and operational depth. In addition to its main function of protecting and transporting command personnel, the Djura can also be used to transfer small combat groups and equipment to combat mission areas, as well as perform fire support tasks by installing machine guns, anti-tank systems, air defense systems, or jammers.

Unlike Russia, with a few critical and highly centralized industrial concerns, the Ukraine defence industry is diversified, with many smaller concerns designing, innovating and developing rapidly. Here is yet another product of that decentralized approach.

Weighing 5 tons, it has a robust 200-horsepower diesel engine with either automatic, semi-automatic, or manual transmissions based on customer requirements and can reach a road speed of 120 km/h. It also has a range of 1300 km. The Djura is equipped with numerous features to improve crew ergonomics and comfort, including special interior lighting, a driving camera with infrared mode for night driving, rearview and parking cameras, an electric winch, 12V/5V sockets, an electric heating system for the windshield and front door windows, a navigation system, and preparation for the installation of additional equipment like radios. It can also be equipped with an optional searchlight.

NVO Praktyka is a Ukrainian company specializing in the design and manufacture of armored vehicles for military and security use. Founded in the 1990s, Praktyka has now become a major player in the Ukrainian defense industry, known for its innovations and product quality. Among the vehicles they produce is the Kozak armored vehicle, designed to offer high protection against ballistic and explosive threats while being capable of traversing difficult terrain. In addition to its utility armored vehicles, Praktyka develops infantry fighting vehicles (IFVs) like the Otaman, a modern IFV equipped with advanced weapon systems and offering enhanced mobility and protection for troops on the battlefield.

These vehicles, like the Djura, developed by NVO Praktyka, enable discreet and rapid operations, reducing troop exposure to enemy fire and ambushes. Their ability to be equipped with various weapon and defense systems, such as machine guns, anti-tank systems, and jammers, enhances the Ukrainian army's ability to conduct effective tactical missions while minimizing human losses. Additionally, the domestic production of these vehicles allows for a rapid response to the specific needs of the Ukrainian theater of operations. In response to the Russian invasion, Ukraine is actively developing its defense industrial base by forming partnerships with foreign companies and conglomerates. For instance, the partnership with the Turkish company Baykar for the production of Bayraktar TB2 drones has significantly boosted the Ukrainian army's surveillance and strike capabilities.

Similarly, collaboration with Western manufacturers, such as acquiring air defense systems and light armored vehicles from various NATO countries, enables Ukraine to improve its defensive capabilities. These international collaborations not only enhance the operational effectiveness of the Ukrainian army but also contribute to the growth and modernization of the national defense industry by integrating advanced technologies and promoting skill transfers.

And THAT is just a small part of what is going on inside Ukraine. Never forget, most Ukrainians are descendants of the Cossacks, NOT Russian muzhiks....

Slava Ukraini!

View attachment 2373057

After reading your very thought out posts, I've concluded to the best of my ability, that Russia is in reality fighting a world war against all of nato? Am I not correct? That without all of the backing of nato Ukraine would have been utterly destroyed sometime last year? I'm not sure your seeing the entire picture, by what you're presenting the US and the European union are at war, is that a correct assumption? So with the Ukrainian gains in industry and it entire manufacturing power do you believe the Russians will be driven out of Ukraine by the end of the year?...
Chloe, I'm not being snarky.... I just see a different version... that's all.... if and when the ukies oust the Russians they will be in utter devastation and in debt to the bankers whom are funding this bloodbath for (just guessing) the next 100 years if you an historical similarly situation read about the fall of the ottoman empire and how their war financially destroyed them all over a stolen tin start from a church in Bethlehem.....in the end, Ukraine will die most likely taking Russia with it......and the son of perdition will collect his souls...

 

[Buffalogurl]

P.s. as an after thought..... at what point do you believe president Putin goes global with his embedded insurgents and or his nukes...... my thoughts are the United States will use the cover of the Ukrainian war to implement the b16? Tactical nuke under the wing of the F-16's.......for a first strike to try and decapitate the Russian leadership...

 

[Rightguide]

No one in their right mind are going to put rookie pilots in the f16 then have them in combat..... not gonna happen.... they be using sheepdipped nato pilots.......

