Two Masters?

[lil_slave_rose]

I give up. The word luxury was obviously poorly chosen. Insert word of choice to describe a "highly favorable circumstance" or "a range of choices" or "availibility of back-up plans"

for what it's worth, i understood what you were saying, and agree

 

[catalina_francisco]

I give up. The word luxury was obviously poorly chosen. Insert word of choice to describe a "highly favorable circumstance" or "a range of choices" or "availibility of back-up plans"

I'm not sure those terms cover how it is either. Though luxury might not be 100% what you meant it to mean, the alternatives still hint at it being an easy choice or one which does not mean sacrifice worth thinking about compared to your own situation, to which I strongly disagree. As I said in my previous post, whichever choice I made, it meant I was going to be separated from someone I loved deeply and someone who wanted/needed me close by. The decision was not easy except in the way I had decided what type relationship I wanted before looking for it, and had accepted I would likely make some painful choices to live it....that does not translate to easy or highly favourable circumstances.

I cannot jump a plane and go 16,000kms to visit my family and friends at the drop of a hat, and when I do get the opportunity to go back it is a short visit during which I cry on the plane nearly all the way there because I am leaving F behind for at least most of the time I will be gone, and cry all the way back here because I am leaving behind all those I love at home. Believe me, after nearly 5 years of this routine, it is not getting any easier, nor does it make for a lovely holiday back home. Not to mention the deep depressions I go into when I am missing those back home more than usual, or worried about them and usually with good reason...F is amazing the way he tolerates those black days and flood of tears that don't dry very quickly. As to money, we learn to live within our means which fortunately for me, after living years below the poverty line with 2 children to raise, it seems a breeze these days, but still a far cry from being able to buy the simplist thing without thinking, planning and budgeting first.

The interesting thing is that although I had made the decision to live this type relationship, I had not altogether planned on the distance factor, or the problems that would raise. We married and he returned to Europe to leave me to sort out my life in Oz and then work out how we were going to live together here. It caused problems for us and it was when I was venting to another Dom I knew about how frustrating it was, how impossible it all seemed, how long it was taking, how little money there was to make the move, how many people would be upset, how much paperwork and planning there was, that he lost patience and said if I really wanted to be with my Master I would stop fucking around with the excuses and just do it. I did just that, and though it was difficult to sort everything out along the way, it was the best thing we could have done and was what entering this relationship was really all about...being together, not online complaining about how much we wanted it but just couldn't make it happen. Reality is nothing is impossible as long as you know what you want and are prepared to acknowledge it doesn't just fall out of the sky and resemble a fairytale where sacrifice does not exist.

Catalina

 

[ownedsubgal]

I am just guessing here. I think that "slave puts the Master first, and Master looks out for the children" does not necessarily mean that slave does not care for the children. In fact, I would expect that most mothers do the caretaking and most fathers help out as they desire to, regardless of who is Master/slave...yes, there are exceptions, but that's the majority.

In the case of a slave mother and Master father, I would say that the slave still does most of the day-to-day caretaking. And again, the Master participates as he wishes to, which may be a little or a lot.

But what I think is the point, is that the Master arranges the slave's life in a way that enables her to look after the children. If they need two incomes, maybe he allows her to work part-time and then come home so she's there when the kids are home from school. Or he expects her to care for the kids all the time, but if he is going to make some demand of her, he will provide an alternative caretaker for while she is serving him. She can rest comfortable that whenever she is going to be focusing on him, her children will still be taken care of. (Alternative caretaker could be a babysitter, a movie, whatever.)

Does that sound like something that could work in everyday life?

