Never say "the left" when you mean "the Democrats"

[ChloeTzang]

No party can fairly be called "leftist" unless its political success would pose a real threat to the power of the rich and the corporations.

The Democrats do not meet that test. They give lip-service to labor, but on balance, they are almost as wholly owned by Wall Street as the Republicans.

The Democrats are Fascisrs AND Left. Live with it

 

[Politruk]

The Democrats are Fascisrs AND Left. Live with it

You really are an idiot. "Fascist" does not mean "authoritarian" -- it can apply to nothing on the left side of the spectrum.

 

[ChloeTzang]

You really are an idiot. "Fascist" does not mean "authoritarian" -- it can apply to nothing on the left side of the spectrum.

LOL. Fascism IS socialism. Duh. Mussolini was a socialist. Educate yourself just a little and take the blinkers off.

 

[Politruk]

LOL. Fascism IS socialism. Duh. Mussolini was a socialist. Educate yourself just a little and take the blinkers off.

No, Mussolini was a socialist before he was a fascist.

The Nazis were not socialists either, despite their oxymoronic name.

 

[Politruk]

Fascism is based on Palingenetic ultranationalistic populism.

Palingenetic means rebirth or regeneration, more specifically a cleansing such. Once the unwanted elements are washed away, eliminated, or destroyed the remaining old core will bring about a new dawn and reach their proper place.

Ultranationalistic means that the nation, its traditions, and the corresponding sense of unity is paramount. This means that it isn't really possible to import fascism to one country from another—each nation must have its own, and it will express itself in different ways.

Populism means appeal to the masses, usually by appeals to feelings, "common sense", revanchism, or disenfranchisement, and the assertion that the speaker is the true representative of the masses. Often the established elites are the target for this. However, populism in this regard carries a highly elitist core, since the masses are not expected to themselves influence the (self-appointed) leader; they are to follow.

That shoe fits the Trump movement. It does not fit the Democrats. And it does not fit the socialists.

 

[YDB95]

LOL. Fascism IS socialism. Duh. Mussolini was a socialist. Educate yourself just a little and take the blinkers off.

You really, really need to study up on the meanings of words you throw around.

 

[PaxNurgle]

He's by no means the worst offender in that respect either. I hear the word "Socialist" applied to everything from anti-racism to environmental justice to GLBT issues- none of which have anything to do with socialism.

 

[Politruk]

I recall seeing picture dating from the 1950s or '60s -- a crowd of white segregationists all carrying signs that said "RACE-MIXING IS COMMUNISM".

Certainly American Communists supported the black civil rights movement because Communists are thoroughgoing egalitarians. But the party was too small to matter, and the movement would have existed if there were no Commies in the country.

In the 1980s I personally witnessed a Klan rally protesting the naming of a street in a small town in Florida after MLK on the ground King was a Communist. (The Klansmen at the rally were not locals, they came in from out of town.) A point Jesse Helms raised in the Senate when a King holiday was being considered.

 

[Politruk]

Some dumbasses even think Harris is a Commie! if only! She ain't even a social democrat!

 

[Politruk]

Not liberals either.

I presume you're doing that dishonest thing where you equate liberalism with libertarianism.

 

[Saint_Ann]

I presume you're doing that dishonest thing where you equate liberalism with libertarianism.

I mean when "liberal" became unpopular, probably thanks to Limbaugh, it was never spoken of again by the left.

 

[Politruk]

He's by no means the worst offender in that respect either. I hear the word "Socialist" applied to everything from anti-racism to environmental justice to GLBT issues- none of which have anything to do with socialism.

I recall George Orwell writing (in the 1940s) of someone calling something "Socialism" "in the same way as, 20 years ago, a cubist painting or a vegetarian meal was called 'Bolshevism.'"

 

[UltraChad]

No party can fairly be called "leftist" unless its political success would pose a real threat to the power of the rich and the corporations.

That's a lie.

Your personal opinion on their threat level to things you don't like isn't what makes the left the left.

Supporting leftist ideology and values is what makes a person or group leftist.

Democrats meet that test. They are DEFINATIVELY leftist.

 

[Politruk]

Supporting leftist ideology and values is what makes a person or group leftist.

Democrats meet that test. They are DEFINATIVELY leftist.

But, they don't. You won't find anything in the party platform or any candidate's rhetoric that qualifies as leftist. Nothing that even tends in the direction of flattening the socioeconomic pyramid.

DEI, CRT, wokeness, feminism, LGBT rights -- those things are not left in any economic sense.

 

[Rightguide]

Another Blind Bat thread.

 

[Politruk]

If it does not cost the plutocracy any money or power, it is not left.

 

[Politruk]

Another Blind Bat thread.

Bats are not blind. Though they do rely more on echolocation than eyesight to hunt.

