I just don't understand women.

[Felix_Jones]

Oh god, I read the whole thing.

That's my relationship penance for the rest of the year, from now on I'm not going to bother. Women don't lie as much, but they change their minds so drastically, and so frequently that they might as well be.

 

[TheOne007]

I've been teased so much in my life that I require a woman to either come right out and say what she wants or kiss me before I take her seriously.

That's a pretty good sentiment! I have to agree!

I've been finding out the three strike rule is currently in effect for my life. I've noticed greater occurrences of the following:

1.) One-sided conversations: A pet peeve that is driving me nuts. I can't stand to run a conversation with little or no input from the opposite person. I find that I'm always starting the conversations. I find that 2-3 words is an acceptable answer (can't stand that). I hate listening to friends complain that their partner/lover/friend/etc doesn't communicate.

2.) I'm not a mind reader: I'm almost 30. I don't know what's going on half the time. I can't figure it out. Tell me what's pissing you off. Tell me honestly why you can't date anymore. I can write a book "Dating Rejections...For Dummies" on the amount of bull rejections I have had in the last few years. Applies to #1.

3.) Too Nice/Being treated terrible: Ok, a happy medium is apparently difficult. I'm finding that my common issue is that I'm "Too Good" "Too Nice" "Too Helpful". However they leave on that issue, only to talk to me a month or so later (still single), claiming the last few guys you dated were 1.) Assholes 2.) Disrespectful 3.) Said they loved you on the first date 4.) Were moving too fast 5.) Rude


All I have to say is I'm out like the fat kid. What's the point anymore? Meeting decent people and dating to me is the most difficult aspect to accomplish in my life. I'd rather have a materialistic bachelor lifestyle than have my mind deteriorate over the lack of conversations and worrying associated with finding someone special.

 

[RedButterflySlut]

I'm going to step in and defend women a little bit, or at least give my point of view.

1.) One-sided conversations: A pet peeve that is driving me nuts. I can't stand to run a conversation with little or no input from the opposite person. I find that I'm always starting the conversations. I find that 2-3 words is an acceptable answer (can't stand that). I hate listening to friends complain that their partner/lover/friend/etc doesn't communicate.

There are a lot of guys that say that girls talk too much. Girls can get the idea in their head that talking too much is a bad thing, and it's better for them to just stay pretty and quiet, that way they can't mess it up. I was once friends with this girl who was AMAZING. She did some of the makeup for Repo! The Genetic Opera, she was a gourmet chef, she knew how to do professional makeup, and when we talked it was an endless discussion on history, philosophy and politics. Girl was smart, funny, educated and pretty.
Then... there was that same girl, around men. Quiet as a mouse. She wasn't shy, she just thought that's what was expected of her. All of my guy friends bitched about how boring she was, and all she could do was repeat a few words back to them. I had a heart-to-heart with her, convinced her to take a chance and open up to guys intellectually and she started dating a new guy in a month. She's still with him.
I don't know how you approach girls, but it doesn't hurt to let them know you genuinely want to know what they say. It sounds basic, but it isn't.

2.) I'm not a mind reader: I'm almost 30. I don't know what's going on half the time. I can't figure it out. Tell me what's pissing you off. Tell me honestly why you can't date anymore. I can write a book "Dating Rejections...For Dummies" on the amount of bull rejections I have had in the last few years. Applies to #1.

I don't disagree with that. I've been rejected for dating so many times that I've stopped trying. It seems better to accept how I'm treated and have fun than suffer constant heartbreak.

3.) Too Nice/Being treated terrible: Ok, a happy medium is apparently difficult. I'm finding that my common issue is that I'm "Too Good" "Too Nice" "Too Helpful". However they leave on that issue, only to talk to me a month or so later (still single), claiming the last few guys you dated were 1.) Assholes 2.) Disrespectful 3.) Said they loved you on the first date 4.) Were moving too fast 5.) Rude

Too nice can simply mean lack of chemistry. Girls love to beat themselves up for not having chemistry with the nice guy, but sometimes it just doesn't happen. It's not that you're too nice or helpful. It's possible that they don't feel the spark, guys do it to girls all the time. They get flighty, they lose interest, they'll view some women as being 'worth the chase' but most girls are demoted to 'if it's easy.'
The other possibility is that they're not ready to be with you. 'Too good' can mean "I'm not ready to make myself a better person."
As far as finding a happy medium, girls have that same problem too. If they're too uptight, they're frigged and uninteresting. If they talk too much, they're blabbermouths that prattle on. They talk too little, they'res nothing for the guy to interact with. They're too sexual, they're sluts. They're not sexual enough, they're boring and not worth spending time on. Girls can get laid easier than guys, but finding a decent relationship is a completely different ballgame.

