The AI & Data Center Thread

[icanhelp1]

Yep, especially the line "Some machine, do it all for you"

I'm not anti AI or Data centers. None of the issues you mentioned are unsolvable problems. God gave us a brain, we need to use it. We'll never get to the stars if we fail to push the limits of our minds and hide in fear of progress.

 

[ll74]

A good quote on the topic from today's "The Dispatch" (https://pca.st/episode/056afc7f-cf15-42e7-9d51-daaadf030dca - about 25 mins in) -
Megan McArdle - "the media cycle is not doing us any favors on this front"
Also Jonah Goldberg - "who do you want I charge of this AI tech, China or the US? If you want it to be the US, there has to be lots of data centers somewhere in the US"

 

[MajorRewrite]

Data centers are a big political issue.

Data centers emerge as new flashpoint between Kotek, Drazan in Oregon governor’s race

A late July poll by the Portland-based firm DHM Research found that 71% of Oregonians have a negative view of data centers, which have found a comfortable market in Oregon with the state’s lack of sales tax, generous property tax breaks for industrial development and relatively low electricity rates.

Responding to public angst over data centers and the tech industry has become an issue among candidates in both political parties. Among Democrats, data center backlash was key to the campaign of political newcomer Myrna Muñoz, who in a primary for a Washington County-area senate seat defeated incumbent state Sen. Janeen Sollman, of Hillsboro. Earlier this month, four state Democratic lawmakers announced they’d propose legislation in 2027 to pause the creation of new, large data centers in Oregon for the next three years.

The National Republican Senatorial Committee issued an Aug. 18 data center memo for one U.S. Senate race in Ohio, warning that support for data centers was becoming a problem for the Republican candidate and “campaigns or party committees cannot fix the toxic brand of an entire segment of the economy.”

 

[ll74]

Data centers are a big political issue.

Data centers emerge as new flashpoint between Kotek, Drazan in Oregon governor’s race

What I've seen in the past month has been data centers going from an interest to a full on panic in terms of interest.

That is artificial and easy to spot.

If there is an initiative for a data center in your area, find information and learn what the disinformation is, and go to a community meeting and listen to what people say. Then research more and let your voice be heard.

And I say that about every issue in your area. But outright rejecting data centers is dumb (not saying you're doing that)

 

[Rob_Royale]

My question is how many of these friggin things do we need? It's kind of like job search websites and search engines were back in the 90s and 00s. At some point, two of the best will put the rest out of business.

 

[coati]

My question is how many of these friggin things do we need? It's kind of like job search websites and search engines were back in the 90s and 00s. At some point, two of the best will put the rest out of business.

True, but what a colossal waste, given the rape of the earth that each hyper-scale data center requires, not to mention the associated market crashes.

 

[njlauren]

I'm not anti AI or Data centers. None of the issues you mentioned are unsolvable problems. God gave us a brain, we need to use it. We'll never get to the stars if we fail to push the limits of our minds and hide in fear of progress.

The big problem is who is going to control the technology, and how do we implement it without destroying ourselves in the process. There is a run to gold with AI right now primarily because big business sees it as a way to automate out a lot of jobs, pure and simple. Not to mention that AI can be used for good, but it can be used for really evil crap as well, like literally something from a dystopian novel. You look at the people promoting this and it is pretty scary, because most of them seem to have forgotten humanity along the way, they are pretty scary people when you hear them talk.

Musk talks about abundance, how the AI age will create an abundance for everyone. How does that work when that abundance still requires money to live. He is talking a star trek universe, but we live still in the old model of things, where companies especially are trying to maximize stock price value.

Businesses see AI as a free lunch, you can use it to teach, to make things, to do all these things without people, but they never ask themselves who will buy their products and goods and the like. So what do human beings do with themselves? And if you think I am lying, then why did the head of Microsoft come out to tell other tech companies to stop hyping the ability of AI to destroy jobs? And funny part is he didn't say it as in "AI will create new jobs" (which is a lie btw, it will create very few new jobs, very specialized ones, for AI scientists and engineers), but rather because it was turning people against it.

