sub/slaves and perfectionism

[Richard49]

Or as another example: He has me send Him a nightly report, listing all the disciplines and tasks that i have completed that day. It used to be that i would write out very long, very detailed reports... something He enjoys, but said was not necessary.

perhaps you are also getting mixed messages

 

[lark sparrow]

I have experienced feelings such as these, and for me, it comes down to surrender - this is the easiest way to make the mind shift, again, for me.

When I am feeling uncertain about my performance, or I am feeling the need to please, it's time to stop focusing on me and focus on the rules I have, the known ways of pleasing Mistress however simple, and the fact that She is not one bit shy and will tell me if I am not pleasing Her. She is also not liar - if She says it was pleasing and well done - it was. Part of my service to Her as a submissive is in this obedience - not just physically, but emotionally as well.

It's making the shift between pleasing yourself in being pleasing, and actually pleasing your Dominant. It is done with the right and good intentions, but it is listening to the wrong voice. It should be about surrendering to Her will - not the things I set up for myself, but the things She Herself, has set for me. In a way, for me, it's actually about letting go, ceding control.

It doesn't mean I can't look for ways to please Her, but it does mean that I should be listening to Her first and foremost. Communicating your feelings is good, but after a time, you have to allow your Dominant's pleasure and expectation to be foremost in your mind. Not an easy task, but it's getting "on the same page with your Dominant", and allowing them to truly lead - and having faith and belief.

I'm not sure that this will parallel your experience, but it's my two cents, and I think it is a common, beginning experience and one of the more difficult leaps in surrender. It's also why compatiblilty is such an important aspect. There are many forms of domination and control - some people take a more laid back approach and this really works for them, others like a higher maintenance relationship. It could also be in part, your fantasy expectations, crashing into the reality of maintaining on a daily basis. At first we may use an extraordinary amount of time and energy to please, but it cannot be sustained realistically in the long run - it's coming down to reality, and this is not bad - it's REAL, which is what you want.

However if Dom/me and submissive share the approximate level of need and expectation, I think this still comes up frequently in the beginning of some relationships. When we, as submissives, are on our own, we imagine what serving a Dominant will be like, or we have experience of what has pleased in the past with other Dominants- the trick is in switching from those ideas, and focusing on the individual Dominant in front of you.

*Oh, and one more point - you mentioned becoming more and more disobedient, and that rang a bell combined with perfectionism. I have a perfectionist streak too, and if I let it go too far it will actually morph itself into the anti-perfectionist. If I can't do it perfectly, then I simply won't do it at all! I'm not sure if any of this will connect with your experience, but I'm offering it nonetheless.

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

hello again.

Well, i read through...along with my owner to all the previous replies listed by dom/me and sub alike. He sees things that i do not see about myself, thus i figured what better way to see what i am about than to go over this awesome thread with him. He agreed. First off, my owner does agree that i am more disobedient then i believe I am because i try to go above and beyond what he sets for me, alot. I felt that made me a better slave, he says it does not. Being able to follow commands to the letter makes me good "pet" not trying to out do what he has said. Also, he says that i should take a page from sparrow and learn how to cede complete control to him. It is hard for me to grasp that he would want such a thing, as before we got into our relationship...he was never this way!! (at least not with me!!) SO i guess s.p. that you and i have more in common than i thought, at first. Luckily, he is trying to work with my mind set and not around it. I guess i want to thank every one for putting their opinions on this board..and for allowing me to use this board as a way to open communication with my owner. Lark, if you have a secret on how to give over control, please share...because honestly, i find it difficult to trust a man with that kind of control over me, best friend or not!! I know that we will have major issues eventually if i do not learn to release my past indiscetions and so some helpful hints would be delightful. Thanks once again, every one...and especially you s.p. for having the heart to start this thread.

 

[T.J. Jackson]

I have experienced feelings such as these, and for me, it comes down to surrender - this is the easiest way to make the mind shift, again, for me.

When I am feeling uncertain about my performance, or I am feeling the need to please, it's time to stop focusing on me and focus on the rules I have, the known ways of pleasing Mistress however simple, and the fact that She is not one bit shy and will tell me if I am not pleasing Her. She is also not liar - if She says it was pleasing and well done - it was. Part of my service to Her as a submissive is in this obedience - not just physically, but emotionally as well.

It's making the shift between pleasing yourself in being pleasing, and actually pleasing your Dominant. It is done with the right and good intentions, but it is listening to the wrong voice. It should be about surrendering to Her will - not the things I set up for myself, but the things She Herself, has set for me. In a way, for me, it's actually about letting go, ceding control.