All I have to say is I'm out like the fat kid. What's the point anymore? Meeting decent people and dating to me is the most difficult aspect to accomplish in my life. I'd rather have a materialistic bachelor lifestyle than have my mind deteriorate over the lack of conversations and worrying associated with finding someone special.

I'm in the same boat as you. I've given up on being the girlfriend. I see no point in it, there's too much worrying about acting the correct image. It's been the most difficult aspect of my life, I think it's hard for most people.

People are messed up. Don't blame the gender.

 

[Miles Long]

Well this thread sure took a turn.

 

[Felix_Jones]

So in easy-to-understand point form:
- Get ready to be rejected by hordes of women, unless you look something like Joel McHale-George Clooney-Jon Hamm or stop trying.
- Even if she kind of seems like she might be interested in something other than a bit of banter she's really not, by the time you recognize this you've already said something to put her off.
- If you do start dating the odds of a freakout and police call which results in your arrest increases exponentially.
- Have fun!

 

[butterfly_flip]

Yeah, and why don't they lose some weight once in a while?

*freakinmahoosivesnortage*

Bad Miles! :caning:

 

[satindesire]

I've been hurt by women and men, but I'm adult enough not to blame one half of the entire population of the planet on a few select individuals.

Anyone who thinks all women are like XYZ, and therefor unworthy of respect, need to grow up.

 

[RedButterflySlut]

So in easy-to-understand point form:
- Get ready to be rejected by hordes of women, unless you look something like Joel McHale-George Clooney-Jon Hamm or stop trying.
- Even if she kind of seems like she might be interested in something other than a bit of banter she's really not, by the time you recognize this you've already said something to put her off.
- If you do start dating the odds of a freakout and police call which results in your arrest increases exponentially.
- Have fun!

Get ready to be rejected by hordes of people. Period. No matter what gender you are, or how you look. Plenty of gorgeous guys get rejected. I dated a male model once, he had an insanely low ego and a lot of problems- he could get girls, but not keep them. Being unattractive isn't going to deny you a relationship but be sure you're not expecting unrealistic things, real life isn't always Family Guy with skinny pretty Louis and awkward Peter. Sometimes you'll see a relationship with a great attractiveness barrier between the two, but it's certainly not a steadfast rule.
Girls find different things attractive. My best friend likes guy-butts. I could care less about guy-butts. I like big shoulders and big guys. Does that mean a guy is disqualified if he isn't big? No.

While it's true girls have an easier time getting laid, they run into the problem of being used for sex by men they care about a lot. There are plenty of men out there that will date any girl in order to say he has a girlfriend, but that doesn't mean there's anything real to it. It doesn't mean he sees her as a person, just a warm pretty body with irrational thoughts, emotions and fears. I'm not saying guys are incapable of seeing women as real, they can, and do, but that's harder to find.

I find the situation in Toronto tragic, but not all girls cry rape or assault on a drop of a hat. Most of us are too afraid of being branded as 'crying wolf' or attention whores.

My point in all this is, rejection sucks but don't think it's confined to one gender. It's human nature to strive for more, and there is no good answer. There's no way to avoid it, except to accept that people just are the way they are. Attraction is complicated. You're complicated. Let it be complicated. Rejection from one or a few girls doesn't mean a thing except for maybe you're looking in the wrong place.


For books on seduction and attraction, read The Mystery Method. It has some valid points of seduction and confidence, even though parts of the book made me mad. Even after I read the book I found the tricks still worked on me, much to my dismay.

Edit: Also
http://xkcd.com/513/

 

[sterculius]

Why do women flirt with a man, get him all interested, then walk away, ignore him completely and flirt with other men?

Are they trying to wind him all up? Are they just flirting for the attention and to make themselves feel good? Do they even care that a man might get his hopes up about actually having a chance with someone for a change, only to realize that these women who flirt with him are just stringing him along?

Ladies, what is up with that?

They do it because they can.

 

[lothwen]

I can't speak for anybody else, but the reason why I flirt with a guy is because I'm "testing the waters" so to speak. I have to figure out if we have a connection, and if we do, then I'll see about taking it further, and if not, then I'll get out of the situation.


What I think is funny is if a man comes up to flirt with me, and I try my hardest to show him I'm not interested (barely speaking to him, one word sentences, closed off body language, walking away from him) and yet he still doesn't get the hint. I've found it a lot easier on myself to just say "Hey, I'm not interested in you, so go find somebody else." Maybe things would be better if we all acted that way.