Etoile, that's precisely the sort of thing i meant. it is not a situation in which a slave mother would be neglectful, or in which the slave's children would feel resentful of the Master. it is one in which everyone is taken care of, while still maintaining the M/s structure.

rose, you said that D/s, M/s, etc. does not exist in a vacuum. and i agree with you there, it does not. that's why these issues (kids, work, whatever) need to be addressed. because for some us, our D/s, our M/s, affects all aspects of our lives, because it IS our life. there is a Dominant we know who has been begging my Master for advice on how to conduct his relationship with his submissive while she is recovering from a major surgery. in his view, the D/s must go on hold because "real life" has ruined all of his kinky plans. my Master just shakes his head and laughs in disbelief...because for us, this IS real life. however many seem to feel that things must be compartmentalized....their is your D/s, your bdsm, and then there is your "real life." and never the twain shall meet. what these folks should realize is that it just does not have to work that way, you can lead a productive, fulfilling life, be a good mother, maintain a job, or whatever else, and still be the best possible slave to your Master.

also rose, i'm not denying the fact that one can indeed serve both a Master's (not necessarily every Master) needs, as well as their children's needs, while always putting the children first. but (and this is just my worthless old opinion) part of being a slave is understanding and accepting that whatever past or current responsibilities you had, whatever dreams or desires you cherished, whatever your personal issues or struggles, that now there is One who is the ruler of your fate, and this One comes before all others. this is not an easy thing for most to accept, Catalina mentioned the many personal sacrifices she had to make when she became Francisco's slave. i consider myself fortunate, i only had to give up school, friends, and face-to-face contact with family. but still it was painful to me for a time, yet i accepted it as part of the reality of being owned.

 

[FurryFury]

I just find it really really interesting that these issues are not raised in the context of male slaves. It would never be questioned for a male slave to work outside the home, it would seem obvious and the norm - keeping one home would seem renegade and unusual.

I don't understand how one can think hierarchically about relationships with children versus relationships with partners OR owners - it seems to me that demanding priority OVER children, minor OR adult children, is completely useless in regard to having any kind of relationship with anyone fit to be a parent - if you and the persons's kids are in "competiton" something is really really wrong with your security in the relationship.

I agree with that wholeheartedly. I've seen that sort of competition in action and it's ugly. I also agree these sorts of questions don't come up with males much.

Fury

 

[lil_slave_rose]

Etoile, that's precisely the sort of thing i meant. it is not a situation in which a slave mother would be neglectful, or in which the slave's children would feel resentful of the Master. it is one in which everyone is taken care of, while still maintaining the M/s structure.

rose, you said that D/s, M/s, etc. does not exist in a vacuum. and i agree with you there, it does not. that's why these issues (kids, work, whatever) need to be addressed. because for some us, our D/s, our M/s, affects all aspects of our lives, because it IS our life. there is a Dominant we know who has been begging my Master for advice on how to conduct his relationship with his submissive while she is recovering from a major surgery. in his view, the D/s must go on hold because "real life" has ruined all of his kinky plans. my Master just shakes his head and laughs in disbelief...because for us, this IS real life. however many seem to feel that things must be compartmentalized....their is your D/s, your bdsm, and then there is your "real life." and never the twain shall meet. what these folks should realize is that it just does not have to work that way, you can lead a productive, fulfilling life, be a good mother, maintain a job, or whatever else, and still be the best possible slave to your Master.

also rose, i'm not denying the fact that one can indeed serve both a Master's (not necessarily every Master) needs, as well as their children's needs, while always putting the children first. but (and this is just my worthless old opinion) part of being a slave is understanding and accepting that whatever past or current responsibilities you had, whatever dreams or desires you cherished, whatever your personal issues or struggles, that now there is One who is the ruler of your fate, and this One comes before all others. this is not an easy thing for most to accept, Catalina mentioned the many personal sacrifices she had to make when she became Francisco's slave. i consider myself fortunate, i only had to give up school, friends, and face-to-face contact with family. but still it was painful to me for a time, yet i accepted it as part of the reality of being owned.

i could not live with anyone who expected me to give up my responsibility to my kids because i CHOSE to be owned by Him. i didn't mean that i have my M/s life and then my 'real life' that is not what i meant at ALL by we do not live in a BDSM vacuum. M/s IS our life as well, but that does not mean that sometimes things aren't going to come up that do not fit into our lifestyle and we have to say 'oh, ok, hold on a minute, we'll get back to that, we gotta deal with this first' nor does that change who we are to each other or what the dynamic of our relationship is.

