The future is dense, walkable cities.

[Chernosoth]

Odor can be one of the limiting factors of urban density. In NYC, New Orleans, etc., new arrivals rapidly learn to reduce sensitivity, but that will be harder as horses and chamber pots replace cars and flush toilets.

 

[TrailerHitch]

Some states are depaving their rural roads because they can't afford pavement maintenance. That will eventually be all rural roads. Rural drivers can expect to pay more for tires, suspension repairs, and less mpg. But dirt roads are healthier for horses, which will eventually replace cars.

Dude...Step back from the crack pipe. Here our cities, counties, and the state DOT have a very aggressive road repair and replacement schedule. Even most rural roads are well taken care of. You are delusional if you think these asphalt roads will be removed for your imaginary future of dirt roads and horse traffic. If for no other reason the roads,are needed for police, fire and ems emergency response, as well as the USPS, and utility maintenance vehicles. In order for horses to make a major comeback it would take a cataclysmic event, like a nuclear war.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

Los Angeles has been dominated by the automobile for over 100 years.

I know! We have a lot of work to do to undo the damage!

 

[Chernosoth]

Dude...Step back from the crack pipe. Here our cities, counties, and the state DOT have a very aggressive road repair and replacement schedule. Even most rural roads are well taken care of. You are delusional if you think these asphalt roads will be removed for your imaginary future of dirt roads and horse traffic. If for no other reason the roads,are needed for police, fire and ems emergency response, as well as the USPS, and utility maintenance vehicles.

https://www.governing.com/archive/gov-dirt-unpaved-roads.html

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Been a long time since I’ve jumped into this thread. The longevity and volume of posts indicate how relevant the topic is.

As one who has been close to the issue in California, here are a few observations:

- Densification is a top legislative priority. The state has stripped local government of authority to designate single family zoning neighborhoods. The whole concept of single family zoning is dead.

- Politicians are pledging to reduce housing costs by infill. Creating urban villages with mixed use buildings with retail on the ground floor, residential apartments on higher floors.

- Local governments are assigned housing quotas. Those that don’t comply risk losing state money, and becoming subject to a legislative mandate called “builder’s remedy.” It basically strips local planning commissions of authority land use discretion if a housing project meets building code standards.

- The laws, which began in 2021-22 so far are not resulting in more housing. The math isn’t working for developers.

- The California gubernatorial candidates are all promising to “build more housing”, but none are offering any new ideas.

- Former Democratic Congresswoman Katie Porter has come closest to offering up anything remotely realistic. She lives in Irvine, an Orange County city that was planned in the 70s from vacant land. She’s called for more exurbs like Irvine. She’s on to something, but she’s in 5th place in the polls and won’t make the runoff.

 

[Chernosoth]

I know! We have a lot of work to do to undo the damage!

Keep it simple. With climate change, mostly drought and fire, and California's economic decline, California's cities will lose most of their population. The people who stay and survive can decide which parts of LA's vast suburban sprawl of annexed land are worth keeping as city land.

 

[Chernosoth]

When I lived farther out, one hour of biking was enough to leave the denser suburbs and ride all day on unlimited miles of dirt roads. I moved in and the suburbs sprawled more, so I need a bus or car to reach the edge of sprawl. In small walkable towns, a cyclist could be out of the town in minutes and have a great ride.

 

[Chernosoth]

There is room for improvement in the engineering of foldable bikes and scooters that can be carried in buses. Skateboarding could become a more common skill. The stem and handlebar of a scooter add weight.

 

[TrailerHitch]

There is room for improvement in the engineering of foldable bikes and scooters that can be carried in buses. Skateboarding could become a more common skill. The stem and handlebar of a scooter add weight.

Ever try to skate board on a dirt road? Especially a muddy one?

 

[Chernosoth]

Ever try to skate board on a dirt road? Especially a muddy one?

There are some boards with bigger wheels, which may become more common as sidewalk and road maintenance slips. Cobblestone roads may return, so that would be a bumpy ride for any type of wheel. There are cyclists who build their bikes specifically for mud, with big knobby tires and extra chain protection.

