Winter Holiday 2024 Contest Support and Seasonal Story Discussion Thread

[MelissaBaby]

Most of your votes are coming from the standard selection process anyway, where all that information is included. They get more than the average attention because they have top billing on those lists, and are thus more likely to remain on the list without getting pushed off by new releases for extra days as well.

The contest page only contributes to the longer tail contest stories have. The number of people stumbling upon a subject they don't like on the contest page and down-voting because of it is probably minimal at best. Any depression of scores after the honeymoon period is more likely to be trolling and the few people who use the scale instead of 1 or 5 exclusively. I suspect more people lean toward the latter in contests than on everyday releases.

All true, but my point was not in reference to scoring, but pointing out a means by which it would be easier for readers to find the stories they are most likely to be interested it reading. The official list only gives title and author, the tag list includes the category and description.

 

[sinfantasy]

If everyone would just tag their stories "Winter Holidays 2024", readers would be able to click the tag and get all the stories, with the info including category.

It's difficult to see how well your story is doing compared to other stories if you don't add the contest tag. But from another perspective, it would also help to hide from trolls and 1 bombers. On my part, I simply forgot to add the contest tag as it was not explicitly asked in the contest rules.


Congratulations to the winners. It was fun to participate and a good learning experience.

 

[AtlantisGuy]

Readers unwillingly exploring categories they don't usually read (and may find offensive) are probably more likely to down-vote if they vote at all. If you care about the score on your contest story, then it might be a good idea to avoid the more polarizing categories: I/T, GM, and NC/R come to mind.

I hope this doesn't come off as being self-absorbed and -congratulatory, but I wanted to chime in here. A major reason I had for not believing my story had a prayer of winning is that I thought a story about two straight guys stumbling into gay sex would be off-putting to the general readership here. There are all kinds of different story categories, but nearly all of them relate to some version of straight sex. I was afraid most guys in particular would look at my story and nope right out of there (or worse, start sending hate mail). And the "1 trolls" have certainly been at it since the announcement--my story went from a winning score of 4.91 to a current score 4.71 in the span of 24-hours. That said, I've genuinely been touched by the feedback that's come in since the contest that folks really liked my story, even if man-man sex wasn't their thing. So I guess you clearly can win with a niche story, but I think the general observation about non-polarizing categories having a better chance at winning still holds.

 

[Dubinsky]

And the "1 trolls" have certainly been at it since the announcement--my story went from a winning score of 4.91 to a current score 4.71 in the span of 24-hours.

That is not uncommon at all, no matter what the category or subject matter. It's really amazing.

 

[NotWise]

I hope this doesn't come off as being self-absorbed and -congratulatory, but I wanted to chime in here. A major reason I had for not believing my story had a prayer of winning is that I thought a story about two straight guys stumbling into gay sex would be off-putting to the general readership here. There are all kinds of different story categories, but nearly all of them relate to some version of straight sex. I was afraid most guys in particular would look at my story and nope right out of there (or worse, start sending hate mail). And the "1 trolls" have certainly been at it since the announcement--my story went from a winning score of 4.91 to a current score 4.71 in the span of 24-hours. That said, I've genuinely been touched by the feedback that's come in since the contest that folks really liked my story, even if man-man sex wasn't their thing. So I guess you clearly can win with a niche story, but I think the general observation about non-polarizing categories having a better chance at winning still holds.

Yours isn't the only GM story I've seen win. I came in 3rd in the 2017 Valentine's contest behind a GM Romance. The author originally posted it to Romance, where the readers brutalized it, and Laurel moved it to GM. Then it didn't have a lot of votes when the sweeps hit. His story went from the middle ground to 4.9+ and knocked my story to 3rd. Like yours, his story was immediately voted back into the 4.7s, where it was when I last checked.

By all accounts, it was a very good story, but the standing in the contest was created by the sweeps, not by the readers. It's hard to count on the sweeps helping that much.

There were similar circumstances for the only SF/F story I've seen win. It had very few votes (usual for SF/F), then the sweeps put it in first place with the bare minimum number of votes needed to qualify. There were protests. I think it was in the 4.6s the last time I checked.

I've also seen I/T stores win, even when I thought that was impossible. LC did it fairly recently. Aside from being a very good writer, LC has 24,000 followers, and probably even more readers who recognize his name.

For the rest of us, I/T isn't a very good bet. NC/R might be the worst bet.

 

[RejectReality]

Your scores are almost always going to decline after a win. Yes, there are going to be some jealous people and some trolls putting their 1-bombs back on there, but you're getting some heavy exposure as well. With that exposure is going to come people who like it, but don't love it.