if i were recovering from a serious surgery, Master would likely put all things BDSM/Kinky aside until i was feeling better. He wouldn't expect me to 'serve' Him in the way he does when i am not sick or recovering from surgery. Does that mean i am no longer His slave and He no longer my Master?? no, it means i had something wrong with me that needed fixed, i got it fixed, and the doctor said 'rest' well you can't very well rest if you have to clean a house, take care of kids, have dinner on the table before Master gets home from work, and then at Master's whim be beat until He's satisfied. like i said, i'm glad that i have a Master who agrees whole heartedly with all of these issues.

part of having someone else hold your fate in their hands, is knowing that they will take care of you, and do their best to protect their Property. i would not be owned by someone who didn't have my safety and well being first and foremost in their mind.....but that's just me.....

 

[callinectes]

I'm out. No matter what I say or how I say I am not making myself clear.

I suppose my involvement was superflous anyway. I'm not a slave.

It's been an interesting and educational discussion to read though.

 

[BiBunny]

Ok, what if one's Master/Mistress is not interested in having control of the career aspect of his/her slave's life? Maybe I'm taking a simplistic view of this, since B. and I don't live together, but he honestly does not give a shit. As long as I fulfill the things he does require, he doesn't care about anything else, job/school/whatever. And, as for me, if I ever acquire a hypothetical sub/slave/pet of my own, I will be the exact same way.

 

[Etoile]

I think not expecting a slave to live up to their normal duties following surgery is just good common sense. After all, one doesn't want to damage one's own property by demanding things. I hardly think any Master/Owner would find it necessary to demand things when it risks prolonging the recovery time, popping out the stitches, or whatever. Also, it's entirely possible that the slave would end up doing a poor job if they did try to perform, simply because they were not physically up to it, and there's no point in having a job done poorly, might as well do it yourself. If certain things can be done, like waiting to eat until Master has taken a bite, or sitting on the floor rather than in a chair is a normal thing and the slave is not bedridden, then they can do that.

It's just common sense, I have no idea why osg's Daddy's acquaintance is asking about this! Why would you damage your own property and risk having a sloppy performance?

 

[FurryFury]

I'm out. No matter what I say or how I say I am not making myself clear.

I suppose my involvement was superflous anyway. I'm not a slave.

It's been an interesting and educational discussion to read though.

I don't think you should be out. I think it's a matter of different ideas for different people. This thread never stated it had to be from a slave's POV or that there was only one slave POV. It asked about two Masters and if having a military career would be another Master. Everything else is just different people's POV that's all, not wrong, or right, just different. You view is just as valid as anyone else's.

Fury

 

[ownedsubgal]

I think not expecting a slave to live up to their normal duties following surgery is just good common sense. After all, one doesn't want to damage one's own property by demanding things. I hardly think any Master/Owner would find it necessary to demand things when it risks prolonging the recovery time, popping out the stitches, or whatever. Also, it's entirely possible that the slave would end up doing a poor job if they did try to perform, simply because they were not physically up to it, and there's no point in having a job done poorly, might as well do it yourself. If certain things can be done, like waiting to eat until Master has taken a bite, or sitting on the floor rather than in a chair is a normal thing and the slave is not bedridden, then they can do that.

It's just common sense, I have no idea why osg's Daddy's acquaintance is asking about this! Why would you damage your own property and risk having a sloppy performance?

the thing with this particular Dominant is that his whole relationship with his submissive (or maybe slave, not sure which) is built on kink. He has absolutely no idea how to "live" D/s without the long list of daily physical rituals, sexual training, bdsm activities, etc. so this real life situation has come up (her surgery and recovery) and because D/s is not part of real life for him, he has absolutely no idea how to incorporate the two.

obviously a very ill or injured sub/slave cannot be expected to perform precisely as normal, especially in physical ways. however for those of us whose D/s is their "real life", things like being ill or injured (or work or kids) don't interrupt the power dynamic.

