Heroes & Villains

[catalina_francisco]

I think I fail at quiet. I must not be a sadist.

LOL, that's easily remedied, we'll buy you a gag and then quiet you will be!!

Catalina

 

[faeriefire]

Hmm...In movies I like heroes with the ability to be villains or villians with the ability to be heroes. Anyone too one-dimensional is just boring. It's part of the reason I loved braveheart, mask of zorro, gladiator, spiderman, shawshank redemption, v for vendetta I don't know that I gravitate more strongly towards one or the other. Maybe. But outside the movies I like people in general, find them fascinating and like to listen and watch a bit before I decide whether or not I'll get along with them. That said what about the female archetypes? Or are there any?

Good girl? Bad girl? Churchgirl? Slut? I feel like most of the female heroes in the world tend towards the good girl end of the spectrum. Mother Theresa comes to mind. Florence Nightingale. Helen Keller. Jaqueline Kennedy. Mary Poppins Well, of course there's always Angelina Jolie and her portrayals of female heroes. I think my favorite female hero is the mutant gal from resident evil. Either her or the girl who plays the main role in Serenity.

Ok, end hijack...to answer the question seriously I think the villian has appeal because he seems more real, and more likely to see the wickedness hidden deep inside a good-girl exterior. The hero is safe, predictable, reliable. I have dated far more hero-types and truth be told I think everyone has a little of both in them. I've just recently realized that it's ok for me to have some of both too. Not that I intend to impersonate catwoman or tomb raider lol. It's the contrast that keeps things fun. And the knowledge that myself and those around me can swing either way at the drop of a hat

And just to clarify: actual villians, those that are completely evil hold zero appeal for me. I do not like the thought of a bully or someone without conscience. The appeal lies in dichotomy, contrast, opposition. The ability to act as a chamelion. To counter my own ability to do the same.

 

[Homburg]

LOL, that's easily remedied, we'll buy you a gag and then quiet you will be!!

Catalina

Hahahaha!!!

 

[be_ignited]

...

Good girl? Bad girl? Churchgirl? Slut? I feel like most of the female heroes in the world tend towards the good girl end of the spectrum. Mother Theresa comes to mind. Florence Nightingale. Helen Keller. Jaqueline Kennedy. Mary Poppins Well, of course there's always Angelina Jolie and her portrayals of female heroes. I think my favorite female hero is the mutant gal from resident evil. Either her or the girl who plays the main role in Serenity.

A slight hijack. Helen Keller was not such a good girl in her adult life. You don't hear much about her once she overcomes her disabilities. She was a rather vocal (pun not intended) Radical Socialist. They tend to leave that part out in school

 

[YourCaptor]

I would say I am the black knight. Oral legend has it there was a black knight in my family a few generations back, or more precisely a schwarzer ritter. As cool as that may be, in reality black knights where much like the Japanese ronin, basically wanderers. Yet I think if he did exist, he deserves some credit for renouncing the teutonic order, those are not guys you want to fuck around with.

Anyway, black knight it is, riding around all romantic like, kidnapping hot yet humble millers daughters. … actually there is another legend… ahh this could continue forever, there are so many legends from my place of origin I best just not mention them…

So I think I lean towards the villain, although I don’t do anything evil just for the sake of evil, and I am pretty nice too I think. I think I am only the villain though because society says I am, I do what I like, is that really so bad?

 

[JMohegan]

[r j masters mode on]

All this talk of Captain Save-A-Hos got me thinking about a way to divide BDSM. It seems to me that on one hand, we have those who identify themselves with the idea of the Hero, and on the other hand, the Villain.

The Hero: The invincible white knight, the Father figure, the all-knowing BDSM therapist who can heal your kinky psychic wounds. Dragon-slayer and protector. The Lone Ranger. (John Wayne, all-American hero, Indian-killer, ranch saviour, was kind of problematic. He had an evil side).Represents the nurturing and protective side of BDSM. Places the female on a pedestal. Not associated with "perversion" as such. Writes the BDSM rulebook.