The F-16s aren't going to change the outcome of the war. They are late 1960s and early 70s technology. It is a good aircraft built to conform to American integrated air combat tactics which are completely foreign to those employed in Ukraine. They will be targeted by Russian-integrated air defenses and shot down or located on the ground by overhead surveillance systems and targeted like the rest of the Ukrainian Air Force in the region. The Russians now have air superiority over Eastern Ukraine. Most of the Patriot air defense systems that still survive are defending Kyiv. There is a reason why as we speak Zelensky is openly asking the Russians to join planned peace talks. Right now the Russians are attacking all along the line of contact in the east, gaining ground, forcing decimated Ukrainian units to give ground. Putin has 100,000 combat troops sitting on the Ukrainian northern border in Belarus as well. 700,000 military-aged men have fled Ukraine and those left on the ground in Ukraine re openly defying government press gangs trying to kidnap males and impress them into the war. A recent article in The Telegram reported in citizens burning government vans used to transport men seized on the streets by press gangs. Why do we have to go to Europe to learn about these events? We know why, because they implicate the fucked up policies of our deep state and the Biden administration known for its foreign policy fuck ups.

 

[Lazaran]

Blah blah. Blah blah blah.....keep it for the bullshit threads where it belongs, like I do, not for something serious.

How cute that Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang believes everything isn’t connected, and that the threads devoted to the election of the next POTUS aren’t in all actuality determining the fate of Ukraine.



If Traitor Trump wins, then Ukraine falls - full stop. (And Taiwan would be next.)

Hope that ^ helps.



Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang

 

[ll74]

Romania plans to collaborate with Ukraine on the development and modernization of the R-360 "Neptune" missile. This partnership aims to jointly control the coastal waters of the Black Sea in the post-war period. And it's not really an anti-ship missile anymore either......its anti-everything. it has gps to terminal infrared homing which basically means it can be used to hit moving targets at sea and on land. In other words, a long range cruise missile capable of strikes deep into Russia on key targets and with a 150kg warhead. Badda-badda-boom!

Currently, Ukraine is working on increasing the missile's range to 1000km and ramping up production. Between Turkey, Ukraine and Romania, the Russian Navy's dominance in the Black Sea has pretty much evaporated. Russia's ability to do naval projection in any strength has pretty much vanished for the next 20 years, and THAT is assuming the Russian Federation still exists by the end of this war.

View attachment 2373055

Romania and Moldova have the biggest stakes in the outcome of this invasion

 

[ChloeTzang]

After reading your very thought out posts, I've concluded to the best of my ability, that Russia is in reality fighting a world war against all of nato? Am I not correct? That without all of the backing of nato Ukraine would have been utterly destroyed sometime last year? I'm not sure your seeing the entire picture, by what you're presenting the US and the European union are at war, is that a correct assumption? So with the Ukrainian gains in industry and it entire manufacturing power do you believe the Russians will be driven out of Ukraine by the end of the year?...
Chloe, I'm not being snarky.... I just see a different version... that's all.... if and when the ukies oust the Russians they will be in utter devastation and in debt to the bankers whom are funding this bloodbath for (just guessing) the next 100 years if you an historical similarly situation read about the fall of the ottoman empire and how their war financially destroyed them all over a stolen tin start from a church in Bethlehem.....in the end, Ukraine will die most likely taking Russia with it......and the son of perdition will collect his souls...

I would say that this was something Putin did NOT expect, which is rather obvious in hindsight. He was misled, as was western Europe. Both Putin, Scholz and the Europeans, and the Americans, all thought Ukraine would roll over without much of a fight, throw in the towel and it'd all be over bar the parades through Kyiv as the new Quislings were installed. Everyone misread the situation. What they did NOT account for were the deep-seated roots of Ukrainian nationalism, which go back to 1917 in modern history, and even further back if you care to read rather more deeply. Remember Biden offering Zelensky a flight out, and Zelensky's response. "I need guns, not a ride." That one line was a turning point for Ukraine.

It showed the world that Ukraine intended to fight, and the Ukrainian people and military responded. Nobody expected Ukraine to win, aid came, but it was slow and it was small scale - and it was Stingers and Javelins that really helped turn the tide initially, along with Azov holding the fort in Mariupol so heroically and for so long, as Ukraine fought with whatever they had and whatever they could lay their hands on. As the front stabilized and Ukrainian forces pushed the Russians back, so Western European military assistance grew - successes were rewarded with more and more assistance, until now we are at a point where the European Union if firmly committed to supporting Ukraine, both militarily and financially.