AI has a lot of potential,and it isn 't the problem, to me it is human frailty and the fact that in many ways greed runs more rampant than it has since the 19th century. I am no socialist, what I am talking about is from the standpoint of human nature and what AI in the hands of people who see only numbers will do. Robert McNamara in the 60's thought he really had the answer to the Vietnam war, it was applying his Harvard Business school finance training to war, that the efficient use of the military would win the war. His methodology nearly destroyed the US auto industry, and in the Vietnam war it got us into a mess we had to walk away from. AI is being pushed with the same worldview McNamara had.

AI can free us from things and be a big help doing things, it can enhance creativity, but the beancounters want it to replace it, which it can't.It can give us freedom, but in the hands of the wrong people, it can also be the most efficient form of repression ever created. Just think about Trump, what his personality is like, and imagine him with the full power of AI at his fingertips, and how he would use it...or any other autocrat. Or for that matter the loopy left, a Castro or a Putin.

 

[njlauren]

What I've seen in the past month has been data centers going from an interest to a full on panic in terms of interest.

That is artificial and easy to spot.

If there is an initiative for a data center in your area, find information and learn what the disinformation is, and go to a community meeting and listen to what people say. Then research more and let your voice be heard.

And I say that about every issue in your area. But outright rejecting data centers is dumb (not saying you're doing that)

Outright banning anything is dumb, but there is another side to this, and that is you don't have all the information either. For example, the data center builders claim the issues with water and electricity are non issues, that they will build their own power sources and that the centers will have a recirculating water cooling, so they won't need to use much water. But there is a big caveat there, it usually comes with the words "in the future". Right now they are dead lying if they say they are going to use radiative cooling to cool down their systems, radiative heat exchangers don't have the ability to cool down 7-9 GWh of usage, especially in hot climates. Likewise, you don't plug these into Honda generators, to generate the power they use, which is in the 7-9 GWH range a day, is literally a full size power plant used to power a city of millions of people. Takes a while to build them, and what are they going to run on? Natural gas? That means setting up a distribution system to it, either bringing in liquified natural gas, or having a gas pipeline to it. Is the delivery there in the area? If it is in an area where natural gas is used for heating and yes, generating power, that demand could cause delivery issues if the infrastructure is not going to be there. Is the center going to pick up the cost, or the natural gas provider. While Natural gas is transported all over the country via pipeline and the US has a lot of natural gas, you pay one way or the other. If they take power from the grid, the demand surge causes electricity prices to soar, and also creates brownouts and shortages. Customers in places around nevada just lost their source of electricity because the utility is overloaded with data center demand, and the people there are finding out how expensive the replacement is.

There is a huge cost to these things and they generally aren't telling the truth, and the people in the area will end up paying for it. These centers should be charged for the excess power they use, and should be forced to pay the cost of the local utility upgrading their power grid to accomodate these centers. But what happens is the utility goes to the state, says "I have spent 5 billion updating my local grid" (which was NOT done to help home customers), and that cost is tacked on to everyone's bills, rather than making them pay for it.

That is the reality of them, and at the meetings they lie through their teeth.

 

[icanhelp1]

The big problem is who is going to control the technology, and how do we implement it without destroying ourselves in the process. There is a run to gold with AI right now primarily because big business sees it as a way to automate out a lot of jobs, pure and simple. Not to mention that AI can be used for good, but it can be used for really evil crap as well, like literally something from a dystopian novel. You look at the people promoting this and it is pretty scary, because most of them seem to have forgotten humanity along the way, they are pretty scary people when you hear them talk.

Musk talks about abundance, how the AI age will create an abundance for everyone. How does that work when that abundance still requires money to live. He is talking a star trek universe, but we live still in the old model of things, where companies especially are trying to maximize stock price value.

Businesses see AI as a free lunch, you can use it to teach, to make things, to do all these things without people, but they never ask themselves who will buy their products and goods and the like. So what do human beings do with themselves? And if you think I am lying, then why did the head of Microsoft come out to tell other tech companies to stop hyping the ability of AI to destroy jobs? And funny part is he didn't say it as in "AI will create new jobs" (which is a lie btw, it will create very few new jobs, very specialized ones, for AI scientists and engineers), but rather because it was turning people against it.

