How and why women Kill vs How and why men do!

[NoTalentHack]

Murders committed by women with guns are only 32% (which is the highest percentage), but a woman beating a man to death is higher than the reverse, which amazes me. But, in truth, when you disable a big man with a bat, club, nightstick, or two-by-four, with a hard blow to the head or lower leg, you do what you want to them. And if he repeatedly beat the shit out of her, she's only returning the favor.

That’s not what the stats there say. They don’t break out victims; they only say that a woman is more likely to kill with their hands than a man, not that they’re more likely to kill men. There may be separate statistics for that, though.

 

[MillieDynamite]

That was what I meant: they were more likely to kill others with stabbing or beating than a man. But still, once disabled, anyone can be beaten to death without breaking a fingernail. In one of the reports, I read that women were more likely to clean the scene better than men. However, if he or she cleans it well enough, no evidence remains, which makes that killing fall into the unsolved category. Then again, only 58% of homicides end in someone being identified as the murderer. Or, rather, the murder being cleared.



Meaning of non-negligent in English is not caused by or guilty of negligence (= the fact of not giving enough care or attention to people or things that are your responsibility): The driver who struck and killed the pedestrian was charged with nonnegligent manslaughter.

 

[MillieDynamite]

My Mum says I have to go back to bed now. I hate being sick. It's embarrassing for one's mother to order her back to bed when she's 35 years old.

 

[NoTalentHack]

My Mum says I have to go back to bed now. I hate being sick. It's embarrassing for one's mother to order her back to bed when she's 35 years old.

Feel better. My whole household was struck down by this year’s flu variant last week, and it was miserable.

 

[HordHolm]

Actual facts don't support your conclusion.

When Women Kill Their Partners


MEN, WOMEN, AND MURDER



How Women Kill
View attachment 2484648

From Motive to Method, Women and Men Murder Very Differently

One small thing with those stats - if you're setting a story outside gun-legal countries (though I expect you are looking at the US as your location) then things like knife/blunt object will see a big leap in incidence, diminishing the place of (though not completely replacing) the gun.

 

[HordHolm]

Murders committed by women with guns are only 32% (which is the highest percentage), but a woman beating a man to death is higher than the reverse, which amazes me. But, in truth, when you disable a big man with a bat, club, nightstick, or two-by-four, with a hard blow to the head or lower leg, you do what you want to them. And if he repeatedly beat the shit out of her, she's only returning the favor.

My wife promises me that if she ever decides to murder me it will be with her acacia-wood rolling pin

There's also this case from the UK - https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-somerset-59096177

It seems to back up the 'whatever to hand' thesis as the row leading to the murder began over dinner and she used a kitchen knife - presumably she had to do little more than stand and open a drawer, and she had her weapon. When you think of the lethal weapons lurking in every kitchen it reassures me that so many people don't resort to murder despite having the means to hand.

 

[BobbyBrandt]

These statistics are interesting, but boring.

I try to be more creative if someone in one of my stories kills someone, usually in retribution or as a preemptive move. Here are a few ways this has played out in my stories:

Murder by man: Dangled the person from a bridge (think bungee jumping) over a railroad crossing and waiting for the next train to finish them off.
Murder by man: Drop unconscious drunken victim into a rock crusher at a quarry and the turn it on and walk away.
Murder by man: Place bound body in a cardboard box into a crematorium incinerator and light it up
Murder by woman: Three perfectly placed bullets into the victim's groin.
Murder by man: Seal victims into a building and use the exhaust from a vehicle piped through a hose into the building to asphyxiate them with carbon monoxide gas.

 

[FidelityBoss]

How and why women Kill vs How and why men do!

How murders committed by women are, in descending order, for murder in general (that is, not serial killings).

Sharp objects to kill, suffocation, poisoning, bring up the bottom, shooting. Most often, the victim is dispatched in their home or their killer’s home.

How murders are committed by men, in descending order, for murder in general (same as above, not including serial murders).

Men more often use blunt objects or firearms to kill their victims, and surprisingly, poison is used by men more often than by women. But the stereotype, you scream, ain’t true!

As to the why…

In general, female killers, unlike their male counterparts, aren’t members of an aggressive, antisocial lifestyle. Generally, women were more reactive than men in their violent acts, much of the time killing someone they had previously been victimized by. Not necessarily the only motive, though. Shockingly, often, revenge wasn’t the motive at all but financial gain.

In addition, much of the time, both the victim and perpetrator were intoxicated.

When women kill for profit, you know, life insurance, the family wealth, it is either disguised as natural causes, an accident, or an act of violence by apparently someone outside the home or circle of friends. Hired killers may or may not be used.

The killing of a woman by a stranger was rare (RR = 0.18). More than twice as many women were shot and killed by their husbands or intimate acquaintances than were murdered by strangers using guns, knives, or any other means. Although women comprise more than half the U.S. population, they committed only 14.7% of the homicides. Well, that we know of!

The killing of a child by either parent is an act of despair and desperation — a reaction to an intolerable situation. Most often, they are suffocated in their sleep.