( Same applies to the toplists, BTW )

Keep in mind that when you're above 4.0, anything but a five decreases your score.

 

[ShelbyDawn57]

I hope this doesn't come off as being self-absorbed and -congratulatory, but I wanted to chime in here. A major reason I had for not believing my story had a prayer of winning is that I thought a story about two straight guys stumbling into gay sex would be off-putting to the general readership here. There are all kinds of different story categories, but nearly all of them relate to some version of straight sex. I was afraid most guys in particular would look at my story and nope right out of there (or worse, start sending hate mail). And the "1 trolls" have certainly been at it since the announcement--my story went from a winning score of 4.91 to a current score 4.71 in the span of 24-hours. That said, I've genuinely been touched by the feedback that's come in since the contest that folks really liked my story, even if man-man sex wasn't their thing. So I guess you clearly can win with a niche story, but I think the general observation about non-polarizing categories having a better chance at winning still holds.

Some people here just hate winners. Stories winning in the 4.9s then dropping to the 4.7s is not unusual. The ones I've known about usually recover over time. Sometimes as a result of another sweep, other times just because they're good stories and the trolls forget about them. Congrats again on your win.

If I can suggest, please add a link to your story page in your signature to make it easier for lazy people like me to to find your stories.


EDIT: I found it anyway and am so glad I did. That is an amazing story; great idea well executed, hot, sexy, raw... Damn. You earned my five stars. I can see why you won.

 

[AtlantisGuy]

Thanks for the kudos!

Folks are bringing up interesting points. I think one potential advantage of the really niche categories can be a high sense of solidarity, support, and excitement among the readership... i.e. smaller numbers but die hard enthusiasm. Maybe that's a situation that may benefit from sweeps? I'm gratified that since my story was the top tier of scores before the final sweeps, I don't think it necessarily looked suspicious... but yeah, the sweeps certainly changed things up. FWIW, it's curious that there isn't really a bi category.

And I think (hope) I've updated my signature. Still new here as an author (although a long-time reader), so I'm still trying to get the lay of the land. Thanks again!

(edit: if I may be so bold, my story "Matt and Jason" has easily been the biggest fan favorite here abouts...)

https://www.literotica.com/authors/AtlantisGuy/works/stories

 

[redgarters]

FWIW, it's curious that there isn't really a bi category.

This
A bi category would be sweet

 

[NotWise]

Thanks for the kudos!

Folks are bringing up interesting points. I think one potential advantage of the really niche categories can be a high sense of solidarity, support, and excitement among the readership... i.e. smaller numbers but die hard enthusiasm.

Romance is the source of a lot of winners. Outside of contests, it's a niche category as you describe. Inside of contests, there aren't a lot of people who hate on Romances (some are bored by slow development).

 

[NotWise]

This
A bi category would be sweet

People have been asking for a bi category for years.

 

[forgotmyantidepressants]

Congrats to all the winners. There were some really great stories. I have been humbled.

 

[Rustyoznail]

People have been asking for a bi category for years.

People have been asking for all sorts of different categories for years...

I doubt they'll change.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Any depression of scores after the honeymoon period is more likely to be trolling and the few people who use the scale instead of 1 or 5 exclusively. I suspect more people lean toward the latter in contests than on everyday releases.

One of things I noticed in the few contests I've entered (not many, because I can't handle deadlines when I don't need to) is that the story would run as any other story would while it was on its category front page. But when it fell off the category page, the votes would keep coming in, at a slower rate, but the score would inevitably drop.

I put that down to folk wandering into the story from the contest pages, wandering into unfamiliar categories, and down-rating what they didn't like so much. Or as you say, using the scale rather than the extremes. It got to the point where the extra traffic became a penalty, score wise, which became another reason not to bother with contests.

 

[RejectReality]

One of things I noticed in the few contests I've entered (not many, because I can't handle deadlines when I don't need to) is that the story would run as any other story would while it was on its category front page. But when it fell off the category page, the votes would keep coming in, at a slower rate, but the score would inevitably drop.

I put that down to folk wandering into the story from the contest pages, wandering into unfamiliar categories, and down-rating what they didn't like so much. Or as you say, using the scale rather than the extremes. It got to the point where the extra traffic became a penalty, score wise, which became another reason not to bother with contests.

Most of that 11th hour stuff is authors/fans trying to improve the position of themselves or their favorites. Especially the truly 11th hour stuff the last 24 hours before the announcement is scheduled. I have a strong suspicion that the bulk of the votes swept come from that period of time.