 

[Noor]

Maybe you are confusing flirt for fun with flirting with intent

 

[Felix_Jones]

Get ready to be rejected by hordes of people. Period. No matter what gender you are, or how you look. Plenty of gorgeous guys get rejected. I dated a male model once, he had an insanely low ego and a lot of problems- he could get girls, but not keep them. Being unattractive isn't going to deny you a relationship but be sure you're not expecting unrealistic things, real life isn't always Family Guy with skinny pretty Louis and awkward Peter. Sometimes you'll see a relationship with a great attractiveness barrier between the two, but it's certainly not a steadfast rule.
Girls find different things attractive. My best friend likes guy-butts. I could care less about guy-butts. I like big shoulders and big guys. Does that mean a guy is disqualified if he isn't big? No.

While it's true girls have an easier time getting laid, they run into the problem of being used for sex by men they care about a lot. There are plenty of men out there that will date any girl in order to say he has a girlfriend, but that doesn't mean there's anything real to it. It doesn't mean he sees her as a person, just a warm pretty body with irrational thoughts, emotions and fears. I'm not saying guys are incapable of seeing women as real, they can, and do, but that's harder to find.

I find the situation in Toronto tragic, but not all girls cry rape or assault on a drop of a hat. Most of us are too afraid of being branded as 'crying wolf' or attention whores.

My point in all this is, rejection sucks but don't think it's confined to one gender. It's human nature to strive for more, and there is no good answer. There's no way to avoid it, except to accept that people just are the way they are. Attraction is complicated. You're complicated. Let it be complicated. Rejection from one or a few girls doesn't mean a thing except for maybe you're looking in the wrong place.


For books on seduction and attraction, read The Mystery Method. It has some valid points of seduction and confidence, even though parts of the book made me mad. Even after I read the book I found the tricks still worked on me, much to my dismay.

Edit: Also
http://xkcd.com/513/

You kind of made my point for me, as in your male model ex-boyfriend could get girls. Keeping them is something altogether different. I neither get nor keep, your friend there's got a full order of magnitude on me.
Yeah, derivative cartoons can't be trusted for life lessons. Although the fat, schlubby guy with hot wife seems to be pretty consistent on sitcoms as well. I have a feeling it's a result of nerdy writers getting some sort of third hand vengeance on all those pretty high school girls they loved and feared at the same time.
Apparently, I'm not one of those guys that needs to date just to say they have a girlfriend, thank fuck. I can only imagine how miserable I'd be making myself having to go around with some equally miserable girl in tow.
Although you're right about one thing, I do see women as hollow, materialistic, irrational. Then again, I also don't believe that estrogenic skin cream with help me get rid of cellulite.

 

[Felix_Jones]

I've been hurt by women and men, but I'm adult enough not to blame one half of the entire population of the planet on a few select individuals.

Anyone who thinks all women are like XYZ, and therefor unworthy of respect, need to grow up.

Bitches ain't shit.

 

[Miles Long]

Part of the fun is figuring a woman out and knowing her better than she knows herself. Part of the fun is that same woman completely throwing you for a loop and you realizing you don't understand women. Part of the fun is the frustration you both find in each other. Part of the fun is getting naked and flopping around together. Yes we are maddeningly frustrating to each other at times, but that's all part of the fun! If we can't handle some ambiguity and ambivalence in ourselves and others, we shouldn't be in relationships.

Also, I love titties.

 

[bailadora]

Although you're right about one thing, I do see women as hollow, materialistic, irrational.

And therein may lie the problem. You do realize you come across as quite the misogynist, don't you? Is that just how you express yourself here or are you this cynical in your every day interactions, as well?

It is unfortunate that there are some people out there who like to play games, but that's not the province of any one gender. There are also people out there who are looking for genuine connections and who try to deal with others as sincerely as possible.

I can't speak for anyone else but from my perspective, I can tell you that I'd not be very motivated to get to know someone who held me accountable for actions or attitudes that are not mine.

Yes we are maddeningly frustrating to each other at times, but that's all part of the fun! If we can't handle some ambiguity and ambivalence in ourselves and others, we shouldn't be in relationships.

Well said! Although, I wouldn't go so far as to say people like this shouldn't be in relationships - just that it might be wise to rethink one's perspective.

 

[Felix_Jones]

And therein may lie the problem. You do realize you come across as quite the misogynist, don't you? Is that just how you express yourself here or are you this cynical in your every day interactions, as well?

It is unfortunate that there are some people out there who like to play games, but that's not the province of any one gender. There are also people out there who are looking for genuine connections and who try to deal with others as sincerely as possible.

I can't speak for anyone else but from my perspective, I can tell you that I'd not be very motivated to get to know someone who held me accountable for actions or attitudes that are not mine.



