Is it time also to vote on new moderators?

[JMohegan]

She is a Mod, not God. She doesn't have to behave as a Saint. She is not just a moderator, she is a member with opinions just as every other member here. It's within her right to share opinions without having her service as mod questions when other's do not like or do not agree with her opinion.

Many people on many boards do this same thing: Forget that the member serving as Mod was once just a member like everyone else..... sharing opinions. Soon as the person is a mod and no long just a member like everyone else ... some decide to take it upon themselves to stick them up on some silly pedestal and then scream that the sky is falling if they happen to lean to far to either side. Give me a break......

Just because she doesn't like the way things have changed on the board doesn't mena she doesn't care to continue as mod or that she can't continue to do so as effectively as she always has.

Regardless of what you have voted, your points are weak, in my opinion.
You ready to fill her position here JM?

Click me. That post is the genesis of this thread, as far as I can tell, and it was made in response to the remarks from Catalina that I quoted.

Of course she is entitled to rant. I never said otherwise, or even implied such a thing.

My points were:

1 - Even though she seems unhappy here, she has not asked to be replaced. Therefore, I see no reason to ask her to step aside.

2 - I don't see any reason to ask Marquis to step aside either.

3 - I voted no.

Which of these points do you consider to be weak, Sinn0cent1? Or did you simply misread my post?

 

[h_i_s]

For what time i have been on Lit, i havent seen anything bad from cat or Marquis that wouldn't be appropriate as moderators.

Their own personal opinions stated in different posts are just that; their(the individual, not the moderator) personal opinions.

Boards will always have drama somewhere involved, otherwise it would get awful damn boring; and many people would leave.

Cliques happen online just as much as in real life, and they always will. Some of the cliques here i wouldnt want to be involved in, and others; i already am.

So thank you, Catalina and Marquis; for your efforts and time as moderators. And i realize that your individual opinions arent going to stop either of you from doing your volunteered moderators jobs; without judgement of others here.

This is exactly why I do not like having to dealing with cliques. Any one will always subscribe to thinking that they are better than the next.

Do me a favor please, doveofserenity. Name them for me. I don't even care if it is public or in PM. Send me the names and the heads up on who is who of these cliques you speak of, please. I just would like to have this information so I can contact, verify, and then put them all on my blocked list.

 

[catalina_francisco]

The above are excerpts from posts 93 and 113 on the Librarian thread. As far as I can tell, 93 is the post that prompted WriterDom to start this thread, asking about the possibility of new moderators.

Catalina's posts not only express dissatisfaction with the board overall, but also openly insult roughly 90% of the active participants. Her comments echo various other posts I have read from her recently - in which she talks about why she doesn't like to post here much anymore. Taken together, all of this makes me wonder why on god's green earth she wants to continue as moderator.

However, since she has not specifically asked to be relieved, I can't see any reason to ask her to step aside.

What any of this has to do with Marquis, I have no freakin' idea.

I voted no.

Thanks for the 'no' vote. As some might already have guessed, I am human (I know, I hate to disappoint all these bot lovers who got off on thinking I was a mere machine with sparkling dials and switches, or Seven of Nine incognito...oh I wish) so yes, like the rest of the board, there are days I feel it is less than friendly, pleasant, fun....sometimes I am not alone, sometimes it is more to do with other things disrupting my cheery disposition, sometimes it is due to things which go on behind the scenes here which I diplomatically decide to not share openly, and sometimes it just is...such is the life of being a human being who happens to be a moderator and poster on the same board. And yes, I have mentioned it a few times in posts over the last week or 2 (because I tend to be a fairly open person, not to mention optomistic, have faith in fellow humans, not perfect, and I rarely check and edit a post before posting it).....I have not said it the entire time I have moderated which is more than a week or 2, nor is it likely to be permanent. Of course, some when they feel it is less than fun here will take a spell...that is not practical as a moderator and to date I have never known a mod who has not had times when they have not enjoyed the forum as much as they usually do for one reason or another just like in any job, voluntary or paid...if they (or I) left each time we felt this way, or thought it a good idea, we would have a revolving door type modship, more work for the site, less efficiency for the forum, and I daresay a point at which we would run out of volunteers.