 

[lil_slave_rose]

the thing with this particular Dominant is that his whole relationship with his submissive (or maybe slave, not sure which) is built on kink. He has absolutely no idea how to "live" D/s without the long list of daily physical rituals, sexual training, bdsm activities, etc. so this real life situation has come up (her surgery and recovery) and because D/s is not part of real life for him, he has absolutely no idea how to incorporate the two.

obviously a very ill or injured sub/slave cannot be expected to perform precisely as normal, especially in physical ways. however for those of us whose D/s is their "real life", things like being ill or injured (or work or kids) don't interrupt the power dynamic.

i'm not sure why you think that because someone's kids, work, or whatever demand some of their time that it 'interrupts the power dynamic' Master has power over me aLL of the time, it's not a game we play, we are not in it for the kink, we LIVE the lifestyle as well, we just happen to have kids that are not a part of that lifestyle....as i said in an earlier post about being ill/after surgery, simply because i cannot 'serve' Him in the way i normally do does not change who we are to each other...or the power dynamic.....nor does it make me less submissive or Him less Domly.....kids are and never should be a part of the lifestyle, so yea dealing with them is different, but it still doesn't change who Him and i are to each other.....period.

 

[Etoile]

the thing with this particular Dominant is that his whole relationship with his submissive (or maybe slave, not sure which) is built on kink. He has absolutely no idea how to "live" D/s without the long list of daily physical rituals, sexual training, bdsm activities, etc. so this real life situation has come up (her surgery and recovery) and because D/s is not part of real life for him, he has absolutely no idea how to incorporate the two.

obviously a very ill or injured sub/slave cannot be expected to perform precisely as normal, especially in physical ways. however for those of us whose D/s is their "real life", things like being ill or injured (or work or kids) don't interrupt the power dynamic.

Of course not! My goodness, just because someone is ill or injured doesn't mean they are not still in control or still lack control. If a slave is injured and their Master has to bring their food to the bedroom, help change bandages, etc - this doesn't mean that the Master is now the servant, it's just the way things work when something comes up like this! It's not always a physical thing, you can easily have the slave being cared for and the Master getting them things they need, and the mental aspect of the relationship is still there. The slave is not going to be ordering the Master around! Of course they can ask for things - "my wound has been bleeding heavily, could you please help change the dressing so the blood doesn't leak onto the sheets?" When M/s IS your real world, you integrate them, of course. Breaking your back does not mean you are no longer a slave, for example, even if you need to be carried to the bathroom! You don't just stop everything and change your mindset just because you broke your back. I am just blown away that someone could even be struggling with this...it's just the right way for things to work between a real-world Master and slave!

I hope that guy comes to realize that just because his sub cannot suck his cock every morning for a couple of weeks, or just because she cannot get down on the floor to eat under the table, etc. - doesn't mean she's not still his property. Life happens to everybody, Masters and slaves included, and they treat normal life events as anyone else would: with their own personalities and relationship dynamic applied to it!

 

[MasterPhoenix]

Of course not! My goodness, just because someone is ill or injured doesn't mean they are not still in control or still lack control. If a slave is injured and their Master has to bring their food to the bedroom, help change bandages, etc - this doesn't mean that the Master is now the servant, it's just the way things work when something comes up like this! It's not always a physical thing, you can easily have the slave being cared for and the Master getting them things they need, and the mental aspect of the relationship is still there. The slave is not going to be ordering the Master around! Of course they can ask for things - "my wound has been bleeding heavily, could you please help change the dressing so the blood doesn't leak onto the sheets?" When M/s IS your real world, you integrate them, of course. Breaking your back does not mean you are no longer a slave, for example, even if you need to be carried to the bathroom! You don't just stop everything and change your mindset just because you broke your back. I am just blown away that someone could even be struggling with this...it's just the right way for things to work between a real-world Master and slave!

I hope that guy comes to realize that just because his sub cannot suck his cock every morning for a couple of weeks, or just because she cannot get down on the floor to eat under the table, etc. - doesn't mean she's not still his property. Life happens to everybody, Masters and slaves included, and they treat normal life events as anyone else would: with their own personalities and relationship dynamic applied to it!

Well put Etolie, I agree 100 percent.

If rose is sick or injured, I will care of her out of love to help nurse her back to health. That doesn't make her any less submissive to me. In fact there are times when she has a cold when I have to use my Dominance to make her take her medicine.

Yeah, the kinky play may go on hold but the power dynamic is still there.