AI has a lot of potential,and it isn 't the problem, to me it is human frailty and the fact that in many ways greed runs more rampant than it has since the 19th century. I am no socialist, what I am talking about is from the standpoint of human nature and what AI in the hands of people who see only numbers will do. Robert McNamara in the 60's thought he really had the answer to the Vietnam war, it was applying his Harvard Business school finance training to war, that the efficient use of the military would win the war. His methodology nearly destroyed the US auto industry, and in the Vietnam war it got us into a mess we had to walk away from. AI is being pushed with the same worldview McNamara had.

AI can free us from things and be a big help doing things, it can enhance creativity, but the beancounters want it to replace it, which it can't.It can give us freedom, but in the hands of the wrong people, it can also be the most efficient form of repression ever created. Just think about Trump, what his personality is like, and imagine him with the full power of AI at his fingertips, and how he would use it...or any other autocrat. Or for that matter the loopy left, a Castro or a Putin.

I agree, we need to push forward and solve these problems. That being said there is an undercurrent being facilitated by Chinese propagandist and the media putting a negative spin on data centers without having the facts. People are screaming NIMBY before they have the facts.

The Vietnam war lacked the will to call it a war and fight it like a war. We had China and Russia to contend with and with a little fortitude and courage we should of told the Chinese and the Russians if they want to play around with mushrooms then bring it on.

 

[ll74]

Outright banning anything is dumb, but there is another side to this, and that is you don't have all the information either. For example, the data center builders claim the issues with water and electricity are non issues, that they will build their own power sources and that the centers will have a recirculating water cooling, so they won't need to use much water. But there is a big caveat there, it usually comes with the words "in the future". Right now they are dead lying if they say they are going to use radiative cooling to cool down their systems, radiative heat exchangers don't have the ability to cool down 7-9 GWh of usage, especially in hot climates. Likewise, you don't plug these into Honda generators, to generate the power they use, which is in the 7-9 GWH range a day, is literally a full size power plant used to power a city of millions of people. Takes a while to build them, and what are they going to run on? Natural gas? That means setting up a distribution system to it, either bringing in liquified natural gas, or having a gas pipeline to it. Is the delivery there in the area? If it is in an area where natural gas is used for heating and yes, generating power, that demand could cause delivery issues if the infrastructure is not going to be there. Is the center going to pick up the cost, or the natural gas provider. While Natural gas is transported all over the country via pipeline and the US has a lot of natural gas, you pay one way or the other. If they take power from the grid, the demand surge causes electricity prices to soar, and also creates brownouts and shortages. Customers in places around nevada just lost their source of electricity because the utility is overloaded with data center demand, and the people there are finding out how expensive the replacement is.

There is a huge cost to these things and they generally aren't telling the truth, and the people in the area will end up paying for it. These centers should be charged for the excess power they use, and should be forced to pay the cost of the local utility upgrading their power grid to accomodate these centers. But what happens is the utility goes to the state, says "I have spent 5 billion updating my local grid" (which was NOT done to help home customers), and that cost is tacked on to everyone's bills, rather than making them pay for it.

That is the reality of them, and at the meetings they lie through their teeth.

I do have all the information. It's not something that I need to address all sides of the issue.

I support data centers.

 

[DeluxAuto]

The Trump administration has approved two new datacenter chemicals to which exposure can result in “sudden death” and a range of other serious health risks, like cancer, eye corrosion, neurological damage and reproductive harm.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

Claude Code considered harmful.

 

[icanhelp1]

The Trump administration has approved two new datacenter chemicals to which exposure can result in “sudden death” and a range of other serious health risks, like cancer, eye corrosion, neurological damage and reproductive harm.

View attachment 2675167

Many manufacturers rely on deadly chemicals.

 

[HisArpy]

Many manufacturers rely on deadly chemicals.

He's doing what the Left routinely does; scan around until he finds something he can scream about and point a finger to try and blame someone for something.

He thinks nothing of the big picture. Which in this case is his free use of the internet. You know, that thing that relies on data centers he's suddenly so concerned about being poisonous...

 

[DeluxAuto]

Many manufacturers rely on deadly chemicals.

Look at the thread topic and then realize where you fucked up, traitor.

He's doing what the Left routinely does; scan around until he finds something he can scream about and point a finger to try and blame someone for something.

He thinks nothing of the big picture. Which in this case is his free use of the internet. You know, that thing that relies on data centers he's suddenly so concerned about being poisonous...