 

[UltraChad]

But, they don't.

Yes, they do.

You won't find anything in the party platform or any candidate's rhetoric that qualifies as leftist. Nothing that even tends in the direction of flattening the socioeconomic pyramid.

It's literally all they talk about and everything they say/do is pointed at that.

DEI, CRT, wokeness, feminism, LGBT rights -- those things are not left in any economic sense.

They absolutely are, that's why they promote the economic oppression of whites and men and UNDESERVED pedestalization of BIPOC, women and LGBTQ over them.

They are modern western progressives not Marxist.

That doesn't make them not leftist.

 

[UltraChad]

If it does not cost the plutocracy any money or power, it is not left.

You can keep trying to redefine the left, but you're still wrong.

The left doesn't stop being the left just because they suck and fail at just about everything they do.

Any person or group that supports leftist ideology, values and politicians such as the democrats is still leftist.......they can be a literal window licking retard that shits themselves and fail at picking their own noses, can't keep a job and have no hope of tearing down their betters....they're still leftist.

 

[Politruk]

They absolutely are, that's why they promote the economic oppression of whites and men and UNDESERVED pedestalization of BIPOC, women and LGBTQ over them.

DEI, feminism, etc., do not do anything like that!

 

[Rightguide]

Bats are not blind. Though they do rely more on echolocation than eyesight to hunt.

Yes and you automatically echolocate every stupid theory and leftwing talking point and follow it home.

 

[UltraChad]

DEI, feminism, etc., do not do anything like that!

Sure they do, many of their initiatives have gotten SMAKED DOWN in the courts for it over the last few years. Because racism and sexism against white males, is still racism and sexism.

That's also why even the people who promote DEI get PISSED when someone calls a DEI hire. Could not be more definitively leftist.

Body positive feminist queens will demand you recognize LIzzo is a certified baddie, perfect 10, hottest woman alive!!! Support the collective of the sisterhood!!! ALL WOMEN ARE 10's BECAUSE EQUITY!!! YASSS QUEEEN!!!!! Again, couldn't be more leftist.

Then tell her she looks just like Lizzo and watch her go instantly NUCLEAR.

 

[Politruk]

The TVTropes page on "Political Ideologies" can help us put all this in its proper perspective.

It has sections on:
Liberalism — For Equal Opportunity!
Conservatism — For Tradition and Stability!
Christian Democracy — For God and His people!
Libertarianism — For The Free Market!
Socialism — For Economic Equality!
Social Democracy — For Freedom and Equality!
Marxism — For the International Working Class!
Anarchism — For Absolute Freedom!
Fascism — For Our Nation, Our Leader, and Victory!

Of these, only Socialism, Social Democracy, Marxism and Anarchism* count as "left." Liberalism does not. And you won't find much Socialism, Social Democracy, Marxism or Anarchism in the Democratic Party.

*N.B. Anarchism is not just a more extreme form of American Libertarianism. Anarchism is a European tradition closely associated with Marxism. In a nutshell, Libertarians oppose the state because they see it as a threat to private property, and Anarchists oppose the state because they see it as a guardian of private property. Except for the Anarcho-Capitalists, of whom the less said the better.

 

[UltraChad]

The TVTropes page on "Political Ideologies" can help us put all this in its proper perspective.

It has sections on:
Liberalism — For Equal Opportunity!
Conservatism — For Tradition and Stability!
Christian Democracy — For God and His people!
Libertarianism — For The Free Market!
Socialism — For Economic Equality!
Social Democracy — For Freedom and Equality!
Marxism — For the International Working Class!
Anarchism — For Absolute Freedom!
Fascism — For Our Nation, Our Leader, and Victory!

Of these, only Socialism, Social Democracy, Marxism and Anarchism* count as "left." Liberalism does not.

*N.B. Anarchism is not just a more extreme form of American Libertarianism. Anarchism is a European tradition closely associated with Marxism. In a nutshell, Libertarians oppose the state because they see it as a threat to private property, and Anarchists oppose the state because they see it as a guardian of private property. Except for the Anarcho-Capitalists, of whom the less said the better.

Oh another BS wiki-esque "source"....LOL

Socialism at large and Marxism specifically are anti-equality in that the only equality they seek is that of outcome. AKA equity, not the same as equality in general that's why it's called equity.

They also don't understand liberalism, it's not about equality, it's about liberty. And I never claimed liberals were left wing, almost eclusively otherwise, leftist are near universally authoritarians.

Anarchism is the "left" the same way atheism is a religion, it's not.

None of this changes the fact that the Democrats are equity seeking collectivist and definitively left wing.

 

[Politruk]

They also don't understand liberalism, it's not about equality, it's about liberty.

Libertarianism is not liberalism.