Justice League: The New Wave (OOC - Interest Check)

[ChasNicollette]

So is it possible to catch a speedster by surprise. I know in the early episodes of flash that the Arrow did something like this when he setup an ambush.

But I've been thinking for awhile that if Kiz gave Velocity the Lasher Staff and during a chase, Velocity put it on the Purple Streaks leg...could the purple streak stop in time (assuming the purple streak was unable to rip the staff from the ground)?

Also, I think I've asked this before...but Speedsters don't have super reflexes, when not going at speed they can be surprised? I was an episode of Flash season 2 where this happens a few times. If a speedster sees it coming, they can dodge (e.g. A guy firing a gun at them) or if they are already going at Mach4 -> Speed of Light then. Things are already in bullet time for them. But otherwise, its fair game?

It varies.

Jericho once possessed Deathstroke and kneecapped Impulse when Impulse was standing still, but Impulse was still very new at that point and his inattentiveness was legendary. He should have been able to vibrate instinctively through the shotgun blast, but instead it took him out.

Similarly, the Barry Allen that Arrow ambushed was still very, heh, green.

But when Wally West was attacked by speed ninjas at a sidewalk cafe in the Dead Heat arc, his speed switched on automatically and an epic fight scene ensued.

A properly trained and experienced speedster can have their accelerated senses kick in on instinct and allow them to evade even a surprise attack. But if they're not fully honed, then they'd be boned.

On the other hand, even speedsters are only human and can make mistakes, Dervish included. Handing her The Lasher staff would probably have the same effect on her as trying to catch Mjolnir in flight had on MCU Quicksilver.

 

[ChasNicollette]

The Fear scan worked catastrophically, disastrously better than I thought it would.

I have a plan, but yikes.

 

[kizkiz]

The Fear scan worked catastrophically, disastrously better than I thought it would.

I have a plan, but yikes.

An unveiled, unrestrained Demon prince? Yeah and wiping out a few of Thea's 9 lives. Poor kitty.

 

[Aussie_Wolf]

Catching a Speedster by surprise is possible. Attacks from behind still work, long range, multiple angles etc.

However most speedsters see the world in slow mo.Their Accelerated metabolism is always on. Barry Allen did not need to eat to replace lost energy, I think this was only a Wally West thing and he grew out of it when he breached the Speed Force (I think). So as long as they can see an attack coming 9 times out of 10 they can avoid it.

 

[ChasNicollette]

In happier news, the closing zinger for the "Zero Punctation" review of "Metroid Prime: Federation Force" says "Colour her green and say it's her Irish cousin Seamus O'Ran."

:: side-eyes Milton and Lysl ::

 

[kizkiz]

So speedsters have no weakness? Is it just magic or can they outrun most spells?

 

[Aussie_Wolf]

Oh speedsters have weaknesses. Think AOE attacks, magnetic attacks, clones, gravity, cold, heat I mean they are still human. Just look at Barry's old rogues gallery (Which they have given to Wally). Captain Cold, Heatwave, Mirror Master, Elemental Master, Weather Wizard, Captain Boomerang, etc. Then think of people like Magneto (Yes I know he is Marvel but I am sure there is a DC equivalent). Then there is also Sonics to disrupt inner ear.

See lots of ways to take out a speedster.

 

[ChasNicollette]

Speedsters have weaknesses.

They are resilient but not unbreakable. Injuries heal fast but still could take hours or days depending on their severity.

Lasers and other energy-based ranged weapons are much harder to dodge or vibrate through than projectiles.

Their metabolism can be turned against them. Poisons and drugs work out of their systems faster, but they also kick in faster, giving you an immediate window upon which to capitalize.

One can take advantage of accelerated senses, such as by strobing images to provoke a seizure in their lightning-charged brains.

One could also interfere with the Speed Force energy. Block the link, or siphon the power off. It could be harnessed by magic.

Also there's temporal manipulation, or cryogenic attacks, inhibiting their acceleration and kinetic energy.

 

[ChasNicollette]

DC equivalents to Magneto are Dr. Polaris and Magenta.

 

[kizkiz]

How fast do speedsters go? In the tv show the Flash is only going 1700mph or so, which isn't actually bullet time

Curious because if they are able to dodge a laser gun (e.g. Faster than the Speed of light)... Is crazy fast.

To dodge the typical explosion is like mach 4-9.

So the abilities don't match up with speeds, most of the time it's hand wavy, but just curious.

 

[Wyldfire]

DC equivalents to Magneto are Dr. Polaris and Magenta.

Don't forget the Krinn boys sweetie And Rokk and Pol both predate Magneto I do believe..... I know Rokk does.

 

[ChasNicollette]

Different speedsters have different top speeds.

Rare speedsters, we're talking full-on Flashes, can beat a laser in a flat run but they risk falling into The Speed Force and never getting back out.

For awhile post-Crisis, Wally could only hit about Mach 1, but eventually got his full speed back in order to defeat Barry's archfoe, The Reverse Flash.