Never forget that taken as a whole, the European Union can easily surpass the USA if they put their mind to it. They are an industrial giant - Germany has never outsourced manufacturing to China the way we have, and they are just as capable of designing and manufacturing leading edge military equipment as we are. Now, add in Japan contributing billions financially, which they HAVE been doing, and while the USA is important, we are almost at the point where our assistance is no longer critical. As Biden showed by cutting supplies of 155mm ammo, he can weaken Ukraine, but as the Czechs showed, their are alternative ammo supplies available and it's now unlikely that if the USA ceases to support Ukraine, Russian would be able to make any substantial gains. That day has passed.

The EU and NATO are backing Ukraine, and having, very slowly, committed themselves, they cannot afford to back away and give Russia a victory. So yes, it is NATO vs Ukraine in a way, with Ukraine doing the fighting but NATO supplying the means. Our contributions were key to Ukraine surviving for the first two years, but they are no longer as critical - in the end we supplied very few tanks and Bradleys, and it seems unlikely we will supply more. The EU (CV90's) and Rheinmetall would appear to be key suppliers now, and as Ukraine takes on more and more manufacturing for itself, albeit financed by the EU, they will become more self-reliuant and with more and better equipment than the Russians. Combine that with air superiority by late 2025 - which will be a gradual process - and Russian can only lose.

As for Russian escalation and nukes, even in Russia, Putin cannot launch the nukes on his own. That would still take an existential threat to Russia, and Putin's death would not be existential. Except to Putin of course. NATO and the US will not allow Ukraine to push into Russia, and there is NO existential threat to Russia in Ukraine regaining their 2014 borders. Russia may collapse internally, but there is no way a Greater Ukraine would emerge, and one can be pretty sure that, all the Russian Nationalist ravings aside, Putin would drink tea, take a dive from a window, or swallow a lead pill before any nukes would be launched.

The Russian Federation may well implode of course, it's one of the last great colonial empires, along with China and Indonesia, but that would be a very different scenario. My opinion anyhow, for what its worth. LOL

 

[ChloeTzang]

Romania and Moldova have the biggest stakes in the outcome of this invasion

The Baltic States as well, which is why they are so vociferously pro-Ukrainian. They know, along with Moldova, that they would be next.

 

[ChloeTzang]

If Traitor Trump wins, then Ukraine falls - full stop. (And Taiwan would be next.)

Nope. Ukraine is now at the point where if the USA ceased to help, it would not be critical. See above post. The big thing we supply was 155mm ammo, and HIMARS ammo. The EU is stepping up 155mm ammo, Ukraine is coming online with their own plants, and the Czech ammo initiative is filling the gap in the meantime. Ukraine would take larger losses, they would be pushed back, but it's past the point now where there is any scenario in which Russian could win, even if USA cuts support completely, and we all know Trump will NOT do that.

As for Taiwan - no, not under Trump. There might be other scenarios, and China will NEVER give up on Taiwan, but they take the long view. They'll keep the pressure up but there won't be an open war. Esp if Taiwan work on their defences themselves instead of relying on us.

 

[Lazaran]

Nope. Ukraine is now at the point where if the USA ceased to help, it would not be critical. See above post. The big thing we supply was 155mm ammo, and HIMARS ammo. The EU is stepping up 155mm ammo, Ukraine is coming online with their own plants, and the Czech ammo initiative is filling the gap in the meantime. Ukraine would take larger losses, they would be pushed back, but it's past the point now where there is any scenario in which Russian could win, even if USA cuts support completely, and we all know Trump will NOT do that.

As for Taiwan - no, not under Trump. There might be other scenarios, and China will NEVER give up on Taiwan, but they take the long view. They'll keep the pressure up but there won't be an open war. Esp if Taiwan work on their defences themselves instead of relying on us.

Perhaps the most ignorant and naive comment Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang has ever posted on the PB - and that is saying a lot.



Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang

 

[ll74]

Perhaps the most ignorant and naive comment Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang has ever posted on the PB - and that is saying a lot.



Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang

She's right

 

[Lazaran]

"Some people" are too ignorant to recognize the true scope of U.S. contributions to ANY effort (humanitarian or war).

If the U.S. had failed to deliver on the $60 Billion aid package to Ukraine, (while simultaneously applying diplomatic pressure on the EU and NATO to deliver aid) and had failed to negotiate the loans to Ukraine based on frozen Russian assets, Russia would likely be rolling up Ukraine as we speak. (And just look at what the delay in U.S. funding for SIX MONTHS due to TRUMP AND REPUBLICAN OBSTRUCTION cost Ukraine.)