Boringly in that I can't claim complete ownership of the idea, the things I commented on which were seen as insulting so many were mentioned because at times they get to me, but more importantly I get my PM space filled with the complaints of more than a few posters about the very same issues before I have said a thing. As mod I then usually try to soothe frayed nerves, and also make the decision as to whether it would help to make a public comment of some sort in the interests of a more cohesive and happy atmosphere. I do not dictate how people can post (that is not my job), nor do I edit (except personal info breaching Lit rules) or delete posts and threads, but I may offer suggestions and request for thought and thinking of others when it is seen as needed by other posters. I do not set out to insult people as it is not my style, but invariably I get accused of it (most times because people have read different things into it, or based their judgement on how it would be translated if they said the same thing or tinged by their own perceptions). Comments I made about people who open a thread with the idea it is 'their place' was because it is actually against site policy. According to Lit rules, threads belong to the forum, not the original poster. I imagine they made this rule to run alongside and support the strong free speech and inclusionary policy they have built the site on.

Unavoidably as we all know, if you are going to have the balls or tits to speak up when you think something is not as it was intended to be here, hurting others, making others uncomfortable without logical (IMM) reason, or just not what your experience is or can agree with, someone if not many are going to accuse you of being insulting...it is life. I used to once upon a time here let it get to me majorly...fortunately with the advice and help of those much wiser and more experienced than I, I have grown and realised it is just as much their right to have an opinion as it is mine and vv and so if they see something I say as insulting, I can, like everyone else defend myself if I have time and inclination and/or accept it as simply what it is, their opinion and expression of free speech. Hopefully this has served to clarify some points I felt needed clarifying...probably didn't need to be, but I advocate for safe play always, and we all know I take my commitments far too seriously most days.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2383/2100020759_8ff959c930_t.jpgCatalina (see I am not a bot, I am a cat!!)

Oh, and it would have been posted long ago if my internet had not gone down at an inopportune moment.

 

[minx1]

I voted no. I think they both do a great job.

 

[h_i_s]

Click me. That post is the genesis of this thread, as far as I can tell, and it was made in response to the remarks from Catalina that I quoted.

Of course she is entitled to rant. I never said otherwise, or even implied such a thing.

My points were:

1 - Even though she seems unhappy here, she has not asked to be replaced. Therefore, I see no reason to ask her to step aside.

2 - I don't see any reason to ask Marquis to step aside either.

3 - I voted no.

Which of these points do you consider to be weak, Sinn0cent1? Or did you simply misread my post?

Your points are as weak as WriterDom's, in my opinion, because in order to make your point you must focus on only a very limited portion of her posts.
If were to read those two posts, ... and only those two ... I would arrive at the same opinion.
I tend to prefer a glance at the entire picture prior to forming an opinion.

PS

And cut the childish condescending crap with reposting the link... If I want a link I'll find it without fail I write HTML off the top of my fucking head... I think I can manage to find a post when I want to. I read both posts when she posted them, and again when WriterDom posted them.

 

[h_i_s]

I'm on a forum that has a "be nice" rule also and though it is a very nice place to be it is rather boring. However, there is nothing wrong with some manners. (and I'm not talking specifically about you, Netz, I have never found you to be rude) but there is no reason for people to be rude just to be rude. Especially to newbies. If someone posts something a little out of context or maybe they didn't read the whole thread--would it hurt to either ignore them or just steer them politely in the right direction?

When did being a "bitch" become something to be proud of? I don't see being a bitch as a positive personality trait. There is a difference between politely speaking your mind and not being a doormat and being rude, confrontational and hot-headed. If someone says something stupid I give them the benefit of the doubt that maybe they were having a bad day, or their kids just then started yelling about being hungry or their cat just spat up a hairball all over their best carpet or something of that sort. No one can be perfect all the time, even the "bitches".

I'm with you on this point ecstaticsub. I don't think it's about being a bitch though. It's ignorance and lack of tolerance in it's purest form. No excuse for treating others that way at all. Adults should act like adults.

 

[JMohegan]

Your points are as weak as WriterDom's, in my opinion, because in order to make your point you must focus on only a very limited portion of her posts.
If were to read those two posts, ... and only those two ... I would arrive at the same opinion.
I tend to prefer a glance at the entire picture prior to forming an opinion.

The impression I have that she is unhappy here was based on more than two posts. I stated that clearly. Please read my words again, SinnOcent1.

As for my point, for the third time I state: I see no reason to ask her to step down. If you consider that a weak point to make, then we simply disagree.

 

[h_i_s]

The impression I have that she is unhappy here was based on more than two posts. I stated that clearly. Please read my words again, SinnOcent1.

As for my point, for the third time I state: I see no reason to ask her to step down. If you consider that a weak point to make, then we simply disagree.

I see your points and have concidered them.
You ignored mine.


