Judge Engoron's $355 Million Fine Against Donald Trump May Have Far-Reaching Consequences

[ll74]

I'm not a lawyer. I just know a lot more than you do about the law.

Of course which is why you rely on lengthy articles by other people.

Rapey does a better clown show.

 

[SmokingFap]

One has to ask, how many of them are lining up to contribute a little bit more to their car or house payments just to ensure the viability of their neighborhood bank?

One has to ask how many people lie or exaggerate about their income and assets to secure said car loans at more favorable interest rates than they actually deserve.

 

[Rightguide]

Could you imagine if this was happening to someone else?

-Homeowner wants to build a second home.
-Homeowner goes to bank, negotiates loan agreement based upon mutually agreed upon valuation of first home.
-Terms and conditions are met, bank is paid off with interest, both bank and home owner are happy.

-Judge shows up, bangs gavel, declares home owner guilty of fraud without trial, says home isn't worth what the home owner and bank agreed it was worth.
-Judge initiates trial to see if home owner and bank documentation reflects the afore mentioned fraud determination.
-Both home owner and bank protest in court that terms and conditions were all met, both parties happy.
-Judge declares fraud can be victimless crime.
-Home owner fined huge amounts of money and denied right to do business again for years.

Leftist/Democrats hail the outcome as justice, mock any claims the outcome ia absolutely ridiculous and other home owners are extremely worried about the precedent this sets.

That's about it folks. Another demonstration of how the Democrat Party turns the nation's biggest city into a Third World banana republic. The only thing that surprised me was the absence of the death penalty by firing squad, but we all know they're working on it.

 

[Rightguide]

One has to ask how many people lie or exaggerate about their income and assets to secure said car loans at more favorable interest rates than they actually deserve.

The more astounding question is how did you get to be so dumb?

 

[SmokingFap]

The more astounding question is how did you get to be so dumb?

That is indeed an astounding question, because nothing that I said was dumb.

 

[TastySuckToy]

One has to ask how many people lie or exaggerate about their income and assets to secure said car loans at more favorable interest rates than they actually deserve.

You think you get arrested and/or charged with fraud if you go to a bank and claim your beater truck is worth half a million dollars?

 

[ll74]

You think you get arrested and/or charged with fraud if you go to a bank and claim your beater truck is worth half a million dollars?

If you signed your name to attest to it, then yes, you could.

 

[SmokingFap]

If you signed your name to attest to it, then yes, you could.

What he said.

 

[TastySuckToy]

If you signed your name to attest to it, then yes, you could.

No, you just get laughed out of the bank. The bank doesn't take your word for it on what the valuations of your assets are.

You can value your personal assets at whatever figure you damn well please. It's irrelevant because your assessment means nothing if no one else agrees to it.

 

[ll74]

No, you just get laughed out of the bank. The bank doesn't take your word for it on what the valuations of your assets are.

You don't seem to understand fraud.

https://www.bankrate.com/loans/personal-loans/bad-idea-lying-on-a-personal-loan-application/

Knowingly providing false information on a loan application is considered fraud and is a crime

https://www.rocketmortgage.com/learn/mortgage-fraud

Mortgage fraud refers to the deliberate act of lying or omitting information that is used by a mortgage underwriter or lender to fund, purchase or insure a mortgage loan. It can be committed by both

You can value your personal assets at whatever figure you damn well please. It's irrelevant because your assessment means nothing if no one else agrees to it.

Doing it on a loan application is fraud. Whether they choose to report it or not might differ.

 

[SmokingFap]

No, you just get laughed out of the bank. The bank doesn't take your word for it on what the valuations of your assets are.

You can value your personal assets at whatever figure you damn well please. It's irrelevant because your assessment means nothing if no one else agrees to it.

Great! Then I'm worth $14 billion, and my house is worth approximately $1.8 trillion!

 

[SmokingFap]

You don't seem to understand fraud.

https://www.bankrate.com/loans/personal-loans/bad-idea-lying-on-a-personal-loan-application/

https://www.rocketmortgage.com/learn/mortgage-fraud


Doing it on a loan application is fraud. Whether they choose to report it or not might differ.

Thank you, 74. Won't matter to this retard, though.

 

[TastySuckToy]

That's about it folks. Another demonstration of how the Democrat Party turns the nation's biggest city into a Third World banana republic. The only thing that surprised me was the absence of the death penalty by firing squad, but we all know they're working on it.

Posters here are so stupid and ignorant they don't realize that even the bank itself will exaggerate the value of an applicant's assets. This easily happens because the bank can look at your income, existing debt, credit history and determine that you are a good bet on making all your payments and thus the bank will make profit from you.

I know this for a fact because I just had
that happen with me on one of my own recent loan applications.

But they think this is somehow fraud.

You don't seem to understand fraud.

https://www.bankrate.com/loans/personal-loans/bad-idea-lying-on-a-personal-loan-application/

https://www.rocketmortgage.com/learn/mortgage-fraud


Doing it on a loan application is fraud. Whether they choose to report it or not might differ.