It doesn't mean I can't look for ways to please Her, but it does mean that I should be listening to Her first and foremost. Communicating your feelings is good, but after a time, you have to allow your Dominant's pleasure and expectation to be foremost in your mind. Not an easy task, but it's getting "on the same page with your Dominant", and allowing them to truly lead - and having faith and belief.

I'm not sure that this will parallel your experience, but it's my two cents, and I think it is a common, beginning experience and one of the more difficult leaps in surrender. It's also why compatiblilty is such an important aspect. There are many forms of domination and control - some people take a more laid back approach and this really works for them, others like a higher maintenance relationship. It could also be in part, your fantasy expectations, crashing into the reality of maintaining on a daily basis. At first we may use an extraordinary amount of time and energy to please, but it cannot be sustained realistically in the long run - it's coming down to reality, and this is not bad - it's REAL, which is what you want.

However if Dom/me and submissive share the approximate level of need and expectation, I think this still comes up frequently in the beginning of some relationships. When we, as submissives, are on our own, we imagine what serving a Dominant will be like, or we have experience of what has pleased in the past with other Dominants- the trick is in switching from those ideas, and focusing on the individual Dominant in front of you.

*Oh, and one more point - you mentioned becoming more and more disobedient, and that rang a bell combined with perfectionism. I have a perfectionist streak too, and if I let it go too far it will actually morph itself into the anti-perfectionist. If I can't do it perfectly, then I simply won't do it at all! I'm not sure if any of this will connect with your experience, but I'm offering it nonetheless.

Oh my GOD! I see my pet's name written all over this post. That is an awesome post and one I will be sure she sees. I have been trying unsuccessfully to get her to understand my point but I couldn't find the right words. I hope she reads and understands that this is what I was trying to say to her. Thanks Lark for saying something very important in a way my poor command of the English language wouldn't permit. (And it's my native tongue, go figure )

 

[sub princess]

I have experienced feelings such as these, and for me, it comes down to surrender - this is the easiest way to make the mind shift, again, for me.

When I am feeling uncertain about my performance, or I am feeling the need to please, it's time to stop focusing on me and focus on the rules I have, the known ways of pleasing Mistress however simple, and the fact that She is not one bit shy and will tell me if I am not pleasing Her. She is also not liar - if She says it was pleasing and well done - it was. Part of my service to Her as a submissive is in this obedience - not just physically, but emotionally as well.

i couldn't agree more... THIS is exactly what i need to do... make the focus more about His needs, and less about whether i have gone far enough, or was quick enough in my desires to please Him. As with your Mistress, Master will definitely tell me when i have been displeasing or disobedient.

It's making the shift between pleasing yourself in being pleasing, and actually pleasing your Dominant. It is done with the right and good intentions, but it is listening to the wrong voice. It should be about surrendering to Her will - not the things I set up for myself, but the things She Herself, has set for me. In a way, for me, it's actually about letting go, ceding control.

Hmmm, as i read this i asked myself 'have i surrendered to Him?' And though He does in fact have my submission, i do not believe that i have yet to surrender all of myself to Him... Thank you for mentioning this Lark.

It doesn't mean I can't look for ways to please Her, but it does mean that I should be listening to Her first and foremost. Communicating your feelings is good, but after a time, you have to allow your Dominant's pleasure and expectation to be foremost in your mind. Not an easy task, but it's getting "on the same page with your Dominant", and allowing them to truly lead - and having faith and belief.

I'm not sure that this will parallel your experience, but it's my two cents, and I think it is a common, beginning experience and one of the more difficult leaps in surrender. It's also why compatiblilty is such an important aspect. There are many forms of domination and control - some people take a more laid back approach and this really works for them, others like a higher maintenance relationship. It could also be in part, your fantasy expectations, crashing into the reality of maintaining on a daily basis. At first we may use an extraordinary amount of time and energy to please, but it cannot be sustained realistically in the long run - it's coming down to reality, and this is not bad - it's REAL, which is what you want.

This was exactly what He was worried about i believe. He kept telling me that the unrealistic goals that i was setting for myself were not neccessary, and that He was afraid that i would get to overwhelmed and frusterated. That is why when i disobeyed Him in such a HUGE way He was somewhat relieved.

However if Dom/me and submissive share the approximate level of need and expectation, I think this still comes up frequently in the beginning of some relationships. When we, as submissives, are on our own, we imagine what serving a Dominant will be like, or we have experience of what has pleased in the past with other Dominants- the trick is in switching from those ideas, and focusing on the individual Dominant in front of you.