The Villain: The pimp, the rapist, the sadist,the marauding Injuns, the slave-auctioneer, the "online predator", the pervert. Associated with "the other". Represents the animalistic or forbidden side of BDSM. Seeks to topple the female from her pedestal. Is the dark factor in all of us whitewashed by the BDSM rulebook.

I identify with the Villain; always have. When I watch movies, I get frustrated when the evil plans are foiled. At the same time, I've got plenty of Hero in me, I just don't accentuate that side. Everyone has both, light and dark, but which side do you identify with?

Ok, that's it for the cut-rate Joseph Cambell stuff.

Ha ha - yes. One or the other of these archetypes does seem to prevail in most BDSM-focused venues that I've visited.

Either the Dom is celebrated as a superior life form, sprung from the womb ready to command all the other kids in the sandbox and grown to be worthy of genuflecting from all and sundry, or he is celebrated as the ultimate bad boy maverick.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Ha ha - yes. One or the other of these archetypes does seem to prevail in most BDSM-focused venues that I've visited.

Either the Dom is celebrated as a superior life form, sprung from the womb ready to command all the other kids in the sandbox and grown to be worthy of genuflecting from all and sundry, or he is celebrated as the ultimate bad boy maverick.

LOL, you just reinforced my desire to not frequent such establishments! There are enough pretentious posers online and in RL without going somewhere where they gather and are encouraged.

Catalina

 

[intothewoods]

Ha ha - yes. One or the other of these archetypes does seem to prevail in most BDSM-focused venues that I've visited.

Either the Dom is celebrated as a superior life form, sprung from the womb ready to command all the other kids in the sandbox and grown to be worthy of genuflecting from all and sundry, or he is celebrated as the ultimate bad boy maverick.

LOL, you just reinforced my desire to not frequent such establishments! There are enough pretentious posers online and in RL without going somewhere where they gather and are encouraged.

Catalina

Thank you both. It's nice to start my day laughing.

 

[rosco rathbone]

Okay, what am I?

Some kind of nonpareil combination with the strengths of both and the weaknesses of neither, no doubt.

 

[Netzach]

You don't feel any kind of natural affinity?

Antiheroine maybe?

I like white hats, though. Not wussy ones, and DEFINITELY not pompous ones in love with their star and badge, but I do like white hats - I like seeing them suffer and overcome their trials, and I like corrupting them.

 

[intothewoods]

Some kind of nonpareil

I love those things on frozen yogurt.

 

[Netzach]

Ha ha - yes. One or the other of these archetypes does seem to prevail in most BDSM-focused venues that I've visited.

Either the Dom is celebrated as a superior life form, sprung from the womb ready to command all the other kids in the sandbox and grown to be worthy of genuflecting from all and sundry, or he is celebrated as the ultimate bad boy maverick.

Fuck yeah to that.

 

[Netzach]

LOL, you just reinforced my desire to not frequent such establishments! There are enough pretentious posers online and in RL without going somewhere where they gather and are encouraged.

Catalina

You don't have to go out to encounter that, it lives and breathes wherever people gather to talk about SM.

 

[kinkyknickers]

Meh,

Villans own stuff, villans protect their stuff.

Sir and I were talking about this the other day.

He's protective of his stuff, both of us. He'll fuck with me, he'll fuck with her in public or private.... as is his want.

Don't fuck with his stuff or he'll be a hero. Don't fuck with his female friends in general, he'll be a hero.

He's only a villan if we get outta line.

No need to define between the two.

Hero? Villan?

Same same.

KK

 

[Homburg]

Meh,

Villans own stuff, villans protect their stuff.

Sir and I were talking about this the other day.

He's protective of his stuff, both of us. He'll fuck with me, he'll fuck with her in public or private.... as is his want.

Don't fuck with his stuff or he'll be a hero. Don't fuck with his female friends in general, he'll be a hero.

