Why The Holocaust Must Be Questioned

[miles]

I think if you will go back in this thread you will find that the figure had already been debated and authenticated. The Nazis didn't decide on the six million....the Jews did...

.

That's the point, clown. You people are certified nutcases. Crazy. Whackjobs. Delusional.

I'd be willing to bet that you and your Jew - obsessed skinhead Lit pals have never accomplished a damn thing in your miserable lives.

 

[krastner]

You mean *gasp* he's a German Revisionist?

No worse than that..I would not let it get near any children especially new born babies

 

[phrodeau]

No worse than that..I would not let it get near any children especially new born babies

That AV is you, isn't it?

 

[krastner]

hey little poo poo squeeler...go tattle on someone and leave my threads alone you little peice of doo doo censor and tattler...

 

[krastner]

Please do not let this thread die. I promise to ignore the little pee pee person little poopoodreu.

This thread is about the worlds biggest liard and the most devious villians in all history. They need to be jap slapped around a bit more.

 

[krastner]

Please do not let this thread die. I promise to ignore the little pee pee person little poopoodreu.

This thread is about the worlds biggest liars and the most devious villians in all history. They need to be jap slapped around a bit more.

 

[WingNut_N_Bolt]

I think if you will go back in this thread you will find that the figure had already been debated and authenticated. The Nazis didn't decide on the six million....the Jews did...

But that's only coincdence isn't it?

Anywa, it's not quite six million, it's 5.7 million or so.

 

[Anachron]

Godwins Law raises its ugly head again as Holocaust sycophants have only a myth to hold to and no facts to base it on other than Holocaust® Exaggeration, or Holocaust® Fraud.

That Jews buy into this shit makes them communally stupid and gullible, given how sharp they keep claiming to be yet cant seperate political lies from religious fantasy. Even as a venerated religion event for jewry, it shouldn't be imposed on every other living thing because worse things happened to the Russians and Germans in the same time period and Jews couldn't give a shit.

Talmudists have a lot to answer for.

The historicity of the Holocaust is undeniable. Deny the Holocaust, claim the moon landings were faked, believe Galactic Overlord Xenu freeze-dried our ancestors and stacked them near volcanoes and nuked them--it's all the same absurdity. I do believe people should have the freedom to question the Holocaust; I believe people should also have the right to march down the street carrying signs reading "Man Will Never Fly." As a professor I had once said, the Constitution gives a man the right to make an ass of himself.

Now if you want to say that the Holocaust shouldn't have given Jews a free pass to evict Arabs from their land and create Israel, you might have a point.

If you want to say that Israel has behaved imperialistically toward the Palestinians, you might have a point.

But these are separate issues. The historicity of the Holocaust. The legitimacy of Israel. The conduct of Israel toward the Palestinians. Related, yes, but distinct and separate. Criticism of Israel does not equal anti-Semitism. Accepting the historicity of the Holocaust does not mandate acceptance of Israel's legitimacy.

 

[Lovelynice]

Most countries have detailed census records covering such information but the specialist nature of the records you seek would need a dedicated research effort such as that undertaken by Ruppin and the Thrid Reich who have published their own records of jewish populations in Europe, a necessity with their planned programme of transfer.

Any capable researcher can tediously create their own record but obviously this is not popular... whining and stone throwing is much easier.

I've noticed that "whining and stone throwing" are the usual tell-tale sign that the "stone-throwers" have nothing else to use in argument.

 

[Lovelynice]

The historicity of the Holocaust is undeniable. .

History is always revisable, just like anything else. New facts are discovered, myths are revealed as fictions, and the historical "facts" become something else.

Care to show me one of those mythical diesel "murder vans" or "diesel gas chambers"?

They're stated as being "undeniable" but nobody can show a real one, or the schematics of one, or can say how these things could be plausible when so many scientific studies about diesel and sane automobile mechanics will tell you that they're impossible.

Maybe you can go out and find those vast mass graves without the remains of tens of thousands of dead at Treblinka in that ground that hasn't been dug up since the last Ice Age?

Have a whole list of things like this.... read through the thread, and come up with something other than broad-sweeping generalisations that are logical fallacies such as the "historicity of such-and-such event is undeniable". A very big part of the holocaust myth is very much deniable, and the evidence is exceedingly thin on the ground to prove otherwise.

 

[nyminus]

History is always revisable, just like anything else. New facts are discovered, myths are revealed as fictions, and the historical "facts" become something else.

Care to show me one of those mythical diesel "murder vans" or "diesel gas chambers"?

They're stated as being "undeniable" but nobody can show a real one, or the schematics of one, or can say how these things could be plausible when so many scientific studies about diesel and sane automobile mechanics will tell you that they're impossible.

