Sex once this year

[blushrush]

I am the husband you describe and i'll tell you why I act the way I do:

I don't love my wife. I haven't loved her for a long time. But there's more.

I don't like her. I often think to myself I've married the worst person in the world.

But we have young children and I don't think I'd get full custody and I don't trust my wife to take care of the kids.

I fear if we split up the kids would end up in dirty clothes without food in the house. I want better than that for my kids.

So I stay and give the kids the most normal life I can.

We don't have sex. I'm really not interested in her that way anymore.

I've told her to go have an affair if she wants - just don't put it in front of me and the kids. keep it confidential is all that I ask.

I don't think she has but I really don't care as long as its not publicized.

As someone whose parents split up when I was very small, it's not a sure thing that things will be worse if you do.

My parents were unhappy together and if they had stayed together, they would have ended up miserable. Children can sense these things and growing up in a loveless home will have an effect in some way. Now my parents are happy with new partners and it makes me happy to know they are happy.

Staying together 'for the children' will not necessarily be a better solution than being apart. I know things don't always work out for the better but felt I had to offer my personal experience.

For the OP, I can only imagine your frustrations. Trying to reach someone who seems bent on refusing to acknowledge there is a problem in the first place must drive you mad.

As a last resort, does he have any friends or family you can speak to about his behaviour? Maybe if he hears it from two separate sources, he might be more responsive?

 

[Eilan]

As someone whose parents split up when I was very small, it's not a sure thing that things will be worse if you do.

My parents were unhappy together and if they had stayed together, they would have ended up miserable. Children can sense these things and growing up in a loveless home will have an effect in some way. Now my parents are happy with new partners and it makes me happy to know they are happy.

Staying together 'for the children' will not necessarily be a better solution than being apart. I know things don't always work out for the better but felt I had to offer my personal experience.

For the OP, I can only imagine your frustrations. Trying to reach someone who seems bent on refusing to acknowledge there is a problem in the first place must drive you mad.

As a last resort, does he have any friends or family you can speak to about his behaviour? Maybe if he hears it from two separate sources, he might be more responsive?

As the product of such a marriage, I have strong feelings -- none of them positive -- about couples who stay together for the "sake of the children."

Sure, if you wanna insult your kids' intelligence and fuck up their future relationships by giving them a shitty relationship model, then knock yourselves out.

 

[suckonsimon]

As the product of such a marriage, I have strong feelings -- none of them positive -- about couples who stay together for the "sake of the children."

Sure, if you wanna insult your kids' intelligence and fuck up their future relationships by giving them a shitty relationship model, then knock yourselves out.

My parents came to hate each other profoundly. The thing which helped the four of us survive their broken marriage was that they lived in different countries. We did our best to make sure it stayed that way. Nonetheless, I reckon I was 40 before I was through sorting the dross in me. My wonderful woman - we married when we were 23 - so enabled me to discover what committed loving could look like.

PS to their very great credit: my parents both separately apologized to us, in our young adulthood, for the damage which their mess-up of a marriage might have caused us. I so respect and love them [both dead some long time] for having stepped up to that.

 

[NightL]

sjt2424

As the product of such a marriage, I have strong feelings -- none of them positive --

My parents came to hate each other profoundly.

A GP once told me (I have no supporting articles for the following) "The longer a child remains with parents continuing to live together in a dysfunctional marriage there is an increasing likelihood the child will experience psychological issues in their teenage years and beyond. The closer a child is to the age of 5 and beyond, while still living in such a family environment, the chance and severity of psychological/psychiatric disorders will increase dramatically. Children have a much better shot at life having happy parents living apart than miserable parents living together."

Sticking it out for the sake of the children is likely to do far more harm than parents establishing happy lives apart.

sjt2424 - you are denying your children a chance to experience and witness an environment of laughter, smiles, fun and love. Your children deserve to be around adults who are not only affectionate toward them, but toward each other - or even around parents who are content and happy leading single lives. In your writing the contempt you display toward your wife and for the environment you live is palpable. That is a shit gift for your children. You are doing no one any favours by stoically sticking it out.