It is believed women are more organized in their killings than men. If they are, it becomes harder to determine how many victims a woman might’ve killed. In fact, with certain poisons, it might never be proved a death was murder.

Okay, what do you folks think?

Pretty fascinating stuff! The fact that women are more likely to kill for financial gain while men go for brute force tracks, but the poison stereotype getting debunked is a surprise. Also, the idea that some murders might never be detected because of how organized women can be? That’s lowkey terrifying.

 

[MillieDynamite]

Yes, all my research, other than the 20-year study in Sweden, was based on one FBI study or another.

One small thing with those stats - if you're setting a story outside gun-legal countries (though I expect you are looking at the US as your location) then things like knife/blunt object will see a big leap in incidence, diminishing the place of (though not completely replacing) the gun.

A rolling pin or butcher's knife works rather well. Not that I've done that.

My wife promises me that if she ever decides to murder me it will be with her acacia-wood rolling pin

There's also this case from the UK - https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-somerset-59096177

It seems to back up the 'whatever to hand' thesis as the row leading to the murder began over dinner and she used a kitchen knife - presumably she had to do little more than stand and open a drawer, and she had her weapon. When you think of the lethal weapons lurking in every kitchen it reassures me that so many people don't resort to murder despite having the means to hand.

 

[MillieDynamite]

In Greed in Golden Valley, Western Adventure author Ron Lewis had one of the killings done via a box of rattlers. The snakes, not the child's toy. But it was a man, not a woman, who planted the treasure box for his suddenly inconvenient co-conspirator.

My wife promises me that if she ever decides to murder me it will be with her acacia-wood rolling pin

There's also this case from the UK - https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-somerset-59096177

It seems to back up the 'whatever to hand' thesis as the row leading to the murder began over dinner and she used a kitchen knife - presumably she had to do little more than stand and open a drawer, and she had her weapon. When you think of the lethal weapons lurking in every kitchen it reassures me that so many people don't resort to murder despite having the means to hand.

 

[MillieDynamite]

It's great fodder for writers. I have a story that I'll probably never finish. In it, two women plot to kill a mutual lover for his money, which they plan to split. But the ending has them sitting across from one another at their months-later celebration, one weary of the almond cookies the other made and the other worrying about the wine the other gave her. Neither wants to sample what the other gave them. It was loosely based on Bound, so the two are lovers. Perhaps I can enter it in the Crime and Punishment Event or the Mickey Spillane Noir Challenge.

Pretty fascinating stuff! The fact that women are more likely to kill for financial gain while men go for brute force tracks, but the poison stereotype getting debunked is a surprise. Also, the idea that some murders might never be detected because of how organized women can be? That’s lowkey terrifying.

 

[Bamagan]

I'm surprised 'For the lolz' didn't make the list. Possibly that means I've been playing too much GTA lately.

 

[gunhilltrain]

It's great fodder for writers. I have a story that I'll probably never finish. In it, two women plot to kill a mutual lover for his money, which they plan to split. But the ending has them sitting across from one another at their months-later celebration, one weary of the almond cookies the other made and the other worrying about the wine the other gave her. Neither wants to sample what the other gave them. It was loosely based on Bound, so the two are lovers. Perhaps I can enter it in the Crime and Punishment Event or the Mickey Spillane Noir Challenge.

Millie, I'm glad to see that you seem to be going through that backlog of unfinished stories you mentioned. I'm not sure I can offer much about your original question. The only character I've ever killed off was from the point-of-view of a passenger in a real train wreck in New Jersey in 1958. It was in the non-erotic category, and it did fit in there.

 

[TheRedChamber]

In one of the reports, I read that women were more likely to clean the scene better than men

Now I'm imagining me as Clyde, my wife as Bonnie, her saying 'you missed a bit' and me replying 'no-one will notice'

 

[gunhilltrain]

Now I'm imagining me as Clyde, my wife as Bonnie, her saying 'you missed a bit' and me replying 'no-one will notice'

I had a crush on Faye Dunaway as Bonnie Parker, but I was too young to see the film and I finally saw it in 1973. Yes, the film was romanticized, but it had an impact anyway. I guess a story could be done about them here, but maybe they're been overexposed over the years. I think I first noted them on the cover of a Time magazine in a doctor's office. It immediately struck me as evocative of the whole time period. "Wow, this lady is driving the getaway car!"

https://api.time.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/bonnie-clyde-time-cover.jpg?quality=75&w=828

Of course, Hollywood can change you from a short redhead to a tall blonde.

https://www.tshaonline.org/images/handbook/entries/PP/parker-bonnie-clyde2.jpg

 

[Belegon]

If I ever kill someone, it will most likely be because I was unarmed and something truly intense happened and I lost my self control and struck them as hard as I could in a vulnerable area instead of striking to disable. Mind ya, I grew up in a place where knowing how to fight was an absolute necessity and in my forties I enhanced that knowledge by becoming a black belt in taekwondo (I'm a third degree Black belt now, and I taught martial arts for a dozen years before my health forced me to quit.) So if I'm ever accused of murder, it will probably be from a beating. I am a gun owner but I have a hard time conceiving of myself ever aiming a firearm at any human with the intent to pull the trigger.