Maybe you can go out and find those vast mass graves without the remains of tens of thousands of dead at Treblinka in that ground that hasn't been dug up since the last Ice Age?

Have a whole list of things like this.... read through the thread, and come up with something other than broad-sweeping generalisations that are logical fallacies such as the "historicity of such-and-such event is undeniable". A very big part of the holocaust myth is very much deniable, and the evidence is exceedingly thin on the ground to prove otherwise.

Didn't you know that after the war, at the behest of the Israeli government ( about the same time that the Israelis used their clout on a nation weakened by war and it's aftermath to have laws passed that would imprison anyone denying the holocaust: the death penalty failed but the prison sentence stood) Germany destroyed all of these horrible deadly vans. That's why you cannot find one. Not that they didn't exist.

For years the messerschmitt was the favorite at many air shows but the last one crashed years ago and they are extinct. In America thousands of WW2 aircraft still exist. There are field of them in mothball somewhere. Why not Germany. They were a symbol of German might and had to be destroyed. The zionist Jews wanted to ethnically cleanse the world of all German blood but it met with the same problems that Hitler had with Jewish blood. Too much had been passed around. Too much intermarriages and such. Even Hitler was reputed to have a modicum of Jewish blood.

So ethnic cleansing was a failure before it even started ..that is if it did start at all. We only have the Jews word on that.

 

[Lovelynice]

Germany destroyed all of these horrible deadly vans. That's why you cannot find one. Not that they didn't exist.

Nice theory, but it doesn't hold water. The things were scientifically and mechanically IMPOSSIBLE - that's why they NEVER EXISTED. Just like the "Diesel Gas Chambers" at the Aktion Reinhardt camps. Equally impossible and equally a fairytale myth.

Not a single one of their proponents has been able show otherwise.

 

[phrodeau]

http://www.deathcamps.org/gas_chambers/gas_chambers_vans.html

 

[unculbact]

http://www.deathcamps.org/gas_chambers/gas_chambers_vans.html

Yeah, I reference this site a lot, since it pretty well admits the technical impossibility of gas vans.

Not to mention the contradiction between the first and second paragraphs!

The first paragraph claims that Himmler was horrified by mass executions in Minsk, and that it was then that he ordered the development of alternative murder technology. Doesn't give a date, but Minsk was captured by the Wehrmacht in July of 1941.

Yet in the second paragraph, it claims that gas trailers were already in use in late 1939 in Poland, at least a year and a half before Minsk was captured.

Nazi time machines?
-----------------
There's this little gem:

"Piaskowski was an experienced driver. He declared later that he has never seen the motor of this type. "The motor was a bit odd". "It was enormous"."

The engine compartment of any vehicle is designed to fit a certain type of engine. You can't retrofit a bigger or smaller engine into a road vehicle. People who make funny cars for the NASCAR circuit do so by practically tearing the engine compartment apart, AND totally rebuilding the transmission, and the vehicle they create is good only for drag racing, it would never stand up to road use. This testimony doesn't make a lot of sense.

"The most interesting in his report is the description of the exhaust system. He has noticed that the exhaust pipe was divided into three parts. First and third were done of metal as in normal cars. But, the central part was done of the elastic, "hydraulic" pipe which could joint both standard tubes or could be screwed to the hole in the van's floor."

This presents the problem of the thermal properties of rubber hoses, which I've already covered.

After the repair of the cooler, when the motor was tested, so much exhaust fumes were produced that the air in the garage (size 30 m x 12 m) started immediately to be blue. The German bosses ordered to open all windows and doors. The workers who spent a very short time in the polluted air have got headache.

Then, as now when a vehicle is serviced in a garage, a pipe is connected to the exhaust system that routes the exhaust either into a vent at the top of the building, or down a drain in the floor, where it condenses into a grease pit. Why would they test the engine, in a fully equipped repair garage attached to an auto factory, in the middle of winter with the windows and doors closed, without taking the usual precautions? After all, Piaskowski "was an experienced driver!"

The witness heard later their comments that the motor of this car uses 75 liters of petrol per 100 km, so twice more than normal motors do.

The biggest vans were alleged to be Saurer trucks. Saurer stopped making petrol powered vans in 1912, concentrating exclusively on diesel power plants, so the engine would have used no petrol.

And, even if petrol, the high fuel consumption doesn't make any sense. The amount of carbon monoxide that an engine produces has nothing to do with how fast it's run, and little to do with how much fuel it consumes. It has to do with how hard you CHOKE it.

Assuming a petrol, not diesel, engine, to create the maximum amount of CO, you want the minimum amount of air that can be used and still keep the engine running, in otherwords a very low air/fuel ratio. Beyond a low initial point, gas consumption is irrelevant, you can create enough CO to kill dozens of people using the exhaust from your lawn mower.

