For Those Who Might Be Wondering Why We Might Be In Ukraine

[Rightguide]

Already laughing

Ukraine has never sought the conquest of Russia. Russia invaded Ukraine to conquer Ukraine.

It reads as a Russian propaganda piece.

Here's some more Russian propaganda for you straight from a NATO General:

Bloomberg: Estonian general says NATO underestimated Russia’s war machine​

Elsa Court, The Kyiv Independent news desk
Thu, January 25, 2024 at 12:07 AM PST·2 min read

Martin Herem, the commander of the Estonian Defense Forces, said that NATO underestimated Russia's ability to supply its war in Ukraine, and Russian production of artillery shells is far outstripping European efforts, Bloomberg reported on Jan. 24.

The European Union pledged in March 2023 to deliver one million artillery shells to Ukraine by March 2024, but by November 2023, Ukraine's Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said the deliveries were behind schedule.

EU Internal Market Commissioner Thierry Breton said on Jan. 20 that the EU will be able to produce around 1.3 to 1.4 million shells by the end of 2024 and will continue to increase production "significantly" next year.

Speaking to Bloomberg from Tallinn, Herem said that the West had estimated that Russia could produce a million artillery shells a year, but intelligence suggests that the country has the capacity to produce "many times more."

More here: https://news.yahoo.com/bloomberg-estonian-general-says-nato-080754600.html

It's all just Russian propaganda though isn't it, 74?

 

[ll74]

Here's some more Russian propaganda for you straight from a NATO General:

Bloomberg: Estonian general says NATO underestimated Russia’s war machine​

Elsa Court, The Kyiv Independent news desk
Thu, January 25, 2024 at 12:07 AM PST·2 min read

Martin Herem, the commander of the Estonian Defense Forces, said that NATO underestimated Russia's ability to supply its war in Ukraine, and Russian production of artillery shells is far outstripping European efforts, Bloomberg reported on Jan. 24.

The European Union pledged in March 2023 to deliver one million artillery shells to Ukraine by March 2024, but by November 2023, Ukraine's Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said the deliveries were behind schedule.

EU Internal Market Commissioner Thierry Breton said on Jan. 20 that the EU will be able to produce around 1.3 to 1.4 million shells by the end of 2024 and will continue to increase production "significantly" next year.

Speaking to Bloomberg from Tallinn, Herem said that the West had estimated that Russia could produce a million artillery shells a year, but intelligence suggests that the country has the capacity to produce "many times more."

More here: https://news.yahoo.com/bloomberg-estonian-general-says-nato-080754600.html

It's all just Russian propaganda though isn't it, 74?

Russia invaded Ukraine.

 

[Rightguide]

Russia invaded Ukraine.

...and has won the war.

 

[Rightguide]

Here's why the last thing in the world we want is a ground war in Europe with the Russians:

2024 Index of

U.S. Military Strength​

The only non-governmental and only annual assessment of U.S. Military Strength

Download

https://www.heritage.org/military

 

[jomar]

Here's why the last thing in the world we want is a ground war in Europe with the Russians:

2024 Index of

U.S. Military Strength​

The only non-governmental and only annual assessment of U.S. Military Strength

Download

https://www.heritage.org/military

You do realize that your choice of sources are basically ignored at this point and I hope you know why.

 

[jomar]

...and has won the war.

If your side has its way.

 

[ll74]

...and has won the war.

The war isn't over.

But keep insisting otherwise.

 

[Sean Renaud]

...and has won the war.

When did it end? I admit I took my eye off the ball to focus most of my energy on watching Israel, the Southern Border and what Trump is up to. Either way weren't you right there with me expecting that this whole thing would be over in a matter of weeks or months? If I go six rounds with fucking Tyson Fury no matter how bad he fucks me up I'm going to the club and and dancing like I just conquered the fucking world all alone. I mean my chances of lasting that long with him is just slightly higher than my chances of being the first black super saiyan.

 

[RandyRebecca]

Hitler was a fascist claiming to be a National Socialist and had little or nothing to do with capitalism since like you he considered it a Jewish plot.

Educate yourself further. "National Socialism" was a slogan to seduce certain people (i.e. ex-communists and ex-socialists) into the Nazi Party in order to build a mass movement. These people were then directed against the labor movement and trade unions. Look up Otto Strasser, Strasserism, Beefsteak Nazis and the Night of the Long Knives, and see what happened to the Nazi "left" after their usefulness was over. Hitler then proceeded to fuse the Nazi state's repressive apparatus and ideology with big business corporatism.

Now think about it. A society where trade unions have been utterly smashed to bits, the Nazi "left" wiped out in purges, and fusing the Nazi state with big business. There is nothing more right-wing than this.

Fascism is a mass movement of counter-revolutionary despair. It gathers all the despairing and crazed elements in society together, and wields them into an anti-working class mass movement based on racial and blood purity and ultra-nationalism, perhaps even mixed in with a slogan of "national socialism". Once this is done, the aim is the utter destruction of the organized labor movement.