We disagree.

 

[Etoile]

This is usually done at the admin level...either people complain to the admins that they don't like the mods, or the mods say they are burned out ask to be removed. I've never heard of "voting in" new mods, it is usually an administrative thing.

 

[h_i_s]

This is usually done at the admin level...either people complain to the admins that they don't like the mods, or the mods say they are burned out ask to be removed. I've never heard of "voting in" new mods, it is usually an administrative thing.

Heh... I see that you have now posted this twice Etoile.

... and you have made a good point, of course. I don't know how anyone could argue differently & I agree whole edly.

 

[JMohegan]

PS

And cut the childish condescending crap with reposting the link... If I want a link I'll find it without fail I write HTML off the top of my fucking head... I think I can manage to find a post when I want to. I read both posts when she posted them, and again when WriterDom posted them.

I provided the link out of common courtesy. Personally, I always appreciate ease of reference when reading or responding to posts. Do unto others, as they say.

Though you choose to interpret it as childish and condescending, I will not stop providing links. You may have the time and skill to hunt down the post being referenced, but others might not.

 

[Etoile]

Heh... I see that you have now posted this twice Etoile.

... and you have made a good point, of course. I don't know how anyone could argue differently & I agree whole edly.

Nobody seemed to hear the first time! And since what I was saying is "this thread is moot" I figured I should call more attention to it. Seriously, this thread is not how moderators are chosen. This thread is pointless. If you want to be a mod, you have to talk to Laurel. If you don't like a mod, you have to talk to Laurel. If you're tired of being a mod, you have to talk to Laurel.

Lit is not a democracy

 

[h_i_s]

I provided the link out of common courtesy. Personally, I always appreciate ease of reference when reading or responding to posts. Do unto others, as they say.

Though you choose to interpret it as childish and condescending, I will not stop providing links. You may have the time and skill to hunt down the post being referenced, but others might not.

You provided the link, as well as both posts in thier entirety (refer to your posts #'s 67 & 76 ... take your own advice and YOU go back and read) and told me to reread. You assume that I hadn't already read it numerous times because you are constantly stuck in condescending-ignoranus mode, always have been and never tire of proving it over and over again.
Common courtesy my ass. Grow up, JM.

 

[JMohegan]

Thanks for the 'no' vote. As some might already have guessed, I am human (I know, I hate to disappoint all these bot lovers who got off on thinking I was a mere machine with sparkling dials and switches, or Seven of Nine incognito...oh I wish) so yes, like the rest of the board, there are days I feel it is less than friendly, pleasant, fun....sometimes I am not alone, sometimes it is more to do with other things disrupting my cheery disposition, sometimes it is due to things which go on behind the scenes here which I diplomatically decide to not share openly, and sometimes it just is...such is the life of being a human being who happens to be a moderator and poster on the same board. And yes, I have mentioned it a few times in posts over the last week or 2 (because I tend to be a fairly open person, not to mention optomistic, have faith in fellow humans, not perfect, and I rarely check and edit a post before posting it).....I have not said it the entire time I have moderated which is more than a week or 2, nor is it likely to be permanent. Of course, some when they feel it is less than fun here will take a spell...that is not practical as a moderator and to date I have never known a mod who has not had times when they have not enjoyed the forum as much as they usually do for one reason or another just like in any job, voluntary or paid...if they (or I) left each time we felt this way, or thought it a good idea, we would have a revolving door type modship, more work for the site, less efficiency for the forum, and I daresay a point at which we would run out of volunteers.

You're welcome, of course, but the thanks really should go the other way.

To be honest, I have no idea what you & Marquis do as moderators - and that, all by itself, tells me that you must be doing something right. I don't post on any other message boards, but I imagine that frequent and prominent intervention by a controlling body would be offputting indeed.

 

[h_i_s]

Nobody seemed to hear the first time! And since what I was saying is "this thread is moot" I figured I should call more attention to it. Seriously, this thread is not how moderators are chosen. This thread is pointless. If you want to be a mod, you have to talk to Laurel. If you don't like a mod, you have to talk to Laurel. If you're tired of being a mod, you have to talk to Laurel.

Lit is not a democracy

Yeah I know... i know.
I'm bored with the word game threads and no one is posting thier weather so I'm passing time here.

I'm stirring shit up today ....
so whatcha gonna do, Etoile... beat me or something :caning: ???