Running an engine at high speed, by the way, means combustion is more complete, and less CO is produced. CO is best produced when the engine is at idle. Back then, the choke was manual, not automatic, controlled with a knob on the control panel, so there was no reason to adjust the fuel system at the engine to create CO.

Another ingenious technical description:

The only (but important) difference is the description of the connection of elastic pipe with the hole in the car's floor. According to Falborski (who made even a picture) they were joint by two fasteners tightened by four screws. It seems that this connection was permanent, quite difficult to change and only optionally substituted by the standard connection of both metal parts of the exhaust pipe as in normal cars.

So, after loading the people in, some poor slob is supposed to scoot under the truck, unscrew the rubber connection to the exhaust train, and route it into the joint in the bottom of the truck. There's an upscale career for you! Besides all the time this would take, have you ever noticed what happens to screws in the exhaust system? Like those on your muffler?

While there have been improvements since 1970 in screws that resist thermal oxidation, it's still the rule that screws in the exhaust system swiftly rust. Heat rusts metal just as quickly and efficiently as water. That's why, when you go Midas to have your muffler replaced, they torch the muffler out, along with the first few feet of the exhaust pipe. Having a movable joint in the exhaust pipe that depends on screws is just impossible! In a few DAYS the screws will rust into and become part of the joint.

It's also unnecessary. A perfectly hermetic seal could have been made at the joint by the simpler use of a hose clamp, the same kind as those used on radiator hoses. Since they are not part and parcel of the pipe system, they don't rust from heat. Why would anybody choose such a complicated and unwieldy system of jointing the hoses? A good clue that whoever wrote this article was technically illiterate, they should have consulted an auto mechanic.

AND - why the hole in the bottom of the truck? In refrigerated or heated vans, both now and then, gas circulation is achieved by inlets at the top or side of the van with perfect efficiency. Note that the air conditioner on your city bus is on TOP of the bus. A hole at the BOTTOM of the truck would be subject to mud and dirt that would score or plug it, water that would rust it, and if the truck bottoms out - very likely on the unpaved backroads of Mother Russia - it would be damaged. Again, this article was not written by anybody with even a cursory knowledge of auto mechanics.
---------------------------------
Note the disclaimer at the bottom of the article:

The pictures of Diamond, Opel, Saurer and gas trailer are not original. They shall just show the possible appearance.

In otherwords, having no pictures of a Nazi gas van, they padded out their article with pictures of what they MIGHT have looked like. Of course, if you miss the fine print of that disclaimer, you might think that they had published a picture of the real thing.

Shouldn't that disclaimer be at the TOP of the article?

Another misleading picture, linked in the article:

http://www.deathcamps.org/gas_chambers/pic/gasvan01.jpg

This shows you the interior of a truck, without ever claiming that it's the interior of a gas van. In fact, that interior doesn't match the descriptions of the testimonies, there is no hole in the floor, and no sliding rack to bring out the victims.

So...Irrelevant photos and technically illiterate testimony. I wonder how well the authors would stand up under cross-examination.

 

[krastner]

Nice theory, but it doesn't hold water. The things were scientifically and mechanically IMPOSSIBLE - that's why they NEVER EXISTED. Just like the "Diesel Gas Chambers" at the Aktion Reinhardt camps. Equally impossible and equally a fairytale myth.

Not a single one of their proponents has been able show otherwise.

Hey now..I actually saw a picture once of a van that the caption under it said that it was a death van...Actually ...now that you mention it ...it did look the same as lot's of vans of the time..kinda like the hole..you know the ones the Jewish leadership dug for themselves when the thought up the big lie...

 

[phrodeau]

(edited)
-----------------
There's this little gem:

The engine compartment of any vehicle is designed to fit a certain type of engine. You can't retrofit a bigger or smaller engine into a road vehicle. People who make funny cars for the NASCAR circuit do so by practically tearing the engine compartment apart, AND totally rebuilding the transmission, and the vehicle they create is good only for drag racing, it would never stand up to road use. This testimony doesn't make a lot of sense.

You don't know old trucks, do you? I've stood inside the engine compartment of a pickup truck with both feet on the ground to work on them. They used to have lots of room inside.

Oh, but I don't have any pictures of me standing in an engine compartment; sorry.

Assuming a petrol, not diesel, engine, to create the maximum amount of CO, you want the minimum amount of air that can be used and still keep the engine running, in otherwords a very low air/fuel ratio. Beyond a low initial point, gas consumption is irrelevant, you can create enough CO to kill dozens of people using the exhaust from your lawn mower.

Again, read the article. The CO gas was provided from gas cylinders.

 

[Clea]

You insult the memory of the dead, it is as simple as that.