As for Jews, Lenin said it best, there are Jews who are workers and socialists and they are our friends and allies. There are also Jews who are capitalists and imperialists, and they are our enemies.

Ukraine is run by a democratically elected Jewish President but you claim is festering with nazis………I’ve tried to explain why that imagery gets a bit of cultural traction in that part of the world but you choose instead to buy propaganda from the same Russia that fucks with your elections and their citizens freedom to go about their business unmolested by state goons.

Ukraine has banned at least 11 political parties since 2014, and that was before the Russian invasion. No democracy there even compared to 2013.

 

[ShandyLeer]

Educate yourself further. "National Socialism" was a slogan to seduce certain people (i.e. ex-communists and ex-socialists) into the Nazi Party in order to build a mass movement. These people were then directed against the labor movement and trade unions. Look up Otto Strasser, Strasserism, Beefsteak Nazis and the Night of the Long Knives, and see what happened to the Nazi "left" after their usefulness was over.


Ukraine has banned at least 11 political parties since 2014, and that was before the Russian invasion. No democracy there even compared to 2013.

Have you even the slightest clue what sort of a task it is trying to turn a frontline former Soviet country - its people, its economy, its institutions- into a western leaning nation ! Whilst Russia is breathing down your neck ?

Have you ever set foot in the region ? Ever ?

You‘re setting western expectations - half of which you despise - and acting surprised when they don’t meet them.

 

[RandyRebecca]

Have you even the slightest clue what sort of a task it is trying to turn a frontline former Soviet country - its people, its economy, its institutions- into a western leaning nation !

You mean the ruination of Ukraine that has taken place because of what the US and NATO has done there? Soviet Ukraine had full employment, public services, cheap rents, education, healthcare. What does current Ukraine have?

 

[ShandyLeer]

Educate yourself further. "National Socialism" was a slogan to seduce certain people (i.e. ex-communists and ex-socialists) into the Nazi Party in order to build a mass movement. These people were then directed against the labor movement and trade unions. Look up Otto Strasser, Strasserism, Beefsteak Nazis and the Night of the Long Knives, and see what happened to the Nazi "left" after their usefulness was over. Hitler then proceeded to fuse the Nazi state's repressive apparatus and ideology with big business corporatism.

Now think about it. A society where trade unions have been utterly smashed to bits, the Nazi "left" wiped out in purges, and fusing the Nazi state with big business. There is nothing more right-wing than this.

Fascism is a mass movement of counter-revolutionary despair. It gathers all the despairing and crazed elements in society together, and wields them into an anti-working class mass movement based on racial and blood purity and ultra-nationalism, perhaps even mixed in with a slogan of "national socialism". Once this is done, the aim is the utter destruction of the organized labor movement.

As for Jews, Lenin said it best, there are Jews who are workers and socialists and they are our friends and allies. There are also Jews who are capitalists and imperialists, and they are our enemies.


Ukraine has banned at least 11 political parties since 2014, and that was before the Russian invasion. No democracy there even compared to 2013.

In what possible way does this rant alter what I said - that “Hitler was a fascist claiming to be a national socialist” ?

Your entire post confirms it for Christ sake.

 

[ShandyLeer]

You mean the ruination of Ukraine that has taken place because of what the US and NATO has done there? Soviet Ukraine had full employment, public services, cheap rents, education, healthcare. What does current Ukraine have?

Are you taking the piss now ?

You want to sell the virtues of life behind the iron curtain, where even your family was likely spying on you, and where people had to be walled in lest they see the west and try and run past the machine gun nests ? Where all that’s for dinner is a potato?

And all because the rent on the shithole of a flat you‘d have to be eternally grateful for is cheap and a sound education provided you don’t mind being indoctrinated.

You must be fucking joking.

 

[LLCox]

Here's some more Russian propaganda for you straight from a NATO General:

Bloomberg: Estonian general says NATO underestimated Russia’s war machine​

Speaking to Bloomberg from Tallinn, Herem said that the West had estimated that Russia could produce a million artillery shells a year, but intelligence suggests that the country has the capacity to produce "many times more."

You and the Elboian general don't get out much do you. Fat Kim has been sending Pootin all the defective artillery shells he can handle.

 

[Rightguide]

You and the Elboian general don't get out much do you. Fat Kim has been sending Pootin all the defective artillery shells he can handle.

Putin is still producing many times more than we are.

 

[Rightguide]

When did it end? I admit I took my eye off the ball to focus most of my energy on watching Israel, the Southern Border and what Trump is up to. Either way weren't you right there with me expecting that this whole thing would be over in a matter of weeks or months? If I go six rounds with fucking Tyson Fury no matter how bad he fucks me up I'm going to the club and and dancing like I just conquered the fucking world all alone. I mean my chances of lasting that long with him is just slightly higher than my chances of being the first black super saiyan.