Well said! Although, I wouldn't go so far as to say people like this shouldn't be in relationships - just that it might be wise to rethink one's perspective.

Oh yeah, I'm fair certain that I do come across this way in meat-space as well. Still, I'm not all that afraid of the misogynist label (although Misogyny is a great song by Rusty), mostly because the consequences are so non-existent. It's not like I try to close down women's health clinics or hold a sign at a pro-life rally. Shit, I don't even vote conservative. Professionally, personally, intellecutally, philosophically, and any other type of adverb I am not beholden to nor do I have to answer to any woman, and very few men. It's more a weary indifference than any overt act on my part. If that lives in the same neighbourhood as misogyny then so be it.

I see your greater point about playing games, but I'm not wired to pursue men. So far the spank bank is populated by women only. It's not men's games that worry me.

 

[bailadora]

Oh yeah, I'm fair certain that I do come across this way in meat-space as well. Still, I'm not all that afraid of the misogynist label (although Misogyny is a great song by Rusty), mostly because the consequences are so non-existent. It's not like I try to close down women's health clinics or hold a sign at a pro-life rally. Shit, I don't even vote conservative. Professionally, personally, intellecutally, philosophically, and any other type of adverb I am not beholden to nor do I have to answer to any woman, and very few men. It's more a weary indifference than any overt act on my part. If that lives in the same neighbourhood as misogyny then so be it.

I see your greater point about playing games, but I'm not wired to pursue men. So far the spank bank is populated by women only. It's not men's games that worry me.

One need not take action against women to be misogynistic. All that is required is a deep dislike or distrust. From the way you portray yourself here, it sounds like you qualify.

As for the consequences of said label - I guess it all depends on perception. My point is that this strong distrust/dislike attitude you exude is likely warning off / turning away women who just might be compatible with you. If you don't stop judging all women by the actions of a few, it's difficult to see how you'd ever form a healthy relationship. What I'm saying is do not judge a woman based upon your preconceived notions of her gender. Judge her on the basis of her character as an individual. Now, if you don't mind remaining single throughout your lifetime, then this paragraph is moot.

Regarding your comment about my observation of game playing: it's difficult for me to tell if you are being facetious or not. If it's the latter, then I disagree that you understand my point at all.

 

[Noor]

I prefer to date men who love women, if I see them being nasty to other women or hear them say so I go the other way.

 

[Felix_Jones]

One need not take action against women to be misogynistic. All that is required is a deep dislike or distrust. From the way you portray yourself here, it sounds like you qualify.

As for the consequences of said label - I guess it all depends on perception. My point is that this strong distrust/dislike attitude you exude is likely warning off / turning away women who just might be compatible with you. If you don't stop judging all women by the actions of a few, it's difficult to see how you'd ever form a healthy relationship. What I'm saying is do not judge a woman based upon your preconceived notions of her gender. Judge her on the basis of her character as an individual. Now, if you don't mind remaining single throughout your lifetime, then this paragraph is moot.

Regarding your comment about my observation of game playing: it's difficult for me to tell if you are being facetious or not. If it's the latter, then I disagree that you understand my point at all.

That's the way it is. I have been and will be single. The longer I do it the better the case for it gets. I work in a very male-dominated industry. It's even industrial so the word really applies, and I see it daily how many life-shattering relationships these people get into. Put on top of that a judiciary eager and willing to super fuck you and it all adds up to a cool disdain for the XXs.

You were trying to say, I think, that men play games with women as well. That women aren't the only ones to blame here, n'est-ce pas? I guess what I was saying was that I don't care, that my sympathies do not lie with them.

 

[bailadora]

You were trying to say, I think, that men play games with women as well. That women aren't the only ones to blame here, n'est-ce pas? I guess what I was saying was that I don't care, that my sympathies do not lie with them.

A rather skewed perspective, in my opinion. But hey - if you're happy with your life and the way people perceive you, who am I to tell you that you're wrong?

 

[satindesire]

That's the way it is. I have been and will be single. The longer I do it the better the case for it gets. I work in a very male-dominated industry. It's even industrial so the word really applies, and I see it daily how many life-shattering relationships these people get into. Put on top of that a judiciary eager and willing to super fuck you and it all adds up to a cool disdain for the XXs.

You were trying to say, I think, that men play games with women as well. That women aren't the only ones to blame here, n'est-ce pas? I guess what I was saying was that I don't care, that my sympathies do not lie with them.

I want you to read this:

http://www.cracked.com/article_1978...r2=Sex&wa_user3=article&wa_user4=trending_now

And think about it and how it described you and your attitude and why you're a misogynist. Maybe it'll shed some light on why you're so hateful and bitter.