Your "and I don't trust my wife to take care of the kids" reads as a bitter man determined to make everyone's lives miserable as you are. What right do you believe you have for sole custody of your children if you allow the chance of happiness for everyone? What right do you believe you have to deny your own children the chance of experiencing a happy father as well as a happy mother? Your comment reads "I will make her life miserable by sticking around" control control control at the cost of your own children's chance of witnessing happy affectionate adults.

If your wife has a psychiatric disorder or a drug dependency or some other form of impediment to caring for her own children or impediment for her own happiness then all you need is character references from family and friends, teachers, other supervising adults your children fall under the care of to your upstanding character as parent to get shared custody or, if extreme situation, full custody.

So if the above is not the case why would it have to go to a custody/court situation anyway - why can't you both display some maturity and organise an amicable separation and care arrangements for your children?

Even under your worst fears - happy children running around in dirty clothes are still happy.

Stop inflicting your misery and let everyone, especially your children, a chance to experience some joy, affection and love. Let them witness that in the adults around them.

Now that I have got you all angry and indignant with a "how dare that person lay judgement on my situation!" - just think about it for a few days. I had to do just that when the GP gave me his advice after he asked me "why do stay in the marriage?". Many years later that GP returned to the practice and I asked "why did you ask me about my marriage when I came to you with physical ailments?" to which he replied "because I had gone through the very same thing, left it too long and my absence was for needing to look after my troubled teenage son".

 

[LadyVer]

sjt2424

A GP once told me (I have no supporting articles for the following) "The longer a child remains with parents continuing to live together in a dysfunctional marriage there is an increasing likelihood the child will experience psychological issues in their teenage years and beyond. The closer a child is to the age of 5 and beyond, while still living in such a family environment, the chance and severity of psychological/psychiatric disorders will increase dramatically. Children have a much better shot at life having happy parents living apart than miserable parents living together."

Sticking it out for the sake of the children is likely to do far more harm than parents establishing happy lives apart.

sjt2424 - you are denying your children a chance to experience and witness an environment of laughter, smiles, fun and love. If your children deserve to be around adults who are not only affectionate toward them, but toward each other - or even around parents who are content and happy leading single lives. In your writing the contempt you display toward your wife and for the environment you live is palpable. That is a shit gift for your children. You are doing no one any favours by stoically sticking it out.

Your "and I don't trust my wife to take care of the kids" reads as a bitter man determined to make everyone's lives miserable as you are. What right do you believe you have for sole custody of your children if you allow the chance of happiness for everyone? What right do you believe you have to deny your own children the chance of experiencing a happy father as well as a happy mother? Your comment reads "I will make her life miserable by sticking around" control control control at the cost of your own children's chance of witnessing happy affectionate adults.

If your wife has a psychiatric disorder or a drug dependency or some other form of impediment to caring for her own children or impediment for her own happiness then all you need is character references from family and friends, teachers, other supervising adults your children fall under the care of to your upstanding character as parent to get shared custody or, if extreme situation, full custody.

So if the above is not the case why would it have to go to a custody/court situation anyway - why can't you both display some maturity and organise an amicable separation and care arrangements for your children?

Even under your worst fears - happy children running around in dirty clothes are still happy.

Stop inflicting your misery and let everyone, especially your children, a chance to experience some joy, affection and love. Let them witness that in the adults around them.

Now that I have got you all angry and indigent with a "how dare that person lay judgement on my situation!" - just think about it for a few days. I had to just that when the GP gave me his advice after he asked me "why do stay in the marriage?". Many years later that GP returned to the practice and I asked "why did you ask me about my marriage when I came to you with physical ailments?" to which he replied "because I had gone through the very same thing, left it too long and my absence was for needing to look after my troubled teenage son".

It's hard to give much advice to people we don't know online. All anyone can do is offer their opinions. I don't think it does much good to tell someone to stop inflicting their misery on everyone else and now that I have got you all angry and indigent, etc etc. You're playing therapist.

Midwest Yank: I like your points about power. I've been in two relationships where my partners withheld sex, and it was strictly all about power and getting back at me because I wasn't doing what they wanted. It took a while to figure this out though.