View attachment 2310361

For all practical purposes, the war is over Sean. There is no way Ukraine can win this war at this point. Almost an entire Ukrainian male generation has been buried on the plains of Ukraine. We helped it to happen.

 

[ShandyLeer]

Putin is still producing many times more than we are.

This is because Russia is now in wartime economy mode, which comes at a price,………all this for a three day operation we’re heading into year 3 of. The geographical equivalent of the US military struggling to reach Mexico City after 2 years of trying.

 

[RandyRebecca]

This is because Russia is now in wartime economy mode, which comes at a price,………all this for a three day operation we’re heading into year 3 of. The geographical equivalent of the US military struggling to reach Mexico City after 2 years of trying.

The US capitalist imperialist establishment is always in war mode. Biden's administration have overreached themselves like the neocons of old, but at least those neocons did it in 2003 (when the illusion was that the US could click its fingers and get what it wanted), not in 2022 to 2024. Biden actually acts like it's 1980 or something, when the Russians were in Afghanistan. So many Carter 1980 vibes from him, like how detente suddenly became a lot of wars again.

 

[ll74]

The US capitalist imperialist establishment is always in war mode. Biden's administration have overreached themselves like the neocons of old.

Russia invaded Ukraine.

 

[RandyRebecca]

Russia invaded Ukraine.

But the context is ignored, like the goings on in Ukraine since 2014, the war games on Russia's borders by NATO, the killing of over 13,000 ethnic Russians in the Donbass from 2014 onwards before February 2022. How would the US react to similar things on the Canadian border by Russian or Chinese troops? That answers itself.

 

[ll74]

But the context is ignored, like the goings on in Ukraine since 2014, the war games on Russia's borders by NATO, the killing of over 13,000 ethnic Russians in the Donbass from 2014 onwards before February 2022. How would the US react to similar things on the Canadian border by Russian or Chinese troops? That answers itself.

Russia invaded Ukraine.

Putin's taking points are noted and dismissed.

 

[Lazaran]

The US capitalist imperialist establishment is always in war mode. Biden's administration have overreached themselves like the neocons of old, but at least those neocons did it in 2003 (when the illusion was that the US could click its fingers and get what it wanted), not in 2022 to 2024. Biden actually acts like it's 1980 or something, when the Russians were in Afghanistan. So many Carter 1980 vibes from him, like how detente suddenly became a lot of wars again.

Does "Becky" realize how ridiculous they come across???



President Biden has overreached???



Not Putin???



"Becky"

 

[ShandyLeer]

The US capitalist imperialist establishment is always in war mode. Biden's administration have overreached themselves like the neocons of old, but at least those neocons did it in 2003 (when the illusion was that the US could click its fingers and get what it wanted), not in 2022 to 2024. Biden actually acts like it's 1980 or something, when the Russians were in Afghanistan. So many Carter 1980 vibes from him, like how detente suddenly became a lot of wars again.

Oh really.

If the US regime is always in war mode how come there’s no ammunition to give the Ukranians?

 

[RandyRebecca]

Oh really.

If the US regime is always in war mode how come there’s no ammunition to give the Ukranians?

Republican shenanigans in Congress? Also, and more to the point, because the US have overreached in playing world police. Fighting on too many fronts is never wise, even if you're apparently all powerful. US imperial might was never stronger than around 2002-2003, and look at how Iraq ended up and how it massively boosted Iran's power across the entire region. US imperial power is far weaker now than it was then, yet Biden has the US blundering into wars all over the place, from Ukraine to Israel to Yemen, and he obviously has eyes on Iran and China too. He also seems to view Russia as if it's the 1950s or 1980s.

 

[ShandyLeer]

Republican shenanigans in Congress? Also, and more to the point, because the US have overreached in playing world police. Fighting on too many fronts is never wise, even if you're apparently all powerful. US imperial might was never stronger than around 2002-2003, and look at how Iraq ended up and how it massively boosted Iran's power across the entire region. US imperial power is far weaker now than it was then, yet Biden has the US blundering into wars all over the place, from Ukraine to Israel to Yemen, and he obviously has eyes on Iran and China too. He also seems to view Russia as if it's the 1950s or 1980s.

No, the reason you don’t have the ammunition they need is because the US isn’t in war economy mode, despite your claims to the contrary.

Israel/Yemen/Iran is a single linked event, not “wars all over the place”…….the US is barely engaged and didn’t ask the Iranians to stoke it up, or Hamas to run amok in October.

You know full and well the Russians invaded Ukraine as a matter of choice not necessity, and your constant insistence that the west provoked this is for the birds. Like any Trot or Leninist you can’t bear to see Russia as anything other than the warm fuzzy home of the revolution, even if it’s turned into a gangster kleptocracy since.