Which means they end up amounting to jack-squat. LOL

The boost in exposure for simply entering is hard to ignore. That goes doubly true for newer authors. Your fortunes can rise tremendously without ever getting near the winner's circle. Even once you're established, it's a great way to put yourself in front of new readers.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Most of that 11th hour stuff is authors/fans trying to improve the position of themselves or their favorites. Especially the truly 11th hour stuff the last 24 hours before the announcement is scheduled. I have a strong suspicion that the bulk of the votes swept come from that period of time.

I agree with you there, it's where my idea of "not so helpful fans" comes from.

I'm less convinced about the kick up in readers from contests though, although to be fair, I stopped entering contests a long time ago, so behaviour might well have changed over time. I saw some, but nothing to write home about.

 

[NotWise]

I agree with you there, it's where my idea of "not so helpful fans" comes from.

I'm less convinced about the kick up in readers from contests though, although to be fair, I stopped entering contests a long time ago, so behaviour might well have changed over time. I saw some, but nothing to write home about.

For most of my stories, I've used a numerical model to break down the relative contribution to views from the new list and category page (can't distinguish between those two), the contest page, and long-term post-contest views.

The result varies with the size of the category, but even in a heavily-read category like I/T the contest can be 50% of the views from the new list. In a lightly-read category like Romance, the contest can give you twice as many views as the new list.

My current contest story hasn't been up long enough to use the model, but eye-balling the curve for views over time, I'd say the contest produced at least 12,000 views, and the New list and I/T page produced about 27,000. The contest page is still up, so the contest count will go up.


.

 

[MelissaBaby]

For most of my stories, I've used a numerical model to break down the relative contribution to views from the new list and category page (can't distinguish between those two), the contest page, and long-term post-contest views.

The result varies with the size of the category, but even in a heavily-read category like I/T the contest can be 50% of the views from the new list. In a lightly-read category like Romance, the contest can give you twice as many views as the new list.

My current contest story hasn't been up long enough to use the model, but eye-balling the curve for views over time, I'd say the contest produced at least 12,000 views, and the New list and I/T page produced about 27,000. The contest page is still up, so the contest count will go up.


.

And the bonanza if you win is huge. My winning Christmas story from last year has more than twice as many views as any of my other stories.

 

[NotWise]

And the bonanza if you win is huge. My winning Christmas story from last year has more than twice as many views as any of my other stories.

My Romance that placed in a contest has three times the views of my next-most-popular story in Romance. That isn't all directly from the contest, though. The contest story was on the first page of the most popular romance stories for several years.

 

[Voboy]

I can see I'm just going to have to put an end to this whining by killing you again, Voboy! A glorious death awaits you should you be so daring as to volunteer again! You CAN be part of a winning story. Just, mine, all mine!!!!! But I will credit you!!!!

The last time, IIRC, was pretty graphic.

 

[RejectReality]

Can't compare my Nude Day win directly, because Les didn't have any stories in the Mature category. It's also significantly longer than most of my Mature stories as RR. It's also multi-partner, which I would have previously placed in Group Sex. I amended that personal rule with this story, as I was leaving too much on the table.

I can say it accumulated views far more quickly than usual for me in the category. It's north of 100k already, which is double what I'd expect in this amount of time for a typical, well-performing story. 1.5k votes, but that's not uncommon for me ( as RR anyway ) in this sort of time frame. It's a very good performance, but not anything that shocks me. Score is still north of 4.8, which is rare for me. I typically hit the mid 4.6 to 4.7 range in Mature. The length probably contributes to that.

My Magic of the Wood stories are a better metric. Those that were entered in and won themed contests have somewhere around 2.5x the views and 2x the votes of other installments in the series.

 

[AtlantisGuy]

In terms of comparisons, when the contest was called my story stood at 4.91 rating, 354 votes and 23K views. As of now it is at 4.73 rating, 412 votes and 33K views. So the rating has jumped around, but the big boost was in terms of readers, at least many of whom I suspect didn't know me or were not regular readers of GM stories. A big boost, but at the moment that would put it around #8 of my top 10 stories, although it might have longer legs. For a hot second the story led the Hall of Fame, but now is completely off the list... so I suspect most readers coming to it now will have been brought in from the contest page specifically and not any of the other usual ways. All in all, I'm thrilled... and especially happy if my story (or stories) can reach a broader audience.