 

[Riles]

I like the way you characterize it as an autopsy. The autopsy I performed took a couple of years a lot of reading. 2 years seems a reasonable length of time to analyze two decades. It was really amazing the clarity that one has when one is no longer in the situation.

Thank you. I can't recall when I first started seeing it as such, or if I had heard it before in that context and it stuck....but it is appropriate.

For me, clarity came 2 years before I actually left...Ducks in a row and whatnot. But once the grieving was done, I realized I had been crying over the loss of a dream, not the actual relationship. Leaving was (I think) akin to shedding a smothering, confining skin that was becoming toxic. Once I broke free of that, it was like I could take in a full breath again.

It's taken a year on my own to re-establish enough trust between my ex and I on how to co-parent without fear that the other is poisoning our kids with bitterness. But to bring it back around to my original comments, learning to hand over these issues to a professional has been a life saver for me. The ex has a great therapist who takes my list of "needs work on" and does what he does, all without having my ex feel threatened or preached at. Finding that safe zone for him has been key, and unlike my attempts at "fixing", his ego isn't getting bruised in the process.

 

[NightL]

I realize it is all modern and forward thinking to say that no one owes anyone sex. Alienation of affection is an actual charge. Still enforceable in some states. Taking the affection away from the person that it "belongs" to.

I looked again at that line "Alienation of affection is an actual charge" and thought "surely not" but I had to look
http://family-law.lawyers.com/divorce/whats-alienation-of-affection.html

Damn there are some backward crazy laws still in existence in the US. I had to laugh when I saw Utah was one of the states still allowing this - wondered how this would work in a polygamous marriage and wife #3 not getting affection (yeah I know polygamy is illegal in Utah)

Anyway there are only 5 (5 too many) states where that law is technically enforceable. "All other states and the District of Columbia have abolished it, primarily because it’s a “revenge” law and does little or nothing to protect marriages."

There is no point in being in a sexless, monogamous relationship of any description.

While I agree with that, obviously some will justify being in such a situation. I still don't hold that sex or indeed affection is a right within a marriage for the simple premise of, apart from those five states (which is more about suing after a marriage breakdown involving a cheating partner), how do you uphold the right? Through force? Of course not as that would be marital rape and that is illegal in all 50 states (drumming up on your legal system). Rather than being a right for sex and affection within a marriage, the obvious is, as you mentioned Query, there is the right for a person to leave a marriage devoid of affection if they so choose.

 

[boomer177]

How are you doing, OP?

 

[NextDoorSecret]

I'm struggling. I signed back in this morning because having a conversation again, practically begging him to do something resulted in him saying he'd call the dr.
Which was apparently said to appease me, because he hasn't bothered and the subject has once again been dropped.
I've made an appointment with a therapist for myself, we'll see how that goes.
I have read every response. Thank you for the input.. I'm considering all of it.

 

[subwannabe]

The only way he will appreciate you is after you are gone. Since he knows you won't leave there is no incentive to do anything. Maybe the best thing for your relationship is to leave and hope that he begs you to come back. If he doesn't do that then the situation will always be hopeless. There is such a thing as separation before getting a divorce.

 

[sybarite_1]

I would vote for she gets sex elsewhere. In the meantime, buy a Symbian machine. And get full body massages. Lack of touch can make the body ill.
I do adore pedicures and reflexology and back rubs and....

 

[NextDoorSecret]

Reflexology and massage and pedicures and such are a really good idea. I think my biggest reason for starting the thread was in the hopes of getting ideas of how to LIVE with this.

I've reviewed all my options and I'm still where I am.
I know I could have an affair. Hell, since logging in and being able to talk to people about this, my inbox filled up quickly with offers, but that wasn't really my intent. Creative as some of the offers were, that wasn't my intention.
I may end up someday crossing that line, but I didn't come here looking for that either. (I can here for the erotica and porn because frankly, I'm only human)

I know I could leave him. I'm not stupid, I'm realistic and I'm trying to figure out at this point if I can live like this for the rest of my life. I've read before that when things are good sex is something like 5-10% of a marriage and when there's a problem it becomes 95%. Sounds about right, the difficulty is deciding if what should amount ot only 5% is worth throwing away the history, the loyalty, the family we have and I'm not ready to toss that away, but we're talking several years now that this has been a problem and eventually something IS going to have to give.