Millions of people die in the most horrific war the world has ever seen and you use it as an oppertunity to sling shit at Israel

it is truely pathetic

As for the impossibility of gas vans, could you possibly be grasping at any thinner straws? Your argument doesnt even make sense, why would the executions have been done in the engine comparment, trucks have cargo compartments do they not? Prehaps I misread, but your ignorance detracts from your "argument"

Im a libertarian, I believe in the right to free speech and Ill defend that right against any encroachment upon it, but what you are saying is indefencible and FUCKING STUPID

it as a testament to your downright blockheaded IGNORANCE that you can even begin to question the holocaust, sure enough we cannot take everything we are told at face value. Prehaps you would argue it did not happen because YOU did not see it, as a child would, but i did not personally see the attacks on the world trade centre 5 years ago, does this mean they did not happen?

NO
IT
DOES
NOT

Why? Because people SAW it happen people SURVIVED it as people SAW and SURVIVED the holocaust.

As for the notion of a "world jewish conspiracy" I cannot help but find this faintly rediculous and, yet again, as I have seen from so much I what I could stand to read of what you have written, testament to what can only be described as your IGNORANCE

Retort, as I am sure you will, with the words of David Irving, but the overwheling body of evidence, as well as Irving peers and anyone with any true knowlege of the subject accepts, Irvings works are largely conjecture, speculation and the "evidence" he provide was largely falsified by Irving himself.

This is not Orwell's 1984, what we know of the past cannot be changed merely by changing the evidence.

On the other hand, this is not 1984, you are entitle to your own opinion, rediculous as it may be, and I cannot challenge that.

However, do not try to dress it up in fact, you will not find enough to avoid being made a fool.

 

[Clea]

Fuck it I believe in free speech, but that doenst mean I have too listen to you (yeah im aware you havent replied yet, i just ant be assed to listen to whatever shit youll enevitably come out with)

Can you say

"IGNORE"

I doubt it you probably think its a Jewish conspiracy

you tit

 

[Lovelynice]

As for the impossibility of gas vans, could you possibly be grasping at any thinner straws? Your argument doesnt even make sense, why would the executions have been done in the engine comparment, trucks have cargo compartments do they not?

Doesn't change the reality that diesel fumes can't kill in the way described, or that the gas vans would blow up all over the countryside first.

Prehaps I misread,

You've definitely misread if you can't understand why the gas vans are impossible to work in the way that they are described.

This is not Orwell's 1984, what we know of the past cannot be changed merely by changing the evidence.

No one can change the evidence, and it's the evidence and the scientific study of it which is starting to refute many of the old claims about the holocaust. There were no giant mass graves fuilled with the remeains of thousands of victims at Treblinka - nobody can find them, they don't exist. The gas vans are impossible. The diesel gas chambers impossible. The evidence hasn't changed, it's the old stories and lies that weren't based any evidence except hearsay and propaganda which are being questioned.

 

[Lovelynice]

Oh, but I don't have any pictures of me standing in an engine compartment; sorry.Again, read the article. The CO gas was provided from gas cylinders.

That's changing the story then.

None of the "eyewitness testimonies" make that assertion about the gas vans. NONE. I've read them all.

 

[Anachron]

Who cares about the design of 1940s Diesel vans? What the hell does that have to do with the Holocaust?

First, any petrol-fired internal combustion engine can produce enough CO gas to kill someone. If a dozen people were locked up in a garage with a Prius idling, it would produce enough CO to kill. Might take awhile, but it doesn't take a very high concentration to bond to hemoglobin and cause anoxia.

Second, the Holocaust wasn't carried out with portable vans...they shipped the Jews TO the concentration camps, not the other way 'round.

 

[2ndSight]

First, any petrol-fired internal combustion engine can produce enough CO gas to kill someone.

Diesel engines can't.

They produce hardly any CO at all. I remember reading a study on it where they couldn't even kill badgers and rabbits with the exhaust from a Diesel engine.

 

[unculbact]

Second, the Holocaust wasn't carried out with portable vans...they shipped the Jews TO the concentration camps, not the other way 'round.

The story is that on the Eastern Front, the Einstatzgruppen relied on gas vans to do their work in the heart of Mother Russia.

And, of the four Operation Reinhardt camps, the camp at Chelmno supposedly used gas vans as the exclusive method of execution.

 

[hunterwren]

Why the Holocaust must be questioned?

Because there are a lot of insecure people out there who need to question it because it makes them think that they are intelligent. Pedants.

And to think that they are doing it on a literotica message board.

pathetic.

 

[Lovelynice]

Why the Holocaust must be questioned?

Because there are a lot of insecure people out there who need to question it because it makes them think that they are intelligent. Pedants.

And to think that they are doing it on a literotica message board.

pathetic.

What's pathetic is that in the entire time since May 2004 (a whole two years ago), you've only managed to achieve a mere 18 posts with that alt of yours, and seem to be under the dumb idea that anyone would not notice.