Well put... brava!!

*Oh, and one more point - you mentioned becoming more and more disobedient, and that rang a bell combined with perfectionism. I have a perfectionist streak too, and if I let it go too far it will actually morph itself into the anti-perfectionist. If I can't do it perfectly, then I simply won't do it at all! I'm not sure if any of this will connect with your experience, but I'm offering it nonetheless.

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you... you make perfect sense to me, and it 'clicked' in my head as soon as i read this. Subconsciously i may have been doing just that. i now know that i have to re-focus my energy on Him, carry out His desires, and trust and know that He will in fact tell me when i am not putting in enough effort...... Ah, seems simple enough, but i know i have much work ahead of me now. i am a perfectionist in many areas, so changing my whole mindset may be a little difficult.. but certainly not impossible. Afterall, what better incentive than pleasing a loving, caring, wonderful Master!!

Thanks again Lark... you have truly made the connection for me!

 

[Shadowsdream]

i will give an example: He will give me a photo assignment (He likes me to take various pictures of myself for Him), He tells me to have it done by tomorrow evening..... i do it right away, in the hopes of pleasing Him, and long for Him to assign more.

~i do it right away, in the hopes of pleasing Him, AND LONG FOR HIM TO ASSIGN MORE:~

Troubles Me a little...We Dominants give time limits for reasons..the reasons are not always wrapped up in the sub. Perhaps We have chosen this form of Dominance and have NO desire to feel the Obligation or Need to add another task..and then another and another as quickly as the submissive can cross one off the list.
Believe it or not a rush to be ahead of schedule consistently does feel, on occassion, as though We must get BUSY and Dominate...

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

ok...

[BAh, seems simple enough, but i know i have much work ahead of me now. i am a perfectionist in many areas, so changing my whole mindset may be a little difficult.. but certainly not impossible. Afterall, what better incentive than pleasing a loving, caring, wonderful Master!!

Thanks again Lark... you have truly made the connection for me! [/B]

As i asked Lark, I will ask you, s.p., just how do you go about releasing that control?? Some hints if you have em would be good...and thanks once more for the thread...

 

[Richard49]

I still say
that part of this has to do with mixed message
from the Dom

 

[Richard49]

Believe it or not a rush to be ahead of schedule consistently does feel, on occassion, as though We must get BUSY and Dominate...

and busy can make me irritated and
worn out

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

ms. Shadow??

Troubles Me a little...We Dominants give time limits for reasons..the reasons are not always wrapped up in the sub. Perhaps We have chosen this form of Dominance and have NO desire to feel the Obligation or Need to add another task..and then another and another as quickly as the submissive can cross one off the list.
Believe it or not a rush to be ahead of schedule consistently does feel, on occassion, as though We must get BUSY and Dominate... [/B]

Just one question...if you are dominant by nature...why would you have to get busy and be dominant??? Just wanted to know...(and no, I was not trying to be disrespectful either.) It just seems to me, that as a dominant in any relationship...well, you only have to move at what you consider to be an appropriate speed. But i was just wondering...thank you..

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

Sir Richard...

and busy can make me irritated and
worn out

Yup...i can see that business along with taking command would be irritating...i hope your day is better than earlier...

 

[sub princess]

Re: hello again.

Well, i read through...along with my owner to all the previous replies listed by dom/me and sub alike. He sees things that i do not see about myself, thus i figured what better way to see what i am about than to go over this awesome thread with him. He agreed. First off, my owner does agree that i am more disobedient then i believe I am because i try to go above and beyond what he sets for me, alot. I felt that made me a better slave, he says it does not. Being able to follow commands to the letter makes me good "pet" not trying to out do what he has said. Also, he says that i should take a page from sparrow and learn how to cede complete control to him. It is hard for me to grasp that he would want such a thing, as before we got into our relationship...he was never this way!! (at least not with me!!) SO i guess s.p. that you and i have more in common than i thought, at first. Luckily, he is trying to work with my mind set and not around it. I guess i want to thank every one for putting their opinions on this board..and for allowing me to use this board as a way to open communication with my owner. Lark, if you have a secret on how to give over control, please share...because honestly, i find it difficult to trust a man with that kind of control over me, best friend or not!! I know that we will have major issues eventually if i do not learn to release my past indiscetions and so some helpful hints would be delightful. Thanks once again, every one...and especially you s.p. for having the heart to start this thread.