For those that have mentioned the kids, they have no idea there's really a problem. That sounds naive, but we don't fight, we interact beautifully as a family. I think they just assume that displays of affection are private, they don't realize that there really aren't any.

 

[suckonsimon]

... I've read before that when things are good sex is something like 5-10% of a marriage ...

Thanks for keeping us in the loop of your thoughts, NDS.

Allow me to beg to differ on that statistic. For us, we would both say that our intimacy is a heck of a lot more than 10% of our marriage. Hugely more. I don't mean to be unhelpful here. Rather, to give due credence to the value of great sex in a good marriage. Let's not please reduce the bar.

Hey. Hug and kisses. Simon.

 

[snoopydaddy59]

I'm struggling. I signed back in this morning because having a conversation again, practically begging him to do something resulted in him saying he'd call the dr.
Which was apparently said to appease me, because he hasn't bothered and the subject has once again been dropped.
I've made an appointment with a therapist for myself, we'll see how that goes.
I have read every response. Thank you for the input.. I'm considering all of it.

You DESERVE better!!!
Have you ever heard the phrase, you can lead a horse to water, but can't make them drink?"....... need anything more be said???????

 

[NextDoorSecret]

Thanks for keeping us in the loop of your thoughts, NDS.

Allow me to beg to differ on that statistic. For us, we would both say that our intimacy is a heck of a lot more than 10% of our marriage. Hugely more. I don't mean to be unhelpful here. Rather, to give due credence to the value of great sex in a good marriage. Let's not please reduce the bar.

Hey. Hug and kisses. Simon.

thanks.
I know.. it's important. It's just not everything either.
I have a 2 hour massage AND a pedicure scheduled for this weekend. Not the same but still good for me.

You DESERVE better!!!
Have you ever heard the phrase, you can lead a horse to water, but can't make them drink?"....... need anything more be said???????

I do deserve more. I do know that. It's what I'm trying to deal with.
And as far as the analogy goes, sure you can lead a horse to water and you can't make him drink.. but if he's been a good loyal horse do you leave him by the side of the road or do you try and find out if the problem can be resolved.

 

[thefishfryer]

I do deserve more. I do know that. It's what I'm trying to deal with.
And as far as the analogy goes, sure you can lead a horse to water and you can't make him drink.. but if he's been a good loyal horse do you leave him by the side of the road or do you try and find out if the problem can be resolved.

I'm with you on this, and like your metaphor. I do hope you can resolve your problem.

 

[subwannabe]

If a horse breaks a leg then you shoot it. Bottom line is you are never going to get anywhere if you are the only one who is working on the problem. He seems to care less. He has a broken leg that will never heal, only make you more miserable every day. Massages and pedicures only last so long.

 

[36524]

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[NextDoorSecret]

I very much agree with this, Simon, simply because good sex and those who regularly want it with their partners have that need for closeness and intimacy. For me, I'd actually say the physical is just as important as the emotional, it's probably an even 50-50.

And I agree with this:

My boyfriend's a gamer, only reason he isn't certified as one is because he's not pro who wins money at e-tournaments. lol And yet, his addiction to video games doesn't keep him from living and loving experiences outside of his monitor, and certainly doesn't distract him from giving me attention and love. I don't play video games myself, but I'm interested in them enough to listen to Dark Souls lore, know what personalities play mage versus melee, when The International happens, that j-rpgs always mean an awful grind, what new games are coming out, etc. I'm actually more involved than I ever intended, but it makes our relationship much better in that he can talk to me about what he really likes, which is games.

I also agree with this:

I was depressed during middle school and high school, but I didn't know I was because I'd always felt that way. It eventually escalated, but for a long time I had dysthymia. You never really feel anything but this flat line of blah and you end up keeping to yourself and not wanting to do anything, despite not feeling more depressed with suicidal thoughts. I had no sexual drive until I was about 18 or 19-years-old.