 

[saxyman26]

Well this thread sure took a turn.

apparently, it's not all about you!

 

[LucyH]

You know, this kind of thing can be a self fulfilling prophesy.

A sane woman tends to cut and run if she figures out the guy she's flirting with is a misogynist. If you've already decided she's probably a crazy bitch before you even know her, trying to relate to you would be an exercise in frustration. She'd be much better off moving on and finding someone else more pleasant. (Perhaps leaving you wondering why she suddenly seemed to lose interest, and prompting you to post about it on the internet.)

That means that the women who will stick around and try to relate once they figure out how you feel are the off-kilter sorts who think they can fix you, have such low self esteem that they'll put up with all kinds of crap, or are crazy bitches and proud of it. And of course, as you scrape the bottom of the barrel, your prejudices will be reinforced, further reducing the odds that you'll ever be involved with a sane woman, and making single life seem increasingly appealing, by comparison.

 

[Felix_Jones]

I want you to read this:

http://www.cracked.com/article_1978...r2=Sex&wa_user3=article&wa_user4=trending_now

And think about it and how it described you and your attitude and why you're a misogynist. Maybe it'll shed some light on why you're so hateful and bitter.

Belive it or not, I actually read it. Buddy makes some good points, but the whole thing is ridiculously reductive.

My bit of reaction if you care to read it.

#5. We Were Told That Society Owed Us a Hot Girl
I've never believed this. Schlubby, weird-looking, defficient women have been the only ones accessible to me.

#4. We're Trained from Birth to See You as Decoration
100% true. And there's never been, nor will there ever be a shortage of women who will wholeheartedly dive into being treated as decoration.

#3. We Think You're Conspiring With Our Boners to Ruin Us
I'm not a dog, I don't go around humping the furniture. I can control my urges.

#2. We Feel Like Manhood Was Stolen from Us at Some Point
Nah, I'm super manly. I play rugby and I've spent my entire career in heavy industry. I'd have to be a criminal biker or assassin or something to be more manly than this.

#1. We Feel Powerless
Doesn't everybody though? Isn't empowerment an illusion? A story we tell ourselves to avoid the stark realization that the future is vague and uncertain. That we are really dancing to someone else's not very good tune.

For the record I'm fully behind health insurance supplying birth control (free condoms!), and Rush Limbaugh is a fat, ignorant wart on the ass of America. He's another very good reason to hate the wealthy.

 

[satindesire]

Belive it or not, I actually read it. Buddy makes some good points, but the whole thing is ridiculously reductive.

My bit of reaction if you care to read it.

#5. We Were Told That Society Owed Us a Hot Girl
I've never believed this. Schlubby, weird-looking, defficient women have been the only ones accessible to me.

#4. We're Trained from Birth to See You as Decoration
100% true. And there's never been, nor will there ever be a shortage of women who will wholeheartedly dive into being treated as decoration.

#3. We Think You're Conspiring With Our Boners to Ruin Us
I'm not a dog, I don't go around humping the furniture. I can control my urges.

#2. We Feel Like Manhood Was Stolen from Us at Some Point
Nah, I'm super manly. I play rugby and I've spent my entire career in heavy industry. I'd have to be a criminal biker or assassin or something to be more manly than this.

#1. We Feel Powerless
Doesn't everybody though? Isn't empowerment an illusion? A story we tell ourselves to avoid the stark realization that the future is vague and uncertain. That we are really dancing to someone else's not very good tune.

For the record I'm fully behind health insurance supplying birth control (free condoms!), and Rush Limbaugh is a fat, ignorant wart on the ass of America. He's another very good reason to hate the wealthy.

Well, you must be lacking in some specific area, either looks, money, or attitude. I'm guessing attitude, and that's why only "deficient" women are "available" to you.

I know with your attitude, I certainly wouldn't want to date you. You're incredibly bitter, and that's just not cool.

But the part I bolded, you basically proved the article right! You said, "Only ugly girls want me!" And that's the thing, you WANT a hot girl, you don't have one, now you're pissed off because from what I've seen, you have a serious sense of entitlement.

Men aren't just going to be handed a girl. You have to change yourself if you want to be a good partner. What you're doing is a vicious cycle, you're angry that you don't have a good partner, so you become bitter and misogynistic, and because you're bitter and misogynistic, you can't get a good partner.

Break the cycle. Stop hating women. It's really that easy. Once you become a good partner, and put effort into getting a good partner that is -realistic to your own "type" and not a perfect 10 ideal barbie- you'll be surprised how many women out there are single and ready for a relationship.