I will say, I started posting stories about 9 months ago, so I don't have a lengthy record to draw from, or a great deal of experience/understanding of how to maximize readership. When I started, I worked like a demon to deliberately post stories to keep my name in the churn so to speak, to keep on the "new" list, popular authors list, and recently read list, etc., anything to keep my name in front of folks. My third story (my previously mentioned Matt and Jason) was a multiparter that broke through... despite the anticipated attrition that multi-part stories seem to face as they go on, M&J's finale ended up being my highest rated story, with a 4.97 rating that landed me on the top spot of the Hall of Fame. That seemed to be the biggest driver of traffic to my stories, not just boosting that specific chapter but giving a huge boost to earlier chapters. It stayed there for most of the summer, and a couple more stories cracked the top 10, but then the reaction hit and in the span of a couple of weeks all my stories took a huge ratings dive. I've come to accept that I'll probably never get a top rated story again, but I can't really complain. I've been excited to pick up a great fan base of readers, and I'm having fun doing it.

 

[MelissaBaby]

In terms of comparisons, when the contest was called my story stood at 4.91 rating, 354 votes and 23K views. As of now it is at 4.73 rating, 412 votes and 33K views. So the rating has jumped around, but the big boost was in terms of readers, at least many of whom I suspect didn't know me or were not regular readers of GM stories. A big boost, but at the moment that would put it around #8 of my top 10 stories, although it might have longer legs. For a hot second the story led the Hall of Fame, but now is completely off the list... so I suspect most readers coming to it now will have been brought in from the contest page specifically and not any of the other usual ways. All in all, I'm thrilled... and especially happy if my story (or stories) can reach a broader audience.

I will say, I started posting stories about 9 months ago, so I don't have a lengthy record to draw from, or a great deal of experience/understanding of how to maximize readership. When I started, I worked like a demon to deliberately post stories to keep my name in the churn so to speak, to keep on the "new" list, popular authors list, and recently read list, etc., anything to keep my name in front of folks. My third story (my previously mentioned Matt and Jason) was a multiparter that broke through... despite the anticipated attrition that multi-part stories seem to face as they go on, M&J's finale ended up being my highest rated story, with a 4.97 rating that landed me on the top spot of the Hall of Fame. That seemed to be the biggest driver of traffic to my stories, not just boosting that specific chapter but giving a huge boost to earlier chapters. It stayed there for most of the summer, and a couple more stories cracked the top 10, but then the reaction hit and in the span of a couple of weeks all my stories took a huge ratings dive. I've come to accept that I'll probably never get a top rated story again, but I can't really complain. I've been excited to pick up a great fan base of readers, and I'm having fun doing it.

Your experience is pretty much par for the course. My winning entry took a similar drop, then slowly rose back up.It's rated 4.87 right now, #71 on the Romance Top List.

Your experience with your series is also a common one, as you go along, you shed readers, but keep the most loyal ones, so your scores usually go up.

 

[Actingup]

Your experience is pretty much par for the course. My winning entry took a similar drop, then slowly rose back up.It's rated 4.97 right now, #71 on the Romance Top List.

Your experience with your series is also a common one, as you go along, you shed readers, but keep the most loyal ones, so your scores usually go up.

Watching discussions of the Ionosphere from the Troposphere...

 

[AlexFourways]

Also, I did wanna ask about that: how often is too often to submit stories if you want to be sure they get read and noticed?

I've seen on other websites that if someone posts a lot of posts in succession then posts tend to drown each other out, and I'd like to not shoot myself in the foot here.

On frequency. If you consider I have been here just over a year and have 50 stories then it implies I did a lot of one a week (I did). (The following proof reader advice I have learnt more recently).
I didn't get complaints. But possibly try to be a bit slower than that. (The story stays [NEW] for a week)
Top tip, get a proof reader, or at very least use a screen reader (ideally both so your proof/beta reader isn't having to correct 'whist' to 'whilst' and so can help more with dialouge and other things).
Also no point publishing once a week for 6 months and then once a month for 6 months and then once a quarter...
Don's my coward's coat YMMV!

OK taytay4eva* - just an update on story frequency - I stumbled across Satsumabook123 who (according to his Bio has been a Member Since 2 years has written 266 stories and has 1,169 followers and, as of time of posting, 5 [NEW] stories! The stories seem to be quite short and of a spread of Categories but not all to my taste, so it won't be 1,170 followers on my account.
So that is between 2.6 and 1.7 stories a week and doesn't seem to have done him any harm!
He doesn't appear, from his stories or comments, have a proof reader and doesn't seem to know that Word can be set to spellcheck English (United Kingdom) rather that (United States) as he states that it changes spellings!

So my Jury is out on the best frequency and content is probably King or Queen or President (according to gender and political system - but never Dictator)

* I have only just seen the clue that you are a Discworld reader and TP's advice on narrative causality and letting the characters decide on the story with the author just keeping up, have been influential on my works.