I really wish the best for you, NextDoor, I hope speaking to someone helps relieve some of the frustration and burden on you. And even if you end up dragging him to counseling together (since he doesn't seem to really oppose to anything, just has no motivation to try), I hope the perpetual cloud over his head stops searching for you, as well, and maybe when he realizes he can feel differently and like being in life again he'll understand what he doesn't see right now.

Thank you so much. This last paragraph really kind of sums things up. I think that it's really possible he's depressed, whether he thinks it or not. He's just not really participating in life.
He's not OPPOSED to it, he just doesn't think of it?
I've tried getting into the video games. I can speak to them way more than I ever thought, I never really thought of myself as a gamer girl and I probably never will. I'm terribly clueless around a controller but I can talk about them. I did try and play but I lose interest and I'm not good enough at them to be a challenge for him to play with.
Good suggestions though.

Really it does help to be able to talk about it and at least knowing I'm not CRAZY for wanting things to be normal, whatever that is, helps too.

 

[36524]

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[NightL]

If your life long best friend confided unto you what you have laid bare here - what would your advice be to that person? You only need answer that to yourself.

 

[sybarite_1]

I'm reading
Your Quantum Breakthrough Code

Maybe put it on your reading list...

 

[indian_cpl2013]

I am guessing that for a man in his thirtys to lose interest in sex suggests a medical condition of some sort. However, from what you have said, it sounds like he is not prepared to seek help. Does he have an interest in life that excludes you, or does he appear to have no interest in anything?

Ultimately you may have to decide whether you can continue to with this situation and what your options are.

Sorry if entered this thread late..

Low testosterone levels.... is what i am thinking.

 

[Bob_F451]

You are not alone in being lonely

We've had sex once this year, 14 months actually. 3 times the previous year.
How do I accept that this is my life now, or do I not just accept it?
I'm starved for touch, for real companionship and yet loyalty, history and love keep me here.
I've tried everything under the sun. I'm out of ideas.
Maybe someone else has some?

Hi there.
My thoughts are with you. You are not alone in being lonely, my count with my spouse is 0. In my case my wife has had health issues for years and things keep getting worse so at least I know part of the reason. It's so damn hard to to be lonely all the time. No touch, no bonding, no love. I'm nothing more than the room mate in the same house anymore who maintains the property. It eats a person away, I know.

And everyone will tell you "get counseling" that's crap to me - it was a waste of time. Nobody knows your problems like you do, all we did was waste money to tell a strainer our problems - I already did that here once. [Some people helped me some people hated me.] And if your partner won't participate on the 'magic fix' the counselor suggests then what? I could have killed that bastard for making me feel even worse.

I can't answer your question or give advise on what to do, my own attempts have been epic fails so far. You need to decide what you are going to do. I had a very hard time telling my wife how I felt but I did, and nothing happened. So weeks later I sat her down and went even deeper. We both broke down in tears but nothing has changed. I even asked her if I should move out but that even made me feel worse because she needs help. I feel so trapped.

I've reviewed all my options and I'm still where I am – stuck because I have feelings and I care even though I am alone. So just let me offer an ear if you ever need/want someone to talk to or need to vent - just use my inbox.

All the best.
Bob

 

[ItalianStyle]

Thank you so much. This last paragraph really kind of sums things up. I think that it's really possible he's depressed, whether he thinks it or not. He's just not really participating in life.
He's not OPPOSED to it, he just doesn't think of it?
I've tried getting into the video games. I can speak to them way more than I ever thought, I never really thought of myself as a gamer girl and I probably never will. I'm terribly clueless around a controller but I can talk about them. I did try and play but I lose interest and I'm not good enough at them to be a challenge for him to play with.
Good suggestions though.

Really it does help to be able to talk about it and at least knowing I'm not CRAZY for wanting things to be normal, whatever that is, helps too.

Did go through entire thread... so if this is repeated, I apologize in advance.

- If he has ever had his T-levels base-lined, find out what his levels are now. Lot T-levels lowers interest
- Stress level lowers interest. Is he experiencing stress at work? at home?
- His hormones may be imbalanced. Get him to take vitamins. Get his levels checked.
- Get him exercising. If he won't go to the gym... go for walks. Find ways to get him moving. (maybe on one of your walks, tell him you're not wearing any panties and maybe show him where its a more secluded area).