You are very welcome apet4you, i am glad to hear that i am not alone here, and that perhaps this thread can help some of us from repeating unneccessary mistakes time and time again. i think that i have learned to release alot of myself.... but not until last night (i cried in front of Him, something i have not done in front of A/anyone in years) had i really released to Him emotionally. i saw my tears as a gift, for it truly showed me that i not only trust Him with my well being and my body, but my heart as well.

i am glad that you showed this thread to your Owner, and that it might help you out... Good Luck!......

 

[Shadowsdream]

Re: ms. Shadow??

Just one question...if you are dominant by nature...why would you have to get busy and be dominant??? Just wanted to know...(and no, I was not trying to be disrespectful either.) It just seems to me, that as a dominant in any relationship...well, you only have to move at what you consider to be an appropriate speed. But i was just wondering...thank you..

I don't HAVE to..and I don't fall for it..but I also read between the lines and knowing that the task is not finished on schedule just because it is My wish..or even finished early but presented as asked..then I can feel annoyed..and turned off. Which means less Domination.
Dominating in a 24/7 lifestyle can be very exhausting some days...perhaps I have had the flu for a week..and am over come with the tired effects...I will devise a task that takes time, is important and has a purpose...and also allows My slave to know that My illness does not stop My control but changes it in a direction that does not ease for him but gives Me a little extra time and space to recover so that I can get back to My more pleasing (to Me) style of constant and minute detail control.
I hope that makes some sense?

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

Re: Re: hello again.

You are very welcome apet4you, i am glad to hear that i am not alone here, and that perhaps this thread can help some of us from repeating unneccessary mistakes time and time again. i think that i have learned to release alot of myself.... but not until last night (i cried in front of Him, something i have not done in front of A/anyone in years) had i really released to Him emotionally. i saw my tears as a gift, for it truly showed me that i not only trust Him with my well being and my body, but my heart as well.

i am glad that you showed this thread to your Owner, and that it might help you out... Good Luck!......

I think it is beautiful that you have such an open heart s.p., and quite truthfully I understand the way you see your tears as being a gift, since i have difficulty with releasing emotions as well...yet never to my owner (we were best friends long before we travelled this road) I hope things get better for you...as some people truly deserve happiness and you strike me as such a one...Have a good day darlin"...kiss

 

[sub princess]

Troubles Me a little...We Dominants give time limits for reasons..the reasons are not always wrapped up in the sub. Perhaps We have chosen this form of Dominance and have NO desire to feel the Obligation or Need to add another task..and then another and another as quickly as the submissive can cross one off the list.
Believe it or not a rush to be ahead of schedule consistently does feel, on occassion, as though We must get BUSY and Dominate...

i think that the reason i starting the 'rushing' thing was because in the beginning i was given so many tasks all at once, that i thought that i was going to be constantly bombarded with multiple tasks each week.... but as i have become accustom to my daily scheduling i have learned to pace myself better. The desire for 'more' is still there... i happily do all that he asks, but i pace myself alot better now... at least i think so, and He has not complained. He now actually gives me many tasks at once, but gives a weekly deadline, i have a list that i check off as i complete each one..... but i still do the one's that i know will please Him the most, or are the most important ones to Him, right away.

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

Re: Re: ms. Shadow??

I don't HAVE to..and I don't fall for it..but I also read between the lines and knowing that the task is not finished on schedule just because it is My wish..or even finished early but presented as asked..then I can feel annoyed..and turned off. Which means less Domination.
Dominating in a 24/7 lifestyle can be very exhausting some days...perhaps I have had the flu for a week..and am over come with the tired effects...I will devise a task that takes time, is important and has a purpose...and also allows My slave to know that My illness does not stop My control but changes it in a direction that does not ease for him but gives Me a little extra time and space to recover so that I can get back to My more pleasing (to Me) style of constant and minute detail control.
I hope that makes some sense?

Yes, Ms. Shadow, that does make sense. Thank you for taking the time to answer my (not so impertinent) question.

 

[lark sparrow]

Giving up control is simple, but not easy. Stop trying to control the situation.

I'm not a surrender guru and far from perfect, but I think it truly does start with simply listening to and obeying the Dominant - and resisting the other urges outwardly. It's a practice - you just have to be willing to be obedient to the letter, even uncomfortably so, because sometimes that means you just have to be with yourself and stop trying... eventually the actual exchange becomes clear - it truly is simple.