I suggest you reread your source and find the part where asset value determination disagreement constitutes fraud.

 

[TastySuckToy]

Great! Then I'm worth $14 billion, and my house is worth approximately $1.8 trillion!

Now go to bank and see how that claim works out for you.

 

[HisArpy]

One has to ask how many people lie or exaggerate about their income and assets to secure said car loans at more favorable interest rates than they actually deserve.

And how many of them have been fined millions and denied their right to engage in commerce as a result?

 

[HisArpy]

That is indeed an astounding question, because nothing that I said was dumb.

Nearly everything you say is dum. Not quite as dumb as the crap ninnygirl spews, but still dum nonetheless.

 

[ll74]

I suggest you reread your source and find the part where asset value determination disagreement constitutes fraud.

Lying isn't disagreeing.If you sign your name on a value you know is incorrect, you are lying.

Whether they pursue charges or not is irrelevant to the crime being committed.

 

[TastySuckToy]

Lying isn't disagreeing.If you sign your name on a value you know is incorrect, you are lying.

Whether they pursue charges or not is irrelevant to the crime being committed.

Explain how Pawn shops are a legal and non fraud business model, since according to you, they operate on lying about asset valuation and therefore are committing crime.

 

[ll74]

Explain how Pawn shops are a legal and non fraud business model, since according to you, they operate on lying about asset valuation and therefore are committing crime.

What does a pawn shop have to do with an application for a loan?

 

[HisArpy]

What does a pawn shop have to do with an application for a loan?

oh FFS...

 

[dmallord]

You don't understand enough about the case to comment. There was no victim, there was no swindle, no laws were broken, and nobody lost any money.

Well, now, the judge in this case understood and eloquently rendered an impressive, coherent decision against those accused. He is an experienced adjudicator, well respected, and considered a reasoned person. There is that going for him, contrary to your viewpoint.

Go back and look at what he wrote. His court document shows all four of your declarations are wrong. The judge found Trump, his sons, and others guilty on multiple accounts. He fined them, took away business privileges for some, banned others, and pretty much installed at least a three-year oversight of Trump's Enterprises. All this points to his understanding that Trump's enterprise violated laws and would likely continue to do so if left unchecked.

You telling someone they don't understand enough about the case to comment is an utter and contemptible failure to use normal rationality or perception. By that definition, your statement was asinine. It points to your inability to accept facts over your preconceived notions.

Given your past history, I realize this will not change your view. You're welcome to it. So, others are also allowed to comment without your expressed approval and without bowing to your 'understanding of what transpired.'

 

[TastySuckToy]

oh FFS...

I've clearly grossly underestimated the stupidity of people here; we're dealing with functional retards.

They literally don't grasp the concept that any asset's value is arbitrary and open to negotiation. Market value figures are just a wide scale assessment of a common value agreement and is non binding in actual transactions.

The concept of bargaining and negotating asset value is apparently unknown to them, and they seem to think if an asset value is assessed differently from some other arbitrary figure, fraud has occurred.

This level of ignorance and stupidity is mind boggling.

 

[HisArpy]

I've clearly grossly underestimated the stupidity of people here; we're dealing with functional retards.

They literally don't grasp the concept that any asset's value is arbitrary and open to negotiation. Market value figures are just a wide scale assessment of a common value agreement and is non binding in actual transactions.

The concept of bargaining and negotating asset value is apparently unknown to them, and they seem to think if an asset value is assessed differently from some other arbitrary figure, fraud has occurred.

This level of ignorance and stupidity is mind boggling.

I've come to believe they aren't as stupid as they seem. Merely because it's impossible to have that amount of low brain function and still have an autonomous nervous system for heartbeat and breathing.

That doesn't seem to stop them from trying to convince everyone they are indeed that stupid.

 

[ll74]

Explain how Pawn shops are a legal and non fraud business model, since according to you, they operate on lying about asset valuation and therefore are

I've clearly grossly underestimated the stupidity of people here; we're dealing with functional retards.

They literally don't grasp the concept that any asset's value is arbitrary and open to negotiation. Market value figures are just a wide scale assessment of a common value agreement and is non binding in actual transactions.

The concept of bargaining and negotating asset value is apparently unknown to them, and they seem to think if an asset value is assessed differently from some other arbitrary figure, fraud has occurred.

This level of ignorance and stupidity is mind boggling.

I honestly never knew that pawn shops gave loans.

Negotiating prices is not the same thing as lying about value. If I sign my name and knowingly overvalue an item... That is fraud.

Negotiating a value means both parties are honest brokers in the deal.

 

[HisArpy]

I honestly never knew that pawn shops gave loans.

Negotiating prices is not the same thing as lying about value. If I sign my name and knowingly overvalue an item... That is fraud.

Negotiating a value means both parties are honest brokers in the deal.

Dear God, please make this idiot stop trying to convince the world he's completely and utterly stupid.