He's only a villan if we get outta line.

No need to define between the two.

Hero? Villan?

Same same.

KK

Good post. Seriously.

 

[catalina_francisco]

You don't have to go out to encounter that, it lives and breathes wherever people gather to talk about SM.

Yep, a reason I find myself moving away from it for more and more of late, and why F stopped posting here or anywhere long ago.

Catalina

 

[intothewoods]

Yep, a reason I find myself moving away from it for more and more of late, and why F stopped posting here or anywhere long ago.

Catalina

Aw man, no chance he'll come back? I've read some of his old posts too and wished he were around.

It's definitely quite the downside to bdsm gatherings. I at least feel lucky the heroic superior life form PYL is scarce in my kink group. The let's-do-a-gang-rape-hang her from her toes off of a 5 story building type gets on my nerves, but I just don't hang much with them. Problem solved.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Aw man, no chance he'll come back? I've read some of his old posts too and wished he were around.

I've asked, begged, tried enticing him with things I know he gets interested in, all to no avail unfortunately. Hasn't even read the forum for a couple of years.

Catalina

 

[rosco rathbone]

Antiheroine maybe?

I like white hats, though. Not wussy ones, and DEFINITELY not pompous ones in love with their star and badge, but I do like white hats - I like seeing them suffer and overcome their trials, and I like corrupting them.

The white-knight sub thing is a whole nother trip. I don't know if my taxonomy could even really apply to female dominants. You always struck me as rather evil.

 

[JMohegan]

You always struck me as rather evil.

You're talking bedroom here, right? Not that I've ever been in Netzach's, but I agree that she does give an evil impression. Temptress, ball buster, emasculator, and whatnot, no doubt. That all sounds wicked to me!

Overall, though, I'd actually describe Netzach as a strong heroine type. Not the archetype you've outlined, not a chest-puffer, but a genuine pick up a sword and fight for the underprivileged or unfairly attacked kind of person.

Evil in the bedroom, crusader for justice overall. That's the way I read her.

 

[rosco rathbone]

You're talking bedroom here, right? Not that I've ever been in Netzach's, but I agree that she does give an evil impression. Temptress, ball buster, emasculator, and whatnot, no doubt. That all sounds wicked to me!

Overall, though, I'd actually describe Netzach as a strong heroine type. Not the archetype you've outlined, not a chest-puffer, but a genuine pick up a sword and fight for the underprivileged or unfairly attacked kind of person.

Evil in the bedroom, crusader for justice overall. That's the way I read her.

I see the evil glee underneath the shiny exterior.

That woman is rotten to the core.

 

[JMohegan]

I see the evil glee underneath the shiny exterior.

That woman is rotten to the core.

I lol'd at "shiny".

Maybe we should call her Red Delicious from now on.

 

[rida]

Antiheroine maybe?

I like white hats, though. Not wussy ones, and DEFINITELY not pompous ones in love with their star and badge, but I do like white hats - I like seeing them suffer and overcome their trials, and I like corrupting them.

That bold part? Is what I love about white knights ... showing them that the dark side is not such a bad place ... afterall ... I'm there too

As for the evil bastards? what I love is to dig into their core, find their soft spot and make it come to the light and show them that acknowledging it will make it as strong as a diamond and be their strength.

Yeah ... I don't like white knight or evil bastard with wall so thick around their core that they became monotone stereotypes. I like to mix and confuse their cards, show them the other side. I like to touch their soul.

I'm evil & sweet like that

 

[rosco rathbone]

The consensus seems to be that balance is key, that too much of one or the other makes the man insipid or annoying, etc etc.

Also, there are many who hate the idea of labels. (I'm one of them!).


Still, no fence sitting. Have the balls to declare which side you identify with in your heart.

 

[graceanne]

I really do try not to derail these threads, so I'm gonna sit on my hands for some of the smart ass comments that came to mind.

K's mostly the hero type, with a strong underlying asshole. ( I guess you'd call him a villain.)