"Some people"

 

[ll74]

"Some people" are too ignorant to recognize the true scope of U.S. contributions to ANY effort (humanitarian or war).

If the U.S. had failed to deliver on the $60 Billion aid package to Ukraine, (while simultaneously applying diplomatic pressure on the EU and NATO to deliver aid) and had failed to negotiate the loans to Ukraine based on frozen Russian assets, Russia would likely be rolling up Ukraine as we speak. (And just look at what the delay in U.S. funding for SIX MONTHS due to TRUMP AND REPUBLICAN OBSTRUCTION cost Ukraine.)



"Some people"

So you're saying the current state is the same as a previous state.

Got it.

I'm sure nothing has changed even though Chloe actually laid out exactly what has changed.

 

[ChloeTzang]

"Some people" are too ignorant to recognize the true scope of U.S. contributions to ANY effort (humanitarian or war).

If the U.S. had failed to deliver on the $60 Billion aid package to Ukraine, (while simultaneously applying diplomatic pressure on the EU and NATO to deliver aid) and had failed to negotiate the loans to Ukraine based on frozen Russian assets, Russia would likely be rolling up Ukraine as we speak. (And just look at what the delay in U.S. funding for SIX MONTHS due to TRUMP AND REPUBLICAN OBSTRUCTION cost Ukraine.)

The $'s helps, of course, but Ukraine would not collapse without it. They didn't collapse over 6 months of no US funding and they wouldn't collapse next year if Trump cuts funding - which won't happen because that funding comes from Congress, and there's enough bipartisan support for Ukraine to force the issue if it comes to that. So between that, the EU, income from Russian assets and Japan, Ukraine funding will keep on coming. and as with the Patriots and HIMARS, if the US doesn't supply more over time, other countries will pony up and buy them. And other countries are now also funding Ukrainian defence companies....

Yes, we contribute, but the EU contributes as much and that's enough to keep Ukraine in the game, albeit they need to keep working hard to up their game to at least NATO standards.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Whoaaaaaa WTF!!!!! Ukraine just sank a Russian submarine

 

[ChloeTzang]

Ukraine’s defense forces struck the Russian submarine Rostov-on-Don in the port of occupied Sevastopol. As a result of the strike, the Russian submarine Rostov-on-Don sank on the spot, added the General Staff. The Rostov-on-Don submarine is part of the Russian Navy’s Black Sea Fleet. It was laid down in the fall of 2011 at the Admiralty Shipyards in St. Petersburg and launched in the summer of 2014. Submarine B-237 "Rostov-on-Don" (according to NATO classification - Kilo class) is one of four submarines of the "Kilo" class, capable of using "Caliber" missiles. "Rostov-on-Don" was put into operation on December 26, 2014. On September 13, 2023, as a result of a Ukrainian missile attack, the vessel was significantly damaged. Subsequently, it was repaired and tested in the waters of the Sevastopol harbor.

The Rostov on Don submarine was previously hit by a storm shadow in the dry dock at Sevastopol in Sept 2023, but was patched up so it could float and continue to be worked on. Ukraine just hit it again and totalled it, sending it to the bottom of the harbor. It ain't coming back after this except as scrap metal. Exit, one $300,000,000 submarine.

 

[Lazaran]

"Some people" FAIL to recognize that Chloe “Chicomgo” Tzang is an ignorant imbecile whose comments have as much value as Russiaguide’s - even though Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang is less of a traitor than Russiaguide when it comes to Ukraine (but not on anything else.)



Side note:

Israel would also be devastated if the U.S. didn’t continue to supply aid and assistance in their defense against hostile actors:

See: U.S. weapons deliveries, the recent assistance intercepting an attack from Iran (which included organizing a coalition of countries to assist in defending Israel) and redeployment of a Carrier and missile cruiser group to the eastern Mediterranean in preparation for another imminent attack from Iran, etc, after recent Israeli successes in targeting leaders of Hamas and Hezbollah.)

Again: The true scope of U.S. contributions to any effort (humanitarian or war) goes unrecognized and unappreciated by "Some people".



"Some people"

 

[ChloeTzang]

"Some people" FAIL to recognize that Chloe “Chicomgo” Tzang is an ignorant imbecile whose comments have as much value as Russiaguide’s - even though Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang is less of a traitor than Russiaguide when it comes to Ukraine (but not on anything else.)

rotflmao. I think for myself, Laz, but I get a lot of my material from some rather well know and respected analysts, and I chat offline with three or four ex-US Army officers who were up there in those exalted ranks where they know these things, one or two of whom also spent time in Ukraine. I study at the feet of the masters, as it where, and I am but a grasshopper, but a very diligent and well-read grasshopper. LOL.