 

[Netzach]

I'm on a forum that has a "be nice" rule also and though it is a very nice place to be it is rather boring. However, there is nothing wrong with some manners. (and I'm not talking specifically about you, Netz, I have never found you to be rude) but there is no reason for people to be rude just to be rude. Especially to newbies. If someone posts something a little out of context or maybe they didn't read the whole thread--would it hurt to either ignore them or just steer them politely in the right direction?

When did being a "bitch" become something to be proud of? I don't see being a bitch as a positive personality trait. There is a difference between politely speaking your mind and not being a doormat and being rude, confrontational and hot-headed. If someone says something stupid I give them the benefit of the doubt that maybe they were having a bad day, or their kids just then started yelling about being hungry or their cat just spat up a hairball all over their best carpet or something of that sort. No one can be perfect all the time, even the "bitches".

Depends. I probably beg to differ that I've never been rude. I can be a complete asshole when something seriously offends me, and there are things which are offensive enough that they deserve a WTF moment, because having a bad day and wilfully shoving one's head up ones own butt on an issue and saying things that are 1. belittling and 2. ignorant in ways that demand one's engagement -- those are two different things. I really don't care if someone's dog just crapped their rug if they're going to say something so spectacularly bigoted that I can't believe it.

And what those criteria are are pretty subjective, but I'm not going to be the person to say my indignation is valid and everyone else's isn't.

Being a bitch is something to be proud of because merely by being direct and not hand holding incompetent people it's a badge you often get stuck on you. For doing insane things like deciding you're not there for the comfort and smiles of everyone around you at your own expense. It's a remarkably easy scarlet B to get stuck with, almost universal. The same "well I tell it like it is" is practically cause to get everyone's panties on the board thrown at you if you have a dick.

 

[Homburg]

Lit is not a democracy

Nice to see someone else saying this. It boggles me when mob rule tries to rise up on something that is explicitly autocratic.

You want democracy? Vote with your feet.

 

[Netzach]

This is exactly why I do not like having to dealing with cliques. Any one will always subscribe to thinking that they are better than the next.

Do me a favor please, doveofserenity. Name them for me. I don't even care if it is public or in PM. Send me the names and the heads up on who is who of these cliques you speak of, please. I just would like to have this information so I can contact, verify, and then put them all on my blocked list.

You'll have to block all of Lit who's been here for more than five minutes. Me, definitely.

 

[JMohegan]

You provided the link, as well as both posts in thier entirety (refer to your posts #'s 67 & 76 ... take your own advice and YOU go back and read) and told me to reread. You assume that I hadn't already read it numerous times because you are constantly stuck in condescending-ignoranus mode, always have been and never tire of proving it over and over again.
Common courtesy my ass. Grow up, JM.

What happened to: "I don't start drama. And when anyone makes an underhanded attempt to sling it my way, it pisses me off for that reason: I don't DO drama and pettiness" ?

Is there a reason you seem so eager to provoke and insult me today, SinnOcent1?

Surely the tone you project onto my posts is off-topic here.

 

[Netzach]

JM links stuff all the time posting to me, and everyone else.

I also code HTML in my sleep, but thankfully I don't read every post on Lit and don't care to go hunting.

FWIW I totally disagree with him on this one too, I just don't think linking crap is hostile.

 

[Netzach]

Thanks for the 'no' vote. As some might already have guessed, I am human (I know, I hate to disappoint all these bot lovers who got off on thinking I was a mere machine with sparkling dials and switches, or Seven of Nine incognito...oh I wish) so yes, like the rest of the board, there are days I feel it is less than friendly, pleasant, fun....sometimes I am not alone, sometimes it is more to do with other things disrupting my cheery disposition, sometimes it is due to things which go on behind the scenes here which I diplomatically decide to not share openly, and sometimes it just is...such is the life of being a human being who happens to be a moderator and poster on the same board. And yes, I have mentioned it a few times in posts over the last week or 2 (because I tend to be a fairly open person, not to mention optomistic, have faith in fellow humans, not perfect, and I rarely check and edit a post before posting it).....I have not said it the entire time I have moderated which is more than a week or 2, nor is it likely to be permanent. Of course, some when they feel it is less than fun here will take a spell...that is not practical as a moderator and to date I have never known a mod who has not had times when they have not enjoyed the forum as much as they usually do for one reason or another just like in any job, voluntary or paid...if they (or I) left each time we felt this way, or thought it a good idea, we would have a revolving door type modship, more work for the site, less efficiency for the forum, and I daresay a point at which we would run out of volunteers.