Velocity and Dervish are each somewhere in between.

 

[ChasNicollette]

Don't forget the Krinn boys sweetie

They ain't villains, tho'.

 

[Wyldfire]

One of DC's best anti speedster combatants is Count Vertigo......

 

[Aussie_Wolf]

I think with the TV series they are building Wally's speed up.

Fastest is tapping into the speed force itself which is actually above the speed of light. He can actually break the reality barrier and I am not sure how fast you have to be to do that LOL

So it is a matter of training.

 

[Wyldfire]

They ain't villains, tho'.

One of them has been though.... He just didn't use his magnetism.....

 

[Aussie_Wolf]

At the moment Carin (Velocity) is running at Mach 3 as a cruising speed but is starting to push herself to go faster.

She has reached a speed of 10,000 mph + but that was for a short time and she is afraid to go that fast for fear of ripping up the earth. However as she learns about the speed force and her speed aura she may just cruise at those speeds.

 

[ChasNicollette]

One of them has been though.... He just didn't use his magnetism.....

There are common elements but I still don't see them as archetypally similar. Magnetic powers do not a Magneto make. A fractured psyche and a cape are also in Erik's starter kit.

 

[Wyldfire]

There are common elements but I still don't see them as archetypally similar. Magnetic powers do not a Magneto make. A fractured psyche and a cape are also in Erik's starter kit.

And I am being silly due to the tipsiness.....

 

[Aussie_Wolf]

And I am being silly due to the tipsiness.....

Oh...Just what are we drinking tonight???

 

[Wyldfire]

Oh...Just what are we drinking tonight???

I am going to sound like a hillbilly frat girl here. Moonshine of the highest order.... Mixed with fruit punch Kool-aid. That is actually the chaser for some Yukon Jack.......

 

[Aussie_Wolf]

I am going to sound like a hillbilly frat girl here. Moonshine of the highest order.... Mixed with fruit punch Kool-aid. That is actually the chaser for some Yukon Jack.......

Sounds fine to me. We get Moonshine down here but it might not be the same.

No Kool-Aid though

 

[kizkiz]

She has reached a speed of 10,000 mph + but that was for a short time and she is afraid to go that fast for fear of ripping up the earth.

C4 explosion is 18,000 mph.

 

[ChasNicollette]

http://i328.photobucket.com/albums/l325/chasnicollette/dbc989ee-161f-4bc8-a97a-9d3a843f8d33_zpsxs32vw4i.png​

Additionally, The Speed Force provides certain effects that buffer speedsters against the physical detriments of their speed-- and cushions the environment against the massive destruction of their wake to an extent.

The buffers include inertial dampening to bolster their resilience to the physical stresses of running, screeching to a halt, that's factored into their ability to survive punches from super-strong baddies. But this is not the same as the invulnerability of a Superman. It just makes them less likely to get mashed into a gooey paste on the interstate if they trip running Mach 10, it doesn't mean they don't get hurt at all ever.

On top of this, The Speed Force aura provides insulation against friction heat, which by extension provides some protection against the heat of fires and blasts and energy weapons and underground magma. So it may not just be their speed that protects them from explosions at that velocity-- the ignition of those blasts just doesn't touch them as much as it might a normal person.

For perspective, Impulse once tried a frontal assault on Kobra and got immediately blasted off of a skyscraper by a pyrotechnic energy firearm. Despite getting engulfed in conflagration and taking a header off of a multi-story building, Impulse survived because of his vibrations and his aura. Granted, he wasn't bouncing up again immediately and didn't feel better until a dramatically awesome moment later on, but he survived long enough that he would have healed on his own if given the chance.

At one point in the pages of JLA, Wally West-- at the absolute zenith of his power, having entered The Speed Force itself and returned stronger, making him the fastest Flash of all time --got his tendons in one lower leg severed by an attack from The Ultramarine Corps. He immediately complained that this would "take hours to heal." Of course, in a normal human, I suspect that injury would have been instantly career-ending, but as fast as The Flash could regenerate it still sidelined him for the rest of the battle-- he had to lend his speed to Aquaman so that Orin could carry him around very ignominiously.

Conversely, during the Terminal Velocity arc (the same one where Impulse got shot off the rooftop), Jesse Quick took a laser through the leg and while she could hop around at superspeed she didn't have the vastly increased healing powers that Wally did later and it was likely she would never properly run again-- until she was healed by the same miraculous event that restored Impulse. I would say that Dervish and Velocity are somewhere between Jesse and Impulse with regard to their ability to diffuse and survive injury, rather than up there with Wally during that later JLA tale.

Useful tidbit: even at supersonic velocities, speedsters can still talk to each other if they're close enough together that their auras intersect.

To answer your original question, yeah, The Lasher Staff could hypothetically delimb a speedster, Dervish included, going at sufficient velocity. I advise you to try it and see!

 

[ChasNicollette]

I need to go wash dishes and contemplate, but I should hopefully have up a response to the Fear situation before the end of the night.