The more complex you make it the further away you are getting from the actual process of surrendering and obeying, and the less you can feel it. Focus, trust, and follow through. The more you do it, the more natural and harmonious it becomes. It's not being mindless, it's being mindful. Does that make sense at all?

 

[sub princess]

I still say
that part of this has to do with mixed message
from the Dom

Richard, thank you for your posts... i guess i should have clarified myself a little better, but still i am new at this posting stuff. When i said "Or as another example: He has me send Him a nightly report, listing all the disciplines and tasks that i have completed that day. It used to be that i would write out very long, very detailed reports... something He enjoys, but said was not necessary." i meant that He was happy that i was taking the time to write about my day so detailfully, but that He knew that it was becoming time consuming and overwhelming to me. He also at that point had me start journaling, a way He thought would better serve my creative and at times long winded writings.

Thank you again................

 

[sub princess]

Re: Re: Re: hello again.

I think it is beautiful that you have such an open heart s.p., and quite truthfully I understand the way you see your tears as being a gift, since i have difficulty with releasing emotions as well...yet never to my owner (we were best friends long before we travelled this road) I hope things get better for you...as some people truly deserve happiness and you strike me as such a one...Have a good day darlin"...kiss

Thank you so much (what to call you? how to shorten? lol) apet4you. You are very sweet. You too have a good day, and take care...............

 

[Shadowsdream]

Re: Re: hello again.

You are very welcome apet4you, i am glad to hear that i am not alone here, and that perhaps this thread can help some of us from repeating unneccessary mistakes time and time again. i think that i have learned to release alot of myself.... but not until last night (i cried in front of Him, something i have not done in front of A/anyone in years) had i really released to Him emotionally. i saw my tears as a gift, for it truly showed me that i not only trust Him with my well being and my body, but my heart as well.

i am glad that you showed this thread to your Owner, and that it might help you out... Good Luck!......

Tears are freedom...
They are a gift when shed in honesty and understanding...
congratulations!

 

[sub princess]

Giving up control is simple, but not easy. Stop trying to control the situation.

I'm not a surrender guru and far from perfect, but I think it truly does start with simply listening to and obeying the Dominant - and resisting the other urges outwardly. It's a practice - you just have to be willing to be obedient to the letter, even uncomfortably so, because sometimes that means you just have to be with yourself and stop trying... eventually the actual exchange becomes clear - it truly is simple.

The more complex you make it the further away you are getting from the actual process of surrendering and obeying, and the less you can feel it. Focus, trust, and follow through. The more you do it, the more natural and harmonious it becomes. It's not being mindless, it's being mindful. Does that make sense at all?

Yes Lark, again you make perfect sense to me.. thank you. i do tend to over analize things. You give great advice, and i will stop trying so hard and allow my nature and my devotion to Him guide me...... Thank you so much!

 

[sub princess]

Re: Re: Re: hello again.

Tears are freedom...
They are a gift when shed in honesty and understanding...
congratulations!

Thank you Shadowsdream..... Master said the same thing.

 

[Shadowsdream]

i think that the reason i starting the 'rushing' thing was because in the beginning i was given so many tasks all at once, that i thought that i was going to be constantly bombarded with multiple tasks each week.... but as i have become accustom to my daily scheduling i have learned to pace myself better. The desire for 'more' is still there... i happily do all that he asks, but i pace myself alot better now... at least i think so, and He has not complained. He now actually gives me many tasks at once, but gives a weekly deadline, i have a list that i check off as i complete each one..... but i still do the one's that i know will please Him the most, or are the most important ones to Him, right away.

The desiring the more is natural...and We want you to desire the more....I think My caution just comes into...some days the more is too much...other days the mores are not enough...We also have mores ~~grin~~

 

[Ebonyfire]

Obedience is hard work

It is often hard to obey and do tasks without embellishment or slacking. The temptation to do a bit more than the Dominant ahs requested maybe too much. Or even worse ,the temptation to ignore the request may be even more.

As SD says, many times a time limit is given for a reason. The reason may not always be apparent to the submissive, and the sub may try to read his/her Dom/me's mind. This almost always leads to the wrong conclusion.

So surrender, is the only option, if intend submission is the goal. Do what is requested (or ordered), and in the manner that is directed.

 

[Shadowsdream]

Re: Re: Re: ms. Shadow??

Yes, Ms. Shadow, that does make sense. Thank you for taking the time to answer my (not so impertinent) question.

~~smile~~ your question was honest and valuable..please never hesítate to question for only in asking will you know the real answer without assuming...