Boringly in that I can't claim complete ownership of the idea, the things I commented on which were seen as insulting so many were mentioned because at times they get to me, but more importantly I get my PM space filled with the complaints of more than a few posters about the very same issues before I have said a thing. As mod I then usually try to soothe frayed nerves, and also make the decision as to whether it would help to make a public comment of some sort in the interests of a more cohesive and happy atmosphere. I do not dictate how people can post (that is not my job), nor do I edit (except personal info breaching Lit rules) or delete posts and threads, but I may offer suggestions and request for thought and thinking of others when it is seen as needed by other posters. I do not set out to insult people as it is not my style, but invariably I get accused of it (most times because people have read different things into it, or based their judgement on how it would be translated if they said the same thing or tinged by their own perceptions). Comments I made about people who open a thread with the idea it is 'their place' was because it is actually against site policy. According to Lit rules, threads belong to the forum, not the original poster. I imagine they made this rule to run alongside and support the strong free speech and inclusionary policy they have built the site on.

Unavoidably as we all know, if you are going to have the balls or tits to speak up when you think something is not as it was intended to be here, hurting others, making others uncomfortable without logical (IMM) reason, or just not what your experience is or can agree with, someone if not many are going to accuse you of being insulting...it is life. I used to once upon a time here let it get to me majorly...fortunately with the advice and help of those much wiser and more experienced than I, I have grown and realised it is just as much their right to have an opinion as it is mine and vv

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2383/2100020759_8ff959c930_t.jpgCatalina (see I am not a bot, I am a cat!!)

Oh, and it would have been posted long ago if my internet had not gone down at an inopportune moment.

cat, honestly though, I don't think those narcissism threads are so much about "this is my shit tread not here" in a TOS violation kind of way, as they are "here's where to find updates on me, should you happen to give a shit" threads. Which seems like as fine cafe fluff as "what pop star are your boobs?" quizzes.

This is of course a question of interpretation of the TOS, but there you go. My interpretation of TOS thread "ownership" means the material in the thread is not your copyrighted material by dint of starting the thread.

 

[JMohegan]

JM links stuff all the time posting to me, and everyone else.

I also code HTML in my sleep, but thankfully I don't read every post on Lit and don't care to go hunting.

FWIW I totally disagree with him on this one too, I just don't think linking crap is hostile.

Thanks, Netzach.

I don't even know what it means to "code HTML". Excel, Word, and elementary email are about the limit of my computer literacy skills.

If I read a reference to a post taken out of context, in order to find the source I use the Search function - copying and pasting the text, narrowing it down by forum, poster's name if possible, etc. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.

 

[catalina_francisco]

You're welcome, of course, but the thanks really should go the other way.

To be honest, I have no idea what you & Marquis do as moderators - and that, all by itself, tells me that you must be doing something right. I don't post on any other message boards, but I imagine that frequent and prominent intervention by a controlling body would be offputting indeed.

'Tis OK, and I'm not unhappy. And yes, I have since becoming a mod seen the wisdom and beauty of Lit's ways of moderating and running the site. Being pretty much an internet novice at the time, and with my only forum experience being here, it was refreshing to find they are so definate about upholding their policy of free speech, even when things which are posted go against their own personal beliefs. That is a commitment I can respect and one I wish more politicians and people in power could adhere to without the need to corrupt the process.

Basically mods are only supposed to move threads which are SPAM, alert admin to breaches of rules in signatures, edit posts which contain email addresses or other personal details not permitted, and move inappropriate threads to their correct forum. It is not a big job in actively moving or editing, but requires time to scan everything or as much as possible which is often aided by observant posters using either the report thread/post feature or PMing us about anything they think might need attention.

Catalina

 

[Netzach]

Nice to see someone else saying this. It boggles me when mob rule tries to rise up on something that is explicitly autocratic.

You want democracy? Vote with your feet.

Amen.

But this beats shooting people for blowing off Christmas insane.

 

[catalina_francisco]

cat, honestly though, I don't think those narcissism threads are so much about "this is my shit tread not here" in a TOS violation kind of way, as they are "here's where to find updates on me, should you happen to give a shit" threads. Which seems like as fine cafe fluff as "what pop star are your boobs?" quizzes.

This is of course a question of interpretation of the TOS, but there you go.

That is true of most, but also is open to interpretation of posters and sometimes leads to feelings of segregation and cliques becoming more of a focus than the community feel we have enjoyed at times...I just go on what feedback I get and try and keep things reasonably smooth without descending into trying to do the impossible of making everything perfect and everyone friends. I am really touched by the support you and others have given us.

Catalina