 

[TrailerHitch]

A bicycle is not a skateboard. Nice diversion.

 

[Chernosoth]

Testing the feasibility of skateboards on dirt roads is a job for younger people who can learn to skateboard.
Some communities and private drive owners buy chipseal because it's cheaper than asphalt, but it's the most hated surface for cyclists, and possibly worse for skateboarders. Skateboarders might prefer plain dirt roads over chipseal. As cycling and maybe skateboarding become standard transportation, chipseal will probably disappear.

 

[TrailerHitch]

Testing the feasibility of skateboards on dirt roads is a job for younger people who can learn to skateboard.
Some communities and private drive owners buy chipseal because it's cheaper than asphalt, but it's the most hated surface for cyclists, and possibly worse for skateboarders. Skateboarders might prefer plain dirt roads over chipseal. As cycling and maybe skateboarding become standard transportation, chipseal will probably disappear.

You live in a fantasy world.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

Testing the feasibility of skateboards on dirt roads is a job for younger people who can learn to skateboard.
Some communities and private drive owners buy chipseal because it's cheaper than asphalt, but it's the most hated surface for cyclists, and possibly worse for skateboarders. Skateboarders might prefer plain dirt roads over chipseal. As cycling and maybe skateboarding become standard transportation, chipseal will probably disappear.

There’s a reason the skateboard wasn’t invented until the 20th Century.

 

[Chernosoth]

Here is some feasibility testing.

 

[Chernosoth]

Skateboarding is transportation.

 

[Chernosoth]

As urban and rural surfaces become rougher, we can say goodbye to high heeled shoes, with a partial exception of cowboy boots. Horses will become more common than cars.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

As urban and rural surfaces become rougher, we can say goodbye to high heeled shoes, with a partial exception of cowboy boots. Horses will become more common than cars.

Chopines

 

[Chernosoth]

"Chopines were usually put on with the help of two servants."
There are many types of handcrafted elevated footwear, but mostly level. The low toe and high heel position can be an ankle breaker on rough ground.

 

[TrailerHitch]

As urban and rural surfaces become rougher, we can say goodbye to high heeled shoes, with a partial exception of cowboy boots. Horses will become more common than cars.

I find your idea that horses will become more common than cars silly and delusional. Even the Amish, that use horses extensively, have arrangements with people outside their community for transportation to jobs sites, medical appointments, and so on.

The only way horses will ever become common transport again is in the aftermath of some catastrophic world event, EMP, nuclear war, or something similar. I laugh wondering where you will get hay and oats to feed the thousands, or tens of thousands, of horses needed for large urban areas.

 

[MajorRewrite]

I laugh wondering where you will get hay and oats to feed the thousands, or tens of thousands, of horses needed for large urban areas.

Cherno has wacko beliefs, but you do realize that there were large cities before the invention of the automobile, right? The people got around by foot, bicycle and streetcars mainly.

 

[Hel_Books]

It’s amusing how agitated the sheep get when someone says that walkable neighborhoods are nice.

The sheep worship at metal altars, one to each person, that crawl along the highways and byways, stuck in traffic, occasionally crushed in collisions as the air fills with the burnt offerings of toxic petrochemical smoke . . .

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

The sheep worship at metal altars, one to each person, that crawl along the highways and byways, stuck in traffic, occasionally crushed in collisions as the air fills with the burnt offerings of toxic petrochemical smoke . . .

 

[TrailerHitch]

Cherno has wacko beliefs, but you do realize that there were large cities before the invention of the automobile, right? The people got around by foot, bicycle and streetcars mainly.

You avoided horses.

 

[Chernosoth]

I laugh wondering where you will get hay and oats to feed the thousands, or tens of thousands, of horses needed for large urban areas.

That's why older communities have town commons, public grazing spaces. Newer towns have parks. Grass can grow anywhere. The urban size limit will still be locally available human food within horse drawn wagon distance.