I make no claims to be an expert and I make no bones either about my sources and my personal lack of any military experience except at second hand, but an ignorant imbecile I am not. LOL. They wouldn't give me the time of day if I was. And I certainly don't mind opposing views on this war either. In fact I welcome them. Buffalogurl asks some really good questions and makes some very valid points that are worth discussing and digging into. As do you, now and then when you go all normie. LOL.

 

[ChloeTzang]

You can hear the Anthem​

You can hear the thunder in the sky,
There is whistling in the sky, but you can hear the anthem
There is foggy smoke in the clear sky...
The forest is burning, but you can hear the anthem!

The truth is with us,
So we'll stand against your shooting!
The truth is on our side, and it can't be shot away!
The truth is on our side, we'll free village after village!
The truth is on our side, we'll drive your evil from our valleys!

And now we're gonna defeat you
For Azov and Bucha!
For Dnipro's cliffs!
For Irpin which you tormented!
For our blooming fields!
For Kherson - our fertile land!
For Donbass you'll get some!
For Chernihiv as a matter of course!
For our dense forests!

For Bohdan Khmelnytskiy!
For Ivan Franko!
For Sumy, and for our churches
The ZSU's gonna come for you!
And for nights, and for wounds,
For each disturbed morning!
For Kharkiv and tulips!
For mother Odesa!
For Rivne and Zdolbuniv,
For Poltava, Lviv, and bullets!
For Kyiv, Lutsk, for Vinnytsia,
For Mykolaiv - it's not yours!
For Chernivtsi, Cherkasy, Ternopil and Kryviy Rih,
For Zaporizhzhia, and Zhytomyr,
And forgetting about Crimea would be a sin!

You can hear the thunder in the sky,
There is whistling in the sky, but you can hear the anthem
There is foggy smoke in the clear sky...
The forest is burning, but you can hear the anthem!

 

[ChloeTzang]

"We Will Never Be Brothers"

 

[ChloeTzang]

"Azov"

Eyes pecked with stars,
Fingers cut with strings,
Ears deafened with songs,
The body is painted with runes.
The heart is filled with dew,
Legs crippled by wandering,
Footsteps echo like thunderstorms
The path runs through meanders.
Hands calloused with swords,
The chest is pierced with arrows.
All roads are allowed to me,
For I am the whitest among the Whites.
When the stealthy springs are under the steps
The dry discharges of your charm are cracking
I hear the wind of the coming war
And the delicate aroma of napalm.

Komu Vnyz is a Ukrainian rock band founded in 1988. Komu Vnyz's music is a blend of gothic and industrial styles, combined with the lyrics of ancient Ukrainian legends.

 

[ChloeTzang]

At the front with Azov Brigade clearing Russian positions. Pretty intense.

 

[ChloeTzang]

And this is a really interesting clip about the Ukrainian designed and built BTR-4 IFV. It's proved a quite effective IFV, and I guess the point I'm making here is if you really want to assess what's happening, you need to understand all this as background info that helps you fill in the gaps. It's not just whatever you happen to read on Twitter. It's watching all these clips, knowing the capabilities of the equipment, the psychology and motivation of the soldiers, the relative effectiveness of military units, how they're trained and the effectiveness of that training, logistics and logistical capabilities, procedures and capabilities, reading the different analysts views and assessments, listing to guys like General Mick Ryan, who's spent a lot of time in Ukraine, and so on and so on. You don't just read a few talking points on Twitter, or believe the bullshit the Biden Administration throws out. There's way more to it than that, and guys like Mick Ryan have spent a lifetime at this so you read their stuff and suck it up and eventually you end up understanding a little....

 

[ChloeTzang]

 

[ChloeTzang]

Special Operations Forces are one of the most mythologized and mysterious unit of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. They are the military elite of the state, comprising the most motivated fighters. Their faces are forbidden to be shown in the media and on social networks, and their names are classified.Each of these fighters poses a threat to the existence of our enemy, Russia. Through their tactical actions, SOF soldiers can achieve success at the operational and strategic levels. Ukraine Army TV presents the first episode of the documentary film “ETHOS,” dedicated to one of the most powerful units of the Ukrainian Special Operations Forces - the 3rd Separate Special Purpose Regiment named after Prince Sviatoslav the Brave.