 

[FidelityBoss]

It's great fodder for writers. I have a story that I'll probably never finish. In it, two women plot to kill a mutual lover for his money, which they plan to split. But the ending has them sitting across from one another at their months-later celebration, one weary of the almond cookies the other made and the other worrying about the wine the other gave her. Neither wants to sample what the other gave them. It was loosely based on Bound, so the two are lovers. Perhaps I can enter it in the Crime and Punishment Event or the Mickey Spillane Noir Challenge.

Love this! A simple yet intense way to build suspense. Noir vibes, high stakes, and a bit of elegance, definitely a winning combo. Hope you run with it.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Now I'm imagining me as Clyde, my wife as Bonnie, her saying 'you missed a bit' and me replying 'no-one will notice'

Bonnie had been married to someone else at one time, but I don't think she ever married Clyde. They were criminals, but I loved the idea of riding around Texas, Oklahoma, Missouri, and elsewhere in a Ford V-8 with a gun moll at the wheel, a handgun in her purse (?), and a sub-machine gun in the back somewhere.

Faye Dunaway made that movie what it was. She portrayed the "I'm doing things as I see fit" attitude of Bonnie.

https://thefashioneaste.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/b-c-4.png

 

[Audiflex]

Additional clarification: these are numbers for solved murders. To quote Dolores Claiborne, "An accident is sometimes an unhappy woman's best friend." If you talk to hospice care workers, you'd be amazed how many of them have had the experience of some 80-year-old grandma (or grandpa) confessing to having murdered their spouse and gotten away with it.

A successful, planned murder looks very different from one done in the heat of the moment.

I'd also note that the statistics you quoted are from after widespread no-fault divorce, meaning they came from a time when a woman didn't have to give a reason to get away from a man. Someone who's gotten used to hiding their injuries from neighbors who might try to help (and would most likely only make things worse pre-no-fault) is someone who has the knowledge to make a poisoning, arson, or "accident" look like an actual accident.

Also, according to the second set of statistics, women are more than six times(!) as likely to kill using poison as men.

Wow, this is such a fascinating (and dark) dive into the stats! It’s wild how societal changes, like no-fault divorce, can shift patterns in something as grim as murder methods. And the idea of “accidents” being a cover for deeper issues? Chilling, but it makes sense in context. Poison being a go-to for women is such a specific detail, it really highlights how history, opportunity, and societal pressures all play a role. Thanks for sharing this; it’s a thought-provoking angle!

 

[Zootonius]

My only response is:

Lizzie Borden took an axe,
And gave her mother forty whacks,
When she saw what she had done,
She gave her father forty-one

 

[MillieDynamite]

@Zootonius, there's actually no definitive proof she murdered them. However, one TV movie starring Elizebeth Mongtomery showed how she might have done it. But it would have meant she was one cool cucumber. The order in the film differed (if my memory is correct) that father dearest was first, and her mother was dead before her stepmother got hacked up by a passing stranger. Remember, she was acquitted. As She should've been since she, if she did kill them, literally left no evidence.

However, whether she killed them or not, she was branded a murderess by society because society doesn't have to follow what the law says.

My only response is:

Lizzie Borden took an axe,
And gave her mother forty whacks,
When she saw what she had done,
She gave her father forty-one

 

[MillieDynamite]

Interesting tidbit!

ABC commissioned The Legend of Lizzie Borden (1975), a television film starring Elizabeth Montgomery as Lizzie Borden, Katherine Helmond as Emma Borden, and Fionnula Flanagan as Bridget Sullivan; it was later discovered after Montgomery died that she and Borden were in fact sixth cousins once removed, both descending from 17th century Massachusetts resident John Luther. Rhonda McClure, the genealogist who documented the Montgomery-Borden connection, said: "I wonder how Elizabeth would have felt if she knew she was playing her own cousin."

 

[Tio_Narratore]

Close the door
And lock and latch it;
Here comes Lizzie
With a brand new hatchet!

An interesting thread. Millie. Sorry I can't help much; I mostly deal with the aftereffects. If you have any skeletons in your story closet, feel free to call me.

 

[Zootonius]

@Zootonius, there's actually no definitive proof she murdered them. However, one TV movie starring Elizebeth Mongtomery showed how she might have done it. But it would have meant she was one cool cucumber. The order in the film differed (if my memory is correct) that father dearest was first, and her mother was dead before her stepmother got hacked up by a passing stranger. Remember, she was acquitted. As She should've been since she, if she did kill them, literally left no evidence.

However, whether she killed them or not, she was branded a murderess by society because society doesn't have to follow what the law says.

I remember that movie. And it's true the evidence was lacking, other than she was in the house at the time. Plus, it's hard to believe a woman with a genteel upbringing would use an axe, twice.

(And I violated, 'My only response')

 

[Five_Inch_Heels]

Wonder how long it would take forensics to figure out what made the holes?