I think it's time for another doxxing, Derpy. I've grown tired of your whiny, insane bullshit.

 

[icanhelp1]

Look at the thread topic and then realize where you fucked up, traitor.

You brought up the topic of chemicals dumbass!!!!

The Trump administration has approved two new datacenter chemicals to which exposure can result in “sudden death” and a range of other serious health risks, like cancer, eye corrosion, neurological damage and reproductive harm.

I think it's time for another doxxing, Derpy. I've grown tired of your whiny, insane bullshit.

 

[DeluxAuto]

You brought up the topic of chemicals dumbass!!!!

The Trump administration has approved two new datacenter chemicals to which exposure can result in “sudden death” and a range of other serious health risks, like cancer, eye corrosion, neurological damage and reproductive harm.

Yes, in the fucking AI & DATA CENTER thread, dipshit. That means all aspects of AI & data centers will be discussed, including the senile felon fucking up the environment to appease his billionaire cronies, you ignorant fuckwad.

 

[icanhelp1]

Yes, in the fucking AI & DATA CENTER thread, dipshit. That means all aspects of AI & data centers will be discussed, including the senile felon fucking up the environment to appease his billionaire cronies, you ignorant fuckwad.

So dumbass why would the use of dangerous chemicals in AI/DATA centers be any different than the use in other manufacturing processes.

Your point wasn't about the use of dangerous chemicals, IT WAS ABOUT 'LOOK WHAT TRUMP DID' TRUMP BAD!! 'ORANGE MAN BAD' phony hypocrite!

 

[DeluxAuto]

So dumbass why would the use of dangerous chemicals in AI/DATA centers be any different than the use in other manufacturing processes.

Your point wasn't about the use of dangerous chemicals, IT WAS ABOUT 'LOOK WHAT TRUMP DID' TRUMP BAD!! 'ORANGE MAN BAD' phony hypocrite!

Jesus fucking Christ on a potato wedge.

The thread topic is AI & Data Centers. The current President is touting them, and I am pointing out how he's fucking things up. If you have some facts that tell us that what trump is doing with AI & Data Centers isn't fucking up the environment, please show the class. Otherwise, sit in the corner with your red dunce cap and shut the fuck up.

I brought facts to this thread. All you did was troll me and whine like a traitorous little bitch while deflecting.

 

[73Seahawks]

I'm not anti AI or Data centers. None of the issues you mentioned are unsolvable problems. God gave us a brain, we need to use it. We'll never get to the stars if we fail to push the limits of our minds and hide in fear of progress.

Percentage odds this will impact the 2026 Midterm Elections?

 

[icanhelp1]

Percentage odds this will impact the 2026 Midterm Elections?

Mid term politics are local. AI and DATA CENTERS will definitely be high on the list. Politicians have to be very sensitive to the concerns of their constituents or they'll lose. Evaluate the real pros and cons that affect their location and people that live there. Make a mockery of their concerns and they lose. Rise above the negative spin and adapt to this new technology. Cities and towns can win big if they play their cards right.

 

[DeluxAuto]

Cities and towns can win big if they play their cards right.

Explain in detail.

 

[Rightguide]

Data centers are quickly becoming a political hot potato nationwide. It wasn’t that long ago that states and municipalities were welcoming them. Now there’s a growing backlash, even in Democratic strongholds like Silicon Valley and Republican strongholds like Texas.

We have to dominate this field of endeavor to ensure global technological security and prevent authoritarian regimes from dictating the digital rules of the twenty-first century. Hopefully, those in charge won't be the same dullards who took three decades to develop the airport security line.

 

[Hel_Books]

Wasn't all this tech supposed to make things faster and more efficient and cheaper? Like the change from the expensive, heavy, power-guzzling original "brick" cell phone to the modern smart phone?

How did we end up going backward, using lots of land and resources just to generate volumes of useless AI slop?

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

We have to dominate this field of endeavor to ensure global technological security and prevent authoritarian regimes from dictating the digital rules of the twenty-first century. Hopefully, those in charge won't be the same dullards who took three decades to develop the airport security line.

I agree, and they can be located in areas zoned for industrial use, and open space areas reasonably distant from residential neighborhoods. Plenty of depressed cities across the country can and are benefiting from the tax revenue they bring in.